PS3 "rant" pt2

That sounds like the SuperCAPs are not doing their job, they replace the battery of the PS/2 sets.

 

As far as PS/3 being picky, we've seen that as well.  If they don't have a good signal, they are not happy.  The odd thing is, PS/3 was supposed to be more tolerant of marginal signals, not less.

 

Make sure that there's continuity between the wheels on both trucks. I have seen a situation where a locomotive is only getting common from one truck due to a bad connection or the black coating on the screw connecting the wire to the truck block impeding conductivity. I found the fix was to remove the screw from the truck block, remove a bit of the black coating from the underside of the screw head and some of the threads, put a puff of graphite in the hole and reinstall the screw. 

I have also seen some engines where the common is only being pulled from one side of the locomotive (I think the standard protocol is for one truck to the be the left side, and the other to be the right side). I'm not sure if this is an issue with the 3/2 switch being bad or someone installing the 2 rail axle insulators on the wrong side of the axle. 

 

Either of those would stop an engine dead on a switch. The caps (or the PS2 battery backup) only keep the sound on, they wont solve a power interruption from stopping the locomotive's motion.

 

Regarding the reset, that sounds like a problem with the charge circuit not holding enough power to commit the data to memory. PS2 can do that too.

Sounds like a return trip to MTH is probably needed.

Hi GRJ

Supercaps are working because when unit does fail, the shutdown sounds are carried out to completion and LEDs turn off.  But then nothing to get it going again except factory reset.  If I run engine then stop and do shutdown it will restart no problem.  Just lose continuity or derail on Ross switch and game over (that is next mystery, why this engine truck picks switch for straight through (out of gauge, flanges too thick/thin, higher/lower, contoured different.) None other engines do it.

 

Hi Boilermaker,

I put engine in cradle and used my lab Fluke meter good to 0.001 ohm resolution.  Really cra**y readings.  Side to side on same axle reads open to 10-15 ohms.  Other axles read to 100 ohms pressing hard with sharp probe points.  Jiggling axle side to side yields reading all over the place.  Wheel oxide not helping.  I buffed clean spots on wheels of axle and could get almost stable 10-15 ohm reading.  Not sure how trucks are picking up axle current(s) but with those readings, I imagine  a lot of electrical noise is generated and current varies all over the place so when mishap occurs I speculate boards lose power or dip into gray no-mans area.  Pickup rollers readings on rollers from front to back truck is solid 0.1 -0.2 ohm

 

If I were an ASC technician and had access to drawings and parts I would disassemble truck and replace flaky 2/3 mode axles with solid axle with current pickup oxide areas buffed off axle and wheels surfaces (assuming axles were interchangeable and not a new design).  Only solution that comes to mind.  Might not even be a solution or root cause. 

 

 

you should be safe for a few hours or so- they are at york whooping it up.-jim

I agree with Sam ... When it comes to PS3.... I am not impressed .
The old system worked fine with a bcr.
And I have the same problem with the 2/3 rail engines too !
They stutter through switches.

IMO, the 2-rail/3-rail stuff was a very bad idea, or at least a very bad execution. 

hello guys and gals........

 

Stick with conventional control then electronic problems go away.

 

the woman who loves the S.F.5011,2678,2003,200

Tiffany

 

 

Yes, I am at York, but there's no "whooping" going on here. It's business as usual for me on the OGR forum tonight.

 

Why would I delete this? Rrman has a problem with a locomotive and other forum members are trying to help. Isn't this one reason why this forum exists?

Did you look to see if the wires on the 3-2 switch are connected well. If the switch is faulty I've just taken the switch out and bypassed it. Also is the 40 pin plug seated right.

These are just a couple of thoughts. Hope we can get it running right for you.

Ralph

I moved 2/3 switch to 2 position and wheel sides were open circuited.  Moved switch to 3 position and wheel sides were again closed circuited shorted (or as much as flaky meter readings showed as I juggled the axel sets trying to get a reading.) 

 

I have not opened loco to avoid possibly pinching breaking wires on re-assembly (leaving well enough alone).

I had similar problems with a PS3/2 engine.  Read this post to see a suggested solution.

 

Too bad this topic wasn't discussed at the October 2014 TCA MTH meet given the the PS3 problems that seems to crop up, and "pin" Mr Wolf on getting a real solution(s) (and not accept the old "we will look into it" standby answer), ie making 3 rail shorted axle wheel sets available or as another thread posted, make engines that exclusively run 2 OR 3 rail not both.  And make better wipers and remove oxide from where wiper/brushes contact axles, as well as oxide from wheel treads.

