(12/29/21) SOLD OUT! Beta 3.0 Engines from Menards!

There might have been no changes as they were probably hoping for others to get them besides the initial testers in order to broaden the feedback base.   I'm sure you could get your money back; sell it while the market is hot.

Brendan

I’m having an issue with Beta 3.0.

@iDad 3.0, it would seem that your locomotive was wired backwards at the factory. Swapping the leads to both motors should correct the issue.

@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:

Sam,

It’s rather uncommon for a manufacturer to actually sell preproduction units period.

Mike

That depends, do they want them back? It's a losing proposition when you have to incur the cost to return a product and then paying for the disposal of it. I receive lots of tech equipment sent to me that is beta & demo equipment that the manufacture never wants back because they can't resell it and it's only value is to them is e-waste. About 25% of the time do we have to actually send it back and in those cases the manufacture has to pay for the return cost.

@bmoran4 posted:

@iDad 3.0, it would seem that your locomotive was wired backwards at the factory. Swapping the leads to both motors should correct the issue.

I would agree with this.  Remove the four black screws from the bottom to open it.  Careful you don't "break your horns".

John

@bmoran4 posted:

@iDad 3.0, it would seem that your locomotive was wired backwards at the factory. Swapping the leads to both motors should correct the issue.

Simpler yet, reverse the leads on the circuit board.

Spare parts I received with my different versions:

1.  Extra horn loose in box

2.  Extra nylon PCB mounting screw loose inside chassis

If anyone is short either of these or either is broken, let me know and I will send it to you.

John

@Craftech posted:

I didn't say "beforehand".

But 200 were sold out in two hours.  So the orders were done.  If we are beta testing why is knowing what was improved a bad thing?  Not everyone has all three to compare like I do.  If there is no difference between version 2 and version 3 then wouldn't Menards be more forthcoming saying "We are selling a second run of version 2 for a larger feedback"?  New version means some changes were made.  I don't see any so this is version 2 reissued.  What am I missing ?

I also like these things.  Even bought an MTH B unit to go with one of them.  But as I stated above I won't be buying another Beta unless I know I will be testing something new.

John

Sometimes the purpose of the beta test is to see if changes can be made without the end user knowing what or why. I did notice some extremely minor changes made to 3.0 that were not present in 2.0. They were ever so slightly noticeable and didn't bother me so I didn't report them to Menards either. They are there and you need to look hard.

In my line work, I receive equipment from manufactures for demo and beta testing purposes. I once received a  pre-production network switch from Cisco, and studied it thoroughly to compare it from the previous release to see what had changed. Couldn't find a dang thing! My sales rep later revealed to me the one and only change made... the shipping box size was reduced by two inches in length. They did this to see if the equipment would still survive shipping without damage. Apparently the logistics department figured out they would save a bunch of money on shipping if this worked out.

Menards beta test program appears to be a blind study (they won't tell us whats different to see if anyone will even notice) and it's designed to sample folks 100% at random by offering it online only, in limited quantities and to whoever who shows up first.  They didn't select "elite" members of some group or a closed circle of train buddies but rather the masses they intend to sell it to.

@H1000 posted:

Sometimes the purpose of the beta test is to see if changes can be made without the end user know what or why. I did notice some extremely minor changes made to 3.0 that were not present in 2.0. They were ever so slightly noticeable and didn't bother me so I didn't report them to Menards either. They are there and you need to look hard.

Oh.  That's encouraging.  What were they?

Thanks,

John

@Craftech posted:

Oh.  That's encouraging.  What were they?

Thanks,

John

I sent my feedback to Menards as per their request. I assume what little things I noticed had more to deal with stream lining the production and implementing some cost savings.

