54” Curve Recommended for Legacy ES44AC UP - can I run it on my 48” curved layout?

In my experience manufacturers don’t set the minimum radius higher than what the piece will run on  properly.  It limits sales. I’m sure there are exceptions but not many.

@Terry Luft posted:

In my experience manufacturers don’t set the minimum radius higher than what the piece will run on  properly.  It limits sales. I’m sure there are exceptions but not many.

Thanks for the reply.
I am not sure because I had read that the 054 recommendation is based on tubular track which is measured differently than Fastrack? And, currently there is no 054 Fastrack.

Its rated for 54 for the Kinematic pilots. The couplers are not attached to truck blocks. So basically, the answer is no.

@Boilermaker1 posted:

Its rated for 54 for the Kinematic pilots. The couplers are not attached to truck blocks. So basically, the answer is no.

That makes sense. Thank you.

I think I’m going to plan to begin switching over to 060.

@Raven87 posted:

I think I’m going to plan to begin switching over to 060.

If you can possibly put in O-72 curves, you will be able to run almost everything.

O-72 seems to be an industry standard upon which everything must run.

if this were an MTH engine I'd say try it. With LIONEL usually NO!

Thanks guys! If I can put in 072 I will but I’m not sure I’ve got the room. Have to do some more measuring and possibly rearranging regardless.
Most likely, 060 may be the limit but I’m going to try!

I definitely like the looks of equipment on larger curves.

the largest radii you can fit  EVEN IF YOU NEED TO REMOVE or MOVE WALLS!!

@Boilermaker1 posted:

Its rated for 54 for the Kinematic pilots. The couplers are not attached to truck blocks. So basically, the answer is no.

I've been wondering about this also. I have Lionel Legacy SD70s and Dash-9s that will run on 0-36 track and switches. I have been puzzled why SD40s and ES44ACs  need 0-54 while these other Legacy beasts can clear O-36.

While I can’t confirm anything with this run. I remember when the ES44’s original came out with the Kinematic pilot they would say O-48 minimum but O-54 recommended. Meaning it might work ok but for best results use O-54

I can't speak for the ES44, but I have a SD45 with Kinematic couplers that I run on O-42 curves.  Looks goofy, but it has no problems.  The only caveat is that I cannot couple it directly to a piece of rolling stock.  It will derail the rolling stock.  I always couple it to another locomotive, either powered or dummy.  The articulated couplers of the trailing loco work in concert with the Kinematic couplers allowing it to pass through the tight curves.

Steve,  Shoot me an email (see profile) I'm in Delphos.  Work in Elida.  If you want to see how tight a curve your loco can handle bring it over and we can try it out.

Tom

Most Lionel 6 axle engines are really 1B-B1 with the two outboard axles not geared.  The “idler” axles have a greater range of travel which allows engines like the SD70ACe to negotiate tighter curves.  The ES44AC are true C-C trucks with all 6 axles geared.  This makes the lateral travel of the axles more restrictive and demands wider curves.

@JFC454 posted:

Most Lionel 6 axle engines are really 1B-B1 with the two outboard axles not geared.  The “idler” axles have a greater range of travel which allows engines like the SD70ACe to negotiate tighter curves.  The ES44AC are true C-C trucks with all 6 axles geared.  This makes the lateral travel of the axles more restrictive and demands wider curves.

This makes perfect sense. Thank you.

@Tom Densel posted:

I can't speak for the ES44, but I have a SD45 with Kinematic couplers that I run on O-42 curves.  Looks goofy, but it has no problems.  The only caveat is that I cannot couple it directly to a piece of rolling stock.  It will derail the rolling stock.  I always couple it to another locomotive, either powered or dummy.  The articulated couplers of the trailing loco work in concert with the Kinematic couplers allowing it to pass through the tight curves.

Steve,  Shoot me an email (see profile) I'm in Delphos.  Work in Elida.  If you want to see how tight a curve your loco can handle bring it over and we can try it out.

Tom

Thanks Tom. I haven’t bought the ES44 yet but I’ll keep your offer in mind for sure.

I have a Legacy AC6000 coming next week but Lionel says it will work on 042 curves so it should be fine on the 048 curves (fingers crossed!). It will interesting to see if it can navigate my 036 switches but I wouldn’t really need it do anything but run on my mainlines so no worries there if not.  

My SD90MAC (21.5” long) handles everything but then again it is rated for 036 so no surprise there.

Meanwhile I’ll be buying some bigger curve pieces Monday and get started reconfiguring for at least 060.

I have the Lionel BNSF ES44 Oil Train Set and the newest Lionel BNSF ES44 from last year and they both work perfectly find around O-48 curves. In fact I also have a Vision GS-3, 21" passenger cars, and other O54 engines and they work fine as well. The kinematic coupler actually helps in this situation. However the first car behind the ES44 might have to have a longer isolated coupler arm (not be integrated into the truck) or have a heavier base. That kinematic coupler can push things off the track sometimes.

Keep in mind that Lionel never uses O48 as a curve rating for anything - it's either O36 and if it doesn't make O36 then it's automatically tagged with O54. A few years ago they tagged SD70ACes with O54 and they could do O36 with zero issues so the point here is I don't always trust what Lionel puts on their boxes, ask around if you really want to know.

I’m extremely interested in the answer to this. I like the es44 from Lionel, but am not certain I’ll be using o54 on the outer loop when I go to build.

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...59#48452550539971059

I run my Lionel ES44AC on 048 track. In short, the unit will navigate with rolling stock with articulated couplers or with a dummy locomotive in tow.

These replies are great information. Thank you for some real world experiences!

@Csxcellent posted:

I’m extremely interested in the answer to this. I like the es44 from Lionel, but am not certain I’ll be using o54 on the outer loop when I go to build.

Yes! Me too.