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LIONEL SHIPPING

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June 3, 2013 4:30 PM

Has anyone received any new items from Lionel in the past month or so. It seems nothing has been shipped for quite awhile.

 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 4:43 PM

The preorders are due soon, I would expect some items already made to be shipped shortly after that.

 

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June 3, 2013 5:39 PM

Unfortunately, stuff has not been well spaced out this year.  Lots of stuff originally slated for March, April and May have missed their mark.  So we'll likely see a boatload of stuff all at once!  I'm expecting summertime deliveries, but that's just a hunch -- nothing official.  Just seems like the factories are running WAY behind for some reason.  Almost like they've been idle in terms of toy train production for few months now.  Can't wait to hear the "party line".

David
 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 7:00 PM

Wood sided cabooses have arrived at dealers -- I got my Great Northern version last week.

 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 7:26 PM

and now we have two of the same topics within days of each other.

 

 http://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/t...48#17901966902344748

 

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June 3, 2013 7:32 PM

Looks like the first one began 5/22, 12 days before this one.

 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 8:59 PM

Originally Posted by RadioRon:

Looks like the first one began 5/22, 12 days before this one.

exactly the last time Lionel updated their web site.

 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by RadioRon:

Looks like the first one began 5/22, 12 days before this one.

The world can spin off its axis several times over in 12 days.  So it's more than fair game for someone to have missed the earlier thread and ask more questions.  No problem there.

 

I'd be more concerned with the fact that the published shipping schedules are pure fantasy.  Somewhat like the old airline trick of delaying flight departure postings every 10 minutes or so, when they know all along that the airplane ain't pushing back from the gate for another 2 hours due to mechanical issues.    If they told folks the truth up front, travelers would scramble for another flight (on another airline!).

 

Same games at play here.  Product shipping slips one month at a time, rather than tell buyers the raw truth that it's gonna be another 12 months before their "pre-ordered" must-have purchase is REALLY gonna be  produced.  After so MANY delays though, it's easy to understand how folks see through the smoke and mirrors, look elsewhere and go for Plan B.

 

Heck, it's taken Lionel so long to come out with their 18" CZ passenger set, I may very well resort to purchasing a set of Atlas-O cars... buying what's available now and gamble that they'll eventually follow through and deliver the diner, baggage and domed observation by 2015.    Yeah... I think I'll do that!    If I need to wait, I might as well just get a "full scale" set even if it takes an extra few months to a year to get everything just right.

 

David

 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 10:35 PM

I think Rocky Mountain has it about right (unfortunately). I ordered one item from the new catalog which Lionel service says it "has no info about when it will ship." (That's the Great Northern GP-35 separate diesel.) It isn't even listed on their shipping web page. 

Isn't the customer service department supposed to "have info" on its cataloged products?

 
 
 
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June 3, 2013 10:56 PM

after York in April 2013 there were interviews with Jerry Calabrese and Howard Hitchcock (that were posted here) that led us to believe Lionel had fixed most issues with China.  it was even pointed out that Lionel has a person from Lionel living in China overseeing operations. 

 

I find it interesting that after Howard Hitchcock was introduced posting on the OGR form from Lionel employees has been greatly reduce.

 

IMO something changed from what we were told.

 

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June 4, 2013 7:01 AM

Originally Posted by RockyMountaineer:
 

I'd be more concerned with the fact that the published shipping schedules are pure fantasy.  Somewhat like the old airline trick of delaying flight departure postings every 10 minutes or so, when they know all along that the airplane ain't pushing back from the gate for another 2 hours due to mechanical issues. 

Reminds me of the old joke:

 

"What time does the 8:00 train leave?"

 

Rusty

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 8:12 AM

I see that the latest (Updated today.) shipping schedule now shows that the (CZ and Milwaukee Road.) aluminum coaches that I have been patiently waiting for have been delayed (Yet again.) by a further 3 months at least.   

I'm starting to wonder if they will ever be produced in my lifetime. 

 

Nicole. 

Not quite dead yet.

 
 
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June 5, 2013 8:27 AM

I also see the President cars have been moved from May to July. The NS Heritage Diesels are now not due until Nov instead of May 2013.  Stay tunes for further delays or cancellations.

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 9:12 AM

S-2 Turbines to November!  Merry Christmas to me!

 

I suspected that the May date was all smoke and mirrors.

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 9:53 AM

Agree that following the updates and trying to read the tea leaves on the Lionel Shipping Schedule is a real nails-on-the-blackboard exercise. I had a few items from 2012 that I was following and finally gave up. They arrived when they arrived.

 

What’s interesting about the current schedule is the large number of items from the 2013 catalog that have May-August deliveries. Given that the Signature Catalog was just released in April (York week),  they obviously had stuff already produced, or close to it. Of course, that’s if you believe the dates. 

 

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June 5, 2013 10:42 AM

RE:  the updated shipping schedule dated 6/5/2013...

