2016 MTH S SCALE CATALOG...MAYBE NOT??

Thanks for the links. My TOFC did arrive with a damaged stand. But gravity allowed it to fit on the car okay. Now I will get an unbroken part. 

banjoflyer posted:

 

Anyway back to the 2016 catalog. I asked the nice lady when we might expect the new catalog. After some silence she told me that there probably won't be one as the "Upper Management" might choose to release any new catalog type news as a brochure...kinda like this one.

 

Somehow "What will be in the next brochure?" doesn't stir the soul like "What will be in the next catalog?"

Rusty

When I meet Andy Edleman at York in 2 weeks to interview him for the S Gaugian, the next catalog is question number one.  He received the questions 3 weeks ago to get answers in advance so they aren't "off the cuff."  I hope to hear that they have one planned for release soon.  If not, it seems to me that MTH is backing away from S Gauge. 

I will follow this thread closely.  I would be surprised if MTH invested all that money (whatever it was) to buy SHS and not maximize on their investment on making everything they can.  If Charlie Ro is any gauge of success,  it would seem that most of MTH's S gauge product moves.  Maybe there will not be a catalog anytime soon (heck, the one and only catalog is from 2013) but I would rather there be a release of product and flyers as they are released than nothing at all.  I hope York provides an answer to this question. 

 

Ben

I was at a train show in N.J. a few weeks ago that MTH attended.  I asked about a new catalog and was told there would not be a new one this year.  Their focus was getting everything out from the 2013 catalog.  F3's etc.  I said I was disappointed.  I suggested some new items but they seemed that they were adverse to spending any money on new tooling.  I also asked if the long delays of the F3's were still due to their failure regarding the electric coupler.  The answer was no they stopped working on that and had decided to include just a standard coupler.  The date I was given for the F3's was May 2016.

--Rocco--  

Given the delays in getting products out, a new catalog would almost be pointless.  Maybe that'll change once the F3's finally are released, but right now, it's taken longer for MTH to rerelease the F3's than SHS took to develop them from scratch.

Let's see what's left to be made from the old SHS line (assuming the TOFC's and F3's meet the latest release dates): SW/NW switchers, F7's, 2-8-0's, EV Caboose, Outside-braced Boxcar, Straight Flat, Bulkhead Flat, 3-bay PS2 Covered Hopper, Ribbed Hopper, Offset-side Hopper, Offset Panel-side Hopper, Covered Ribbed Hopper, Fish-belly Hopper(not sure if SHS even got to release this one.)  The good thing is many of these products share common parts.

Plus, there were several products in various stages of development before SHS shut down: E7's, Bay Window Caboose, 4-6-0 and a rumored RS-1.

So, it looks like a loooooong time before anything "new" will be coming from MTH.

Rusty

You are expecting big things from the guy who sued half the model train industry and almost brought down Lionel and Broadway Limited?

Now I met the guys from S Helper at the East Coast Shows a number of times and they were great.  They had me ready to change to S back in 1998.

Francine posted:

You are expecting big things from the guy who sued half the model train industry and almost brought down Lionel and Broadway Limited?

Now I met the guys from S Helper at the East Coast Shows a number of times and they were great.  They had me ready to change to S back in 1998.

The same person was responsible for Lionel and Broadway Limited being sued and it wasn't MTH.  I don't recall MTH suing "half the model train" industry.  Walthers, Athearn, Kato, Model Power, etc... weren't part of any lawsuit with MTH.

MTH also took on the Union Pacific for their oppressive licensing program for the benefit of ALL model railroad manufacturers.

I seem to recall Broadway Limited tried suing the NMRA and various DCC manufactures, claiming most, if not all DCC features were his intellectual property.

Rusty

 

I feel sorry for my S scale friends that are still waiting for MTH. I feel really bad for those guys that were so hopeful that this was just a lull and thought things were going to get better. I feel your pain guys. You are stronger than I.