I am just hoping Menards , makes parts available On their web site. And l little training in their stores wouldnt hurt

I just opened and ran my Beta 3.0.  I am very impressed with this entry by Menards.  Because it falls within the starter set price point, it's hard for me to judge it because my collection is Railking and Premier diesels and steam.  I do like its "command" remote, and it seems to be very responsive at 13 volts.  I like the talk and bell a lot.  Having the random control tower sounds is super cool especially at this price point.  However, the horn, needs improvement.  I really like the forward and reverse led lights -- every bit as good as the best.  The lights for the number panels should be steady white lights as has been noted in this forum.  I also like that they put some engineers inside the cab -- you can tell Menards' folks actually play with trains, too.

I thought I had a defective product.  I had no sound or bell/horn.  But it turned out that my batteries were weak.  Once I put new batteries in it worked great.

When I compare it to my MTH Santa Fe F3 I would say this engine compares well, aesthetically, except for the shiny chrome trucks.  The red should be a gloss, candy apple red the way MTH does it -- they nailed it.  Menards trucks look as good as MTH

and I also like the yellow paint around the headlight.  Nice job, Menards.  I think you have a noble contender in the O Gauge category -- definitely at the entry level.  I was planning to test it and then sell it.  But now it may be a keeper because it is, well, fun to play with like a good toy train should be.

I paired it for fun with my MTH B unit and it looks good as you can see.  Menards ought to offer a B unit or a non-powered A.  I have not run it with cars yet because my layout is under heavy construction.

And, BTW, that Spaten Oktoberfest in the photo was really good beer. 

@Brendan posted:

There might have been no changes as they were probably hoping for others to get them besides the initial testers in order to broaden the feedback base.   I'm sure you could get your money back; sell it while the market is hot.

Brendan

I was told some hobby shop was selling three of them as new on "you know where" for over $350 each.

@BobbyD posted:

I was told some hobby shop was selling three of them as new on "you know where" for over $350 each.

Not just " some hobby shop" but a sponsor here that regularly posts "big sales" .(under every forum topic)  That are actually just reductions from original price markups.

I Wouldn't buy from (N)ew (H)aven if they were the last shop on earth.

Stick with honest ,reputable dealers that don't play games.  Like Ro, Trainworld, and Mr. Muffins

Ricko that's pretty good with the  new haven thing👌

Here is the analysis that I just sent.

Menards beta 3 Santa Fe loco

About me:

I come from a family of men who repair machines. Great grandfather owned a machine shop and repaired automobiles in the 30’s and 40’s. Father repaired electromechanical desk calculators manufactured by the Friden Corporation. My older brother was an auto mechanic and also had antique cars. I was a field service engineer for medical machines and machines used in the semiconductor industry. I have an antique car collection which I taught myself to repair and maintain. Additionally, I have been playing with trains and repairing them since around 1955. I keep my hand in the repair business.

Here is my rather wordy analysis of the Beta 3 loco.

The good:

The square holes behind the number boards work well for even lighting.

The ornamental horns set closer to the roof should make them less susceptible to breakage.

The plastic bag on the loco seems to have eliminated all the scuffing on the paint job.

Reworking the firmware for smoother starts and stops worked very well. I especially like the fact that you can run in forward at a good clip, throw the loco into reverse, and watch it slow down smoothly before starting up again smoothly in reverse. The start is still slightly too abrupt for my taste. Maybe a little more tweaking on the lowest speed steps would help. The lowest speed step is a hair too fast for my liking.

I like the fact that everything is mounted on the chassis, so there are no plugs to unplug when removing the body.

The shipping packaging is working very well. My loco took some detours on its way to being delivered a week later than originally announced. The box took a beating, but the loco came through unscathed.

I like the general design of the power trucks. It’s especially nice that the side frames can be removed from the bottom, so traction tires can be changed without a complete disassembly of the loco. The power pickups can be removed from the bottom also without complete disassembly of the truck.

The bad:

One of my rollers would not swivel and was too tight to extend. If it is pushed up into the truck, the spring cannot push it down. I reworked it a bit, but it is still not right. Is there any way to get a replacement?

