Tagged With "AC"

Topic

Basic pushbutton questions

Jonathan Bowman ·
So, while our AC transformer is at the shop, we have been using a cheap HO power pack to control our Lionel Dockside switcher. Hooking up an ammeter indicates that with smoker, whistle, and full speed, we rarely peak above 1.0 amp. I am thinking...
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AC engines

rrman ·
I understand DC traction motor engines cannot go through water about 3 inches above rail top to avoid short circuits. Does this same prohibition apply to AC traction motored engines?
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AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

Dan Padova ·
I have an AC supply. It's been sitting on myself for years. I would like to use it to power accessories. It puts out 20 VAC. What can I use as a throttle ?
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Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

CUSTOM "O" DECALS ·
     Our Newest item (#BB2016-1-S or -1-O) 55 gal. burn barrels should be ready for very limited sales by Feb. 1, 2016. These burn barrels will add another simulation of reality to your layout. As you all know that back in the day and in some areas even today folks burned their trash in 55 gal. metal drums. Rail yards used them to warm their out door work force in winter time.      Our 55 gal. drums are rust colored and illuminated with flickering LED bulbs that...
Topic

Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

CUSTOM "O" DECALS ·
Our Newest item (#BB2016-1-S or -1-O) 55 gal. burn barrels should be ready for very limited sales by Feb. 1, 2016. These burn barrels will add another simulation of reality to your layout. As you all know that back in the day and in some areas even today folks burned their trash in 55 gal. metal drums. Rail yards used them to warm their out door work force in winter time.      Our 55 gal. drums are rust colored and illuminated with flickering LED bulbs that operate on AC...
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Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

CUSTOM "O" DECALS ·
Our Newest item (#BB2016-1-S or -1-O) 55 gal. burn barrels should be ready for very limited sales by Feb. 1, 2016. These burn barrels will add another simulation of reality to your layout. As you all know that back in the day and in some areas even today folks burned their trash in 55 gal. metal drums. Rail yards used them to warm their out door work force in winter time.      Our 55 gal. drums are rust colored and illuminated with flickering LED bulbs that operate on AC...
Topic

Damaged the electronics running DC instead of AC+

ipmagcol ·
I have bought an MTH RailKing PCC Street Car with ProtoSound version 1.0. When I first got it, I put it on my Loinel track with DC for a short while. Now with AC power it just seems to stand in "RESET" state (not moving at all). The sound seams to be there and the bell dings two times upon startup. Can I have damaged the DCRU electronic reverse unit by running DC? I have got it running on AC power by shifting the yellow connectors so the engine gets power from the marker light connector, now...
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Re: Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

gunrunnerjohn ·
Click on profile name, click on BLOCK, you won't see any of them.
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Re: Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

CUSTOM "O" DECALS ·
John, The best idea any one has had lately on this subject. I think you have a firm grasp of the situation. Dave, LBR
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Re: Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

CUSTOM "O" DECALS ·
Up dated photo here now Dave, LBR
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Re: Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

rtraincollector ·
so how many times do yon need to post this
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Re: Feb. 1, 2016: BURN BARRELS

CUSTOM "O" DECALS ·
As this forum is set up to only notify one group at a time probably as many times as it takes to notify everyone in three different groups. OK? Dave, LBR
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

Alan Mancus ·
yes you can use it but typically accessories use 16 vac but not always, what is the amp rating on your power supply? Also it should either be fused or a circuit breaker in case of a short, you want the power to go off immediately, otherwise you could burn out your accessories, and if they are MTH they would have electronics boards and you would not want to burn out electrics as they get very expensive! IMHO Alan
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

ADCX Rob ·
20 volts is fine, but how many amps? If it's not labeled, figure about 1 amp/lb. as a starting point. I have used 8 amp 22 volt industrial transformers for powering PM-1's for CAB-1 conventional control. It works well despite the 18 volt design of the TMCC system, but do so at your own risk.
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

AGHRMatt ·
As funny as that sounds, that's surprisingly close.
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

stan2004 ·
Yikes. I'd want that off of me ASAP. OK, understood you've found a solution with your KW. Hijack alert. This being a discussion forum, if we're talking about powering accessories with a spare/unused fixed-output AC transformer, many newer accessories operate on DC input. For example, Menards, Lemax, Miller lighting products take 4.5V DC, animated mechanisms now routinely use DC gear-motor, and accessories with digital functionality must convert Accessory AC to a lower DC voltage such as 5V...
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

RoyBoy ·
Nobody has suggested getting a TPC? That's what I have been using and building layouts with for years. They work great. Supposedly the new Power Masters have all the programming that the TPC did.
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

ADCX Rob ·
While the PM-1 PowerMaster can be used as a plug-n-play standalone with the 6 amp supply and a CAB-1, a TPC requires extra equipment and cabling.
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

Dan Padova ·
I'm not sure you are understanding what I would like to do. The power supply is an LGB 50110 6 Amp AC transformer. I need to vary the output voltage. LGB has a throttle but it changes the AC to DC at the throttle. Isn't there a device that would allow me to vary the voltage coming from the LGB power supply and keep it as AC ? Here are two photos showing the power supply and the throttle. As you can see, the transformer puts out AC only. The throttle, on the right, changes the AC power to DC...
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

