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Chris Lonero posted:
Train Nut posted:

I bring money and my wife. That way im not afraid to come home!!

I’m not afraid to come home either!   My wife comes with me to every York! 

And...believe it or not...my wife is the one who makes sure WE attend York, the dates on the calendar to be sacrosanct...death, jury duty, or collecting on a Powerball winning ticket, the few exceptions!..., and she's the one on our team who haggles.  She's knowledgeable enough about the hobby, condition grading, and secondary market prices to know a fair price for an item.  As such, she's seldom run into a seller at York who would treat her rudely for her discussion over price or most anything trains related.   In fact, most of them enjoy the bargaining discussion!

Finally, she looks one heck of a lot better than me!!

Besides, having your spouse sharing this hobby and its special events like York makes a world of difference.  I know.  I've lived it both ways; Spouse #1..., spouse #2...!

KD

Hi! I try to have a theme - e.g., last York it was Southern Pacific cars to go with new Lionel AC9.  Another time it was New Haven stuff (love that paint scheme!).  When Vince of Vince's Trains was still at York he would upset my plan real quick though - had great selection of locos, many of which I hadn't thought about until I saw them.  Basic idea always is just have fun!

 

 

Last edited by hclarke

Ed, Some of that was pretty funny. Where did you find it? Apparently, I am related to:

Percy the Purist- Wouldn't think of buying a train unless it had all the original dust on it. 

I believe the dust to be part of the natural weathering.

Tom 

(My dusty but lovable prewar #228)

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Skip the big shows and go to the smaller shows where the vendors are mostly regular folks.  Look under the tables.  Look for O gauge on a HO sellers table.  Make a quick trip around when you get there and then go back around at a slower pace.

Last edited by Former Member

Hi Guys:

I just joined the forum.  I've been going to train shows since the mid-80s and York since '89.

The collected wisdom of this group pools into an amazing wealth of knowledge, and it's pretty funny too!

I have only some small comments to add. 

One is that every train show is different, both in the style of the show and in your needs in attending it.  If you're looking for a refurbished ZW, you'll attend a local show where a guy you've seen before is sure to have a table full of transformers.  If you're looking to buy a boxed new train set, maybe you'll hit Greenbergs and see what Charles Ro has.  If you want to cruise junk boxes for parts, nothing beats York's Purple Hall.  Over time, and with experience you'll get selective and have a pretty good idea where things are and what shows have in store.  There are always surprises, but the guys you regularly deal with can usually be found in the same old corner, ready to do business.

I brought my nephew to York when he was 6.  He wanted a military train.  I introduced him to Maury Klein of K-Line who took an instant shine to Caleb and hand picked his new train from the stock he had on hand at the show.  Sometimes, bringing a kid to a toy show can be magical. 

One last item.  With rare exceptions, our trains are assembly line, mass produced toys that we want, not need.  If the deal can't be made to your satisfaction, don't be afraid to walk away.  As in the NYC subway, another train will be along presently. 

i go the last day and start around 12-4.  I see markdowns starting around 2pm.  so I will go around entire area and then come back and start dealing.  sometimes I get a good price depending on what is sitting there.  I primarily focus on buildings and rolling stock as engines are too iffy.  I like to deal with our forum guys on engines anyway.

 

C

The following is my strategy. It may vary from that of others and many of these have already been mentioned.

I don’t go into a show expecting to find certain items. I have a general idea what I want in each area (diesels, steamers, rolling stock, accessories, roadnames) but not specifics. Unless you are buying new or are at a large one like York it will be a crap shoot as what is at the show. This gives me the opportunity to buy when the condition and prices are right rather than forcing a specific purchase when it is not. If you go in wanting an XYZ only you are likely to either overpay or be disappointed.

I try not to buy the first time around the show. This gives me the opportunity to get the “lay of the land”, in other words, which vendors have good selection and prices and which do not, which items are plentiful and which are not, and how prices are at this show. At any show you are likely to find one or more vendor who is "dealing". Occasionally I’ll buy on the first go-around if it’s something I really want or the price is so good I will not even haggle on it, but that is rare. I Keep notes on my phone on what I wee of interest and where it is. Yes, sometimes it is gone when I come back, but I f I wanted it that bad, I would have bought it first round and I'll see another one someday. If it is a big show you can do this on a building by building basis.

My wife often comes and does one circuit of the show and even gets a thing or to, then she hangs out while I make subsequent rounds. I can drop off my purchases to her rather than walking them back to the car and she is kind enough to make sure I get fed (I forget about food at a train show!)