The screws holding the body to the chassis were way too tight. If someone uses a cheap screwdriver, they are likely to strip the screw heads. The assemblers need to dial back the torque setting on their power drivers.

While there appeared to be excessive grease on the external idler gears, the worm on the motor and the driven worm wheel on the drive axle had very little grease.  I coated them with “red –N- tacky” which is popular with the train crowd.

It would be nice if the remote battery cover snapped closed, rather than using a screw. When this is put away, it’s always good to remove the batteries. Having to unscrew the cover makes it less likely that the batteries will be removed every time the unit is stored.

My loco shudders, shakes, and shimmies going around O-72 tubular curves. I can’t imagine how it would handle O-36 curves. More on this later.

The rear coupler sits just a bit too low to match up with other rolling stock. The coupler had a loose screw at the top, which made the coupler floppy. Tightening that screw almost all the way secured the vertical motion. Tightening it all the way stopped the coupler from swiveling. I used nail polish on the threads so that the screw would stay where I set it. Maybe some sort of shoulder screw would be a better solution. The rear coupler is also too long for my taste, but that may be subjective. Since it does not have a standard mount, I will have to do some work to mount a shorter coupler.

Are the traction tires a hair too wide to fit the slot in the wheels, or is it just that the wheels are poorly installed on the axles?

The ugly:

Much as I admired the engineering of the truck block, the assembly workmanship was TERRIBLE. It appears to be assembled in a hurry or by inexperienced assemblers, or maybe there were no standards or fixtures available. Out of four axles, there were three different gauges. Measuring from where the wheel tread meets the flange, I got 1.295”, 1.270”, 1.270” and 1.225”. That’s a .070” difference from the widest to the narrowest. My layout has O-72 curves and no switches and the loco still wobbles, shakes, and shimmies around the curves. This loco would never go through switches with the wheels set so far out.

In addition to that, two wheels wobble, either from being pressed on the axle poorly, or maybe the axles are bent. It is reminiscent of an MPC loco with wheels that were not concentric. I have not checked the concentricity of my loco’s wheels yet, but will do so soon.

The truck block still has two plastic gears that must be changed to metal if the loco is to have a long and happy life. These are the driven worm wheel gears and the drive gear for the external idler gears. Due to the different expansion rates of the steel axle and the plastic gears, the gears that are press fit onto steel shafts will eventually split and will rotate/slip on the shaft.

Recommendations:

It’s probably best to determine the audience for this loco. If it’s just for kids, and if it’s designed to be disposable, then you might have nailed it.

IMO you must change the plastic gears that are press fit on their axles. As it is, the loco will run for a year or three, but eventually those press fit gears will crack and slip on the steel shaft. It’s not an easy job to replace them, either.

Trains have always been sold as a lifetime investment in happiness. There are many adults, as well as kids, who have limited resources and will buy these locos. The locos must be reliable for them and it won’t be with plastic gears press fit onto metal shafts.

If the extra cost of metal gears is too much, you can save some money by eliminating the chrome plating. Paint is cheaper than the plating, and the plating has been getting mixed (mostly negative) reviews.

***The assemblers must up their game. The terrible way the truck blocks were assembled on my sample will not work in full scale production and the product will perform poorly, as mine does. I will attempt to re-gauge the wheels on my loco, but that is not the kind of thing the buyers should be expected to do.

It is desirable to be able to operate the loco conventionally, as well as with the remote. I have no idea what the cost is for that, but Lionel found that out with the first Lion Chief locos. The added Lion Chief + was the ability to operate conventionally as well as remotely.

Thank you for reading my review. If you have any questions, please contact me.

Roy Yost from the West Coast

@RoyBoy posted:

My loco shudders, shakes, and shimmies going around O-72 tubular curves. I can’t imagine how it would handle O-36 curves. More on this later.. ..........................................................................My layout has O-72 curves and no switches and the loco still wobbles, shakes, and shimmies around the curves. This loco would never go through switches with the wheels set so far out.

