Happen to see someone uploaded this. But I ask, are the sounds in this unit that good? It sound's real. Also can these sounds be added to 3 Rail units or only 2?
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Impressive !
With the right speaker, anything is possible:
http://forum.aorailroad.com/t/.../15?u=centralfan1976
Weve talked about upgraded sounds here before, take a look around it's got to be here somewhere.
Thanks,
Mario
Now that's impressive.
that looks like Matt Forsyth's workbench (Forsyth Rail Services). he has been working with QSI Titan Q3 decoders lately, though I cannot confirm the FM has that installed.
Even larger speakers than the one Mario referenced can be fitted in covered wagons such as single-tower drive P&D F3s. Here is a near-field recording I made of a Tang Band 1828SD speaker module. Its passive bass radiator extends useful bass down to about 75-100 Hz. It is being driven by a Loksound V4L decoder playing a 567 B/C 76311 sound file. Installation will require machining a large hole in the brass frame so that the passive radiator end can pass through and fire down towards the rails. When this recording was made, I held the speaker vertically, about 1/2" above the desk top, in the same position as it will be mounted. Sound from the active driver will escape through etched chicken wire dynamic brake grills on the side and top of the car body.
If you have external computer speakers, turn them up!
Link to recording hosted by Smugmug.
Bob
Lets all remember that it is Train Master! The term "Trainmaster" is a management position in the railroad industry.
I've been messsing with this stuff for years, Bob.
That's the best I've heard. 
Folks,
Yes, this is my work, here @ Forsyth Rail Services-Gibson Shops, and yes, the sounds are emanating from under the hood of the model.
The loco is a C&LS (Car and Locomotive Shops) PRR Train Master.
It sports dual Pittman motors, a ball-bearing drivetrain, and belongs to a Client from Florida. It was custom-fitted with a 6 amp QSI Titan Magnum decoder, running a modified Q3 Fairbanks-Morse 38D-12 sound file. Speaker is a TDS 1.22HB with a custom enclosure.
It also has individual, sound-synchronized, micro-motor driven cooling fans. Here's a video of them spinning up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We4_qJab0Og
Matt Forsyth
PRR Man posted:that looks like Matt Forsyth's workbench (Forsyth Rail Services). he has been working with QSI Titan Q3 decoders lately, though I cannot confirm the FM has that installed.
Yup .... that trainmaster is Matt Forsyth's with a Titan Magnum.
I'm kinda excited about my journey into 2-rail.
Jim
Sorry, Matt.
I meant Bob's Tang Band 1828SD speaker.
The loco is quite good, as well.
No problem...
MF
Penn Division posted:
It also has individual, sound-synchronized, micro-motor driven cooling fans. Here's a video of them spinning up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We4_qJab0Og
Matt Forsyth
That sir is exceptional work....
Man!!! That trainmaster is cool! Wonderful work!
Who is the manufacturer of this ALCO engine on your YouTube channel? Thanks, Matt
Too cool, makes you ask what the MTH and Lionel have been doing for the past 10 years? Is this something that can be put in a 3 rail DCS or Legacy locomotive?
Sounds great!
That sounds like the real thing, turbo whine and all! Why can't MTH or Lionel sound even close to that?
That rates a WOW! 
" Boooooooom! it just blew up real good!
Lionel and MTH don't sound like that because DCC is an open standard and there is competition between manufacturers driving constant improvements to try and continually gain market share. Lionel and MTH are proprietary closed formats so you'll get what they supply and you'll like it . Come over to the dark side (2 Rail DCC), it is getting better every day as sound amplification and speaker technology are improving rapidly as the growing demand for miniaturized devices but with big sound keeps driving technology improvements.
Also, the investment in sound decoder firmware development, hardware development, and attaining quality sound recordings is not cheap, but dedicated DCC sound decoder manufacturers have the economies of scale on their side, they are able to sell far greater numbers of units across multiple manufacturers and across multiple scales (even N scale now with the use of cell phone speaker technology) to repay for their investment, where Lionel and MTH are only selling limited quantities to just their product lines – which, being O Scale, is just a small fraction of the overall numbers that the DCC sound products sell to. The proprietary closed model will always keep Lionel and MTH generations behind DCC sound technology but if you want a Lionel / MTH model of XYZ locomotive with sound then you'll fork over the cash for what they are selling because that is all there is. At least with DCC, if the sound that comes with the model is inferior, we have the option to upgrade - and we do .
Scott K.
