NKP Premier Berk Drawbar/electrical issue

I had this problem with a PS3 Railking mikado. The solution was to make sure that the drawbar was fully seated in its receptacle in the tender. Push on the plug end of of the drawbar until you here a small click, and be careful taking the engine on and off the track. That's what I believe the problem is. 

I had a PS3 Mikado that, go figure, had no issues with the drawbar. I sold it as I wasn't happy with it's performance in conventional (which I run). 

I do have a PS3 Railking 0-6-0, an early PS3 steamer circa 2012 or 2013. I've had drawbar issues since the day I got it. I've wrapped a zip-tie around the drawbar plug/socket with reasonable success to help hold it in but I still have issues, primarily going around curves. Runs fine on straight track but going around a curve causes it to go haywire. 

I've replaced the tether, socket, wiring, etc. I'm sick of dealing with it. I talked it over with my dealer and I'm going to drop it off Saturday at the store. I'm yanking all PS3 electronics out (which are 100% good and functional) and putting a conventional e-unit, whistle/bell and that's it. Dirt simple. The drawbar can stay for the physical connection between engine and tender but the intermittent issues have been a problem since day one with this engine - a shame as it's a really nice little engine and I really like running it (when it runs). I expect flawless performance once the PS3 boards and wireless tether electrical connections are removed. 

Marc,

I agree with Dan. The drawbar isn't fully seated. You should feel it "click-in". Try laying the engine on its side, firmly snap in the drawbar and then rotate it onto the tracks.

I have about a dozen PS2 and PS3 steamers with the wireless drawbar and it's extremely important to properly secure the drawbar.

I should also note that my experience has been that after several connect/disconnect sequences, the socket loses it's "click" and the connection is not very secure.

I should also note that my experience has been that after several connect/disconnect sequences, the socket loses it's "click" and the connection is not very secure.

I noticed the same thing with my first PS3 steamer, a RK Imperial Big Boy. However, after several months of living with this issue, upon close inspection I found that I had inadvertently broken the socket on the drawbar on one side, preventing the drawbar from staying in place long term.

After replacing the drawbar, all of the issues that I'd been having with the engine were gone. It's now one of my best performers.

I have noticed on several engines brought in for repair for the same problem as yours is there is not enough slack in the locomotive wiring harness and when the engines goes around curves it partially disconnects the socket from the tender. I removed the boiler from the engine and pulled a little more slack from the harness and solved the plug disconnect problem.

Thanks for the replies so far. I will look closer at the drawbar connection tonight, however I looked at it last night and could see no gaps. Everything seemed to be good and tight and I did not notice any damage to the socket.

Ill also pull the shell off of the locomotive and look at the wire connection/pulling there. Just to reiterate, if I push upwards (towards the cab roof) on the locomotive end of the drawbar, the engine gets power. If I do not, there is intermittent or tender only power. The problem is consistent on both straight and curved sections of track. 

Let me know if you have any further thoughts based on these observations.

Thanks again,

Marc

Marc,

if I push upwards (towards the cab roof) on the locomotive end of the drawbar, the engine gets power

It sounds as if the drawbar connection at the engine end may be the issue. It also is a plug and socket connection. Make certain that that connection also is tight.

Troubleshooting Day Two: Edited after swapping drawbars with a "good" locomotive

So per your suggestions, I checked the drawbar on both sides (locomotive and tender). I took the shells off of both and visually inspected them. Both were reseated properly and I cannot see any evidence of damage to any drawbar components. I also checked the wires inside the locomotive. They are indeed on the tight side, but I do not see anything that is loose or snagging. I currently run on 0-54, but the problem is persistent on both straights and curves and the locomotive is rated for 0-54. 

I think the next step is to test another drawbar from another functioning locomotive. If that remedies the situation, then I will purchase additional drawbars. If not, I am at a loss for the possibilities. When the problem occurs, all power to the locomotive is down (smoke, motor, lights), but the tender (sounds and lights) remain powered. 

After swapping the drawbars between both locomotives, I currently have two functioning locomotives. I took the drawbar from my PS3 Dreyfuss Hudson and switched it out with the Berk. Both completed loops around the track without a single stall.

I am still very confused as to the root cause of the problems I have been experiencing. Since both locomotives now work, the drawbar itself should not be the issue. Additionally, I know for a fact that the seating was good. I've done it many times and it was the first thing I inspected. The only thing I can think of is that the drawbar from the dreyfuss was slightly longer reducing the strain on the wires. 

Any additional thoughts are more than welcome. In the meantime, I will be continuing to monitor both locomotives that I swapped parts between. 

Thanks,

Marc 

One more question I have... I have noticed that some of the older PS3 wireless drawbars have an exposed metal piece that the newer locomotives lack. Should this be present or was this something that MTH removed in the later PS3 generations? I notice the change from the 2014 models to the 2015 models. 

