What's Your Oldest Locomotive?

This is a great story, I agree you should make a separate thread....

 

So he actually ordered the train in the year 1900?

Do you know what year they actually delivered the train to him?

Do you have any documentation or paperwork, receipts, etc...., dating the details?

 

Does the train have any markings on it, saying it's a prototype or pre-production piece?  Is is it different from a regular production 263E?

 

PCRR/Dave,

I've enjoyed hearing about your unique Lionel set and it's WW2 history.Thanks for sharing the story.

 

FYI: You may already know this, but the Lionel set #263E was cataloged as a Blue Comet set made in the 30's, not a work train set from circa. 1900...

 

 I would be fascinated to see what the actual train was that made the trip to Guadalcanal. Looking forward to a thread with photos.

 

Bert

 

Bert,

    You are correct about the Blue 263E Comet Passenger Train, however I do believe in the late 20's the original Gun Metal Gray 263E work train appeared in one of the early Lionel catalogues, however very few if any were ever actually produced, during that time period, and for some unknown reason, was completely suspended, until sometime in the 30's, when most people believe they 1st came out.   Further that train only had 4 Cars counting the Tender, one of which was the Search Light Car, my Father's original work train has 6 Cars counting the Tender, one of which is the original Red Topped 810 Crane Car, it further had the Green Gondola, the 2 tone Yellow/Brown Box Car, the Black Dumping Log Car, and the Red Caboose.  The Search Light Car was the add on, some years later, there was no room for it in the original wooden box. 

 

PCRR/Dave

 

 

ron m,

   You are only talking about the Lionel Trains catalogued for mass production, some of the early trains never made the catalogues, the 711 switches were invented earlier also, and then released for sale to the general public at a later date due engineering/production problems with the original switches.  Much of the early pre-production work never hit the actual Lionel Catalogue or sales market, development was not like today, everything was tested and retested by Lionel, before it was placed in a catalogue and sold on the open market.  In some instances things even appeared in the catalogue, and were suspended until years later, some never hit the market at all, because of these engineering/production problems.  In the beginning Lionel had an almost 0 rework engineering reputation.  People in that era demanded that what ever they purchased work correctly as purchased.  American quality workmanship was king at that time.  You can read from the Lionel catalogue all you want, I am relating the actuals of what really happened.

 

PCRR/Dave

 

So who did your grandfather know at Lionel to sneak these trains out of the factory years earlier than available to the general public?  Did he know Joshua Lionel?

 

Some people get hung up on catalogs and numbers, don't let that stuff get in the way of telling your story.

 

What I've got so far, is an admiral asked for the set, which was not produced till some years after being given to your uncle as a favor from a person at Lionel, to help improve the morale of US Marines fighting and dying on Guadalcanal to annihilate the Japanese and build an airfield.  I like it!

Maybe we should change the focus and talk about maintaining these tinplate treasures which were marvels of technology "back in the day." 

 

Besides the usual oiling/greasing, I like my Goo Gone.I know my use of Goo Gone on wheels and track is not favored by some others, but I usually don't have any modern locomotives running that have traction tires and I've had good results. A little Goo Gone on the armature plate on a Q-tip helps clean it, too. 

 

Any other methods you folks use? Hope your locomotives are as easy as my steam switchers are to maintain.

 

Tom

I will say, for the most part,  I have complete confidence when buying a standard gauge engine advertised on eBay as 'runs well, forward and reverse'  They always have.  People who had these trains took care of them.  It wasn't a 'throw away' tyoe society.  That is why, in part, so many if these 80+ year old trains still work so well.  Of course it should be mentioned they were made well and made to last to begin with.

Same for me regarding buying (O gauge) on eBay, but I have also bought maybe 25% of my engines as "as is" without knowing for sure that they could run. Every one of them was able to work after a good thorough cleaning except one that I needed help from my friend with rewiring it. 

 

Nice to know they have many more years ahead of them. 

 

Tom 

 Goo gone, just maybe. NOT Goof Off! Which might work better on track, but is aggressive, paint peeling, nasty fume, stuff.

 I might worry about long term citrus acid damage, the possibility of the oil getting under & lifting, or penetrating paint/winding coatings. But I know it "does all the work" & gives you a great shine. (what me worry?) 

 My Grandfather mechanically cleaned a locomotive with naptha &/or oil avoiding the brushes & windings. Then left it at least overnight on a cloth diaper. Excesses on wheels, lower frame edges, etc., wiped clean again. Driver treads got naptha, or alcohol. He compared it to cleaning his Garand ("it was grand Grarnd ta ga-rand wit"[go-round]) 

 On finishes, I cleaned the dust once, or twice a year, mostly with a dry, but sometimes lightly dampened, soft bristle 1-2" paint brush. Once cleaned "the card" was checked for maintenance dates, & maybe waxed, or whatever the former owner used. Pledge, oil, Turtle Wax, even some "Future" was involved. Whatever the original owner used, my Gramps often continued. (everything was on cards, including former owners names addresses, prices etc.[I wonder if he was running a pawn, or "care" & resale service of sorts? He would sell them back to folks, & call/write near every time before he resold things. Time to reconsider? An old TCA courtesy maybe?]) 

