Tagged With "colorado railroad museum"

Topic

High Plains 3 Railers at the Colorado Railroad Museum September 23-24 ,2017

CHOO-CHOO MIKE ·
High Plains 3 Railers layout at museum
Reply

Re: 844 though Ault about 15 minutes ago wiih 3936

Hot Water ·
SUSAN, A few corrections: 1) The test run of 844 was yesterday, July 12, 2016 2) The DDA40X, coupled behind 844's auxiliary water tender was #6936. Not "3936". 3) The "absence" actually has been one week short of 3 YEARS.
Reply

Re: 844 though Ault about 15 minutes ago wiih 3936

Tranz4mr ·
Susan did you get out to watch 844?
Topic

844 though Ault about 15 minutes ago wiih 3936

Susan Deats ·
seen at [Colorado-Railfan] Digest Number 4485 Yahoo! Groups 844 though Ault about 15 minutes ago wiih 3936 Tue Jul 12, 2016 11:10 am (PDT) Ault is in northern Colorado on the line where UP Steam normally does their test runs. If they follow the past Denver Post Cheyenne Frontier Days run schedules, the 844 consist will run to Denver Thursday, July 21st and return Sunday, July 24th. UP STEAM SCHEDULE After a 2-year absence, the Living Legend No. 844 returns to service July 23 for the 2016...
Reply

Re: 37th National Narrow Gauge Convention and the LT&N

Erik C Lindgren ·
To top off the festivities Jefferson had his High Plains Route Model Railroad open house on Saturday afternoon. The A&O was also open. O scale 2 Rail was well represented at this all important venue held each year. Colorado is fast becoming one of the hot spots for O Scale 2 Rail Model Railroading!
Topic

37th National Narrow Gauge Convention and the LT&N

Erik C Lindgren ·
John and I had a marvelous time at the convention last week exhibiting the 2 Rail Longmont Terminal & Northern Branch Line Railroad. Like every venue met some new friends and had some generous help from some old friends. Thank you Myron, Jeff, Bob, and Reyes. Like any project the entire layout is a consistent phase of continuing progress and or partial completion on areas. I make it one way and change it again and again. The bridge as seen in another thread or saga is nearing completion...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

John Mills ·
I do think that railroad is pretty important to the local economy
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Farmer_Bill ·
$25 million sounds like a lot of money. I don't know if the railroad could stand such a loss if they are in fact held liable. Furthermore could the local economy survive the loss of the railroad if it were to go out of business?
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

geysergazer ·
Isn't this like trying to get blood from a turnip? DOJ is seeking $25 million and I bet that would bankrupt the railroad. If that happens I'm thinking you can roll up the sidewalks of Silverton and probably Durango as well. Those are tourist towns and a lot of their trade comes from people there for the train. I don't get the Administration's goal here because the railroad has taken the necessary steps to remedy the situation going forward (by converting to oil-firing) and this suit, if...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Number 90 ·
It was a horrible fire, no doubt about that. This is only the beginning of the legal action, not the settlement. Let's not rush to judgment. There's insurance, and, as BIGKID pointed out there will be a lot of documents filed by both the government and the railroad, and this is a complex matter which will be negotiated..
Topic

June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

rrman ·
https://www.outtherecolorado.c...r-colorado-wildfire/ Be interesting to see how this is resolved. "State story, RR story, and true story somewhere in between". Read thoughtful comments.
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

breezinup ·
Everyone loves the D&S, and thinks they should be excused. But think about every time a major forest fire is started by careless campers, for example, causing millions of dollars in damage and millions for fire suppression operations (and sometimes loss of life). No one thinks the campers should be excused in those cases, and in fact they are subject to civil and criminal liability. The D&S hasn't been found liable yet, and I hope they aren't, but under the law they can't be treated...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

smd4 ·
First of all, DOJ isn't seeking a specified monetary amount at this point. Second, the railroad's liability carrier will be on the hook for any damages won (unless they are self-insured to a certain amount). It's really way, way too early to know what's going to happen here. The "goal" appears to be trying to recoup some of your hard-spent tax dollars...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Tinplate Art ·
The attorneys and insurance folks will sort this out, and it is very likely the lawsuit will not prevail. The tourism draw of this historic railroad is very important to the economy of Colorado, and saner, sober heads will make an informed decision. Proper precautionary procedures will be modified and/or adopted to prevent future conflagations from occurring. The proverbial sky is NOT falling!
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