At every show there are vendors who think it is still the late 1990s and their wares are a priced accordingly. It’s kind of sad because I see them bring the same way overpriced stuff to show after how, year after year. I don’t understand how they can make any money. A few of these will come way down on price to a good deal in modern times, but that is rare. I usually just keep moving.

I go in with a fixed amount of money and deal in cash. Cash in hand is more likely to buy a deal and keeps me from overspending.

Always haggle, that is my rule. Occasionally I’ll break this rule if the price is incredible or it is a very small item, but even on good prices and good vendors I still try to get a little bit off. First, it makes me feel good, second it leaves more money for other things, even if they are small things. If I can’t come to terms with a vendor, I’ll often try bundling it with other smaller items that I have some interest in and that gets us both to where we want to be. Vendors who will not haggle are generally not the type of vendors I want to deal with anyway. On most every transaction I have had with non-hagglers I have regretted afterwards. I generally don’t buy unless I get a great deal. Remember, all this stuff was mass produced so there will be another one out there later, if you are willing to wait. Always be willing to walk away, but always do so courteously. Haggling gets easier with experience, so don’t worry If you are not good at it at first.

Always be courteous and smile. Acknowledge a vendor in some way who notices or speaks to you. A good attitude is the best start toward a good deal. A few vendors are jerks, most are not. Some buyers a jerks and a good attitude immediately elevates you above them.

Bring some grocery bags in your back pocket. Most vendors have bags, but is helpful to them when you have your own and it comes in really handy when a vendor does not or has run out.

I much prefer shows over online because you can touch and feel a piece. No amount of pictures can equate to that. You can also see how the vendor treats his merchandise and how he interacts with other customers to determine if it is the type of seller you want to do business with. Plus, no shipping charges.

I get there well after the opening to avoid the line and stay to the end. As she show winds down, there are many deals to be had. They would rather carry home cash than merchandise. Many vendors pack up early no matter what the rules or repercussions are, but if you time it right, this is when they are most likely to deal.

And of course, enjoy yourself in whatever way suits you. After all you _are_ at a TRAIN show!

My last train show purchase was a new in the box, though not "mint", LGB steeple cab E-lok. The seller had $200 on it, and after examining it, I asked if he could do better on the price, and he replied $175, and I purchased it. He had a Square and my wife paid him with her credit card. This transaction was before the start of the show, as I was a TCA member with a cane, and my 40 year train bud/gatekeeper let me in 30 minutes before the public was admitted! Came to find out from an LGB dealer friend that he listed his last 2030E lok at $330, and it sold quickly. It is a sweet runner, and I feel like I got a good deal!

Last edited by Tinplate Art
RonH posted:
Richie C. posted:

My pet peeve is small time dealers/sellers at shows who want to add sales tax to my purchase.

I can understand major dealers, like many of our forum sponsors, collecting sales tax because I'm confident the money will actually go the state but, seriously, does anybody think the guy with the 6' table from across the country and a supply of used scenery is really going to turn that sales tax money over to the state or is it just going to pay for his lunch and gas money ? 

To sell at a lot of shows (in NJ) you are required to have a state sales tax ID even if you are a small seller.
If someone from the state checks you will have a problem.
I agree with you as that was the way shows used to be back in the 80's.
Some of the larger dealers do not charge sales tax but incorporate the tax into the selling price of a item.

I have no issue with doing the tax thing, but if you're selling used equipment and dealing in cash, do everyone a favor and factor it into the price. That is what the vast majority of sellers do (or they're not doing the tax thing at all.) As a buyer I have no desire to screw with dimes, nickels and pennies at a show, and when I negotiate a price, that is what I expect to pay. It's hard enough keeping the bills organized during a show.

In the five shows I've attended in the last year I probably dealt with 30 or so vendors, all via cash. Only one added on tax, and before that he wouldn't haggle at all and was most unfriendly. Even had a little cash register to figure it up (that should have clued me in.) I wished I had set the trains down and waked away but I didn't.

MNCW posted:

Ed, Some of that was pretty funny. Where did you find it? Apparently, I am related to:

Percy the Purist- Wouldn't think of buying a train unless it had all the original dust on it. 

I believe the dust to be part of the natural weathering.

Tom 

(My dusty but lovable prewar #228)

IMG_0721

MNCW - I don't recall where this was from originally, thinking it was from one of the magazines, maybe CTT.  I had it saved as a scan many years ago.  Makes me laugh every time I read it.

C W Burfle posted:

On the question of sales tax.  If you pay a dealer in cash, how do we know he isn't pocketing the extra money ?   I can understand the tax thing if paying with a credit card, as I don't think the vendor can hide the tax from the taxman.

You don't.

