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Hello 
I am here in Brazil and I also love my trains Lionel, MTH and Williams ...
I recently started to restore a Berk # 736 Postwar locomotive, that with very bad original wheels ...
I already imported US, new wheels for replacement and has started to dismantle, remove the old wheels ...
However I found a "problem" and I was anxious to continue the dismantling of the wheels ...
My doubt is:
How do I Remove the Worm Wheel (726-125) of locomotia?  
If I remove one of the wheels, usually the Worn Wheel, will leave alone?  
I am concerned to take this next step without before I take all the doubts ...
Thanks for your attention.20161017_19430720161017_19431320161017_19432820161017_19433720161017_194346
  Big hug  
Gilbero.P. Luizello 

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  • How do I remove the set of drive wheels and Worn Wheel of Postwar Locomotive 736?
  • How do I remove the set of drive wheels and Worn Wheel of Postwar Locomotive 736?
  • How do I remove the set of drive wheels and Worn Wheel of Postwar Locomotive 736?
  • How do I remove the set of drive wheels and Worn Wheel of Postwar Locomotive 736?
  • How do I remove the set of drive wheels and Worn Wheel of Postwar Locomotive 736?
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This is typical for many post war locomotives.

First - you need the proper tools - a good gear puller (to remove one wheel) and press the drive gear off the shaft.

You also need the proper set of wheel 'cups' that have the proper offset to reinstall the wheels so they are 'quartered' properly.

Wheel cups are quite common, so are gear pullers. 

My advise - if you have never done this before - either get someone to do it, or be careful.

bruce

 

 

 

Your title says you have a 736 Berkshire. But the chassis pictured above is from a 1947-1949 726 Berkshire.
Some of the parts, such as the wheels and axles are different between the two. I'd have to check, I think the worm gear may be different too.
Lionel never sold wheel cups that would fit a nickel rimmed Berkshire wheel. As far as I know, Hobby Horse is the only outfit that made the proper cup.

Judging by the appearance of your chassis, I'd guess that at least the faces of your axle bearing are worn. I'd suggest doing one of the following:

1 - replace the axle bearings

2 - put shim washers on the axles between the wheels and the axle bearings. I typically use 671M-19 or 671M-23 washers.

Hello guys, good night ... 
In my "Shell" printed the number 736! 
But as I bought used, I think this locomotive may have suffered "mutations". 
I had to remove the wheels because they were "stuck" with some kind of glue to remain fixed to the axes ... 
The damage here is great ... 
Yes I also think I will have to replace the bushings on all wheels and I bought these M 671-19 as I saw in Greenberg's Repair Operating Manual for Lionel Trains 1945 -1969 ... 
This is my first restoration, I have a lot to learn yet, and especially with the right tools to use ... For here in Brazil I will not find a Lionel pulley puller, I had to adapt one and it worked ... but great care is needed!
I learn
Thank you for listening to all of you !!!
And sorry my English! 
Gilberto ... 

Last edited by Gilberto

Proper tools are best, but if you wish to attempt riskier homemade effort:

You might try cutting washers to a U shape to fill the gap between frame and gear, and pressing the axle out with a vice. You can use them to reassemble also.

   Once the axle is flush to the frame however, you would need to use a small drift to drive it further. A hammer and drift used lightly may be possible at this point used carefully. So might the vice, if you can find something short and stable for pressing with. A drillpress might be used as a press, able to hold a drift straight . If both wheels are removed, putting the axle into a drillpress chuck, you may be able to pull the axle rather than press, but I'd start with pressing first, as more force is usually needed as a process like this begins, less as it moves along.

Also, if you have all new parts; wheels, bushings, gear, axles, and access to a modeling rotory tool (Dremel) and cut off discs (reinforced are best)  why not cut the brass gear off? With a drillpress and bit,  you might be able to thin the gear enough to crack it in half by twisting a screwdriver to pry it apart. Once the gear is gone the axle should remove much easier.

Tape or thick paper on sockets (tool) for wheel protection, or a hard wood with a stepped hole, can be used as cups for installing the new parts. Keeping all parts aligned well during reassembly is very important. It is easy to bend an axle while pressing.The result of a bent axle will be a wheel and / or a body wobble as your train runs, and / or rod issues and / or short gear life or gear bind (locks up).

Best of luck to you, and please let us know your progress.

 

The axle with the gear is easily driven out with a pin punch. I recommend using a brass one if available. This eliminates the chance of damaging the end of the axle.
As it's driven through, the splines for the gear may score the inside to the bearing it goes through. I do not know of a way to avoid that.
When I install a new bearing, I like to put the shank (uncut part) of a tight fitting drill bit in the hole to prevent it from becoming smaller as it is pressed in place.
Once again, when the axle is put through, the splines for the gear may cause a little scoring inside the bearing. If anyone knows a way to avoid this, I would like to read about it.
The problem with pressing one wheels without proper cups is the fact that most wheels, including your nickle rimmed berk ones, are not flat. If you don't care to buy cups, you will have to rig something up.
Before Lionel sold presses and cups, they advised repair folks to make their own cups, and use a metal lathe to press on the wheels. This was done by putting the cups in the head stock and tail stock, and advancing the tail stock closed.
Not owning a lathe, I've never tried it.

Once I had a press, I started buying cups as I needed them.

One more comment.
Be careful how you move forward with replacing those axle bearings.
In your picture above, the bearing for the second axle from the front looks like it probably is correct (thin and unflanged). But the other two look to be too thick. Your chassis may have been modified to use whatever bearings the repair person had available.

