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Question for Hotwater,  The last several years here in Omaha,  Up has been doing a lot of rail upgrades and Curve smoothing along the west side of the river and at the interchange in South O.  You think they're capable of getting the 14 to CWS home plate now?  I know the 65 could not negotiate specific switches and radius curves previously, But most of these areas have been redone just as of recent.

aterry11 posted:

Question for Hotwater,  The last several years here in Omaha,  Up has been doing a lot of rail upgrades and Curve smoothing along the west side of the river and at the interchange in South O.  You think they're capable of getting the 14 to CWS home plate now? 

OK,what is "the 14"?

I know the 65 could not negotiate specific switches and radius curves previously,

What is "the 65"?

But most of these areas have been redone just as of recent.

If the 844 could negate the track, then things should be OK for an articulated. However, backing up is much more of an issue with that pedestal tender.

 

UP is now the only railroad with a steam program, but NS still allows deadhead moves of 765 and 611. If 611 returns to NCTM this year, it will have to use NS to get there. 765 is probably returning to CVSR in September, and maybe Metra as well. But with the Amtrak business, there will be zero public mainline excursions this year, and the UP 844 excursions are over as well because the Denver Post can no longer afford to sponsor them. To ride behind steam for long distance, you’ll have to go to Grand Canyon, TVRM, Reading and Northern, etc.

Robert K posted:

UP is now the only railroad with a steam program, but NS still allows deadhead moves of 765 and 611. If 611 returns to NCTM this year, it will have to use NS to get there. 765 is probably returning to CVSR in September, and maybe Metra as well. But with the Amtrak business, there will be zero public mainline excursions this year, and the UP 844 excursions are over as well because the Denver Post can no longer afford to sponsor them. To ride behind steam for long distance, you’ll have to go to Grand Canyon, TVRM, Reading and Northern, etc.

Until 765 and 611 have PTC installed, there will have to be a diesel guiding them. Unfortunately, I highly doubt the 765 will return to Chicago this year since Metra does have PTC. The Joliet Rocket may still run, but behind a vintage diesel instead of a steam locomotive. Personally, that's sad for me; I always will consider Chicago to be the 765's second home.

But the Big Boy and 844 will certainly run excursions in the future! The schedule isn't released yet, so you never know what might happen (other than May 10).

Hot Water posted:
Casey Jones2 posted:

Would I be safe in assuming that a lack of any FRA PTC waivers has caused a delay in the UP steam scheduling?

I doubt it. I believe it is more related to reassembling 4014 and working towards a steam test, and then future break-in operations within the Cheyenne Terminal.

That makes sense. I find it funny how many people think that 4014 will go directly from a steam test to hooking up to the passenger equipment to go straight to Utah for the 150th events.

The only example of something like that I can think of was the Freedom Train's "30 day miracle" restoration of Reading 2101. Ross Rowland's crew was doing touch-up on the paint as it literally rolled up to the train in Virginia to start it's journey. I'm not sure they had any time to do other than a single test run...

Robert K posted:

UP is now the only railroad with a steam program, but NS still allows deadhead moves of 765 and 611. If 611 returns to NCTM this year, it will have to use NS to get there. 765 is probably returning to CVSR in September, and maybe Metra as well. But with the Amtrak business, there will be zero public mainline excursions this year, and the UP 844 excursions are over as well because the Denver Post can no longer afford to sponsor them. To ride behind steam for long distance, you’ll have to go to Grand Canyon, TVRM, Reading and Northern, etc.

You overlooked how friendly BNSF has been to qualified steam operators.

Hot Water posted:
Robert K posted:

UP is now the only railroad with a steam program, but NS still allows deadhead moves of 765 and 611. If 611 returns to NCTM this year, it will have to use NS to get there. 765 is probably returning to CVSR in September, and maybe Metra as well. But with the Amtrak business, there will be zero public mainline excursions this year, and the UP 844 excursions are over as well because the Denver Post can no longer afford to sponsor them. To ride behind steam for long distance, you’ll have to go to Grand Canyon, TVRM, Reading and Northern, etc.

You overlooked how friendly BNSF has been to qualified steam operators.

I've never heard of that. Which operators?

TrainMan1225 posted:
Hot Water posted:
Robert K posted:

UP is now the only railroad with a steam program, but NS still allows deadhead moves of 765 and 611. If 611 returns to NCTM this year, it will have to use NS to get there. 765 is probably returning to CVSR in September, and maybe Metra as well. But with the Amtrak business, there will be zero public mainline excursions this year, and the UP 844 excursions are over as well because the Denver Post can no longer afford to sponsor them. To ride behind steam for long distance, you’ll have to go to Grand Canyon, TVRM, Reading and Northern, etc.

You overlooked how friendly BNSF has been to qualified steam operators.