In addition to that, two wheels wobble, either from being pressed on the axle poorly, or maybe the axles are bent. It is reminiscent of an MPC loco with wheels that were not concentric. I have not checked the concentricity of my loco’s wheels yet, but will do so soon.

There is up and down movement that may be contributing to this.  In both versions 2 and 3 if you hold the trucks and pull up and down on the body there is significant up and down movement especially in the rear.

John

So from everything I'm reading here and I've read this entire post, is the problem seems to be quality control. That is a problem with every manufacturer now days and it doesn't seem like an easy fix. Maybe Manards could do something about this with their manufacturers. Because nothing turns a customer off faster than poor quality control.

I got 2 of the Beta 1’s and now have 2 of the Beta 3’s. Never got a 2. I got my extra of each from other people. My Beta 1’s had operational issues as discussed in multiple threads, but no real Quality issues. The Beta 3’s seem to resolve the major operational issues to some degree, but based on mine and the comments of others, Quality too a break.

The good, the start up issue is much better, but is still a bit quick, though acceptable. I did not run them with a load so they may be even better. The horn now will blow as long as you hold it, not the short bust of the 1’s. If you listen closely to the horn, I think it is actually the same short bust but now programmed to keep looping as long as the button is held. Quite acceptable but not perfect. Them being packed in a bag solved the paint scuff issues.

The not so good, the horn sound quality leaves a bit to be desired. Like others, the drivers tend to not run true, the front truck on one rides up and down a little, looks to be a poor fitting traction tire. One of the remotes was assembled with the LED pushed over to one side so it does not stick up through the hole. That was an easy fix. No, they do not operate without the remote. Overall these are nice entry level locos.

Steve

I checked my loco again, by running it upside down. The right two wheels on the rear truck are either out of round, or more likely, they are not concentric with the axles. You can see them going up and down when viewed from the side. No wonder the loco shudders. shimmies, and shakes.

One of the front truck wheels is this way also, but to a lesser degree.

It's a great loco if it is built properly.

Maybe a different crew assembled Beta 3 than the crew that assembled assembled Beta 1???

@RoyBoy posted:

Maybe a different crew assembled Beta 3 than the crew that assembled assembled Beta 1???

Nice review but be careful not to paint with too broad of a brush. My Beta 3 runs perfectly fine. Others have said the same.

I would say the build quality is inconsistent. Who knows what percent is good or bad.

@Steve "Papa" Eastman posted:

If you listen closely to the horn, I think it is actually the same short bust but now programmed to keep looping as long as the button is held.

Man, that horn sounds rough with that looping sound.

I would suspect that some of the QC issues are due to Menards rushing the V2 & 3 out to market. Hopefully they have been listening and will pay closer attention to detail.

Agreed that the horn sounds funky looping like that. On the layout with other background noise it may not be noticeable.

It would be nice if the remote had a center stop. I find it too easy to slam the engine into reverse when I'm not paying attention. This is especially a problem with the V 1.0 that I have.

It sounds like the speed/ stop/start issues were fixed in the firmware. I wonder if they would offer a way to update V 1's to correct the hard starts (probably not). I run mine at about 10 volts and it's manageable.

Bob

@RoyBoy posted:

Here is the analysis that I just sent.

Menards beta 3 Santa Fe loco

About me:

I come from a family of men who repair machines. Great grandfather owned a machine shop and repaired automobiles in the 30’s and 40’s. Father repaired electromechanical desk calculators manufactured by the Friden Corporation. My older brother was an auto mechanic and also had antique cars. I was a field service engineer for medical machines and machines used in the semiconductor industry. I have an antique car collection which I taught myself to repair and maintain. Additionally, I have been playing with trains and repairing them since around 1955. I keep my hand in the repair business.

Here is my rather wordy analysis of the Beta 3 loco.

The good:

The square holes behind the number boards work well for even lighting.

