Flyonel SD40

I think collectivily we are of like mind on the issue.  I am as happy as any posting my wants and desires on here but if you don't express this to Lionel or MTH (3rd rail or whoever) we will only get so far. 

I did my part - I posted on Lionel's FB page about an SD40-2.  I encourage everyone to do the same, send a message to lionel at the "talk to us" section of their website or hit them up on their facebook page.  I am not a fan of social media, but the nice thing about posting on facebook is other people see your intrest, not just Lionel (or MTH) - a good idea is contagious! (That's why I am always sick!)

Ben

Nice job with all the S Gauge Information and photos.

Gary

Sorry Guys, I met with Matt Ashba at York for the S Gaugian interview and he mentioned no current plans for an SD40 for American Flyer.

Bill

Did you get the impression of a change in the wind from lionel to the commitment of continuation in the nice scale pieces? 

Ben

From the interview I learned they are going to see how the market reacts to the Berkshires and the FlyerKing operating system.  That takes them into 2016 for decisions.  If you look at the O gauge catalog and ready-to-run catalog for 2015 there is probably 30% of it in LionKing items. They are waiting for results before they determine future products as development costs for new products are high.

Bill

Do you mean Flyer Chief and not Flyer King?

I'm not sure how sales and intrest in the FlyerChief Berk and its low level detail (comparative) have a direct correlation to the nice scale pieces. 

Ben

Sorry, Flyer Chief.

 

For now I would not look for "Nice Scale Pieces" except what they are producing now. The correlation is that if these Berks sell well and satisfy people at this price point then they

will make engines more like them at that price point.  The market determines where they will invest their capital for product development.  So, if they sell twice as many of the Berks as they did Y3s you can guess their next move.

 

If you look at the new Lionel O gauge catalog the expensive to scale stuff at over $700 is only to be ordered in advance.  You don't order and reserve one you don't get one.  My guess is they will do the same thing for AF if they make future items like the challenger or Y3.  

Basing their S scale decisions on an engine with cast-on features is, well, "odd" to me.  Not a very good thought process IMHO.

 

Like they sat around their think-tank table and one of them blurted out...

 

"Hey! I have an idea! Let's see if we can sell an engine that is several steps backwards in scale fidelity from what modelers have come to expect and see if it goes over? If it does, we're in like Flynn and we can make low-detailed models and sell'em at a tidy profit. If not... well... we always have O 3 rail... at least for now."

 

Weird.

Scale detailed Flyer.  It was fun (mostly) while it lasted:

 

Rusty

I suppose I am in the minority of buyers who want and will pay for highly detailed hi-rail engines with Legacy. I am not a large purchaser but I have 7 Legacy engines, 3 original TMCC engines and 12 Gilbert, AM and SHS engines converted to TMCC. I am planning to have another 5 converted this year. The reason is the models are not available from Lionel. I am not interested so far in the FlyerChief system. The detailing is not as good and I do not need a a stack of remotes that are unique to one engine. Were there an extra cost upgrade or software update that would allow Legacy control then I might change my mind. 

I still run original Gilbert and some unmodified AM with conventional transformers but that is for fun, not my preferred way. 

Really nice pictures in the post above!

I'm somewhere in the middle. Coming from 1960's Post War Lionel (heading into low points of detail and quality compared to years earlier).  Fast forward to 2013 when I stumbled back into the hobby (O Scale).  Culture shock is putting it mildly as to computer control (a dream come true) and level of detail.  Bought MTH diesels @ $430.00 and $1,300.00 Michigan Central Berk from Lionel for starters.  Now I realize O scale market is > S scale but < (HO & N scale) but this stuff is like Brass of years gone by.  I think conventional is fine, but computer control is where it is at/going to be (take your pick of DCS , Legacy, or DCC for example).  To my point, great systems but I did not want to have 3 or 4  different systems for O scale and then also when I started  moving to S scale.   Choose DCC so I could run Lionel Y3, Sd70ace, Es44c's, MTH F3's (PS3 DCS can do  DCC also), and American models (DC ones can be DCC by adding an encoder).  The detail is very good to great (or can be enhanced).  Wanted a scale Berk and thought they might use this as a base for a more detailed version next (I would order one right now if it had a bit more detail - not molded in handrails for example).  This current version gets people into the market (hopefully) and is more easy to handle (probably) for kids - but seems like they are taking a step back IMO.  I would be happy with a bit more detail but it does not need to be a VisionLine end of of spectrum either.

I want S and HO to switch places in the market. I like S so much better than HO, but it just isn't going to happen. It really is a shame.

 

It was fun while it lasted Rusty. And there was a lot of excitement for a little while. Not anymore. Think about it... Even if Lionel were to start today on a newly tooled scale engine it would be a good 4-5 years from now before we got our hands on it. Since they appear to have nothing in the works right now other than the Berkshire I wouldn't hold my breath waiting.

 

My opinion is Lionel is out of the high end scale market for the most part. They are focusing on AF stuff with the new Flyer Chief cheapo remote with 2nd rate sounds. MTH is going to have the scale market all to themselves, but that's not even too exciting when you consider that they are just offering reissues and they are moving at a snail's pace.  

 

I really have to wonder if Dan at River Raisin isn't getting close to throwing in the towel too. Especially after his recent loss.

 

S=Such a shame... I feel for you guys.

Johnathan

I would not have much of an issue (I guess would still complain a little) if there were projects in the works that were new tooled items that take 3 years. The Y3 project for example would be fine if it took 2 or 3 years to get going from start to finish.  (If I recall the Y3 was announced and delivered all in 2012).


It's all about the lack of commitment (perception seems to be reality right now) by L to forge on.  We will see what happens.  I have started to really thin out my Flyonel traditional type rolling stock and engines. My plan at this point - keep the legacy pieces and scale rolling stock I have.  I'm looking to Ebay for S helper and DesPlains hobbies for scale rolling stock. Dumping my rather large and lately ignored collection of traditional flyer stuff better sets me up to focus on scale highrail and potentialy a bail on S to HO. 

Time will tell.

Ben