Blackwater Canyon Line - April 6, 2024 - Sanky Wanky Coffee Co, Almost Done

Here are photos of the room.  Yes the pink wall will be the first thing to go.  

Nice Mark, Looking forward to pic updates. I would be careful though with that wall heater, and would keep layout legs and boxes at a safe distance.

Joe Gozzo

Mark

From your description, it seems that you have an ambitious plan ahead.  What type of track are you planning to use?  If you decide to go with tubular, I may be able to help you with some pieces, turn-outs and miscellaneous stuff.  Also, when it come time for construction, and you need help, I would be happy to be of service.   I've got lots of tools and love to build stuff.  

I don't know what the minimum curve radius is for your Weaver cars, but I would suggest a single-track "hi-line" on fills and trestles like the P&WV/N&W as an O-72 or O-54 loop around the back of the layout (along the walls) with a siding to run your passenger trains and a through freight. To make the trains seem like they're going somewhere, make a backdrop that conceals a small 3 or 4 track staging yard. Maybe disguise the end of the backdrop with tunnels. Below the grade of the hi-line, you can have a point-to-point coal mine and timber road that interchanges with your hi-line. The coal road would probably have a maximum radius of O-42, and weave beneath the hi-line. If I have a free day later this week, I'll try to mock it up on SCARM. 

Also, if you need any help, let me know, and I'll see if I can find some time on a weekend. 

Trainlover160 posted:

Nice Mark, Looking forward to pic updates. I would be careful though with that wall heater, and would keep layout legs and boxes at a safe distance.

Joe Gozzo

That is for sure Joe!  We actually never turned it on the whole time our daughter had her studio.  The house we had when the girls were toddlers had them,  I found a stuffed animal next to one and it's fur was scorched.  I have a convection heater for the coldest weather.

Bob Severin posted:

Mark

From your description, it seems that you have an ambitious plan ahead.  What type of track are you planning to use?  If you decide to go with tubular, I may be able to help you with some pieces, turn-outs and miscellaneous stuff.  Also, when it come time for construction, and you need help, I would be happy to be of service.   I've got lots of tools and love to build stuff.  

 

 

 

 

Bob,

Thank you very much!!  I agree it is ambitious.  I think it will need more than one level.  I plan to use GarGraves and Ross on the main running areas, but may use tubular on sidings or a little yard for accessories.  Stay tuned to keep up to date,  

pittsburghrailfan posted:

I don't know what the minimum curve radius is for your Weaver cars, but I would suggest a single-track "hi-line" on fills and trestles like the P&WV/N&W as an O-72 or O-54 loop around the back of the layout (along the walls) with a siding to run your passenger trains and a through freight. To make the trains seem like they're going somewhere, make a backdrop that conceals a small 3 or 4 track staging yard. Maybe disguise the end of the backdrop with tunnels. Below the grade of the hi-line, you can have a point-to-point coal mine and timber road that interchanges with your hi-line. The coal road would probably have a maximum radius of O-42, and weave beneath the hi-line. If I have a free day later this week, I'll try to mock it up on SCARM. 

Also, if you need any help, let me know, and I'll see if I can find some time on a weekend. 

Dan,

I certainly like the way you are thinking!  The P&WV/N&W is an example I did not think of, since I am more familiar with railroads to the North.  That would call for some cool trestles indeed!  I will have to search for some photos.  I agree, the Weaver cars say they will take O54, but recommend O72.  They work on O54, but I have tried everything on O72 on the patio, and that is defiantly better.  One thing that helps viewing is being inside the curve instead of outside.  Yes, O42 would work for the coal road, weaving under the high line.  I have an MTH Premier H9 consolidation, a Premier 0-8-0 switcher, K-Line Pennsy A5, some F3 and F7 sets, 2 RS1 units; all scale.  I like 2-bay hoppers, shorter log cars, and 40-foot boxcars.  

Thank you very much!!!

My rebuild is going to be a similar size, roughly12-1/12 x 11=1/2 along with a complete redo of the basement into and I hate this word, "mancave". I was originally planning a full blown take no prisoners layout but since I need to isolate the trains from our cats a sealed off train room was the way to go. It's tough tho having a blank canvas and a million ideas, I wish you luck and look forward to what you come up with.

Jerry

For your main line I would definitely go with 072 curves.  If you use any tubular track I have a big box of almost new in the attic that is yours to use. The first thing I would do is tunnel through the wall in to the basement !!  My layout is about  11 1/2 ft square so space is at a premium.  I would use backdrops and false front buildings. accessories are neat but take up a lot of room.  I have a big opening in the middle for access, would love to use the space but the access is too nice to lose. Do you plan point to point, loops or both ??

baltimoretrainworks posted:

My rebuild is going to be a similar size, roughly12-1/12 x 11=1/2 along with a complete redo of the basement into and I hate this word, "mancave". I was originally planning a full blown take no prisoners layout but since I need to isolate the trains from our cats a sealed off train room was the way to go. It's tough tho having a blank canvas and a million ideas, I wish you luck and look forward to what you come up with.