 

I guess this only proves what we've been alluding to all along here... namely that the importers really don't have a grip on what's being produced overseas nor when it's being produced.  I's not just Lionel either.  One of my LHS's didn't have a good feel about Atlas-O deliveries on stuff like the Gunderson sets either.  Seems everything's a mess of scheduling over in China.

 

Years ago I joked about there being ONE factory in China that produced all this stuff for everyone.  And depending on which executives were in town that week, the factory exterior sign changed names... And the lobby's welcome sign would be updated accordingly, welcoming that week's guests!  Maybe that was closer to reality than a joke.  

 

In any event, the stuff will arrive when it gets here.  That's the healthiest way to view things.  None of this stuff is critical for sure, but it does get tiresome at times.  

 

Nicole, I still have hopes we'll see a Milwaukee Road 18" aluminum passenger set from Lionel, but I've given up on their CZ and going to Atlas-O.  If I must wait THIS long, I'd rather have the real deal, even if it means stepping up to 21" cars and waiting for the complete set of cars to be delivered.    I'm thinking it will be 2015 before we see the domed observation car delivered from Atlas-O -- it's not clear Lionel's set will even have that.  Hopefully I'll still be alive to give my CZ it's official "inaugural" run.  

 

David

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 12:06 PM

I still maintain there's some level of marketing to it.

 

Most dealers had their pre-order deadline end of last week or very early this week.

 

I do not believe it's an accident that some of the items "slip" right after the orders are due in.  While I have no inside information, you can bet there are marketing types who think through all of this and have assigned likelihoods of orders for items based on when they indicate to the public that it should show up.

 

With all the griping (not un-deserved) about delays in this and other forums, I'm thinking the general model is a "indicating earlier shipment provides more orders than indicating later shipment".

 

For me, while I've not checked everything, at least the slip on the S-2 is welcomed.  I wavered a bit when deciding to order that and I actually was a little hesitant because it could already be on it's way.  (and while it's against my theory above, I feel a little less worried about an immediate blow out, since if they really were on shelves in the next month the quantities would have been decided long before orders were received).

 

-Dave

 

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 12:14 PM

Sigh . . .

 

It's probably just as frustrating for them as for us. 

 

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June 5, 2013 1:31 PM


>>S-2 Turbines to November!  Merry Christmas to me! 

I suspected that the May date was all smoke and mirrors.<<

 

I'd be surprised if Lionel had orders in the PW black #671.

Joe 

 
 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 1:59 PM

Looks like my two NS Heitage units and smoke fluid loader will be at least November before shipping.  Looks like they will be a Christmas delivery.  That means the Christmas decorated items will arrive sround March again.
 

-Keith, Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines

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June 5, 2013 2:21 PM

Originally Posted by Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines:
...  That means the Christmas decorated items will arrive sround March again.

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 2:37 PM

Originally Posted by JC642:


 

I'd be surprised if Lionel had orders in the PW black #671.

Joe 

 

Why?

 

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June 5, 2013 2:49 PM

Keith ...... which units did you order? My NS Heritage SD70's (Central of New Jersey) show a delivery date of October.
 
(They were supposed to go under the tree as a gift for me. If November is the ship date, I'm not going to count on it [not that I thought it was a sure thing, anyway]).
 
Thanks
Jim
 
Originally Posted by Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines:
Looks like my two NS Heitage units and smoke fluid loader will be at least November before shipping.  Looks like they will be a Christmas delivery.  That means the Christmas decorated items will arrive sround March again.

 

 

 

 

 

 
 
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June 5, 2013 3:06 PM

Even the die-cast tractors with piggyback trailers has been delayed AGAIN.  If I recall correctly this new July 13 ship date puts it at one-year or more beyond the original predicted ship date.

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 3:08 PM

Well My Southern Pacific Tank Train is now due in August, The add on cars are still showing April for Delivery, and the Dummy Engine for the set is off the list, which means its being shipped..Very Odd.............

 

 

 

Mark

 

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June 5, 2013 3:54 PM

Originally Posted by RockyMountaineer:
Originally Posted by Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines:
...  That means the Christmas decorated items will arrive sround March again.

There was more to the story than that , the AMERICAN builder of the cars went under. Luckily the Chinese bailed them out

 

 

-Chris

 
 
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June 5, 2013 4:10 PM

Originally Posted by ZWPOWER13:

       
... and the Dummy Engine for the set is off the list, which means its being shipped..Very Odd.............




Same thing happened with the CN piggyback set.  The 2nd powered unit and dummy unit were delivered last year.  But the boxed set has been delayed for the longest time now.

David
 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 9:24 PM

Where the SD40-2's and GP35's dropped from the Lionel 2013 Signature Edition catalog?

 

http://www.lionel.com/Products...ngSchedule/index.cfm

 
 
 
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June 5, 2013 9:49 PM

Sure looks like the SD40's bit the dust. Was really looking forward to ordering a Conrail one. Oh well, more money for other things! I hope they get re-cataloged in the  future.

 

 

Update 6/6: Spoke with Lionel this morning and they have not been dropped. They have shipped and will be in stock very soon if not already.