 

 

I recently acquired this Lionel 380 Standard Gauge.  I believe it is from the early years of manufacture, about 1923-25, as it has the combination couplers.  She doesn't run, but looks pretty good.

Northern Pacific 44 tonner. mmm...1957-1958? I can't remember

 

rat

204 1940 - 1942 

258 1941

The oldest locomotives I have are a pair of 8E standard gage electrics.  Close behind is an american flyer o gage streamliner from 1934.  I love the bang and clang as they circle the track. 

 

Rolland

Finally got an answer to my 80 problem. Took awhile. The 8 has a different
motor in it-too small. The 80 uses a Standard Super motor which was used in
many locos. The Super motor parts a available as are complete motors. The
problem with my 8 motor was the holes in the frame were worn so badly on
the non-geared side it was binding up. I am going to wait awhile an look to
see what is available in used motors for the 80 or buy a new armature.

On Fri, Mar 13, 2015 at 8:20 PM, James H Pastorius <panzerjames@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I am dropping off the 38 motor at my "repairman's" house on Sunday. He is
> a funny, little guy but does good work so I will let you know how it goes.
> then I will have a 38 shell to fill !!
>
> On Fri, Mar 13, 2015 at 7:48 PM, O Gauge Railroading On Line Forum <
> alerts@hoop.la> wrote:
>

l

*REMOVED* (since I failed to see what forum this was [Tinplate] when I posted.

my oldest complete train celebrating its 100th birthday this year...

 

cheers...gary

Yukon Jack and Overlandflyer/GaryGary,

   Very nice. Do they still run?

 

Tom 

William 1,

It all depends upon which era you prefer. My favorites are the two with little to no brass or nickel. (I'll let you ponder here)

 

Originally Posted by MNCW:

Tom,

I'm stuck in my eras that almost no one cares for. What's upsetting is when a friend brings his latest eBay find to you. He treats it like a sick puppy saying, "Please tell me everything is, ok". You hate to tell him/her that someone removed every good part. On this, his like new, extremely rare, rattle can painted, collectible 221w/6654W. It was listed under, rare uncatalogued prewar? (just kidding).

 

 

 

 

like a top...  although most of the time they sit on a shelf, all my trains run from time to time.  i have seen the sort of damage that can occur when a locomotive (especially electric) is doomed to the life of a static display for decades by an ironically good intentioned caretaker.

 

being mentioned in an earlier reply, here are a few early Marx/ Joyline pieces...

 

350 locomotive/ 351 "Koal Kar" tender, Ca. 1927-30.  working, but to say it runs well may be overselling the basic design.  the torsion spring powered motor (also seen in some early handcars) is very weak on its best days.

 

 

the cast iron (102) (Ca. 1930-31) clockwork locomotive was a definite improvement over the #350.  this version used the square key/shaft motor w/ original green key.

 

 

much harder to find is the electric version (101).

 

with the original Power House transformer.

 

not as old as some manufacturers, but as old as you can get for Marx.

cheers...gary

A Lionel 248 I purchased, from Forum Member "TheGandyDancer", a few years ago.

My oldest Lionel is a 1936 M-10000

My oldest Flyer  is a 1940 K-4 Pacific with cars

Flyer in pic 2 bottom shelf 

 

Runs like a champ!  No pun intended. 

My Ives #3217, c1916. Runs like a champ!

 

Tim

 

Well, confession time: I have been on an HO Lindberg kick the past couple years. Lindberg was the brand of my most meaningful train set back during those days (eons ago) that I was but a lad. Christmas of 1962, I think. (I still have three of the cars from that original set.)

 

Anyway, all these decades, Lindberg always held a warm spot reserved in me ol' hobby heart. So, a couple years ago, I decided to find 'em and buy 'em if'n I wanted to.  That I have done.  Among the Lindberg items I now own, I have a Lindberg SW600 (that's what they called it, but it's closer to an SW1) in the correct "Baltimore & Ohio" paint scheme, just like the one I had as a youngster. 

 

Seeing as it is from the late 1950s-early 1960s, I figured one of the Lindberg engines was my oldest engine. 

 

HOWEVER!

 

I forgot I still have a Lionel 665 steam engine, so I guess that one displaces the Lindberg engines from being the "oldest".  Ah well... so it is.

 

For those of you that are un-edumacated on things Lindberg, here's a picture of their little SW in Baltimore & Ohio paint.  So long ago, I spent many a fine hour switching the industries on my carpet central using my original Lindberg set!

 

EDIT: OOOPS! My apologies, I didn't realize this was the Tin Plate forum, for I clicked on the subject in the "New Topics" column and didn't realize it was this forum! Sorry!

 

 

 

laming,

   Very nice...never heard of Lindberg, but I dabbled in HO for a few years (I had a Tyco steam switcher, as I recall)  as a youngster before going back to Lionel tinplate. Thanks for sharing.

 

  Tom

I'm always up for's me a little edumacation, Lindberg as in Lindberg Models?

 

 

Hi Tom:  Glad you enjoyed it.  Perhaps my post was a "happy accident"?