Dan Padova ·
I think I'll just use my KW transformer. It doesn't seem worth the effort to mess with the LGB power supply.
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

JohnGaltLine ·
I can think of a couple of ways to do this, but none of them are particularly practical. The first is to go super old school and use a rheostat. You waste a lot of power as heat, but it will get the job done. If you're looking to run accessories at a lower voltage this might work out. Next, you can use a Variac: This will vary the voltage on the input side of the transformer which will, in turn, adjust the output side. While it will work, even a cheap/used variac costs more than just buying...
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

Ace ·
JOHNGALTLINE gave a good rundown on alternate ideas for a throttle controller for fixed voltage output. I use a variable transformer feeding a salvaged step-down transformer on one of my layouts, which works well. I happened to have free secondhand parts on hand for that. Another possibility uses a bank of light bulbs connected in parallel, which as a group are connected in series with the circuit through the locomotive motor. Some of the earliest electric model trains used this method...
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Re: AC Supply. What can I use for a throttle

ADCX Rob ·
I understood perfectly, and now with some specific information, I will stick with using it to powering a PM-1 for CAB-1 conventional control(trains, accessories, lights, whatever you wish). The MTH Z controller will do the same thing, albeit with wires instead of wireless.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
Yep Chuck, there goes another one. You do have to add the choke for DCS compatibility, but that's not sufficient to go to the trouble of making one. I ordered three of these to have on hand, they look useful. Stan, the 153E looks interesting, I've never even seen one of those. Truthfully, if I were to do a signal module, I think I'd probably stick an 8-pin PIC on there and have maybe four transistor outputs and two inputs. Make it do a bit more. Perhaps one of the inputs would be a simple...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

PLCProf ·
Does anybody know the true commercial market for all these modules? Who uses them in what products? Hard to believe they are manufactured for the hobbyists! As an editorial comment, the vast majority of people on this forum are hobbyists, and a lot of us are "old guys with a lot of stuff." There seems to be a bias toward spending $5 to use something I already have rather than spending $2 to buy the correct part for the job. Some of my other hobby interests have the same problem. To...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

JohnGaltLine ·
I'm going to guess it is a hobbyist of a different sort. It has proven difficult to find accurate and/or up to date numbers, but the best I can find shows over 3 million Raspberry Pi's sold as of March 2014. Arduinos are even harder to track because there are many more clones out there. The figures I can find suggest over 1.5 million boards just between genuine Arduino boards and SparkFun branded boards are sold each year. Other articles and community responses say for every genuine board...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

stan2004 ·
Everyone has their opinion on the value of pre-wiring, packaging, branding ("Lionel" printed on it), and so on. I think you could indeed add some value with a 25 cent microcontroller to add logic and timing to Case 1. While I can't imagine anyone doing this, you may recall I showed how you can take a Hennings AC-to-DC LED module plus a $1 eBay 12V DC relay module to essentially duplicate the functionality of a 153E. It additionally has the DCS inductor. The post which includes and video...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

cjack ·
I don't think it has to do with "work " as much as other reasons like tiny, neat, ocd, cost, skills, etc.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

stan2004 ·
Don't forget "tools". While the DIY electrical guys have a soldering iron (or 2 or 3), I'm not sure everyone in the hobby has one. Then there are those insanely (high) priced crimping tools to make connector inserts for some of the wiring used in the hobby. And the tool I have the most "fun" with is the digital multi-meter which I find a lot of guys do not have and hence my delight in pointing out the "Free with Coupon" meter you can get at Harbor Freight...perfectly adequate for a wide...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
Other folks have mentioned programmable signal systems, so that might be a place where there is a chance to add value. I do notice a huge resistance to having to solder anything.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

PLCProf ·
What we need is a module that puts 8 of these in a row, plus de-chatter, for $8. I posted this a few years back but the thread disappeared or my eyes went dim. I'd let you remove the 120VAC coil connection. Add a DCS inductor and it would be a winner. http://controlconsultantsinc.c...-1030vacdc-2381.html
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
We wait with eager anticipation for your product announcement. I know I won't be building it, I can't afford to ship a $20 bill with each unit!
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

stan2004 ·
I suggest starting a different thread specific to a new/proposed "signaling" product whether it be an 8-channel relay system or $20 bills folded origami-style to look like relays. No rules against topic-meander, but this thread started with a proposal to convert low-voltage AC-to-DC...and the trials and tribulations therein. Just my 2 cents. No refunds.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