Austin, TX
The absolute best horn I've ever heard! The prime mover sounds are amazing. I'd love to have this in my VGN FM's.
Only one problem, the ALCO 539 turbo was used in the S-2 and S-4 switchers as well as the RS-1 road switcher. The RS-3 used a model 244 engine which sounded much different. But, I sure wish I had those decoders in my two ALCO switchers. The sound is spot on.
Wes Morgenstern posted:Only one problem, the ALCO 539 turbo was used in the S-2 and S-4 switchers as well as the RS-1 road switcher. The RS-3 used a model 244 engine which sounded much different. But, I sure wish I had those decoders in my two ALCO switchers. The sound is spot on.
Matt was illustrating different prime mover sounds using that same engine ..... 539T, 244, different 251C's, etc
Its a wonderful time for DCC, and for model trains ....
Matt01 posted:Man!!! That trainmaster is cool! Wonderful work!
Who is the manufacturer of this ALCO engine on your YouTube channel? Thanks, Matt
Matt,
The loco is an older Weaver with a horizontal drive. Thanks for taking note that the text says ALCo 539 Turbo 6 cylinder "TEST".
The ALCo RS3 was produced with the 244 prime mover, and some were later rebuilt with EMD engines (RS3m), and others with the newer ALCo 251 engine (RS3u). I didn't have an S2 available, and a Client of mine wanted to hear a demo of the 539T, so I programmed the RS3.
I've been testing the new ALCo FT (Full Throttle) sound files from LokSound.
I've also done some testing of their EMD FT sounds...Here's the EMD 645-12 cylinder in a GP39-2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2XNjkBP0tY
Matt Forsyth
Matt01 posted:Matt was illustrating different prime mover sounds using that same engine ..... 539T, 244, different 251C's, etc
Its a wonderful time for DCC, and for model trains ....
It certainly is a good time for DCC and model trains! DCC seems to be really improving in the sounds category and also with decoders for the larger scales. Some very good choices for sound.
Wow I had no idea this topic would get this many replies. Matt, I'm sending you an email about this with the sounds.
It doesn't sound good because of the speaker, it sounds good because the sound is accurate. Unlike three rail sound systems. (except for true blast plus which is really Tsunami Soundtrax)
Penn Division posted:Folks,
Yes, this is my work, here @ Forsyth Rail Services-Gibson Shops, and yes, the sounds are emanating from under the hood of the model.
The loco is a C&LS (Car and Locomotive Shops) PRR Trainmaster.
It sports dual Pittman motors, a ball-bearing drivetrain, and belongs to a Client from Florida. It was custom-fitted with a 6 amp QSI Titan Magnum decoder, running a modified Q3 Fairbanks-Morse 38D-12 sound file. Speaker is a TDS 1.22HB with a custom enclosure.
It also has individual, sound-synchronized, micro-motor driven cooling fans. Here's a video of them spinning up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We4_qJab0Og
Matt Forsyth
THAT is why it sounds good.
Steven Michael posted:It doesn't sound good because of the speaker, it sounds good because the sound is accurate. Unlike three rail sound systems. (except for true blast plus which is really Tsunami Soundtrax)
Great observation, Steven...spot on.
The speaker (and its acoustically matched enclosure) in this model are of high quality, but it's the quality and accuracy of the original recordings, and how those sounds are being reproduced by the decoder's processor that makes all the difference.
Now, Bob's Tang Band demo does kick a** with that killer speaker, but here again the LokSound 567 file he's using is superb, so it's a win-win.
"Stock", 3 Rail sounds are usually pretty abysmal, generic, and the big mfgs. also have no problem equipping those models with the cheapest Chinese speaker on the market; often far less than $1 ea. their cost. So that then compounds an already bad situation...(garbage in = garbage out).
Matt Forsyth
Matt is right. It takes a combination of an excellent recording coupled with a quality speaker installation. A poor OEM speaker can make the best decoder sound bad, just as a bad recording can make a great speaker sound bad.
This is a Car & Locomotive Shop RS-11 being fitted with a Loksound V4 decoder and a quite small Tang Band 1925S speaker module. This module has a 1" speaker and a large oval passive bass radiator. The radiator extends bass response by about an octave. The speaker is located directly under the radiator fan grill.
This tiny speaker produces cleaner sound with far more bass than a 2.07" QSI high-bass speaker I formerly installed in F-units.
Next is a video clip of a similar install, this time in a C&LS RS-36. There's nothing special here, just a quick iPhone video grab, no editing.
