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I guess if you want 100% accuracy, you would not be in 3-rail. You would be at the "Key" level and happy to spend some very big bucks for your equipment. At that price range, you should demand 100% accuracy.

 

I am very happy to be in 3-rail and happy with the options available to us now which are in my time, the best ever.

Road specific details make a huge difference in appearance right out of the box, and make your models stand out from the rest of the other names. Even a couple simple things... like anti glare panels on the nose, roof top AC, and antenna base.

 

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Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by Laidoffsick:

Elliot that's cuz your layout is sooo d*mn big, nothing else will fit in your mind

You are absolutely right Doug. Your engine is gorgeous, and I can see the effort that went into it. I used to be more detail oriented, but now I focus on the big picture. I just lack the patience for the research and the modeling. I've sort of lost it as I've gotten older. It may also have to do with the fact that I have too many engines.

 

BTW, today is ballast day!

This post and some of the replies has me wondering? People are asking for new Vision Line engines, or other Limited Run engines and cars by other manufacturers on limited runs, which have high prices and are highly detailed with many added features. Apparently thats what the buyers want, highly, and accurate detailed items. Then in some replies here, im also reading that close enough is good enough, or if the paint job is accurate, etc. If I wanted something close enough, I would just go back to running Lionel, etc. trains of the 40s to 60s. at a fraction of the cost.

Then after a product comes out, there are numerous post on reviews and comments on how it could be better or more accurate, or that Line didn't have those engines, or cabooses, etc.  After all, they're still toys, but the amount of outlay should reflect how much effort was made to produce an "accurate facsimile".

One reason I rarely buy new, or will put my money down on pre-orders unless its scaled and accurate.

 I would like to add. Not a rivet counter, but do want accuarate painting, location on lights, gears, horns and bells, and accuarate railings, windows, and decals of the Line to be accuarate. Same for passenger cars, one mold doesn't cover all lines just by changing names and colors.

Last edited by josef

Occasionally a middle ground is reached regarding road specific details. One such case are Golden Gate Depot heavyweight coaches from a number of years back.

 

These cars were patterned after the PRR P70 coach but were available in many road names/paint schemes. For the PRR models the correct 2D-5P 2 axle trucks were used as well as roof vents and flared steps as per PRR practice. Other roads used straight side steps, roofs with no vents, and either 4 or 6 wheel Pullman Standard style trucks rather than the PRR type trucks.

 

Although not completely correct for non PRR roads, these cars have sufficient road specific details to pass as relatively accurate for most non PRR modelers.

No, wouldn't know the road specific details if I saw them. Most of the time I have enough trouble telling one engine from another.  As long as they are orange, yellow & black, road name is spelled correctly and everything works as it should they are good enough for me.

 

I can see where this would bother the folks that do know the difference, but honestly I don't anything about the road specific details or the details of the real engines.

Last edited by rtr12

I appreciate LOS's comments and example of ATSF specific additions to his GP30...I see a big difference in the "before" and "after" photos.  To this I would like to add the following:  I have collected several CB&Q Geeps and SD's that are missing the Pyle Gyralites at each end.  They have very pleasing paint schemes, yet they do not "look right" because they are missing the unique lines and look of the Burlington.  I do own one Atlas GP9 that was manufactured with the correct placement and style of Pyle light, and naturally, it is my favorite. It looks right.

I say all that to say, detail does matter. 

Details? Diesels have details?

=======

It depends; when I buy a diesel (not that often) I expect reasonable accuracy, modified by price, modified by availability, modified by my ability to modify...of course, that works for electrics and steam, too.

 

I did not but an ICG (a former employer) GP30 from Lionel because of the incorrect Blomberg trucks. Every time I almost overlooked it, I realized how easy it would have been to get it right (their Alco FA's have the correct AAR truck side frames, already), and I got

"mad" all over again. I didn't want to encourage them.

 

The ICG's GP30's were all former GM&O units, and those rode on trucks from Alco FA trade-ins. The latest Lionel GM&O GP30 is correct, so, there's hope.  

 

A friend bought the ICG unit, and can't quite get past the trucks...we'll probably attack it, eventually.

Last edited by D500

I used to not be all that particular, and in some case's I'm still not, but as the prices increase, I feel I should get something more for my money. Using the cars produced from Menard's at a $20.00 price point, I expect more at a $50.00 price point. Just an example.

 

I operate PW, MPC, modern, and kit-built. I have enough trains. Except for kits, my purchasing days are pretty much over unless an importer brings out something outstanding in a roadname I'm interested in, which means the details need to be roadname specific, or fairly easy to be made roadname specific to interest me anymore. Otherwise I'll try to build my own.

 

Since the original question was about diesels, and I wandered off topic a little, I'll try to get back on track. Diesels: Price dictates my decision completely. I will gladly pay $180.00 for a postwar reproduction of a F3 AA set. For $750.00 I expect scale details and correctness, not just a fancy operating system. 

Originally Posted by Rob Leese:

I appreciate LOS's comments and example of ATSF specific additions to his GP30...I see a big difference in the "before" and "after" photos.  To this I would like to add the following:  I have collected several CB&Q Geeps and SD's that are missing the Pyle Gyralites at each end.  They have very pleasing paint schemes, yet they do not "look right" because they are missing the unique lines and look of the Burlington.  I do own one Atlas GP9 that was manufactured with the correct placement and style of Pyle light, and naturally, it is my favorite. It looks right.

I say all that to say, detail does matter. 

Now, I am waiting for someone to suggest that I sell all my detail-less Burlington locos and replace them with excellence from 3rd Rail at ~$670 a pop.