The ornamental horns set closer to the roof should make them less susceptible to breakage.

The plastic bag on the loco seems to have eliminated all the scuffing on the paint job.

Reworking the firmware for smoother starts and stops worked very well. I especially like the fact that you can run in forward at a good clip, throw the loco into reverse, and watch it slow down smoothly before starting up again smoothly in reverse. The start is still slightly too abrupt for my taste. Maybe a little more tweaking on the lowest speed steps would help. The lowest speed step is a hair too fast for my liking.

I like the fact that everything is mounted on the chassis, so there are no plugs to unplug when removing the body.

The shipping packaging is working very well. My loco took some detours on its way to being delivered a week later than originally announced. The box took a beating, but the loco came through unscathed.

I like the general design of the power trucks. It’s especially nice that the side frames can be removed from the bottom, so traction tires can be changed without a complete disassembly of the loco. The power pickups can be removed from the bottom also without complete disassembly of the truck.

The bad:

One of my rollers would not swivel and was too tight to extend. If it is pushed up into the truck, the spring cannot push it down. I reworked it a bit, but it is still not right. Is there any way to get a replacement?

The screws holding the body to the chassis were way too tight. If someone uses a cheap screwdriver, they are likely to strip the screw heads. The assemblers need to dial back the torque setting on their power drivers.

While there appeared to be excessive grease on the external idler gears, the worm on the motor and the driven worm wheel on the drive axle had very little grease.  I coated them with “red –N- tacky” which is popular with the train crowd.

It would be nice if the remote battery cover snapped closed, rather than using a screw. When this is put away, it’s always good to remove the batteries. Having to unscrew the cover makes it less likely that the batteries will be removed every time the unit is stored.

My loco shudders, shakes, and shimmies going around O-72 tubular curves. I can’t imagine how it would handle O-36 curves. More on this later.

The rear coupler sits just a bit too low to match up with other rolling stock. The coupler had a loose screw at the top, which made the coupler floppy. Tightening that screw almost all the way secured the vertical motion. Tightening it all the way stopped the coupler from swiveling. I used nail polish on the threads so that the screw would stay where I set it. Maybe some sort of shoulder screw would be a better solution. The rear coupler is also too long for my taste, but that may be subjective. Since it does not have a standard mount, I will have to do some work to mount a shorter coupler.

Are the traction tires a hair too wide to fit the slot in the wheels, or is it just that the wheels are poorly installed on the axles?

The ugly:

Much as I admired the engineering of the truck block, the assembly workmanship was TERRIBLE. It appears to be assembled in a hurry or by inexperienced assemblers, or maybe there were no standards or fixtures available. Out of four axles, there were three different gauges. Measuring from where the wheel tread meets the flange, I got 1.295”, 1.270”, 1.270” and 1.225”. That’s a .070” difference from the widest to the narrowest. My layout has O-72 curves and no switches and the loco still wobbles, shakes, and shimmies around the curves. This loco would never go through switches with the wheels set so far out.

In addition to that, two wheels wobble, either from being pressed on the axle poorly, or maybe the axles are bent. It is reminiscent of an MPC loco with wheels that were not concentric. I have not checked the concentricity of my loco’s wheels yet, but will do so soon.

The truck block still has two plastic gears that must be changed to metal if the loco is to have a long and happy life. These are the driven worm wheel gears and the drive gear for the external idler gears. Due to the different expansion rates of the steel axle and the plastic gears, the gears that are press fit onto steel shafts will eventually split and will rotate/slip on the shaft.

Recommendations:

It’s probably best to determine the audience for this loco. If it’s just for kids, and if it’s designed to be disposable, then you might have nailed it.

IMO you must change the plastic gears that are press fit on their axles. As it is, the loco will run for a year or three, but eventually those press fit gears will crack and slip on the steel shaft. It’s not an easy job to replace them, either.