 

Jerry

Hey Jerry!  I don't like the term 'man cave' either!  Walk out basement to the patio isn't really a cave anyway!  I know I have more ideas than room. Thank you, and good luck to you too!

jim pastorius posted:

For your main line I would definitely go with 072 curves.  If you use any tubular track I have a big box of almost new in the attic that is yours to use. The first thing I would do is tunnel through the wall in to the basement !!  My layout is about  11 1/2 ft square so space is at a premium.  I would use backdrops and false front buildings. accessories are neat but take up a lot of room.  I have a big opening in the middle for access, would love to use the space but the access is too nice to lose. Do you plan point to point, loops or both ??

Jim,

Thank you!  This room was part of an addition my in-laws put on so there is a brick and block wall to the next room.  My wife made a suggestion that I go through the door into the family room and connect onto the Ceiling Central RR, which was also her suggestion.  I thought it wouldn't work because everyone would hit their head, but looking or it, I could put a bridge in the upper right corner of the door and connect on.  If so, I would have to get a track up very high in the new room.  The other side of the brick wall window is the laundry area, and it won't work to run tracks out there.

i would like to do a loop to loop to make it look like the trains are returning, but may end up settling for loops only.

I think your plan is already a lot better than I could come up with. I am not much of a track planner, others here are much much better. I have been fiddling with an addition to my layout for about 1.5 years now and I don't think I am any closer than when I started. I think you have a much better idea of what you want as well. I also struggle with that part.

Looks like you also have some friends willing to lend a hand near by. I think it's good just to have them stop by and offer suggestions too. I think the natural brick wall is kind of neat too. Might be neat if you could work that into the layout some how, it would be something different than most. Just a thought...

Anyway, I wish you luck and I will be following along.  

Mark Boyce posted:

 The other side of the brick wall window is the laundry area, and it won't work to run tracks out there.

The first thing I thought was take it through the window and then I read it was your laundry room.   Could you take it right out the window and right back into the room?  It may give you more room for accessories.   

I like the idea of the larger curves on the bottom line and sharper curves on the second level.

Ever think about a point-to-point option for a third line?

Tim,

The washer, dryer, and stationary tub are right beyond the window, and that is all the wider the room is.  Yes, I could go out about a foot and a half at the most, as I already have a shelf there where I mounted the convection heater for my daughter when she used the room for an art studio.

Point to point third line?  I have thought a third line may be something at a low level where kids could run less expensive trains.  I have also thought of getting a Shay or Heisler someday to go into the mountains for logging.  Point to point could work for that.  Good point to bring up!!  Thank you!

Good to see the creative juices are flowing Mark. I would recommend that if you want to add operating accessories, figure out where they will go first. They take up a lot more space than you think. I like the multiple lines also. Gives you a place to showcase your collection and someplace to "play". A point to point with industries may be a good way to include the accessories you want. Maybe add a by-pass siding or two on the main lines so that you can have multiple trains ready to go.

Looking forward to more updates.

Bob

Hi Mark,

I know this design is very preliminary and I assume you know, but I thought I'd mention it just in case, that your lower level track is set to a height of 2.99" and the upper level to 6.1". Obviously, this will not work.

You also have your upper level track crossing over itself on the curves in the lower left section. Do you intend to have an over/under grade there or a crossing? The over/under on supports might be a challenge, but if your intent was a crossing, I don't believe Ross makes a curved one and the standard straight ones will change the upper level geometry.

You mentioned using GarGraves track with Ross switches. You're currently using GG switches, so I thought I'd also mention that the footprint of the Ross switches is quite different. I added a Ross O54 just to show you the difference in size. I used the GG O54 you had and didn't play with O42 or O72.

I hope you don't mind, but I also played around a bit to see what an over/under would look like on the upper level and added a crossover to the lower level because it looked like you were leaning in that direction. I wasn't sure of the layout size inside the room, so I just used 138x115. I look forward to seeing where this goes.

Check this out - The Spare Room and Pacific RR it has a lot of your druthers and leaves people space when you enter the room. O54 & O72.

Great to hear you are able to build this, Mark.  Good luck!!

I am not very experienced in layout design, I have changed my loops more than once but I find  threads on designing pretty interesting. Not too many are prototypical but they are model RRs built, usually, in a lilited space. I do find the MTH layout in Moonman's post interesting.