I've never heard of that. Which operators?

How about AT&SF #3751, SP&S 700, Milwaukee Road #261, and of course SP 4449.

palallin posted:
Hot Water posted:
TrainMan1225 posted:
 

You overlooked how friendly BNSF has been to qualified steam operators.

I've never heard of that. Which operators?

How about AT&SF #3751, SP&S 700, Milwaukee Road #261, and of course SP 4449.

Not quite so friendly to Frisco 1522, alas.

In fact the UP was VERY friendly to Frisco 1522, on more than one occasion. However, the group in charge of 1522 was getting "long in the tooth", and the engine was coming do for some major maintenance and inspections, so they all simply decided to call it quits, and folded their tent. Thus, the 1522 was returned to the museum in St Louis.

Last edited by Hot Water
Kelly Anderson posted:

Yes, but as the UP bashers will be quick to point out, 11K miles isn't even four times across the USA.  No wonder they say that the UP steam program is dead.

Just for kicks, how about comparing that to previous years, say prior to 2011, when there were at least one operational steam locomotive EVERY YEAR, and sometimes two operational steam locomotives, plus an A-B-A set of executive E units and/or a DDA40X.

With 10 weeks until the Golden Spike event I'm sure the UP Steam shop crew is under tremendous pressure to complete work on 4014 and have several test runs on a main (Denver line?) before making the run to Ogden.  Of the remaining tasks which of them present the biggest challenge/risk?  Is installation and tuning the oil burners a big deal?  Failure of 4014 to show up under steam would be an embarrassment felt right to the board room.  From a PR perspective  there is no next year.  I'm rooting for the UP crew as future corporate support of heritage steam may largely rest with the Golden Spike event receiving favorable nationwide publicity. 

Keystoned Ed posted:

With 10 weeks until the Golden Spike event I'm sure the UP Steam shop crew is under tremendous pressure to complete work on 4014 and have several test runs on a main (Denver line?) before making the run to Ogden.  Of the remaining tasks which of them present the biggest challenge/risk?  Is installation and tuning the oil burners a big deal? 

Very definitely YES!

Failure of 4014 to show up under steam would be an embarrassment felt right to the board room.  From a PR perspective  there is no next year.  I'm rooting for the UP crew as future corporate support of heritage steam may largely rest with the Golden Spike event receiving favorable nationwide publicity. 

 

Kelly Anderson posted:

Yes, but as the UP bashers will be quick to point out, 11K miles isn't even four times across the USA.  No wonder they say that the UP steam program is dead.

Dead as a doornail Kelly! 

And by the sounds of it (for the 5,000,000th time) I should be going back to pre-2011!  Also, I hear a record playing on repeat, but can't tell where its coming from...

Dominic Mazoch posted:
What is the backup plan? I think a meet of UP 844 and SP 4449 would have made more sense. OK, the 4449 is not a UP engine. But an exveption in this case......

That subject was brought up, and extensively discussed, way back last year. The bottom line; no way that SP 4449 was going to be allowed to share ANY of the publicity and limelight with the Union Pacific's 150th event in Utah!

Hum...Were the history books rewritten?  I thought the had part of building the first transcon was done by the CENTRAL PACIFIC!

Yes, SP was bought by UP in 1996.  And UP will do what UP wants.  But a possible history lesson lost.

But maybe sending ANY non-period steamer by themselves is a mistake.  844 and 4014 were built 70 years after the golden spike.  Now, JUPITER/UP 119, 844/4014, the E units,and a modern AC traction motor diesel electric could show motive power ovet 150 years....

But it is the UP show...

Here's the news you've been waiting for! • More details to come...... 

The commemorative tour schedule for the Big Boy No. 4014 and Living Legend No. 844 are now online at https://www.up.com/heritage/steam/schedule/index.htm.

The iconic steam locomotives will join together in a public display for the first time May 9 in Ogden, Utah, during Union Pacific's celebratory event marking the transcontinental railroad's 150th anniversary. The festivities include recreating the iconic photo taken May 10, 1869, when the last spike was tapped into place at Promontory Summit, creating America's first transcontinental railroad. Union Pacific no longer has tracks near Promontory Summit. They were removed to support the scrap metal projects during World War II.

No. 844 will leave Cheyenne, Wyoming, April 27. It will make several brief whistle-stops in communities along its route, arriving in Ogden on April 28. The Living Legend will be on display at Ogden Union Station through May 11.

No. 4014 will leave Cheyenne May 4 following a 9:30 a.m. MT christening ceremony at the historic Cheyenne Depot and arrive in Ogden for the May 9 celebratory event at Ogden Union Station. The Big Boy also will make several whistle-stops in communities along its route.