Trains have always been sold as a lifetime investment in happiness. There are many adults, as well as kids, who have limited resources and will buy these locos. The locos must be reliable for them and it won’t be with plastic gears press fit onto metal shafts.

If the extra cost of metal gears is too much, you can save some money by eliminating the chrome plating. Paint is cheaper than the plating, and the plating has been getting mixed (mostly negative) reviews.

***The assemblers must up their game. The terrible way the truck blocks were assembled on my sample will not work in full scale production and the product will perform poorly, as mine does. I will attempt to re-gauge the wheels on my loco, but that is not the kind of thing the buyers should be expected to do.

It is desirable to be able to operate the loco conventionally, as well as with the remote. I have no idea what the cost is for that, but Lionel found that out with the first Lion Chief locos. The added Lion Chief + was the ability to operate conventionally as well as remotely.

Thank you for reading my review. If you have any questions, please contact me.

Roy Yost from the West Coast

Excellent work, Roy.

@RSJB18 posted:

I would suspect that some of the QC issues are due to Menards rushing the V2 & 3 out to market.

Bob,

You have some very good suggestions here but ...

It can't be because the product is being  rushed to market.  The product hasn't reached the market yet.  The design is not finished yet.  It's currently being tested and updated.  As a result, and by definition, these are not manufacturing QC issues yet.

This is a Beta test.  After all the Beta tests are completed, and the product is officially released, then what you get at that point may have been rushed to market, but we won't know for a while.

We're not there yet.  It's too early.

Secondly, in my mind and given the fine print, these were sold as test units only.  For the price paid, and the privilege of assisting in the development of a better product, I would not expect any of these Beta versions to be upgradable in the field to the production design.  If we're lucky, maybe.

If you have a problem with Menards' approach, don't buy until the formal release takes place.

Mike

@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:

Bob,

You have some very good suggestions here but ...

It can't be because the product is being  rushed to market.  The product hasn't reached the market yet.  The design is not finished yet.  It's currently being tested and updated.  As a result, and by definition, these are not manufacturing QC issues yet.

This is a Beta test.  After all the Beta tests are completed, and the product is officially released, then what you get at that point may have been rushed to market, but we won't know for a while.

We're not there yet.  It's too early.

Secondly, in my mind and given the fine print, these were sold as test units only.  For the price paid, and the privilege of assisting in the development of a better product, I would not expect any of these Beta versions to be upgradable in the field to the production design.  If we're lucky, maybe.

If you have a problem with Menards' approach, don't buy until the formal release takes place.

Mike

Well said!

@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:

Bob,

You have some very good suggestions here but ...

It can't be because the product is being  rushed to market.  The product hasn't reached the market yet.  The design is not finished yet.  It's currently being tested and updated.  As a result, and by definition, these are not manufacturing QC issues yet.

This is a Beta test.  After all the Beta tests are completed, and the product is officially released, then what you get at that point may have been rushed to market, but we won't know for a while.

We're not there yet.  It's too early.

Secondly, in my mind and given the fine print, these were sold as test units only.  For the price paid, and the privilege of assisting in the development of a better product, I would not expect any of these Beta versions to be upgradable in the field to the production design.  If we're lucky, maybe.

If you have a problem with Menards' approach, don't buy until the formal release takes place.

Mike

@Dave Koehler posted:

Well said!

Mike- I fully understand that these are Beta versions, not ready for prime time. I'm simply forwarding the conversation along.

I am actually very happy with the unit I bought, warts and all.

I hope that when full production models do get released that Menards has taken all our comments/ advice into account.

Bob

@RSJB18 posted:

Agreed that the horn sounds funky looping like that. On the layout with other background noise it may not be noticeable.

It would be nice if the remote had a center stop. I find it too easy to slam the engine into reverse when I'm not paying attention. This is especially a problem with the V 1.0 that I have.

Bob

Agreed, and nicely done by the way.  That's precisely why I said that you have some very good suggestions.

