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Looking at a popular auction site, I notice that Hafner seems to have made relatively few different freight cars.  I mostly see the same gondolas, a tank car, caboose.  Is this a correct perception?  Are there certain Hafner cars that are particularly rare?

 

Bill

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Bill,

I'm certainly not a Hafner expert, but i'll contribute what i can.

To my mind at least, there are four different groupings of Hafner freights.

 

In the early 1920's, Hafner sold freight cars made by Bing.  Bing also sold these cars at the same time, and I don't know of any way to tell whether they were sold by Hafner or Bing, so I tend to just think of these as Bing cars, not Hafner.

 

Starting in 1928, Hafner started selling its own line of freights, and these first cars are my favorites. They are 5-1/2" lithographed 4-wheel cars, including the "Peerless" stock car and the Santa Fe box car:

 

PICT0004 copy

PICT0005 copy

There was also a plain, black-painted flat/log/lumber car that goes with these, it uses the exact matching black frame with some side stakes riveted on.

 

The second freights were a matching set in the late 1930's, and they all had cream sides with red roofs and trim, and were all labeled "Overland Freight" and/or "Overland Flyer".  I think these are fairly uncommon to see.

 

Later, from the late 1930's through the early 1950's, Hafner made what I think of as two other kinds of freight cars.  One was the rounded-corner type, for which they used the same stampings as their streamlined passenger cars, so I think of these as their "streamlined freight".  

 

The final type is the one that I most often see for sale: longer, 6" to 6-1/2" cars like the "Grand Canyon" box car, the 1010 and Phillips 66 tank cars, and the 91746 and 91876 gondolas in several color variations, as well as matching livestock, hopper, and several versions of caboose. The nomenclature got a little strange with these, as Hafner called the gondolas "sand cars", and the coal hoppers they called "gondolas", don't know what they were thinking.  Collectors usually call them by their more common names, but once in a while you get a Hafner die-hard selling a hopper and calling it a gondola, something to be alert to.

 

My favorites are the ones I have pictured here, and you don't see them as often.  They have Joy-Line-type hook couplers and the lithography and styling are very typically pre-war tinplate, and toy-like.

 

don't know if this helps any,

 

anybody with more complete knowledge of Hafner, please correct and amplify.

 

david

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Images (2)
  • PICT0004 copy
  • PICT0005 copy
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by hafner33:

Not a Hafner expert in spite of my user name was my first set as a very young kid. Some pictures of 50's freight and 20's passenger that I pickup over the years 

Those orange and brown boxcars in your first photo are very interesting to me - I've never seen anything like them.  Nice!  The coaches sure look very comparable to AF, Ives and Lionel ones of the period.  Again, very intriguing.  (The layout is beautiful, too!)   Thanks for the photos. 

Hafner also made and Century of Progress sets, M10000 streamliners in several colors and 8-wheel coaches and boxcars. The 8-wheel cars are relatively rare and command high prices. They were all from the Overland Flyer era. The rounded frame boxcars were produced at the point where Wyandotte purchased the company, and were continued as Wyandotte items. the Wyandotte style boxcars and freights also appear later in the fifties as Plastimarx after Wyandotte sold the stampings to Marx. Most were litho'ed Ferrocarilles. For example, Hafner produced the 2000 clockwork engine in black and red/blue/silver litho, Plastimarx used the same engine shell in green/yellow/black and silver/orange/black. It should also be noted that Hafner locos were always clockwork.

I purchased the Hafner/Wyandotte book, great info and scads of photos.

 

How did I do Gary?

Last edited by Jim O'C

Originally Posted by TrainsRMe:

...

Those orange and brown boxcars in your first photo are very interesting to me - I've never seen anything like them.  Nice!  The coaches sure look very comparable to AF, Ives and Lionel ones of the period.  ...

 William Hafner and William Coleman jointly formed American Flyer in 1910 but rumored disagreements between the two caused a split with Hafner forming his own company in 1914.  for the first few years of production, the two companies produced nearly identical cars.  i have two early red gondolas and i've yet to figure out which is Hafner and which is Flyer.

 

unfortunately i recently lost a bunch of pictures including almost everything Hafner, but on the positive side, it was a project i wanted to reshoot anyway.  here are a few oddball scans...

 

Haf1

on the right are three late (postwar) production Hafner cars (Type IX frame) including the ATSF boxcar you mentioned in your response.  on the left, despite still bearing the Hafner name, are three Wyandotte production cars.  the b/w circle logo is all that was added to many of the pieces.

 

below are three late prewar sets lead by the seemingly unending variety of the #1010 locomotive...

 

Haf2

 

Haf3

 

Haf4

 

a few more Type VIII frame cars.

 

Haf5

VIII(a) on the right, VIII(b) on the left (short frame).

 

Jim, the only thing i'll question is that i don't believe any of these Type VIII frame cars were continued by Wyandotte, by the time the company was sold, the #2000 type locomotives along with the Type IX frame cars were being produced for years.

 

i do agree there are probably more rare Hafner passenger cars than freight.

on a good day a single 8-wheel car in C7 condition will easily top $1000.

 

definitely invest in the Greenberg (Doyle) book if you want a very thorough cross-section of Hafner production.  as you will gather before long, it would be close to impossible to collect every variation, so it's always fun looking.

 

good luck.

cheers...gary

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Images (5)
  • Haf1
  • Haf2
  • Haf3
  • Haf4
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Hafner did not sell anything but passenger cars/sets for almost their first ten years of operation.  when they finally started to feature freight cars, they went to Bing who was already supplying them with some accessories and stations.

 

in the Doyle text there are only nine Bing freight cars listed as supplied by Hafner, but there were at least twice that many Bing independently released into the US market which are definitely compatible.  here are a few of my favorites that were in the Hafner catalog...

 

Untitled-4

Untitled-7

Bing - Peerless Tank Line - 1000-sm

Untitled-11

Untitled-13

notice that the US market cars all feature the sinple tab/slot coupler as opposed to their European models.  not sure if there is a name for those hook/ loop type.

 

they also fit in very well with the early Flyer 5½" freight cars...

 

Bing - CNJ 10205 vs Flyer IC 1110

 

i have a few cabooses which are also compatible with this 4wh size, but one Bing/ Hafner car which still eludes me is the Bing NYC&HRRR caboose.

 

cheers...gary

Attachments

Images (6)
  • Bing - Peerless Tank Line - 1000-sm
  • Untitled-4
  • Untitled-7
  • Untitled-11
  • Untitled-13
  • Bing - CNJ 10205 vs Flyer IC 1110
Last edited by overlandflyer
beardog posted:
Steve "Papa" Eastman posted:

 Since these photo's were taken, I have sold almost all of the later pieces and added a few more of the early pieces.

 

Steve

 

 

Wall of Hafner 1

 

 

 

Hello, can you tell me anything about the two light green gondolas on the second shelf down?

Thanks, John

John, the Loco, tender, two gondola's and caboose are Marx floor toys.

Steve

Steve "Papa" Eastman posted:
beardog posted:
Steve "Papa" Eastman posted:

 Since these photo's were taken, I have sold almost all of the later pieces and added a few more of the early pieces.

 

Steve

 

 

Wall of Hafner 1

 

 

 

Hello, can you tell me anything about the two light green gondolas on the second shelf down?

Thanks, John

John, the Loco, tender, two gondola's and caboose are Marx floor toys.

Steve

thanks, Steve. I got one of the gondolas in a lot of marx I bought, no wheels or couplers and unmarked.

John

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