In air cooled VW motors there are brass distributor drive gears. Freezing the part, the metal contracts allowing the gear to slip on verses being pressed if done quickly. Its actually in at least one manual (haynes if I recall) The metal is contracting on its self and the hole becomes larger. It never made sense offhand, but I never did the math either because it works. The same gear will need to be cut, or need a puller to come off. The tolerances there are much closer, but for a train, it may minimize the issue with the splines and even negate pressing the bearing into the frame. I realize the bearings might be bronze (?) and be affected differently (?) but its worth a try (for CW) considering the price of a bearing is so cheap. If it works out, try the gear next.

I want to point out that freezing the gear is the opposite of normal practice. Most gears.are heated for expansion to do the same job, some even freeze the crank. Either method seems to work. I don't know know metallurgy for brass that deeply, I was told (not read) it was the brass's contraction properties, thickness, diameter, and hole diameter in combination that made it work. A cold gear is easier to handle than a hot one, I had no issues, got paid by the hour and did as I was asked. I did my own that way 3 times after. Did I get lucky? I didn't do the math.

That said, the main advantage would be the bearings might not need pressing to the frame because that is the outer diameter of the bearing and the OD is shrinking for sure. My not fully understanding about the motors gear was an ID contraction based thing. If the gear contracts, seems the hole should too????? Math is needed before I'll ever truly understand what I was doing.

Ok guys,
I will read and reread all the information, tips and teachings that were posted here and of course try to follow the one I find most appropriate for my situation ...
But I realemente am very grateful for all this attention you are giving me ...
Fantastic...
Yes I'll tell you how is developing my disassembly and reassembly ...
But this may take because I will do as I have time left to "play" with my trains ...
Once again, thank you and a big hug to everyone!
Gilberto ...

Is it possible that once the old bearings are out that you can assemble the axle with a new gear in the chassis first and then slide the new bearing over the axle onto the journal and press into the chassis? This would overcome the problem of putting the bearings in first and damaging them by forcing the knurled part for the gear through one of them.

Is it possible that once the old bearings are out that you can assemble the axle with a new gear in the chassis first and then slide the new bearing over the axle onto the journal and press into the chassis?

Sometimes the bearing compresses as it's being pressed in place and the size of the bore is reduced, causing  the axle to bind in the bearing. The bearing then needs to be reamed. Impossible to do with the axle there.
Other times that is the way to go.

Last edited by C W Burfle
Gilberto posted:

Hello guys, good night ... 
In my "Shell" printed the number 736! 
But as I bought used, I think this locomotive may have suffered "mutations". 
I had to remove the wheels because they were "stuck" with some kind of glue to remain fixed to the axes ... 
The damage here is great ... 
Yes I also think I will have to replace the bushings on all wheels and I bought these M 671-19 as I saw in Greenberg's Repair Operating Manual for Lionel Trains 1945 -1969 ... 
This is my first restoration, I have a lot to learn yet, and especially with the right tools to use ... For here in Brazil I will not find a Lionel pulley puller, I had to adapt one and it worked ... but great care is needed!
I learn
Thank you for listening to all of you !!!
And sorry my English! 
Gilberto ... 

I think you're right about "mutations" I have never seen, nor heard of, a 736 with Baldwin disk drivers only spoked drivers were used on the 736. It should also have the magnets for Magnetraction if it's a 736 or at lest a place that mounts them on the frame. The Baldwin disks were used on the 726 which didn't have Magnetraction nor a place to mount magnets, in the frame. So the question is do you have a 736 with 726 drivers or a 726 frame and drivers with a 736 boiler? 

Bogie

Last edited by OldBogie

   Im pretty sure there is an old (b&w) documentary video that covers that quickly (like two seconds); Marx, Lionel? No telling, I watch the Euro videos too....And I was told as a kid, an original steam bearing lasted longer than a replacement from not having to be pressed over the raised splines...???? I was also sent on snipe hunts at, so you never can tell

My grandfather had blank axles, and I know he had a spline, press similar to a pipe flairing block press. It came in handy on resetting some loose Marx wheels though the pattern was off. He had arbors for the flat pressed onto car axles too. Bought or made?; its tough to say.

 I have not seen this done on parts for any other locos.

I have a bunch of wheel / axle assemblies, purchased from Madison Hardware (Detroit) in a wheel grab bag, that are new old stock. None of them have the bearings.
The wheel sets for a 1946 Berkshire are found as an assembly, with the wheels, axle, and both bearings. I have a few of those too.


Madison Hardware Detroit? You know I thought there was one here at one time. But with all the mention of the shop over the years, I thought it was an east coast thing.

When Madison Hardware was owned and run by Lou Shur and his brother Carl, it was in New York City. Lou sold the business to Richard Kughn, who relocated it to Detroit. Often when I mention Madison Hardware, I will put (NYC) or (Detroit) after it because to me there is a difference.

While the business was in Detroit, they would periodically issue sale flyers. I purchased some stuff from those flyers, including wheels and armatures by the pound. The quality of those parts varied. Some were nice, NOS parts, others were usable seconds, and some were just garbage. Overall, I was happy with  what I purchased.

The Berkshire wheels I mentioned above did not come from Madison. I picked them up when I was focused on 1946 Berkshires.

Last edited by C W Burfle

get a bigger hammer!!! and Im NOT kidding. this came right from my parts guy, Jeff Kane of

ttender.com

hold the locomotive in your lap in a pile of towels for cushioning. take a nail set slightly smaller

than the diameter of axle. place on the axle and wrap it with the hammer. wheels will pop right off.

you will then need to keep pounding the axle thru the body to dislodge the gear. Ive done this and it works everytime.

no wheel puller needed.

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