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Just be aware that running these using the stock 432 and 1445 bulbs @ 18 VAC will use about 6.75 watts a piece of power. So 10 for instance put you into 67 watts of power, or 3.75 amps on an 18 VAC circuit.

I run mine on 16 VDC which operates them fine, provides longer bulb life, and the DC eliminates the AC buzz which many find annoying (me included).

You can also buy LED replacements for the incandescent lamps, which cuts power draw to a fraction, and they last forever. This makes your power supply requirements way less, but these guys use a big surge of power for the split second when they switch, so you can't use #26 wire or anything like that.

The aux plugs should be wired using #18 AWG regardless IMO. 

When they switch, the power runs from the hot aux plug to the control lever, then back to the switch, then to track ground. So you have to consider the total wire loss through all that wiring and still have enough oomph to move a 50+ year old mechanism (if you are using PW 022's). Long runs to the controllers are to be avoided since the Lionel flat 3 conductor wire is only #22.

Just my thoughts.

 

Rod

Last edited by Rod Stewart

rcf0924,

   Rod is absolutely correct, when I was using the Lionel 022, 072 switches I daisy chained the power and installed LED lights in every switch and switch controller and I powered them all with one channel from a ZW, to increase or decrease the power as needed.   It works out quite well in reality.  I now use the Command Control FT switches to eliminate all the wiring and the massive power draw.

PCRR/Dave

Last edited by Pine Creek Railroad
Originally Posted by rcf0924:

Thanks Rod ,Larry and D&H. Again all answers of big help to me. I will use the 18 gauge wire, daisy chain them, and Rod, I had no idea that you could run the O22's on DC power. Did I understand you correctly? Yes my 7 switches are PW O22's and I tested all of them with 18 VAC and they seemed OK.

Yes I did mean DC.

I find that 16 VDC works as well as 18 VAC, but eliminates the annoying AC buzz.

I use a separate DC power supply with the + side powering the aux plug feeds, and the - side common grounded with the outer rails of the tracks.

It has worked just fine for many years.

 

Rod

Originally Posted by Rod:
 

 Yes I did mean DC. I find that 16 VDC works as well as 18 VAC, but eliminates the annoying AC buzz. I use a separate DC power supply with the + side powering the aux plug feeds, and the - side common grounded with the outer rails of the tracks. It has worked just fine for many years.

Rod, 022's shouldn't buzz, they should snap into position and shut off if they are adjusted right.

 

Also, only the common/return is switched(shorted actually, by the bulb(s) and control lever) at the controller, not the fixed input leg/voltage, whether AC or DC, which is fed directly to one end of each solenoid coil.

Again please excuse my ignorance, but whether AC or DC, I am going to use a fixed voltage for the switches. I have another transformer that provides variable DC up to 14 V and fixed AC of 18 volts for accessories. I want to start by trying  the 18 VAC to to my first fixed voltage plug. Do I need to run a wire from the other terminal of the transformer (they are not labeled + or _) to the track? Would that connection be made with a lockon to the outside rail that has no connection with the power feed lockons? Thanks for your help.

Originally Posted by rcf0924:

I have another transformer that provides variable DC up to 14 V and fixed AC of 18 volts for accessories. I want to start by trying  the 18 VAC to to my first fixed voltage plug.

It sounds like you want to use an HO power pack to power your switches. If this is the case, it will likely have enough power to run maybe just one or two switches, if that. Check the output rating - an 022 switch with a controller will draw ~ 12-14 VA at 18 volts before you even hit the switch lever.
 
Originally Posted by rcf0924:

Do I need to run a wire from the other terminal of the transformer (they are not labeled + or _) to the track? Would that connection be made with a lockon to the outside rail that has no connection with the power feed lockons?

Yes, the power supply will need to reference a return to complete the circuit. A connection to clip "2" on a lockon is fine.

 

Once you do that, realize that that connection can actually be made in any of several places, and clip "2" is "common" to many parts of the layout, including anything connected to the outside rails of the layout, for example the center binding post of a 022 switch, the common/outside rail connection to the transformer, the left/#1 post on a UCS/RCS remote track, and many more.