 

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Last edited by Notch 6 June 6, 2013 9:37 AM
 
 
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June 5, 2013 10:13 PM

Not necessarily, Lionels new way of saying "shipped" is by simply removing the item from the list altogether. (what a great idea.) Those diesels are still listed on "Ro's" website.

 

 

 

 

"But you don't want to be bamboozled. You don't want to be led down the primrose path! You don't want to be conned or duped. Have the wool pulled over your eyes. Hoodwinked! You don't want to be taken for a ride. Railroaded!"

 

 

 
 
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June 5, 2013 10:22 PM

Originally Posted by JC642:

>>S-2 Turbines to November!  Merry Christmas to me! 

I suspected that the May date was all smoke and mirrors.<<

 

I'd be surprised if Lionel had orders in the PW black #671.

Joe 

 

I agree. I ordered the 681 (with elephant ears - can't resist 'em). 671 seems to me to be the one that will get the fewest orders by far.

 

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June 5, 2013 11:32 PM

Well, I guess I'm in the minority on the 671! My order is in...hopefully, it'll be made.
 

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June 6, 2013 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by RickO:

... Those diesels are still listed on "Ro's" website.

I agree that we'll likely see these diesels.  Ro's website has an ETA of 6/10, and if you combine that with the fact that they're no longer listed on the shipping schedule, that could mean they have in fact shipped from Lionel.

 

OTOH, I've also noticed many other new items on Ro's site now simply indicate "N/S - ordered on request", rather than quoting a specific ETA with the need to continually update the info with new dates (which keep slipping a few months at a clip, and is a bit of a maintenance nightmare for the retailer).

 

David

 
 
 
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June 6, 2013 3:16 AM

According to Mike Reagan the items not on the shipping schedule are already in stock at Lionel:

 

http://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/t...71#17338734671237171

 

Not entirely clear why they have been sitting on them rather than shipping, but I guess it has to do with the order/distribution mechanics.

 
 
 
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June 6, 2013 5:21 AM

Originally Posted by Swafford:

Where the SD40-2's and GP35's dropped from the Lionel 2013 Signature Edition catalog?

 

Asked a local dealer about this, and according to the Lionel dealer website they are all listed as in stock or sold out which means they should be shipping very soon.

 
 
 
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June 6, 2013 6:25 AM

Originally Posted by RockyMountaineer:
 

 

OTOH, I've also noticed many other new items on Ro's site now simply indicate "N/S - ordered on request", rather than quoting a specific ETA with the need to continually update the info with new dates (which keep slipping a few months at a clip, and is a bit of a maintenance nightmare for the retailer).

 

David

I think thats his way of avoiding future "blowouts", if theres not 100 locos sitting in the back, no need to blow them out. The majority of items have said "ordered on request ever since they got stuck with those overpriced (underfeatured) berkshires that have yet to be blown out.

 

 

 

 

"But you don't want to be bamboozled. You don't want to be led down the primrose path! You don't want to be conned or duped. Have the wool pulled over your eyes. Hoodwinked! You don't want to be taken for a ride. Railroaded!"

 

 

 
 
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June 6, 2013 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by RickO:
... I think thats his way of avoiding future "blowouts", if theres not 100 locos sitting in the back, no need to blow them out. ...

Rick, I think that's indicative of a change in the way even the big dealers are working with Lionel now -- not wanting to be sitting on large inventories in this sluggish economy without a healthy pre-order level to justify a large initial order with Lionel.

 

Proof of this is the fact that Lionel is selling blow-outs direct to the consumer -- both via their occasional web store "sales" as well as the special warehouse events in NC -- rather than channel all those inventories thru places like Ro as they would have in the past.

 

While it's possible some of the larger dealers may occasionally have "sales" on items that haven't moved in their inventories for awhile, I'm more inclined to believe that the super-dooper blowouts that we saw on the Northerns, Mallets and EM-1's were originated by Lionel offering some of their excess warehouse inventories to dealers and distributors at lower internal costs.  Those dealers didn't blow them out on their own... They needed to get the lower internal cost down from Lionel in order to sell at $699-$799, so they could still make something on the deal.  ( Naturally, the dealers who are hurting when this happens are those who still have stock when they acquired their inventory at the earlier and higher internal cost, and then feel forced to lower prices to compete with dealers grabbing new inventory at the lower internal costs.  Messy, but it happens.)

 

David

 
 
 
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June 6, 2013 1:56 PM

Looking at the shipping schedule most freight cars in the new catalog are supposed to  be shipping by June. What do the deadlines to order mean if all items are coming soon.

 

Andrew

 
 
 
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June 6, 2013 3:42 PM

Originally Posted by falconservice:

 What do the deadlines to order mean if all items are coming soon.

 

Andrew

I would believe only a dealer could answer that and they probably will not.

 

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June 7, 2013 6:12 PM

It was updated again today. I could swear the Tanktrain cars, and the PS-4 Flat cars had been changed when they updated it a couple days ago. But they're still showing April. Unbelievable!

 

Bill

 
 
 
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