Ted S posted:Charlie posted:I run streamline steam passenger (name trains) and the rubber band is absolutely needed.
I'm sorry but I respectfully disagree.
Ted, you can disagree all you want, I'm an operator and you need traction tires to pull realistic consists with a single streamline steam or diesel. If your pulling a truncated passenger train with five cars and want to call it prototypical, well, that's your choice. Please don't believe what the other guys have told you, listen to the operators actually using the equipment.
The problem some people encounter with passenger cars is excessive drag from the pick-ups for lighting, etc. There was at least one series of MTH heavyweights with defective trucks that caused excessive drag. I also think that car interiors are a needless extravagance. Unless your layout is up near eye level, or the roofs are removable, they're not worth the added weight and manufacturing cost, which would be better spent on other engineering enhancements (see below.)
Interesting, that is not what I think and I have not seen one post on this forum requesting the manufactures to "reduce or eliminate" the detailed interiors. Again, your choice if you think that might help. Honestly, you could always remove the interiors and add frosted windows yourself. I'm positive Sunset/GGD, MTH, Lionel and Atlas would be severely scolded if they took that approach.
One "out-of-the-box" approach that would render the tires unnecessary, would be to retrofit roller bearing truck sets and battery powered lighting to each car. No more drag from pick-ups, and much less drag starting and rolling. Replacing the bearings on the trucks of your favorite passenger consist would be a one-time, lifetime effort.
While I don't/can't disagree with the above statement, it does come down to a cost/benefit with the manufactures and frankly adding the rubber band is much cheaper and for most of us, (I assume) changing a traction tire is not that big of a deal. I do understand some engines are easier than others though.
No more tires!! In the meantime, I would make sure your wheels turn as freely as possible and your axle bearings are properly lubricated.
If you don't want to put battery lighting in each car, you could switch to LED's and remove the pickups from all but the first car. A tether would carry the low-current, low-voltage lighting to the remaining cars. Again, this would be a one time effort, and now a tireless loco would pull your train easily. A little wheel-slip at startup is very realistic and adds interest. Unfortunately, by fitting tires and permanent grooved wheels the manufacturers have denied us this pleasure.
Again, all this extra work just to eliminate the "possible" need to change a tire, just does not make sense to me as an operator.
May I ask, how steep are your grades?
No grades, (modular club) and the sharpest curve is O-120 I believe.
The tires are a nuisance.
I agree they can be, but until they figure out to have a little 1/48 scale sand delivered to the rails, I'm ok with traction tires.
but the manufacturers keep adding them because people have unrealistic expectations.
If you mean "unrealistic expectations" as in correct or close to correct length passenger consists, than yes, I am guilty.
If you think you need the tires, fine, but personally I'm not buying another steam loco until they retool and give us the choice to fit smooth tires.
This I have no problem with. For the guys who run short trains, or just display, then yes, a smooth tire option would be great.
Ted, you did not say anything wrong so please don't take the above personally, but making the changes you suggest (LED string lighting, bearings on all trucks, removing the interior detail) vs. a traction tire, is a no contest decision from a manufacturing stand point. Our models are going up in price every year, your suggestions will just compound that rise and honestly, might price out a manufacture from bringing a project to market.
Charlie
