New York Second Avenue Sunway

Are these the R160 cars, and are there just two sets of them covered in the blue wrapping as shown above? Between 1972 to 1975 I worked on 2nd Av. at the corner of 110th St when the subway tunnel construction was started but then it was all stopped and the construction was covered up leaving very little sign of what had been done under the street. Any word of when the construction will continue to 125th St? I remember the stations north of 96th St were to be 106th St., 116th St., and 125th St.

Ed G.

Any word of when the construction will continue to 125th St?
I remember the stations north of 96th St were to be 106th St., 116th St., and 125th St.

The MTA should be continuing construction as we speak!

http://spoilednyc.com/mta-new-...e-2nd-avenue-subway/

I have been enjoying all the hoopla about the new Second Avenue Subway on the news. As you probably heard, they have been talking about a 2nd Ave. line for quite a while... quite a LONG while!!!

The insurance company I worked for in Manhattan was always very big on raising money for United Way. One year, the Investment Department sold old, expired bonds that they still had in the vault down in the fifth basement. I bought one and had it framed for my train room... 

In the last picture, the center panel is the un-clipped coupons - guess this incarnation went belly up before they paid off!!! The train/historical aspects aside, these old bonds were works of art (unfortunately, they only had one other train bond, a Florida East Coast which I also bought).

There are two sets of 160's vinyl wrapped for second Ave.   I operated both this week.   the stations are big beautiful and clean.  The dispatching and work program needs a lot of work.  

Here are a few more pics from 96 st and the wrapped cars   The mezzanine level is just as big and beautiful as the lower level

 

 

Some differences that I noticed   Everything is painted gray including the rails and third rail   Also there is a rubber plate under the concrete ties.  This makes for a very different sound   Its hard to gauge your speed by the sound or lack of it

Wow... clean roadbed on the NYC Subway - now there is a rare sight   

Thanks for the pics Ben. Hope to get down to the city sometime this year and see it in person.

looks great Ben. Thanks for sharing the photos.

Did a little research on this project. It is intermeeting to find out that the Second Avenue Subway was first presented as a project back in a Municipal plan issued in 1919. Almost 100 years ago. When the second Ave Elevated was closed in 1942, there was an immediate need for transit capacity noted such that the city put the project up for consideration almost immediately after the El's closure.  Once the 3rd ave El closed, There was only the Lexington Ave Subwa and the Bus lines on the avenues to meet the demand. The route on 1st and 2nd avenues is apparently the most heavily used Bus route in New York City. The new Subway will be welcomed by many. 

 

Hi LIRR Steamer & Ben, I was born in 1943 and I remember during the '50s about building the 2nd Ave. subway to lighten the load on the Lex. Weren't tunnels built in lower Manhattan , one in ChinaTown and another section somewhere else not connected to each other ? The new 2nd Ave line was to be a completely new line as I understood, not an extension of the "Q" line. It might help some but not as intended, and over 60 years in my lifetime. Vic.

I remember as a young man in 1970, first getting a job and an apartment in Manhattan, being fascinated by the prospect of watching the progress of the new 2nd Ave subway. As the years passed, the steel construction plates remained in place along the Avenue, creating exciting driving conditions in any atmosphere of over .0001% humidity.  Every few years there seemed to be a few feet of progress, at a rate of $4 gazillion per foot of construction. Twenty years later, I finally left Manhattan in 1990, still wondering and wishing.  Now I am an old guy with a daughter living in the city. I plan to visit her and go for a ride on the new subway. Hooray.

Blueline:

What are all those white blotches on the walls of the stations? Are they post-it notes asking for help in locating lost loved ones who entered the subway and never returned?  Notes of congratulations for the sand hogs?  Love notes to Comrade Mayor DeBlasio?

The NY Times has a nice article today about an autistic boy who loves trains and his first visit.  It includes photos of the art work, too:

NYT: a boy's first visit

Tomlinson Run Railroad

Here is a timeline that I borrowed from nycsubway.org

 