 

But hey, what do I know, I am just a whiner......

Sam, this is an interesting thread. I sincerely hope you can get this locomotive fixed.

 

I just read the entire thread that Kirk H posted a link to and I don't think your locomotive has the same problem because he never mentioned having to factory reset and re-add his locomotive but if it were my locomotive I would try switching the axles around just for you know whats and giggles.

 

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

 

Unfortunately, this is a diesel engine so axles can't be flipped around.  Supercaps work as I can lift the slow moving engine off the track and it will do complete shutdown.  Put back on dead track and repower track and engine will do the normal DCS start-up sequence.  I have electronic circuit breakers, so took screwdrivers and dead shorted rails to center, thinking perhaps a board diode or transistor might be shorted such that supercaps instantly discharged so shutdown couldn't occur, emulating what seems to happen if lead truck derails across the track/Ross switch causing engine brain failure.  Circuit breaker tripped and engine properly shut down and then powered up when power restored. 

 

So as long as engine travels between switches I got a good runner and puller. Go through most Ross switches and derailment most of times.  Sent engine through old Kline or Lionel switches, perfect operation.  So this weekend I and going to "mike" these wheels against my other PS2 diesels to see whats going on (maybe gear hitting flange/guard rail or frog.)

Sam, which model is this?

 

Thanks,

 

Bob

Sam, sorry about that. For some reason I thought it was steam.

 

I agree, that's a good idea about checking the wheels. I know Ross switches are extremely well made. If your other engines don't have a problem with the switches then it has to be something with that particular engine.

 

But what about the "brain dead" problem you mentioned earlier? Are you still having that problem where you have to do a factory reset and re-add the locomotive to the DCS system in order to run it after a derailment?

Hi,

Its an MTH 20-20288-1 Pittsburgh and West Virginia diesel, number board 101.

Spent Sunday morning watching the new engine track through the problematic Ross O-72 tin plate switches and discovered the reason and fixed it.

 

Back story: On my layout I have a left hand tin plate O-72 Ross switch off the main line. The switch curve then leads into a second left hand Ross switch which forms two yard track leads.  At other end of yard is a right hand switch that connects to a mainline right hand switch.  Symmetrical lead in and out of yard to main line.

 

 All my two truck diesels and yard goat track perfectly through these switches.  However my big Y6b won't.  The front steam engine truck goes through the first switch and continue straight and won't turn further into the second switch curve.  Truck swivels very well in all directions.  Engine would run perfectly through Kline and Lionel O-72 switches just not Ross.  Found that Lionel and Kline track was formed in such way that the blades recessed slightly into a "pocket" so truck would be lead onto the blades.  Ross didn't have this so Y6b flanges climbed the blades and derailed.  The fix several years ago was to epoxy some small pieces of plastic onto the Ross lead in rail such that it formed a "pocket" and Y6b tracked perfectly every time.

 

With new lighter weight engine, I found those flanges hit the top of plastic enough to lift truck and cause derailment.  Got the Dremel out and carefully shaped and contoured the plastic strip edges so now the new engine flange gracefully meets the plastic and is pushed over and rides onto the curved blade.  Problem solved and Y6b and new engines both track perfectly through switches.

 

Sent this suggestion to Steve at Ross but he never replied. 

 

Sam, Back to your diesel.  Did you make sure that the black wire screw are tight?  Clean the bottom of the head and make sure it makes good contact on both trucks?  Than move to the center rail pickups?  Are they shiny screws and are they tight?  Good continuity between rollers?  Are the wheels clean?

 

There is no design flaw on 2 / 3 R models.  Both wheel sets and both sides are connected to ground when the switch is in the 3R position.  There are plenty of engines that work fine with no complaints.

 

So I am sure your engine can be easily fixed.  I would focus on the center rail pickup and make sure that is ok, though the inability to get solid 0 ohm reading on the outside wheels is definitely a problem too.  Screws and wires need to be checked, along with the 2/3R switch and wires.   G

GGG,

Just saw your reply pop up on my screen.  Message must have just popped out of  cyber black hole.

Will gingerly take engine apart and check connections.

Hi GGG,

Took engine apart.  Had to disassemble the truck to get at the wires.  Cleaned the eyelet and re-tightened screws.  Engine seems to run better and powers up and down properly.  Runs without skipping and glitching.

 

Noticed the grease in truck looks like petroleum jelly like Vasaline.  Probably isn't but looked and felt like it.

 

Great.  Yes MTH uses a clear type lubrication.  Works well from my experience.  Glad it is performing better.  G