geysergazer ·
I was going by this: "The cause was released in a federal lawsuit from the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the District of Colorado that seeks compensation for firefighting and rehabilitation efforts, which the U.S. Attorney’s Office says cost the federal government approximately $25 million so far." One wonders if the railroad has insurance to cover off-[railroad]-property fire? Liability insurance to cover on-property injury, of course, as well as on-property fire damage but fire liability...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Bill DeBrooke ·
The reason you buy Liability Insurance is to protect yourself in case you damage someone's property or cause bodily injury. To protect your own property you purchase casualty insurance.
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

bigkid ·
I am not sure this could be considered "frivolous", this isn't like someone suing a distillery because they got cirrhosis of the liver downing a fifth of bourbon every day. Like any legal case, it is going to come down to the answer to several questions: 1)Has the plaintiff in the case experienced harm? Answer in this case, yes, the government spent 25 million dollars or whatever putting out the fire (and theoretically, if any private residences or farms burned, they could sue as well).
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

smd4 ·
Petty harassment? You do realize the Plaintiff is the United States of America , right? Not Farmer Brown whose 3-acre soybean field went up? How would being on the National Register of Historic Places shield the railroad from a federal lawsuit?
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Dennis LaGrua ·
There is no proof that the Silverton and Durango RR started a fire and it should be assumed that precautions were taken to insure that it couldn't happen. . All we have here is speculation. Before the Milwaukee Road had abandoned its Chicago to Seattle route, there were sections that ran through state and federal woodlands through the Bitteroot Mountains in Idaho. There was never a fire as the railroad electrified the line and later ran diesels.
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Dwayne B ·
This is very sad.....My grandparents took me to Durango to ride the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad for the 1st time in 1970. I have been back countless times with the last time being October 2018 with my family. I took a behind scenes tour of the roundhouse with my daughter. I kept telling her during the tour how lucky we were to be taking a step back in time. The Durango & Silverton Railroad is an American treasure right along with the Grand Canyon, Yellowstone and the...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

BobbyD ·
Interesting, would this apply to Boeing as well?
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Tinplate Art ·
Knowledgeable comments by both the legally trained and others have been presented here. Rest assured, this case will go on for months with reams of documents and multiple witness testimonies. Hopefully the insurance will be a key factor and I am fairly certain the railroad has, or will hire, talented legal counsel. I would certainly not write off the D&S at this juncture!
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

bigkid ·
If I remember my business law, in these kind of cases it will come down to whether the railroad reasonably attempted to prevent such fires from happening, whether a reasonable man could decide they bore fault for it (and again, this is what I recall). In theory they could (again based on what I remember of business law) argue the railroad is responsible under the idea of vicarious liability (basically if an activity is so dangerous that no matter how many precautions you take, it doesn't...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

breezinup ·
In fact, the subject lawsuit has been filed by the United States Attorney's office, that is, by the U.S. Government. Also, note the reference to the Colorado statute: The United States is seeking compensation under Colorado Revised Statute § 40-30-103 which states: “Every railroad operating its line of road, or any part thereof, within this state shall be liable for all damages by fires that are set out or caused by operating any such line of road, or any part thereof, in this state, whether...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Jon1443 ·
The article made it seem like the US attorney's office does have proof that the fire was started by the RR. If this suit results in all coal-burning steamers to be more proactive in fire prevention and suppression, it's a win for all involved
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

johnstrains ·
According to the Complaint, no: 17. "Defendants’ train operations along its Durango-to-Silverton railroad track has previously caused wildfires requiring deployment of federal fire-fighting resources, incurring fire suppression costs. Examples of fires previously started by Defendants include: the 2012 GoblinFire (1,000 acres burned); the 2012 Needleton Fire (6 acres burned); the 2002 Schaff II Fire (550 acres burned); and the 1994 Mitchell Lakes Fire (270 acres burned)."
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

smd4 ·
It's actually a fairly short Complaint at only 7 pages. Here are the specific allegations regarding the fire (sorry about the weird formatting--I cut and past from a PDF file): The 416 Fire began on June 1, 2018, at approximately 9:53 a.m., when one of Defendants’ coal-fired steam trains, bound from Durango to Silverton, was passing through the San Juan National Forest lands at a location called Shalona Hill, which is adjacent to a private residential subdivision called Irongate Way.
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