To me, the telling sign is that all their emails, including the S-club ones, have at their bottom a list of all the different product lines logos--EXCEPT the S-gauge line!

Doesn't appear to be a high level of commitment there. . .

Just heard from Doug Peck, the F units will be delivered May to July, depending on road names! Don't hold your breath, but things MAY be looking up!

May to July of what year?  Last year it was supposed to be a June delivery.  Then when that came and went with no word, we were finally updated and told they were going to be on the water beginning of 2016.  The MTH shipping schedule in the fall 2015 then showed March 2016 delivery.  Ok, that may make some sense, time on the water, customs backlog, ship to MTH, send to distributors, finally shipped to end customers could put things at March/April delivery.  Fast forward to late Feb. 2016/beginning of March, and I noticed that all roadnames except SF and Union Pacific have been pushed to a June delivery by their website schedule and SF/Union Pacific stayed at March.

So does that mean that first batch are now supposedly on the water (afterall, we are now into April)?

April transit/customs/distributors - for May delivery or has the web master just neglected to update all the dates on the site.  Next, we will hear that they will be going out in the fall just in time for a holiday arrival (yea right).

Fool me once... 

Well, it seemed a little optimistic to me too, as Doug said they are "in production now" which means they still have to be packaged, shipped, customs, dealer deliveries, etc.  He said he spoke to THE sales manager at MTH who did state that "A production sample has been run at weekend trade shows for the past 2 months, and it has operated flawlessly." 

Hmm, said sales manager shall remain nameless, I guess!

Remember, I said, "Don't hold your breath. . . " !

S gauge is not the only problem. Ho has not had a catalog for a few years now and will not have any time soon. 

 

 

 

 

Which I find amazing.  I know they handle numerous lines of stuff and overseas manufacturing is constantly in turmoil these days, but to not be active in HO - what??

 S is a very small market right now, so I have resigned myself to them probably going the way of "trickle streaming" items out based on their actions since "most" of 2013 catalog has been delivered.  Didn't know about the knew TOFC's until somone here mentioned it.  Don't think I see them advertising in any S publications that I read (could be wrong here).  So, I figured I should maybe sign-up for the S email newsletter so I could catch future annoucements.  What do you get? Next train show schedules.  See our new WIFI module in action.  Great, but I need a DCS/tiu system controling accessories and um - engines to use it.  What a marketing disconnect there.  Now in defense, when they do produce something it seems to be usually of nice quality.  Although just released club car has a shipping issue maybe with the trailer stand.

Well, it just took 4 yrs. for the Lionel Fluid Loader to get delivered from when people ordered it - so there is hope!

jonnyspeed posted:

 

I feel sorry for my S scale friends that are still waiting for MTH. I feel really bad for those guys that were so hopeful that this was just a lull and thought things were going to get better. I feel your pain guys. You are stronger than I.

Me too. I have a small collection of S gauge, mostly SHS. Being a RTR operator, not modeler, I made the mistake of going DC scale. SHS has been replaced with MTH and Lionel barely supports scale S gauge. I haven't seen a scale S gauge locomotive since I received my SHS 2-8-0. My new large layout is O gauge, but if MTH ever gets serious about S gauge, I'd be interested in purchasing switchers built from SHS tooling and setting up a small switcher layout. MTH should also expand the SHS track system.

Yep, and I also. Decided to take the road less traveled - DC Scale.  Check the bay,  scale items don't last long - always get snapped up!  We are supposed to be a minuscule subgroup.  I think it is more like an under-developed market.

Right now if it weren't for shows, SHS on the bay and American Models then I would be looking to build an O scale layout (have a lot of stuff and it would be easier to work on as age creeps up on the eyes and hands), but I really just like something about S and think doing the scenery for some of what I want to model will just work out better.

Well, I will stop for now as I didn't mean to get off topic here on this thread.