1920	Daniel L. Turner of the PSC published the "Proposed Comprehensive Rapid Transit System". It included six new north-south lines including Madison and Third Ave, eight new crosstown lines in Manhattan, extension of the Queens [presumably Flushing El] line and three lines across the Narrows to Staten Island. Later, the IND master plan called for a two phase system: Phase I - Sixth and Eighth Ave lines; Phase II - Second Ave Trunk line.
1922	The Turner papers ware updated in January. Revisions called for a 10th Avenue line in Manhattan, and a Queens Crosstown line. The Second Ave line was revised to be six tracks wide, with a short eight track connection to Queens. The line was to connect with the Grand Concourse branch of IND Phase I, and two tracks continuing under the East River to the Fulton Street line [at the Transit Museum stub]. Price tag $165M.
1925	March: Phase I of the IND subway is underway.
1929	NYC BOT proposes to build the 2nd Avenue line from Houston Street to the Harlem River for a cost of $86M. This includes a turnoff at 34th Street and a 34th Street Crosstown Subway and an East River tunnel to Queens, a turnoff at 63rd Street to connect with the Sixth Avenue line of IND Phase I, and a connection in the Bronx at Morris Park and Lafayette Ave. Later revision has the six track line from uptown branching off as follows: two tracks to 61st Street (instead of 63rd Street), two to Chambers Street, two to the Fulton Street Subway. Cost for the 100 mile Phase II system is $438M. Contracts are expected to be let between 1930 and 1935, with the lines in service 1938-1941. In October, the Wall Street stock market crashes.
1930	February: Public hearing resulted in the system having the 61st Street turnoff dropped and the 34th Street Crosstown to connect to the planned 10th Avenue line. The 2nd Avenue line is expected to be built north from 32nd St. starting in 1931, opening in 1937, and south of 32nd St., starting in 1934, opening in 1940.
1931	Phase I contsruction falls behind. The depression is hurting the city. Cost estimates for Phase I were too low by as much as 100%. Plans for the 2nd Ave. line are postponed. The 2nd Ave. plan was revised, dropping the connection to Fulton Street Brooklyn, instead connecting the line to the Nassau St. loop. New proposed opening date 1948.
1939	Cost of the Second Ave Subway estimated to be $249M.
1944	Second Ave Subway back in the planning stage, with some revision. From Canal Street to 57th Street the line is to be four tracks, with six north of 57th Street (two for a a super express to the Bronx). South of Canal Street would be two tracks. Connections are planned for the lines from the Manhattan and Williamsburg Bridges. Plans for the 34th St. Crosstown and 10th Avenue line are dropped. Since it was felt that the midtown CBD was too far from Second Ave., the plan now included a turnoff at 57th Street to connect to the Sixth Ave line. The plan also called for a BMT connection in Brooklyn with a major rebuilding of the DeKalb Ave junction. The plan still included a Bronx replacement of the Third Avenue El., with cost estimates of the Manhattan segments at $242M. Planned opening date, 1951.
1947	Subway fares raised 100%, from 5 cents to 10 cents. BOT lost $18M.
1948	BOT lost $30M. BOT requests $300M for rehab and $500M for capital improvements from the Board of Estimate. State legislature does not raise the city's debt limit.
1949	Second Avenue Subway now estimated at $504M. Queens residents promise not to approve the bond issue until promises are made for subway service improvements in Queens borough. The new R11 "million dollar train" is unveiled as the prototype train for the 2nd Avenue Subway.
1950	2nd Avenue plan revised to include a two-track turnoff at 7th Street, to 34th Avenue in Queens. A new subway under Northern Boulevard would connect to the LIRR line to the Rockaways. This plan cost $118M, of which $63M would come from deferring construction of the other part of the Second Avenue trunk line. The Korean War starts, driving up material costs.
1951	Bond issue for $500M is approved in November. Construction is to resume with 1957 or 1958 start of operation.
1956	Feb 16 - Third Ave El came down.
1957	Charles L. Patterson uses most of the $500M bond issue for improvements to the current system, leaving only $112M for the Second Ave Subway. The New York Times reports on Jan 17, 1957 (page 1): "It is highly improbable that the Second Ave Subway will ever materialize." In March, a formal hearing is held to probe the use of funds meant for new construction. Patterson defends his right to spend the bond money on system improvement.
1959	As backlash for the transit bond issue, a bond issue for construction of new schools was soundly defeated by the voters of the State of New York.
1963	A 76th Street tunnel is proposed to connect with the Broadway and Sixth Ave lines in Manhattan and the Queens Blvd. line in Queens. The Planning Commission suggested a 59th Street Tunnel and connection with the LIRR. The Second Ave line is still planned but no funds are available.
1964	The Urban Mass Transit Act is passed making Federal funding available for transit projects.
1965	Metropolitan Commuter Transportation Authority founded.
1967	$2.5B bond issue for Transportation passed. $1B is for urban transit in the state and $600M is for construction in New York City.
1968	MCTA changed to MTA. Second Ave subway will cost $220 million for a two track line from 34th Street to the Bronx. It would connect with the 63rd Street Tunnel, Central Park line to 57th Street both Sixth Ave and Broadway. Phase II would bring the line down to Water Street near the Battery. On Sept. 20, the Board of Estimate approves a two track line from the Bronx to Water Street, including the 63rd St. connection.
1972	October 27 - Groundbreaking was held at East 103rd St and Second Ave., 68 years to the day after the opening of the IRT.
1996	Sections that had construction activity include three intact sections: Section 5 (Bowery to Chrystie Street), Section 11 (East 99th to East 105th Streets), and Section 13 (East 110th to East 120 Streets). A fourth area, Section 7 (East 2nd to East 9th Streets) had utility relocation work performed, but all excavation was filled in.

Arthur P. Bloom posted:

Blueline:

What are all those white blotches on the walls of the stations? Are they post-it notes asking for help in locating lost loved ones who entered the subway and never returned?  Notes of congratulations for the sand hogs?  Love notes to Comrade Mayor DeBlasio?

