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I have been checking out some equipment I inherited on my brothers death. My NYC E-7 A units built around December 2011 are both powered and had 9 volt alkaline batteries.  I replaced both batteries with BCRs and put them on a test track with conventional hookup to Z-4000 transformer. I do not have TMCC or Legacy. I turned off smoke and set prgm-run to  run

Questions.

How do I get 1 A unit to start in reverse to accommodate an AA back to back arrangement

When I run them alone one unit squeals a lot and both units seam sluggish maybe only a max of 30 mph in scale.

And if it is possible can these units be converted to DCS P-2 or P-3 and who would you recommend.

A big thanks to this Forum I would have given up on O trains by now if not for SEARCH and reading most topics. In particular a big thanks to Dave Detert, he gave me a whole lot of effort and time. Soon I will post the layout he has helped me with. 

Kevin

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A BCR has no function with TMCC engines, only MTH engines. The battery is only there to aid sound over dead spots.

They were meant to be run with TMCC which would allow you to program the trailing engine to start in reverse. For conventional running you could reverse the wires on both motors so it would start in reverse. They can be converted to PS3. Many here do this and might contact you. As for slow running I would remove the shell and make sure nothing is rubbing on the flywheel. That could account for the noise and slow running.

Pete

Last edited by Norton

First, do you intend to keep them or sell them? If keeping them, before you monkey around with them I suggest getting one of the Lionel command systems to run them. These will run fine with a TMCC Cab-1 system or Legacy Cab-1L system.

The OGR Forum is a great place for assisting you, no question is foolish. Ask whatever.

So BobbyD,

Here's the thing I sure appreciate your comments.

There are two diametrically opposed forces acting on me. First I have about 19 locomotives both steam and diesel that will run on conventional and/or MTH DCS.TMCC. One is a GN S-2 that will operate in conventional.

However The NYC AA  units if lashed up back to back in conventional oppose each other and if I change the wiring would work in conventional although would be screwed up in TMCC.

Now with insights from you and others I know I have 2 locomotives that were made to use TMCC. So I am considering having them upgraded to DCS if I find someone capable.

Selling them is most likely not an option. My brother and I grew up riding the passenger trains of the Central; including often the 20th Century. I received these locomotives and 12,  20th Century cars produced by 3Rd rail on his untimely death. I'm not in planning to build the layout and run the trains he wanted.

Anyways I appreciate your opinion, regards, kevin

First and foremost, sorry to hear of your brother's passing. 

For a historical perspective on the 3rd E7, the 2011 E7s were the first plastic shelled diesels 3rd Rail had ever done.  They had some issues, but overall were very good locomotives.  My one 3 rail E7 has provided me with good service  All my other E7s from that era are 2 rail O.  The issue with the speed may have to do with the belt that connects the motor shaft to the drive system below.  It is just like a little timing belt being geared.  If it has not been run or run in many years it may just need some breaking in, or perhaps look at it see that it hasn't slipped at all.  Overall the belt system is louder than the vertical can motor setup, but the gearing ratio is superior for pulling with the 3rd Rail drive.  There are some plastic drive parts in the original E7s that did occasionally break in the original E7s.  3rd Rail may still have replacement parts made of steel as that was the first upgrade to the drive system which is now in its 4th generation I think.

3rd Rail diesels do top out at about 60 smph which was a decision made early on as 60% of the 3rd Rail market is in 2 rail O which tends to generally run trains at slower speeds.  Replacing the TMCC with PS2 or PS3 is not difficult for someone skilled at those modification.  Getting the trailing locomotive to start in reverse is a TMCC command function.

Good luck and enjoy!  These still command in many cases close to list value on the secondary market.  The cars are difficult to find.  A majority of my trains are now Sunset / 3rd Rail / Golden Gate depot now.  

Hey, Fast Mail, you're talking about quite a train!  12 X 21 inch cars plus a couple of head end sounds like a train 23 feet long. How big is your layout? My outside loop is 20 ft by 50 ft, I could run a train that long, but my station platforms are only about six feet. Long trains are fun!

Jan

@Fast Mail posted:

Jonathan,

Thank you. I hope I can use you as a resource on these Locos for future questions?

kevin

Kevin,

Reach out to me anytime.  My email is in my profile.  I have been a consultant to Sunset / 3rd Rail / Golden Gate Depot for going on 12 years now so I did the master graphics for the locomotives you have as well as some of the research, which admittedly at the time is not nearly as good as the research we do today.  I don't typically get involved with the engineering of the drive, but I have 39 Sunset or 3rd Rail locomotives in total.  I am a biased fan, but the customer service of this company and commitment to get things right is very commendable.  Just through my 4th set of QC for decals for a current project.  It's not fun not to get it right!

Best to you,

@Fast Mail posted:

So BobbyD,

Here's the thing I sure appreciate your comments.

There are two diametrically opposed forces acting on me. First I have about 19 locomotives both steam and diesel that will run on conventional and/or MTH DCS.TMCC. One is a GN S-2 that will operate in conventional.

However The NYC AA  units if lashed up back to back in conventional oppose each other and if I change the wiring would work in conventional although would be screwed up in TMCC.

Now with insights from you and others I know I have 2 locomotives that were made to use TMCC. So I am considering having them upgraded to DCS if I find someone capable.

Selling them is most likely not an option. My brother and I grew up riding the passenger trains of the Central; including often the 20th Century. I received these locomotives and 12,  20th Century cars produced by 3Rd rail on his untimely death. I'm not in planning to build the layout and run the trains he wanted.

Anyways I appreciate your opinion, regards, kevin

I would not bother to spend all that money to convert them and don't mess with the wiring. Get the Lionel system and you can program one to run forward and the other backwards as a "Train" to run flawlessly.

Last edited by BobbyD

I sure appreciate all the input, with luck I will start to build a layout in July and being a novice I doubt the Century will leave Buffalo station until next winter. That seems fitting as I recall it was always winter in Buffalo as a small child. Until then the cars will continue to sleep in boxes next to GGD NYC ESE cars.   

I was glad to hear the figure 23 feet; that's the same number I came up with. I plan on a hidden siding 24 long when other trains are running.  I'm still scratching my head on layout design as I want to do it for my brother.  I have limited space now 24x14 but in 4 years I will have 22x36. I want to run and learn trains now, so soon I will build one rather than wait 4 more years.

I know the space is too small and the trains too long..... reminds me of a sailors prayer " Oh Lord the sea is so great and thy boat so small".  I am hoping for a 4 track mainline around the room. A Ross turntable and roundhouse on a lower level with an 8 track 12' yard.

Right now I have friends who needed a place to stay, so the room is not accessible to this summer when they return to their home. In the meantime I am enrolled in the University of "O gauge" at the OGR campus. Thanks to all the members for their help as I learn. Regards, kevin

@Fast Mail posted:

Pete,

Thank you very much, I'm struggling but I'll get there, just a few weeks back I couldn't spell BCR.  I hope I hear from someone who does upgrades on these engines.

Regards,

kevin

Since you run conventionsl, you can goto Hennings trains [ a forum sponsor] and add Gunrunner Johns YLB [ Your Last Battery] to the tmcc locomotives to keep the fiesel sound going over dead spots and when cycling through your Foward-Neutral-Reverse-Neutral-Foward sequences.

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