Latest Flyer Cancellation

I think pre-orders are going to be the determining factor for items being produced from now on and something we all need to get used to, whether we like it or not. I know some folks pre-order and some are totally against it, but if you really want something, a pre-order will go a long way to help insure that it gets made. Otherwise it has a very good chance of ending up like the item above, cancelled. This may be even more important to the S scale folks.

I think this will become more important to dealers and distributors as well. If they don't see a lot of pre-orders, I doubt they are going to order very many of an item for their stock. No one wants to be stuck with a bunch of items they may end up having to sell for minimum or no profit just to get rid of. They won't stay in business long operating like that.

If this will be the "wave of the future", pre-orders with no guarantees to be made, or when if ever, and possible be cancelled. I'll keep my eyes and money toward manufacturers like Menard's, or secondary market for items that have been made. My deposit's receive no interest while waiting for a delivery or refund when items are cancelled. One reason I will no longer pre-order, too many cancellations, and waiting times.

"letter my LHS received"

Please explain LHS for those who don't know what this means...Thanks

LHS = Local Hobby Shop - LTS = Local Train Shop

Here is a list - Often Used Abbreviations on the OGR Forum

If you have any to add, please post to the linked thread and they will be added to the list.

In spite of the debate over pre-orders, no surprise here. I suspect this crane and boom were greeted with a collective yawn followed by the sound of crickets from the S gauge community.

One does wonder how Lionel comes up with inspiration for products for S. The crane and boom has been offered many ways and how many crane and boom collectors are there in our minority scale. Also at least in my view the 3 rail approach doesn't work in S. It seems like if it is Daylight or Warbonnet no matter the piece is, O gauger's will buy.

American Models got a lot of buzz from the RS 11. Go figure. Maybe Rusty is right and Lionel is not talking to right group. 

I have NEVER understood what Lionel is trying to do with AF. 

Just speaking for me (Hi Rail deep flange and AF couplers kind of guy that runs with AC on Gargraves with AF switches) , I have never wanted more than 3 "Flyonel" items from a given Catalog since the beginning of Lionel production of AF.  When SHS printed catalogs, I never wanted less than 10 items from a given catalog.  

Even though the Daylight Crane looked really attractive to me I owned the SP Crane that Lionel produced for TTOS  (admittedly a Lionel Crane on Flyer trucks) in Daylight colors in 2000, so the new crane wasn't a "gotta have it" item.  I suspect that if they had produced the Crane and if I saw it at a train show for a good price, I might have made an impulse purchase and bought it.  

You gotta wonder about how they market items.  They bring out their catalog at a time when most of us are just digging out from our Christmas bills and when we are in a bad mood, since the items we ordered from their last catalog were not delivered for Christmas.  If we don't put in an order in 2 months, they cancel the item.  That just seems like a really bad model for generating sales.

Little Tommy

"One does wonder how Lionel comes up with inspiration for products for S. The crane and boom has been offered many ways and how many crane and boom collectors are there in our minority scale."

   Probably less than the number of guys who'd buy a 57 foot mechanical reefer for their layout? A wrecking crane just sits most of the time while the reefers roam the land so are more useful to a typical layout operator.....DaveB

Then there's this, cataloged since 2013:

Did anyone ever actually buy one of these things?

Unfortunately, I think this is the poster car for what Flyer is becoming. 

Perhaps, the last hope is with the FlyerChief Berks.

Rusty

I bought one of these and I like it.  I am disappointed that it took so long.  I have decided not to buy anything else until they are actually produced.  Yes, I know that may keep things from being produced.  But I am tired of ordering things and then months later forgetting I ordered it and ordering it again.

I too wonder who Lionel listens to for suggestions on what to produce.  Rehashing things from old Gilbert molds, expensive engines too large to run on my home layout, scale cars that don't work, are just part of the list.  I have ordered nothing from the current Lionel catalog, but I did order 2 undec. RS11s.  Still waiting for a new catalog from MTH, but not expecting a whole lot.

Wayne

By the way, this is similar to the walking toy soldier Christmas car I created for myself.  I like that too.

Wayne

I am venturing into some Flyer from Lionel & also like the Zombie car, as well as the Pumpkin boxcar from a couple of years back.   Has there been a WAVE of zombie cars? No.  Folks must remember that all aspects of this train hobby of ours are based on personal likes & tastes.  There is nothing so sacred about S gauge that prevents those of us who wish to have  little fun with some whimsical operating cars with nice graphics from doing so.   No like.... no buy.... 

Ron

you are right, no matter how campy something may seem if it sells for Lionel because people like it they should make and sell it...and I'm no zombie hater, love the walking dead On AMC.  

the he frustration comes in when the 57' mechanical reefers (nice scale pieces) get the axe while fantasy pieces get produced, when it would seem that the people into a zombie box car are a nitch market compared to the people who would be interested in a scale piece. 

There is an issue of a failed commitment Lionel made to us that, at least So it seems.    

Ben 

Maybe they're both niche markets within S gauge.

Part of the reason that some of the more whimsical items are met with such scorn by some AF operators is the very difference between the Lionel and AF in the 50's.  

On the whole, Gilbert marketed AF as being more "realistic" and did not have Girls Trains, Aquarium Cars and other more Whimsical items.  As a result, many of those who liked those kind of items abandoned AF and went to Lionel either as kids or as adults, while many of those who stuck with AF or converted to it, did not embrace the fantasy side of the hobby.

Judging by posts on this forum, those who collect/operate both Lionel O and AF, and those who are into Lionel O and are looking to "expand" into S, don't find those fantasy items hard to deal with, and those who were "brainwashed" as kids by Gilbert's  advertising (to some extent, I am still "brainwashed") are appalled.

To some extent, the present Lionel marketing has to work against the power of the Gilbert marketing of the 1950's within the limited pool of folks who buy AF products.  It just goes to show how powerful that Gilbert marketing was on the minds of small boys (or how ineffective/absent the present Lionel marketing is).

Little Tommy