Link to RS-36 video hosted by Smugmug
Bob S
That RS36 was in another post last week. That sound set is amazing to me. I like the dynamics of how it runs with the engine.
With DCS, you have to toggle the rev up or rev down or labor buttons manually to get variation like that. Otherwise, it acts like it's always under full load of pulling a train.
It's also nice to see brass engines with sound being installed. Most users run quiet. Having sound adds so much.
I'm so glad to see more people getting into really high quality sound. As an audiophile that grew up in a recording studio, sound has always been at the top of my priority list. We are just now getting to the point where I am truly pleased with what can be done. I've been dabbling in the smaller scales lately and even they are getting pretty good sound for their size. But you can't beat a good O scale installation. I have a coupe hundred dollars worth of Tang Band speakers on the way to me now and I can't wait to get them installed. It's a great time to be in the hobby.
EBT Jim posted:Yup .... that trainmaster is Matt Forsyth's with a Titan Magnum.
Matt01 posted:Man!!! That trainmaster is cool! Wonderful work!
I know a lot of you guys don't seem to give a crap about things like this, but the locomotive under discussion here is a Fairbanks Morse "Train Master." It's two words and it's a proper trade name. Calling it a "trainmaster" is like calling a prized and classic Corvette a "chevy."
A "trainmaster" is a middle management company officer on a railroad.
Matt, I sent you an email back in regards to the VGN FM.
I wrote:
"Stock", 3 Rail sounds are usually pretty abysmal, generic, and the big mfgs. also have no problem equipping those models with the cheapest Chinese speaker on the market...
Please note that I said "usually", by no means is than an absolute. Some of the new 3 Rail loco factory sounds aren't that bad; they have improved tremendously in the last few years.
When I posted that a member quickly put up a YouTube vid of a Lionel Legacy SD40, as an exemplar and asked "is this generic?". The post was just as quickly taken down, and I don't know if by Rich Melvin or by the poster. Either way, I just wanted to say that my above comment was not meant to flame anyone, any product, or anything, and if it did, my apologies.
I own several MTH and Lionel locomotives.
MTH Premier (recent run with etched details): SD60M, SD45...
Lionel: U30C, U33C, 2)RS11, 2)GP30...
My models all came as dummies, and are being converted to 2 Rail (Proto 48) with new pilots, horizontal drive trains, and QSI and LokSound DCC/Sound.
In an earlier post J Daddy wrote, "Too cool, makes you ask what the h*** MTH and Lionel have been doing for the past 10 years?"
Good question. Sound is very very subjective, but I think his query has merit. When you have a proprietary system (Lionel/MTH), and a captive audience, you get to make the rules and decide what's "acceptable" . When you don't have either of those, and there's lots of competition, you really have to up your game.
Here again is that YouTube vid of the Lionel Legacy SD40...
The EMD SD40 was built between January of 1966 and August of 1972, with 1,268 units produced. The prime mover used for this engine was the 16 cylinder, turbo charged EMD 645E3, that produced 3000 hp.
I own an Proto 48, Penn Central SD40, but it's not fully operational.
As a comparative, here is a quick vid clip of LokSound's EMD 645E3-16. This was made somewhat "RioGrande491-Bob S. style", but with no Tang Band on hand I played it directly from the LokSound software. And even though this is not coming from under the hood of my SD40, it is the exact sound file that is loaded onto the decoder, and gives you a pretty good idea of what the model will sound like.
Matt Forsyth
Matt,
Great work!
Larry
It IS a great time for this stuff!
With great people here on the forum showing/illustrating their work with DCC sound .... speaker selection and installation/modification .... tweaking fine motor control .... etc
I'm kinda excited by it all. It's real modeling to me. 2-Rail O scale modeling, with all the fun that can be had with DCC, has made me forget about HO.
Sorry for the video quality of the video and the slight rattling from shell as it isn't screwed on, but it's about the sound. Here are before and after Tang Band module installation videos:
Before:
After:
Boy! That's a significant improvement, Jonathon.
Nice job there, Jonathan!
I bet that it would sound even better if you disconnected the pancake speaker under the cab.
It's interesting to see and hear what you guys are doing to improve the audio. I think the manufacturers are realizing their shortcomings and are starting to make improvements in their audio components in the new stuff they release. I have also worked in the audio world and appreciate good sound.
No one has mentioned the sound of the MTH FM Train Master out of the box. I am really impressed with the improved bass and fullness of the Train Master's startup and run sequences. None of my other 15 MTH engines come close to the powerful sounds coming from this unit. It is one of my favorite engines.