-Marc 

The typical fault for your issue of tender working but engine loosing function is a disconnect in the data line, though it can be the 5V or PB Ground lines too.  Cracked or cold solder joints on the drawbar pins, and I have seen quite a few where the wire harness inside the engine pulls out due to a lack of wire relief, or a bad crimp on the wire terminal.  Visual inspection required.  I have also seen a badly molded connector housing that does not retain the wire terminal.  It floats out, or in the case of the tender pushed out when you press the drawbar in place.  G

I know this wasn't your issue, but this is a good practice for extra holding power: To help keep the draw bar secure on the tender end,  add a small rubber "O" ring that can be purchased from any NAPA store. You just roll it up the metal stem tight against the draw bar. It's also very easy to remove when disconnecting. Take your tender with you to NAPA so that you can try for the best fit and buy a few extras.

I'm experiencing some of the same issues talked about on this thread. I have a brand new MTH Premier Big Boy with steaming whistle. It worked well for a few weeks, but soon began to loose chuffing sounds at various times and various places on the track. The engine finally went completely dead, engine not on track, etc. I had to use a conventional feature reset, e.g., bells and whistles, etc., (thank you Barry Broskowitz, page 168 of the DCS O Gauge Companion, can't function without your book).

I re-added the engine to the DCS remote. All other engines worked fine over the same tracks. The Big Boy also worked, but with continued erratic behavior. To add to the problem, once playing a bit with the drawbar, the engine would fire up without prompting, but would not respond to commands. I pushed up hard on the drawbar, and got some pretty good results, but eventually the same problems happened all over again, such as engine startup without engaging and engine not responding to commands.

I'm considering purchasing a new drawbar from MTH before having the engine serviced through the MTH warranty. I hate to mail this engine. It will not only cost a mint to mail, but I risk damage. I love the MTH engines, so I want this fix to work, permanently.

If there are any other thoughts or suggestions on this subject, I would very much appreciate the input.

I just ordered a 45mm drawbar with 2 female connections, from MTH. Fingers crossed.

Big Lou,

A few things that improved performance for me... First of all, I swapped drawbars with one of my other PS3 locomotives (a NYC Dreyfus Hudson). Swapping for the longer drawbar helped a lot. Both locomotives perform well now. Additionally, I also made sure to seat the metal wire on top of the draw bar so it maintained constant pressure on the tender attachment. The combination of both of these actions has removed most if not all of my problems.

Hopefully that helps. I do think that the longer drawbar will be a good start.

-Marc 

Thank you. That makes perfect sense. Will do.

I had a santa fe imperial northern.That acted like that.It would make sounds but would not move.I sent it back it was fixed free of charge.It was a factory screw up.This is the first time I think mth did wrong.I was happy with the tether.

I had an imperial steam engine that was PS3 as well. I sold it a few months ago actually to help purchase my NKP 765. It often would become unseated if it ran over uneven track. The combination of uneven track and tight curves seem to be hard on PS3 steam engines. They have not been as reliable as some of their PS2 predecessors. 

Thanks for all the support. The new drawbar is on order direct from MTH, who have also been very helpful to me with some suggestions that I might try before having to have the engine checked by a professional. The drawbar I ordered is a 6-pin 45mm. We're hoping this one works, however, sending it to MTH would make me much more confident in the long run.

Yesterday, one of my favorite locomotives, an MTH PS3 B6 steam switcher, would not run. I started it up on DCS, got smoke and sounds, but it would not move, even at 10 to 15 SMPH. I had not run the engine in about 2 weeks, having parked it on a siding on my layout while working on my layout expansion.

I suspected the problem had to do with the drawbar between engine and tender.

When I bought this locomotive over a year ago, I secured the drawbar seating it in the receptacle on the tender using a small piece of tubing as recommended in this thread. Since doing that and simultaneously placing engine and tender on the layout, I have not removed the engine and tender from the layout, and have not disconnected them, until this morning.

Well, I have good news and a point to make about this drawbar issue. Again, following the advice on this thread, I removed the engine and tender from the track and very gently pushed the drawbar, still secured by the same piece of tubing, up into the tender receptacle until I felt the slightest imaginable click. Then, when I simultaneously placed engine and tender back on the track and started it up on DCS, it ran fine.

The slightest imaginable click made all the difference for this locomotive to run well once again. Arnold

Rather than shrink wrap tubing, I'm using small sink washers to keep the drawbars in place. I'm using them on two ps3 Big Boys and on one ps3 Challenger. They seem to work great, but I do have to do exactly what you've done with you engine. That gentle click brings all back to work again. With the washers, I get a little warning from the engines, (bumpy running, etc.) when it's time to re-set the the plug. Thanks for your comments on this topic.

Your very welcome, Lou.

In the case of my PS3 steamer, I thought it important to highlight just how tiny the little click was that needed to happen to get the engine running well again. Arnold

Yes Arnold, in my case, due to hearing issues, it's more of a slight feeling perception when the click happens, but I do feel it. I know what you mean, and you explained it very-well. Once again, thanks for sharing. Keep safe, and happy holidays to you and yours. Lou