Stoshu ·
I use these at work all the time , they are bullet proof. I also use them quite extensively on isolated rail applications. I still add a couple diodes and anywhere from a 480uf to 1000uf cap to keep the relay from chattering. A 1000uf cap give me about a 2 second post delay on the relay, Great for crossing gates. The number we use is the MR101. ( they also include a nice mounting bracket ) That will handle 8-230V input. Bruce..
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
You're talking me out of it Stan. You really can't compete with the Chinese on stuff like this, that seems clear. I do believe the person using the 28V max input module that toasted it was feeding it 22 or 24 volts from an MTH transformer. With 18V AC, you shouldn't hit 28 volts DC, more like 25.5V peak at the cap, and then there's a couple of diode drops through the bridge diodes... I think I'll go back to stuff the Chinese haven't blanketed so thoroughly.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

cjack ·
I like all these suggestions. From the standpoint of providing 4.5 vdc using the 16-17 vac lighting source (for incandescent and new Lionel LED lighting tracksides, I needed ac to dc with high efficiency. I already had some ac to dc linear supplies with readouts and dc to dc switching supplies with readouts. I decided to use the linear supplies for rectification, filtering, and drop a couple dc volts to their output and then feed the dc to dc switching supplies. This works well up to at...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

JohnGaltLine ·
Just to throw it out there, you could use a simple jumper to make the board switch between full and half wave rectification. I forgot about the choke for DCS, but other than that I think this works... The capacitors are random values, you know what you actually need. Anyway for less than a quarter in parts over that of using a full bridge you can add the option to switch between either option by moving a jumper. JGL
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
Looking at the prices of Chinese modules, I don't see where this can be made where it's attractive without losing money on every shipment. Chuck, the one issue with calculating the input cap is knowing the ripple specification for the Chinese module. I guess I'd have to dig into the chip datasheet to see what it tolerates.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gg1man ·
I solved all of my low voltage problems by use of a PC power supply. I bought mien at Radio Shack but I'm sure you can find them at multiple outlets. It provides a 5VDC, 12VDC, 9VDC output from a standard 120 AC input and I only paid about twenty-five bucks for it. Of course you have to get a little creative bringing your voltages out to a terminal strips, but it came with a chart that showed the pin out on the connector. Return is the same for all voltages. Even without that a volt meter...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
A PC power supply is a little large for rolling stock or engines, at least O-scale stuff.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

stan2004 ·
Yes, I think a one-size-fits-all AC-to-DC converter might be one of those "Jack of all trades, master of none." On the layout track-side application, the 2 AC-to-DC applications that come up most often are: Case 1 . Insulated rail triggering of a DC relay or DC circuit for red-green signaling. Case 2 . Using AC accessory voltage to drive lighting such as 4.5V DC for Lemax, Miller, and Menards. In both cases, the use of an external DC power supply whether it be a DC wall-wart, a PC power...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

cjack ·
Actually now...my somewhat solution of using what I had in stock seems more and more to be the solution. An AC to DC linear regulator and setting a few volts drop to a DC to DC switching supply set to 4.5 vdc output. But the suggestion above of this module for 3 bucks plus seems to solve all the requirements in one module... http://www.ebay.com/itm/391078...078368935%26_rdc%3D1
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
Probably prudent, I'll mull over the possibilities.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
I was waffling on the diode or bridge for the reasons stated. I think you're probably right though, a bridge is most likely the safer choice. I guess I need to assemble a "feature list" to try to come up with all the ideas and then see how to fit them into a module. I knew the screw terminals would come up, it would be nice to find a reasonably inexpensive source for them. I suspect that the sandwich idea is also going to be needed, I don't want the module to get too big.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

stan2004 ·
It may be that the track-side application is a red-herring and the real need is for rolling stock. The ~$3 eBay LM2596 AC-DC converter is bulky but no matter if being placed under the layout? And there are versions of the AC-DC switching module that have screw-terminal inputs and outputs for ~$4 free shipping (eBay 391078368935). So drilling down the rolling-stock option without screw-terminal, I suppose it's similar to the Hennings LED module variants with flying leads or DIY soldering. I...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

Stoshu ·
some of those Buck/Boost boards do AC to DC. would yours be a bit beefier ? What would yours do that the others wont ?
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

gunrunnerjohn ·
Nope, just offers DCS compatibility and hopefully a smaller size. That's why I'm considering the alternate layout.
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

PLCProf ·
From painful experience, please be sure to do the math around the half-wave rectifier. Peak/RMS input currents will probably be higher than you expect, but my bigger concern would be the ripple current rating of those tiny capacitors. Perhaps you have already done this. I might also provide instructions to transpose the input polarity of multiple units on the same circuit to cancel the DC component in the transformer as much as possible. I have never done any tests to see how much DC a...
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Re: Proposed AC-DC Power Module for Layout use

stan2004 ·
No question this is a thorny issue. I don't think there's a simple answer. My opinion is to go with the bridge...like the eBay LM2596 module. For rolling stock applications I think there's enough precedence with MTH in particular that guys get the concept that the chassis is NOT "ground". For track-side insulated rail triggering from outer-rail-common, I think a large % of applications can simply power the entire AC-to-DC module if that makes sense. Separately, it's hard to tell but from the...
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Re: Damaged the electronics running DC instead of AC+

ipmagcol ·
Thanks Nick but it did not work, I will try with a MTH transformer. Cheers! Magnus
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