That is part of the artwork of the station   One thing I know they are not is love notes for DeBlasio  LOL

TomlinsonRunRR posted:

The NY Times has a nice article today about an autistic boy who loves trains and his first visit.  It includes photos of the art work, too:

NYT: a boy's first visit

Tomlinson Run Railroad

Nice article.   I have a story about an autistic boy I encountered last week   When I was getting on my train at 96 st there was a mother and her son standing by the cab door.  I said hello and the mother asked if he could look inside the cab because he loves trains.  I told him to go in and let him blow the horn.  He acted like I gave him a bar of gold and was ecstatic.  I told the mother I couldn't let them in the cab as I operated but I let them hold the door open and watch as we made our way downtown.  The boy was hysterical.  He was making all the station announcements before the TOD.  "This is a Brooklyn bound Q train.  Next stop 34 st"  It was very funny and the kid was having a ball.  When we reached Canal st the mother said he had something for me and he came in and put a 20 dollar bill on my leg.  I was telling her no way and it was my pleasure and I wanted to give it back  They ran off the train and down the platform not allowing me to.  Well I went home and figured I would use the 20 to play Lotto and Power ball and if I won I would attribute it to them but of course I didnt win.

I went to visit all 3 new stations (technically 4) on opening day. I took few pictures. The art tile work is really nice as are the stations.

 

Great photos, SilverLake! The contrast of the clear entryway and neon on the roof with the more traditional green globe pole light in your first photo is interesting.  Surprisingly, it works.  I'm still undecided about the wrapped graphics on the cars and parts of the interior, 'though.  Already, I'm trying to imagine them on an MTH model :-).

TRRR

This is my favorite of the artwork   The epitomy of New Yorker   Lead singer of the Velvet Undergtound

Lou! why walk when you can ride!

bluelinec4 posted:

TomlinsonRunRR posted:

The NY Times has a nice article today about an autistic boy who loves trains and his first visit.  It includes photos of the art work, too:

NYT: a boy's first visit

Tomlinson Run Railroad

Nice article.   I have a story about an autistic boy I encountered last week   When I was getting on my train at 96 st there was a mother and her son standing by the cab door.  I said hello and the mother asked if he could look inside the cab because he loves trains.  I told him to go in and let him blow the horn.  He acted like I gave him a bar of gold and was ecstatic.  I told the mother I couldn't let them in the cab as I operated but I let them hold the door open and watch as we made our way downtown.  The boy was hysterical.  He was making all the station announcements before the TOD.  "This is a Brooklyn bound Q train.  Next stop 34 st"  It was very funny and the kid was having a ball.  When we reached Canal st the mother said he had something for me and he came in and put a 20 dollar bill on my leg.  I was telling her no way and it was my pleasure and I wanted to give it back  They ran off the train and down the platform not allowing me to.  Well I went home and figured I would use the 20 to play Lotto and Power ball and if I won I would attribute it to them but of course I didnt win.

Awesome! 

Don't worry, the superintendent of life's railway to heaven saw your good deed. 

Some of the original talk of the second avenue subway was earlier than 1919, there were proposals with the 'dual contracts" between the IRT and BRT, but it was not in the final plan. The 1950 bond issue was supposed to be used for the second avenue subway as noted (people approved it with that in mind), and it did end up going towards the rest of the system (and most people who lived back then will tell you the subways didn't seem to get any better). Almost all experts on government say Robert Moses opposed building the 2nd avenue subway, he hated mass transit and had the kind of power to squash it (basically by threatening the state and city with not using the TBTA bonding authority to finance public projects). It is sad, because with the 3rd avenue already down and the 2nd ave el being destroyed, it left the east side underserved. The second attempt fell to the NYC financial crisis of the early 70's. 

I am just sad that the 2nd avenue they have built is so small scale, but given the cost of building and the reluctance to commit funds to it, unlikely for it to be completed all the way south. Amazing given that the subway is bursting at the seams these days, it is handling record volumes with all the money in the city and so many people wanting to live there. 

There is a show on PBS in New York (Ch. 13) called Treasures of New York. I taped an episode when I wasn't home over the weekend which was called Art Underground (art in the subways). It touches on not only the original tile work throughout the original lines, but much of the newer tile work as well as other forms of art (e.g. glass and metal work). The film was done a couple of years ago, so it doesn't include any of the work on the new Second Avenue line, but they cover some amazing work. I almost wish I was still working in the city so I could visit some of the covered stations... well, maybe not working!!!

I think it is well worth a watch - it runs just under an hour. Here is a link to an online version:

http://www.pbs.org/video/2263498706/

Here are the words that go with the flying papers of the subway

Sections that had construction activity include three intact sections: Section 5 (Bowery to Chrystie Street),
Section 11 (East 99th to East 105th Streets), and Section 13 (East 110th to East 120 Streets).
A fourth area, Section 7 (East 2nd to East 9th Streets) had utility relocation work performed,
but all excavation was filled in.

So technically to get to 125th street should be a "shoe in" since most of the tunneling is done! correct?

And What is meant by "intact sections"? Ready for track and wiring?