These are definitely constructive comments, unlike some.  I look forward to seeing them addressed in the design going forward.

Mike

I just unpacked my version 3.0.  Packaging is excellent, no issues with that.  For the price, it is a very nice locomotive.  I did not find any cosmetic or truck or coupler issues.  My observations when I test ran it:

1.  The horn and bell could use tweaking for a better sound.  Loud enough but just not a great sound.  Horn and bell both stay on as long as button is depressed.

2.  Runs smoothly, the start up and shut down speed are good and it pulls great.  That issue appears to have been addressed.

3.  Crew talk works fine.  I wish there were a volume button (or if there is, I do not know where it is) as the volume is too loud for my liking.

4.  Remote works fine.  I agree a stop at the center would be a nice addition so you had a positive feel when going from forward to reverse.

5.  Agree with the comment about having metal gears.  May not turn out to be a problem.  Only time will tell.

6.  Not a fan of the chrome couplers and the really shiny trucks.  Would refer black trucks and less shine on the trucks,

Overall, I like it.

@Allegheny48 posted:

Excellent work, Roy.

I agree...

...you do know (?) there is an "edit" feature so you don't have to show the entire message you're quoting... 🤔

Mark in Oregon

@JDA posted:

3.  Crew talk works fine.  I wish there were a volume button (or if there is, I do not know where it is) as the volume is too loud for my liking.

There is a recessed thumb wheel on the rounded portion of the remote. That is the volume control.

The switch on the bottom of the fuel tank turns off the prime mover sounds.

@RoyBoy posted:

There is a recessed thumb wheel on the rounded portion of the remote. That is the volume control.

The switch on the bottom of the fuel tank turns off the prime mover sounds.

Thank you for the informationl  I missed that.  Would be nice if Menards sent a page of instructions with the locomotive.

@H1000 posted:

I sent my feedback to Menards as per their request. I assume what little things I noticed had more to deal with stream lining the production and implementing some cost savings.

Where do you send your comments to Menards?  There was nothing in the shipment indicating where to send comments.  If they really wanted feedback, you would think they would have included that information.  Although, they certainly can get feedback from this forum.

@JDA posted:

Where do you send your comments to Menards?  There was nothing in the shipment indicating where to send comments.  If they really wanted feedback, you would think they would have included that information.  Although, they certainly can get feedback from this forum.

There was an email address to send comments. Don't recall it off hand.

You can also get their attention by replying to @Menards here on the forum and they will see it.

@JDA posted:

Where do you send your comments to Menards?  There was nothing in the shipment indicating where to send comments.  If they really wanted feedback, you would think they would have included that information.  Although, they certainly can get feedback from this forum.

Well, this was mentioned in the very first post in this 5-page thread.

Send feedback to: guest@menard-inc.com

Hi Folks,

Finally got my beta 3.0 last Friday after customs hold, duty paid and slow delivery…. Most of this reiterates what others have written already, but felt I would add my commentary.  One reason for my purchase was that I was hopeful of getting a relatively low cost locomotive that my young kids could brutalize without me worrying about how much I spent on it😀

The good.

1.Upon opening was impressed by look of engine and bright colors.  No quality issues on paint / horns etc.. Packaging protected the engine well.
2. I like the momentum start / stop that helps with low speed control and starting and stopping without jerking cars.  This is an improvement over a lionchief GP38 that goes like snot at lowest speed and stops on a dime. One small issue with the momentum start / stop is that my young kids might have some issues with crashing things….

3. I like the volume control on the remote!

The Bad

1. My engines wobbles along the track. I have attached a poor quality iPad video that does show this… apparently others have had similar issues. Appreciate your understanding with video quality. One other thing the video highlights is the sensitivity of this locomotive to voltage drops…. When comparing to my lionchief locos, they do not have this issues to the same extent.

2. The engine does tend to derail at some frequency when running through my fastrack switches. Maybe this is related to a bent axle causing the wobble.