 

So in actuality, an extra lockon is not necessary, just the connection that duplicates/parallels that connection point.

Can I use connections to the A and C terminals of the 1033 transformer (16 VAC fixed) to power my 7 O22's? If so, do I understand that I daisy chain the power lead around to all 7 switches from the transformer and do the same with the center wires on each switch back to the other terminal of the transformer?

Your Tech ll power pack has only about 13 watts of power. The bulbs alone in the switches and controllers will draw most of the power out of that pack.

You can use the 1033 to power your switches by connecting the A terminal to the fixed voltage plugs, and daisy chaining them around to all the switches. The C terminal gets connected to the outer rails of the track through your lockon. Note that due to the design of the transformer, you cannot use the variable outputs of the 1033 to power your trains in this configuration. You need to use a second transformer properly phased to the 1033 to operate your trains.

 

Larry

Originally Posted by rcf0924:

OK great that makes it clear enough. The other transformer is a Tech II and it only has a total of 13 VA. I bought it on ebay specifically to use with accessories on my layout. I don't have an HO train. Can it be useful for anything besides the switches? 

Some Lights. That's not enough power for switches, or any motorized(ac motor) or solenoid operated accessories.

I run the 022 switches from the 20 volt fixed voltage tap on my KW.  Without the diodes, the lamps get hot enough to melt the lanterns.  With the diodes, the lamps never get hot to the touch.  With the diodes, the life of the lamps is essentially infinite because the voltage is low.  Running at 20 volts, the switches throw quickly.

When you take the cover off of the switch motor you will see a wire going from the fixed voltage plug to the lamp.  Unsolder this wire from the fixed voltage plug and put a diode in series with the wire.  It doesn't matter which way you put the diode in.  Radio shack has a bundle of diodes suitable for this relatively cheap.

 

If you want to put a diode in series with the lamps of the controller, you need to read my long thread on fixing 022 switches:  022/711 switch operating pblms.  Look for it with Google.

Originally Posted by D&H 65:

One more piece of info that will trip you up; the 0-22's made in the "Modern' era (LTI / LionelLLC) use a plug that has a smaller ID than the plugs used by Postwar Lionel Corp.. That means a "newer" plug will not fit on to a Postwar 0-22 fixed voltage pin and a Postwar pin may be loose on a Modern unit.

Hey Dand H, I wonder if I am running into this problem now. I AM HAVING TROUBLE GETTING 3 OF MY FIXED VOLTAGE PLUGS TO STAY SEATED IN THEIR RECPTICLE. tHE WANT TO SLIDE OUT. aS  A RESULT EVEN THO PUSHED IN AS FAR AS THEY WILL GO, THE SWITCH IS STILL PICKING UP TRACK POWER. sOMEHOW THEY MUST NOT BE FITTING BETWEEN THE PIN AND THE CONTACT. Please excuse the cap lock error. Any other ideas are welcome. My local train guy says that pin is made of 3 pieces and can be widened.

Originally Posted by servoguy:

You can use a blue crimp on lug for the fixed voltage plug.  They are cheap and stay in better than the Lionel part.  They will not work with the newer switches because the fixed voltage pin is bigger, not smaller.

That should solve the problem. I am grateful for your help and all the experienced people on this forum. Looking at my plugs I was also starting to think that the little bolts used as the wire terminal that came with some of these plugs is too short to reach the pin.

Originally Posted by servoguy:

The reason I recommended the diodes as opposed to LEDs is the cost.  I have about 175 switches, and each switch takes at least one bulb and the controllers take two.  Diodes cost about 20 cents, so the price advantage is all in favor of diodes.

 

Servoguy - got a part number and/or supplier for those  diodes?  Thanks.

 

Pete

 

 

I usually buy them from Skycraft Parts in Winter Park, Florida.  Skycraft is a surplus outlet and their prices are cheap.  You can find them in the Internet.  They have the diodes rated by voltage and size.  

 

The last ones I bought were from Radio Shack as I was not in Orlando.  I just looked on Radio Shack's web site, and they have a bunch of diodes for about $2.  You might have to call the store to find out how many are in the bunch.

 

You want a diode with a voltage rating of at least 50 volts.

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