TrainMan1225 ·
Listen to yourself. I'm not versed in politics at ALL (in fact I hate it), but I am CERTAIN having an economy based off of the fortunes of pot would be MUCH worse for the well-being of the residents than a few coal-burning steam locomotives. Not like that would even happen anyway... I don't see a realistic alternative for these towns should the railroad lose the suit, especially for Silverton. The northern terminus of the D&S is a much smaller town than Durango (the southern terminus),...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Tinplate Art ·
Steve: My comment was meant to be a satirical, tongue-in-cheek criticism of often skewed and convoluted government regulations and associated bureacracy! If the Feds were aware of any recent climatic, environmental or other changing parameters that required the D&S to take additional corrective action regarding spark effusion, perhaps they should have initiated meetings with the D&S Operating Dept. in a more timely manner. The discovery phases of this legal wrangle should be quite...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Matt_GNo27 ·
Having ridden the D&SNGR as a kid, I sure hope that it survives this suit. That said, your title is not "just stating facts," but shows a strong bias against the lawsuit. A neutral title, stating just the facts might be: "U.S. Attorney's Colorado Office files suit against the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad seeking to recoup $25M in 416 Fire costs." It's worth remembering that even headlines that "state just the facts" can convey bias.
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

Casey Jones2 ·
From a post over on TO about this... "First, the operation of steam locomotives has never been declared to be an "untrahazardous activity" by any courts like blasting has been declared to be. Thus, the USFS still needs to prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the railroad was negligent before they can be awarded any damages by the court. That is not a simple as it may look. The D&S will be able to produce evidence of the long history of the use of the steam locomotives out of...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

New Haven Joe ·
Silverton has nothing going for it except for tourists brought in by the D&S. My wife and I spent the night in Silverton a few years ago. The town closes up as soon as the train departs. In addition to the hotel, I think that there was one restaurant open. We enjoyed walking through what was essentially an old west ghost town. Durango is major crossroads and is near Mesa Verde National Park. It also has a University of Colorado campus. It should continue to do well if the railroad closed...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

bigkid ·
Thanks for this, I think it clarifies how judgements happen when it comes to lawsuits for damages. A jury (or a judge, question I always wanted to ask, can a defendant waive the right to a jury in a civil case?) could give much less than asked I assume if they feel like someone else bears some of the blame (for example, if this had been a drought and the government didn't issue warnings or guidelines about the state of the forest, they could be considered partially responsible for it). A...
Reply

Re: June 2018 Colorado fire? Let's sue the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad out of business

bigkid ·
Interesting question. From what I know of vicarious liability cases, the activity involved is so inherently dangerous that basically in doing it the person/organization accepts that fact, that if something goes wrong in effect they will be found responsible/negligent even if they did everything they could. My opinion would be no, that given the relative safety of aircraft that Boeing would not be assumed to be liable automatically. Put it this way, Boeing planes achieve millions of flight...
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

Rusty Traque ·
The D&S hasn't been a "real" railroad in decades. A fine tourist railroad, yes. Rusty
Reply

Re: High Plains 3 Railers at the Colorado Railroad Museum September 23-24 ,2017

CHOO-CHOO MIKE ·
This weekend ! Rain or shine or snow. We will be running trains.
Reply

Re: 37th National Narrow Gauge Convention and the LT&N

Erik C Lindgren ·
Here a few shots of the vendor areas Nice Rio Grande/SP KM in 1/48 Very well attended! Manufacturers are always wonderful to visit with. Trees and more trees... Trees and more trees like my friend at Branching Out Model Trees that custom builds trees like this gorgeous double trunk example. Love this stuff!! Model builders paradise Not sure what these guys were selling, I tried to ask and they were more interested in their iPhones The new Gazette owners Love this guys stuff! The north and...
Reply