You need to trust that people do the "right" thing.  I keep track of my sales at shows and pay the CA sales tax at year end.  It is no big deal and having a clear conscience is certainly better than not paying it.  We all get government services and they need to be funded.

NH Joe

New Haven Joe posted:
C W Burfle posted:

On the question of sales tax.  If you pay a dealer in cash, how do we know he isn't pocketing the extra money ?   I can understand the tax thing if paying with a credit card, as I don't think the vendor can hide the tax from the taxman.

You don't.

You need to trust that people do the "right" thing.  I keep track of my sales at shows and pay the CA sales tax at year end.  It is no big deal and having a clear conscience is certainly better than not paying it.  We all get government services and they need to be funded.

NH Joe

I do as well. But that's between the seller and the state. The buyer doesn't really know.

If the show is in the Great State of Michigan.

You can ask the seller to show you their, Michigan Sales Tax License.  I do this in state and  have done this at out of state shows and the seller will usually have it in a folder under their table.

You can ask and if they do not have the Sales Tax License for the state where the show is being held. I would not pay the sales tax.  This is what I do at train shows.

Have fun and good luck.

Gary

Son is asleep and is excited to be going tomorrow and getting a boxcar. Wife thinks she is coming down with the flu though,  so ... I may have to either scuttle these plans or attempt the show with a 3 year old AND a one year old.

I may be dumb, but I'm not that dumb.  Praying the wife gets well overnight.

Dan Padova posted:

Wow, that'll slow you down.  It may be aliitle late to look for a baby sitter.

I've taken them both to the zoo and a comic book convention by myself before ... but honestly neither one really involved me placing my attention anywhere other than my kids. 

This ... I don't think much, if anything,  would get accomplished. Of course I've  never been before, so who knows. Maybe my sanity could stay intact long enough to find and grab enough of the odd pieces of FasTrack i need to get the layout done on Monday.

Deuce posted:

Son is asleep and is excited to be going tomorrow and getting a boxcar. Wife thinks she is coming down with the flu though,  so ... I may have to either scuttle these plans or attempt the show with a 3 year old AND a one year old.

I may be dumb, but I'm not that dumb.  Praying the wife gets well overnight.

Deuce - your wife has my prayers as well!  You and that little boy of yours need to be at that show tomorrow!!

trumptrain posted:
Deuce posted:

Son is asleep and is excited to be going tomorrow and getting a boxcar. Wife thinks she is coming down with the flu though,  so ... I may have to either scuttle these plans or attempt the show with a 3 year old AND a one year old.

I may be dumb, but I'm not that dumb.  Praying the wife gets well overnight.

Deuce - your wife has my prayers as well!  You and that little boy of yours need to be at that show tomorrow!!   And all of us on this thread need to get a full report

 

Deuce posted:

Son is asleep and is excited to be going tomorrow and getting a boxcar. Wife thinks she is coming down with the flu though,  so ... I may have to either scuttle these plans or attempt the show with a 3 year old AND a one year old.

I may be dumb, but I'm not that dumb.  Praying the wife gets well overnight.

Aww, come on. This will be a true test of your Dad skills! I have done it, my boys are 3 years apart, and it is no simple job. I know I hated doing diaper duty in a men’s room, so I would always go out to my car. If you have bad weather where you are, it’s a thought. 

 If nothing else, it will give you a new story to tell...after you recover.

Last edited by Scrambler81

My feeling is that some sellers will get in a hough.  Others will oblige without question.  Depends on their mood I suppose.

NYS requires show promoters to collect table holder tax numbers. So I have to provide it on my show application / registration.
If an attendee asked to see my tax number, I'd want to know why. (I don't add sales tax to the price. I deduct it from my intake at tax time)
I guess I'd show it to him. Then I think I might refuse to sell him anything.

Unless you are a State IRS inspector, by asking to see a tax number I think you are questioning the seller's honesty, and marking yourself as a problem buyer. No thanks.

Last edited by C W Burfle

I would agree with 99% of what CW says, but unless you are a New York State employee from the Dept of Tax and Finance and you have proper ID to prove it, I am not showing you my tax certificate. 

I've been a vendor for around 15 years and nobody has ever asked to see it (although I carry it with me). In this age of identity theft, I don't believe in sharing information when it is not necessary. 

Tom 

Last edited by PRR8976

Overall a success. Didn't get everything on my list but got a fair portion.  Figured the FasTrack would be a tough buy and it's what I had to walk away from.  

We lasted about as long as I expected.  One hour, and the last thirty minutes he was all over the place, but he did good and he liked the show. We are at Chic fil A  now.  I'll detail things later after lunch.

Last edited by Deuce

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