 

Adriatic:

 

Yes, Lindberg as in "Lindberg Models".  They developed a line of HO products they dubbed "The Lindberg Line". 

 

Lindberg turned out VERY different stuff than was typically found in train sets of the time. For starters, there was the SW engine instead of the ubiquitous F unit or generic steam engine typically found in sets of the time.  Plus, their rolling stock was closely prototypical in livery, as well as having flat, dull "boxcar" type colors. No garish colors to be found. Almost all the paint finishes were flat. (With the exception of the slight sheen on the B&O SW.)

 

I received my Lindberg set also by "happy accident" (serendipity!). For Christmas of 1962, I had asked for a cheaper Sears Allstate (Marx) set I saw in the Sears Christmas catalog that year. (See first picture below, middle of the pic, the NP Geep set #2.)  I had selected that particular set because it best resembled the trains I saw around Kansas City as a lad: A switcher, in this case a road switcher.

 

Fortunately, Sears didn't have that set in stock, so Dad n' Mom went to a genuine hobby shop that dealt in trains and asked for suggestions. He suggested a Lindberg set.  Lo and behold: They upgraded and purchased the top of the line set that Lindberg offered (See the top set in the Lindberg catalog page below.)  The set I received was in B&O livery and included a livestock car instead of the tank car.

 

I'm pretty sure I recall being wowed and a bit puzzled when I opened the gift wrapping to see a big, flat box with large dramatic artwork on it depicting a switch engine switching at night. (See the catalog cover art: That was the same cover art used on some of their car boxes and I think set boxes.) 

 

This obviously wasn't the set I asked for! No, instead, it was set that was right up my alley: Looked like the trains I saw around Kansas City! (A switch engine and "railroady" looking rolling stock!)  In addition to the set, they had also purchased some Atlas snap switches and extra track, so I could really do it up right on my Carpet Central down in the basement. What a memorable Christmas year my parents provided me with that year.

 

So, it took some time for this modeler to fully realize that my history in trains doesn't lay with Lionel Postwar (though admire it as I did as a kid, and still do), or even 3 rail (except for a modest Marx set given to me), no, it was Lindberg that truly etched the good toy train memories in my mind.

 

So, I set about to edumacate myself about Lindberg.  What I discovered was that they were very small in the HO field, with only one engine ever being produced (the SW), and that in only four liveries (and possibly undecorated). 

 

* B&O

* ATSF (Black w/"Cross" emblem.)

* CNW (see the art work)

* Illinois Central (Black w/green diamond herald and white stripe on sidesill.)

* Undec, maybe?

 

The IC was a very, VERY low volume unit. I was fortunate enough to find an IC set still in the box.  Pretty cool.

 

Lindberg only produced the cars pictured in the catalog, though I have never seen examples of the flat car w/stakes, the coal hopper, or the tank car. 99% of the time the cars are found in the liveries depicted in the catalog. (Exceptions: The IC set has a box, gondola, and caboose, lettered for the IC.)  I have seen no other variations.  Their cars were quite ahead of their time in regards to the aforementioned flat, railroad livery paint schemes, as well as being equipped with fantastic "Bettendorf-type" trucks cast in high-detail Delrin (sprung, even!) as well as having NMRA RP-25 wheel profiles. Their trucks rival any that are produced today in detail and performance!

 

As best as I can tell, Lindberg sold trains from the late 1950s until the mid-1960s. They were very low volume, so not many train enthusiasts have memories of them.

 

Thus, Lindberg is definitely a small niche in the big scheme of collecting. Today, not many people are interested in their products, and that's fine with me.  I'm always on the look out for Lindberg stuff that's either better than my current example, or a model that I don't have. Very seldom does something turn up that's worth pursuing, but I enjoy looking.

 

Okay, enough of this.  I need to shut up and let you all get back to the topic at hand!

 

 

Nice. I have an Ives 3218 in nice shape. Ives are good running engines.

On Sun, Apr 26, 2015 at 10:22 AM, O Gauge Railroading On Line Forum <
alerts@hoop.la> wrote:

That number 38 electric engine is neat.  I always call it the 'unibody' engine because it doesn't have a very prominent frame over the wheels.  Its one of those engines that looks better in person than in pictures.  Some classic cars are like that.  Also it was interesting to find out how those live steamers with next to no linkage worked.  That is just about the most elegant engineering solution.  Just to add my two cents my oldest is a Lionel 0-4-0 boxcab from the 20's or 30's.  Hold on I'll go check

OK got it. Its a Lionel 253, green, with orange inserts, manual reverse, and the little plate on the bottom that says 'Lionel Corporation' has gold serif lettering on a black ground.

I have a 255E in Gunmetal from 1936. but the tender needs the top for its oil bunker. Anybody have one?

 

ron m,

Your intentions are obvious. It is best to say, "I stand corrected". Thank you, Sir! I will recheck my reference material.

 

BTW: There's two super motored 33's on the bay. Apparently somebody forgot to tell Lionel.

My Ives 3216, looks and runs great.  I believe it is from 1916-1917.  I'm hoping to find the correct passenger cars for it someday.

 

newB,

  Nice looking locomotive!

    Tom