Re: 37th National Narrow Gauge Convention and the LT&N

Austin Bill ·
Thanks, Erik. It being a narrow gauge convention but nevertheless in Grande country was there much or any Grande standard gauge engines and rolling stock for sale?
Reply

Re: 37th National Narrow Gauge Convention and the LT&N

sleepmac ·
Erik, thanks for all the photos. Looks like a good time for sure! Dan Weinhold
Reply

Re: 37th National Narrow Gauge Convention and the LT&N

Erik C Lindgren ·
Sure thing guys, this is the contest room: Of course our layout WAS NOT on the ballot despite many attendees and voters writing us in. Probably still disqualified due to the “broad minded” nature of our layout.
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

colorado hirailer ·
That ain't preserving history, which is what l want done there, since l was lucky enough to get there and ride it in the 1950's, when it was a real railroad. Meddlers always manage to destroy something.
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

Steve24944 ·
Lets not complain about changing the authenticity of the Railroad. If the D&SNG and Cumbres and Toltec don't make these changes, they may switch to all Diesel, or have to shut down all together. Steve
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

Former Member ·
I took the Durango and Silverton a few years ago and the number of cinder fire spots next to the tracks was incredible. Only a matter of time before they burned down the mountains. Couple that with he EPA polluting the Animas River even more and we are lucky to still have the railroad
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

trainroomgary ·
Hi Steve: Yes, Diesels are on there way to the D&SNG because the railroad has several lawsuits against them because of the forest fires and property losses. In total, Al Harper, owner of the D&SNG, estimates D&SNG will invest about $7 million, not only on the conversion of coal-burning engines to oil-burning but to acquire two custom-built diesel locomotives and take other fire-prevention measures. The diesels, being built by Motive Power & Equipment and Equipment Solutions...
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

colorado hirailer ·
How about the Cumbres and Toltec? Fire is a nuisance reality for both roads...l couldn't ride the C&T one trip because of fire, and this wasn't one of those ranger started fires that chased me out of Yellowstone and around Wyoming to sit at blocked bridges in the middle of the night. Guess l better get to the C&T..was beautiful riding through yellow aspen on the eastern half..and that missed the Toltec. In the 1950's the Rio Grande narrow gauge was a real railroad..not sure what year...
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

Steve24944 ·
Lot of people including me would be sad to see Steam Locomotives retired. Would visitors to these historic railroads decline without Steam ? I'm sure the management of these railroad operations are looking at that. They might resort to running Diesel in periods of high fire danger, mid to late summer. I'm sure many people would be highly disappointed, but better that than shutting down forever. Steve
Topic

Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

trainroomgary ·
Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives I have been to this railroad many times, because my wife and her family are from Ouray, Colorado. Ouray is north of Silverton on the Million Dollar Highway. Link to article https://durangoherald.com/articles/263817#modal=search-modal,slide=undefined Source: Durango Herald • Durango, Colorado • February 16, 2019 Gary: Rail-fan
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

trainroomgary ·
The reason they are going to oil burning is to prevent forest fires. Last year the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad was closed for over 40 days because of a forest fire that may have been started from a hot coal cinders . This fire, which burned more than 54,000 acres. The forest managers & fire fighters are having issues with battling ever-longer droughts. This problem is well-recognized. Al Harper, owner of the D&SNG, estimates using oil instead of coal to fuel...
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

Hot Water ·
They have extensive fire patrols that follow EVERY train on the C&T, some times TWO fire patrols (speeders) behind each train.
Reply

Re: Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge begins era of oil-burning locomotives

trainroomgary ·
John Harper; owner of the D&SNG, is not sure when the two diesels will go into service, but he said they are planned to lead new runs from Rockwood to Cascade that will begin next year. Along with yard work on the D&SNG. My speculation: He is doing this for a “Plan B” if one of the lawsuits goes against the D&SNG he will be able to keep the railroad running. The D&SNG is the main business in Durango & Silverton, Colorado. There are no plans to phase out steam power at...
 
OGR Publishing, Inc., 1310 Eastside Centre Ct, Suite 6, Mountain Home, AR 72653
330-757-3020

www.ogaugerr.com
×
×
×
×
×