That would truly be "putting your $ where your mouth is".

 Lionel made a nicely done B&A 0-8-0. The headlight was mounted on the top of the boiler. The B&A had their's mounted on the smoke box door. The parts were available from Lionel to get it right. They had it on the C&O version. Ordered the parts and used JB Weld to fill in some holes. Wasn't a deal breaker in buying the engine. Satisfying to know it's a little more correct now.

 Certain details matter to me others do not. I like certain things to be correct such as wheel arrangement, whistle location, head light shape and location, etc..

 

  Dave C posted above about the Lionel 0-8-0. I was in the opposite side of the problem. I wanted the headlight on top of the smoke box. The catalog showed the head light on top of the smoke box, the instructions showed the head light on top of the smoke box but when I took the model out the headlight was in the middle of the smoke box. The engine came in Lionelville and Western livery and I repainted it to Texas and Pacific livery.

  The prototype I wanted to model was from an old family photo of a wreck my aunt was in. The car hit a T&P 0-8-0 that was not moving. The photo shows the head light on top of the smokestack and a very smashed up 1930s type car. The driver of the car had been drinking and drove around the cross arm and a flagman late at night. 

  Well I now have a good weekend project.

Douglas

Douglas, e mail me at  nyc_dave1948@yahoo.com   if you want to do this project. I have the headlight and smoke box door you need. You will have to drill a hole in the top of the boiler to run the wires through for the headlight. Other than that it should be an easy swap. Just depends on the bell placement. The B&A originally had it on the top of the boiler. I ended up plugging two holes with JB Weld. The one the wires ran through and the bell mount on the door. Swapping the headlight number was easy. After removing the lens. The number boards popped right out.n

This should be a lesson for all of us. 6 months ago I had a C&O 0-8-0 that I repainted for NYC. Most all the NYC 0-8-0s had the high mounted headlight. It didn't occur to me that others might have wanted to go the other way.

In my case I did find a few NYC lettered engines that had center mounted headlights though they may have worked on subsidiaries if not the parent company.

 

Pete

 

Paul,

That depends. I work for Caterpillar & since EMD is now part of Caterpillar, I had the opportunity to visit their facility & learn more about their current offerings much closer. I also pay close attention to EMD news in our internal newsletters & contact rail-division employees if I have any further questions. As a result, I got to know road-specific details much better for their products. But for GE locomotives or for any freight car or passenger car, I usually know them from the O-Scale models I buy & to a lesser extent from online searches or from watching them pass while waiting at a railroad crossing.

So I cannot make myself buy MTH Premier EMD models since to the extent I am familiar with them, there is some incorrect or missing road-specific details & I am self-restricted to shopping for used brass EMD models that used to capture the road-specific details correctly.

For GE products or for freight cars, I am comparatively ignorant & love the MTH Premier, Atlas Masterline or Trainman models.

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen Rajan

Interesting responses from both sides of the fence. Maybe its' just me in the depth of the hobby, but details that are omitted or blundered by the manufacturers just bothers me to no end. Today anyone can google anything and get it right. The devil is in the details and with the money I've spent he has one hand on my wallet too.       

Originally Posted by PAUL ROMANO:

Interesting responses from both sides of the fence. Maybe its' just me in the depth of the hobby, but details that are omitted or blundered by the manufacturers just bothers me to no end. Today anyone can google anything and get it right. The devil is in the details and with the money I've spent he has one hand on my wallet too.       

Had saved in the event a "Santa Fe" ES44ac would ever be run. Lionel finally cataloged one, but unlike the Vision line tooling the plastic tooling only has the head lights over the cab not in the nose. Could we have overlooked the access door being 2" too narrow or the engineers seat being 4" to the left, headlights 2" too large? Heck yes!

 

Headlights located completely in the wrong location at $600+? Nope.

As MODEL railroader rather than a collector, I find that road specific details are very important to me.    A generic car painted for a RR that never had it without specific details is not a prototypically correct model.    It may be nice, it may have a good paint job, but it is not a very good model.

 

Now I am very very picky about specific details for my favorite RR.   For other RRs that might appear on my layout, I am more open-minded.    I have cars for a variety of RRs that may or may not be correct.   I have not done the research.   But my home road, where all my motive power and cabooses are specific, I want all my home-road rolling stock to be specific also.

 

As an aside, I also like such specific models as the B&O wagon top car and Milwaukee Rib side done by Weaver.    I would rather have these than generic PS01s painted for the same roads.

Originally Posted by Joe Hohmann:

The only one that really matters to me is having to pay for a dome passenger car for a RR that did not have any (in my case, PRR).

Definitely agree with you!  Seems like it would be easy to put Pullmans or coaches in place of the domes in the boxes, but I guess not.  I like long trains, so I run the domes that came with the K-Line Golden State set even though the train never had any.

I used to worry about specific details, but not any more.  If it looks reasonable to me, I'm fine with it.  There are too many things I have to be exact on, so when it comes to trains I have noticed I have become a lot more forgiving as I approach 60.

 

All that said, I appreciate models that their owners/builders have gone to the effort to make as correct as possible.  Great job everyone!!

The Southern Pacific had special light packages on most of its diesels.  I think that getting things such as the position of lights, etc. is important.

 

Also, I don't see any point in painting a diesel in a railroad's colors if the railroad never owned that type of diesel.  I model the New Haven.  Too many manufacturers make NH B units.  The real NH didn't have B units for most of its diesels.

 

Another mistake is to make dome cars for a railroad that never operated domes.  The NH never had any domes because they brought people too close to the overhead wires.  There are a lot of NH domes running on model railroads. 

 

NH Joe

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