My view on the engines at this point is, who cares. SHS made some very nice freight cars and MTH is continuing to make them, I am still purchasing the freight cars. SHS made a nice track system in 3 different radii but it was incomplete. MTH is remaking the track components, I purchased and took delivery of 700' of their new flex track. Unfortunately the rail metallurgy is different making the MTH flex more difficult to work with than the SHS. When the MTH rail is stripped from the ties it has a significant curvature both horizontally and vertically. It is impossible to completely straighten even with a 3 roller rail bender. Hand laying turnouts with the new rail compared to the original SHS rail is a real pain.

The SHS diesels were plug compatible with DCC. Putting DCS in the F7 seems ill advised to me. I doubt very many S gaugers will buy a DCS system and convert their layouts to star wiring just to run one engine. I will not. The SW1 and SW9 are not large enough to accommodate the DCS system. I currently have 12 American models engines converted to TMCC/Railsounds with another 7 in process. Lionel produced enough TMCC and Legacy engines in S gauge to make purchasing the Legacy system worthwhile and ERR provides the products for great conversions. The entire layout is modeled and controlled in LCS on an iPad. I think MTH missed the window of opportunity for other than DCC compatible engines. On the other hand I sure hope I am proven wrong with a surprise release of new products.

AmFlyer posted:

 

The SHS diesels were plug compatible with DCC. Putting DCS in the F7 seems ill advised to me. I doubt very many S gaugers will buy a DCS system and convert their layouts to star wiring just to run one engine. I will not. The SW1 and SW9 are not large enough to accommodate the DCS system. I currently have 12 American models engines converted to TMCC/Railsounds with another 7 in process. Lionel produced enough TMCC and Legacy engines in S gauge to make purchasing the Legacy system worthwhile and ERR provides the products for great conversions. The entire layout is modeled and controlled in LCS on an iPad. I think MTH missed the window of opportunity for other than DCC compatible engines. On the other hand I sure hope I am proven wrong with a surprise release of new products.

You are aware that DCS 3.0 (developed for use in MTH's HO product line) is DCC compatible?  As is the revision of Legacy used in the Lionel's SD70's and ES44's.

Now I'll grant that Lionel's Legacy DCC code doesn't have a million CV's to play with that the DCC-o-philes are so fond of, but the basics are there and it works fine.  At least it does for me and I'm far from being a DCC expert.

Won't be able to evaluate MTH until the F3's come out.

Rusty

Rusty that evidently slipped my mind this morning. That is really great because I think MTH's market should be with those who operate with DCC systems. One thing to evaluate when the F7's are delivered will be the current capability of the HO system compared to the S gauge motor requirements. I have some of the compact ERR boards in my AM Diesels and these small boards are only one amp output. The AM engines draw more than one amp when heavily loaded. The engines have the traction and power to pull longer trains than the one amp boards can support for other than brief periods. The AM steam engine conversions can use 8 amp output boards in the tender so they can safely pull much longer trains.

I thought the Lionel AF Y3's were also DCC compatible.

AmFlyer posted:

 

I thought the Lionel AF Y3's were also DCC compatible.

Not really. 

They can be reprogrammed to add the DCC code if one has the scale conversion done by S Scale Locomotive and Supply (for a $75.00 fee.)  I'm not sure if they're authorized to just do the code upgrade without the scale conversion. 

As far as I know, Lionel doesn't offer the code upgrade as a service.

Rusty

Thanks Rusty, I am always learning something new.

Rusty Traque posted:

AmFlyer posted:

 

I thought the Lionel AF Y3's were also DCC compatible.

Not really. 

They can be reprogrammed to add the DCC code if one has the scale conversion done by S Scale Locomotive and Supply (for a $75.00 fee.)  I'm not sure if they're authorized to just do the code upgrade without the scale conversion. 

As far as I know, Lionel doesn't offer the code upgrade as a service.

Rusty

They will have a service rep up grade the Y3 to DC for the normal charge.  I had mine done.

Tom Stoltz

in Maine