3. The sound is tinny / has significant static. Bell, horn and crew talk are okay. Horn sound is okay, but again in comparison to lionchief the men are loco is not nearly as good.

4.  The couplers are very difficult to open / close. I like the fact they are metal, but they need to function…

5. The top speed is much lower than lionchief GP 38.
6. Pulling capability is poor. The loco cannot pull a six car train up my grade that my lionchief has no issues navigating with larger trains.

To sum it up…. I struggle to see without improvements how Menards competes with lionchief and the differences noted above.  For an extra $20-30USD I would step up to lionchief. I hope they improve and solve the quality control issues as another player in the market making quality locomotives would be nice.  
I do wonder how much of my experience is due to quality control issues vs design issues…

Hopefully this adds useful information for the forum. I will share with Menards.

John

Ok I’ll throw in my $.02 as well.

Nothing that hasn’t already been said. Overall quite pleased. No wobbling, no apparent quality control issues. Surprisingly good pulling power. It pulled a PW B unit, 18 MPC reefers and a PW caboose up a 4% grade with minimal slipping.

The slow speed is way too fast for my taste, but you can run it on lower voltage, like 10v, and it does ok. But then you’re messing with the voltage and it ends up functioning more like a conventional locomotive.

The stiff couplers are a big drawback for me as I do lots of switching on the attic layout. The delayed stop control will take getting used to as right now I’m crashing into my cars in reverse trying to couple them.

With a few tweaks, like on the couplers and the sorry sounding horn, it will make a good entry point for new people in the hobby, and that is good for everyone. Kudos to Menards.

Having read all of the comments to date concerning the 3.0 version, what I've come away with is that approx 30% of the respondents are experiencing coupler and engine wobble issues.   

Versions 1.0 and 2.0 did have coupler issues but they didn't have any wobble related issues.

Thus something changed at the factory while producing Version 3.0 - either there may be a bad assembler or quality control of the gauging of the wheels has slipped.

Additionally what I found concerning - one individual who was experiencing wobble also didn't have enough power to pull an average consist.  It maybe that there was to much friction at the contact point of the wheels to the track which then reduced the remaining available power to pull cars.

The engine now starts smoothly but may coast a bit to much, especially in reverse, when trying to conduct coupling maneuvers causing minor crashing.

Also the horn sounds need to be addressed as they are anemic along with upgrading the Nylon gears to being metal.

Overall many of the respondents found the engines' ability to pull excellent and were quite pleased about its ability to pull consists on a grade without any issues.

Nearly all of the respondents seem to agree that some form of conventional control would make this product a homerun.

Overall Menards has done an excellent job considering this is their first attempt at releasing an engine with remote control capabilities.   

I and I imagine many of you have found these Beta releases very intriguing.

The excitement that it has created on this site is amazing and fact that 200 units sell out within a couple hours also goes to show how broad ranged and powerful this site truly is.

Let's hope that the shortcomings will be fully addressed and the improvements implemented prior to a full blown production release.

I don't have any of the test versions but am truly hoping Menard's is successful.  The wobbling would be a major concern.  Too many potential causes for the wobbling with no answer at this point in time.  Menards has had trouble with wheel gauge and bent axles on rolling stock.  Could this have carried over to power trucks now.  Roy Boy mentioned concentricity,  have the wheels been manufactured improperly.  Improperly fitted traction tires or grooves in wheels not properly machined.  As test engines I would think there is no real QA/QC going on but I would hope production runs are subject to rigorous QA/QC but in this day and age I don't think any product manufacturer does nough QA/QC and the consumer has come to accept it.

Mine just came in ... the front roller assy was loose but thankfully the screw was also in the bag.
When I turn the power to the track no sound.
When I turn on the remote, no sound ... checked volume is all the way up.
Crew talk, horn and bell are working.
The pilot barely clears the center rail.
The big issue I have is a death wobble on the front trucks so bad  that it derails.

Shelf queen at this point ...