A comprehensive schedule for the April – May tour, including additional locations, display times and No. 844 and No. 4014 GPS location tracking information is available at http://upsteam.com. Due to the dynamic nature of these operations, running times and scheduled stops are subject to change.

The 150th anniversary celebration will continue throughout the year with No. 4014 visiting many states across the Union Pacific system. A tentative schedule with tour locations and dates will be published in the near future.

51290737_10156353049968506_3147447889588912128_o

Gary: Rail-fan

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One thing we do know is no 844 public excursion this year from Denver. They decided to end it because the newspaper could no longer afford to sponsor it. Oh well, if you want to ride a long steam excursion this year in the US there’s always the Grand Canyon, Cumbres & Toltec, Durango, TVRM, RBMN, etc. The UP thing is mostly for chasers and for people to watch them arrive at cities. UP doesn’t want to bother with liability insurance for excursions.

Last edited by Robert K
Robert K posted:

One thing we do know is no 844 public excursion this year from Denver.

What about on other lines of the UP?

They decided to end it because the newspaper could no longer afford to sponsor it. Oh well, if you want to ride a long steam excursion this year in the US there’s always the Grand Canyon, Cumbres & Toltec, Durango, TVRM, RBMN, etc.

None of those are on a "main line", however.

 

This year there is probably zero mainline excursions because of the Amtrak ban as well as an NS ban because NS ended support for excursions. I guess the bean counters had their way, excursions are too much of a risk for class 1’s and Amtrak who are trying to cut costs. The RBMN excursions especially the ones on the Lehigh Division are sort of on a main line, the ex-Lehigh Valley and CNJ routes combined.

Last edited by Robert K

A Quick Guide & Timeline

The Great Race to Ogden – No. 844

No. 844 will leave Cheyenne, Wyoming, April 27 and will make several brief stops in communities before arriving in Ogden, Utah, April 28. 

"Experience the Union Pacific" displays include public access to the Experience Car and souvenir shop. The Experience the Union Pacific Car connects visitors to the innovative and expanding story of Union Pacific and modern railroad operations that have united the nation since 1869.

"No Public Access" stops are secured locations where the public is not allowed for safety reasons.

AA

Saturday, April 27

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Cheyenne, Wyo.

UP Steam Shop

Arrival

Depart

9:00 a.m. MT

9:30 a.m. MT

Laramie, Wyo.

Laramie Historic Railroad Depot

E. Kearney and S.

1st St.

Arrival

Depart

11:30 a.m. MT

Noon MT

Medicine Bow, Wyo.

Hwy. 30 at Medicine Bow-McFadden Rd.

Arrival

Depart

1:10 p.m. MT

1:40 p.m. MT

Rawlins, Wyo.

Rawlins Depot

100 W Front St.

Arrival

Depart

2:35 p.m. MT

3:05 p.m. MT

Wamsutter, Wyo.

Near Water Tower

Broadway Street

Arrival

4:45 p.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Sunday, April 28

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Arrival

Depart

8:45 a.m. MT

9:15 a.m. MT

Green River, Wyo.

Green River Depot

200 E. Railroad Ave

Arrival

Depart

10:00 a.m. MT

10:30 a.m. MT

Granger, Wyo.

Main Street crossing

Arrival

Depart

12:30 p.m. MT

1:00 p.m. MT

Evanston, Wyo.

Evanston Depot

10th St

Arrival

Depart

2:30 p.m. MT

3:00 p.m. MT

Morgan, Utah

Morgan Depot

98 Commercial Street

Arrival

4:30 p.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

Monday, April 29 – Saturday, May 4

On Display:

10:00 a.m. – 4:00 p.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

Experience the Union Pacific Rail Car

Sunday, May 5

No Public Display

Ogden, Utah

Monday, May 6 – Wednesday, May 8

On Display:

10:00 a.m. – 4:00 p.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

Experience the Union Pacific Rail Car

Thursday, May 9

Celebration

10:30 a.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

On Display:

Noon – 3:00 p.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

Experience the Union Pacific Rail Car

The Great Race to Ogden – No. 4014

Big Boy No. 4014 will leave Cheyenne May 4 following a 9:30 a.m. MT christening ceremony at the historic Cheyenne Depot and arrive in Ogden for the May 9 celebratory event culminating in the Big Boy joining with The Living Legend No. 844. The celebratory event will be streamed live May 9 at 10:30 a.m. MT via the Union Pacific Facebook page.

The Big Boy will make several brief stops in communities on its way to Ogden.

BB

Saturday, May 4

Christening

Depart

9:30 a.m. MT

10:00 a.m. MT

Cheyenne, Wyo.

Cheyenne Depot Museum

121 W. 15th Street

Arrival

Depart

11:15 a.m. MT

11:30 a.m. MT

Harriman, Wyo.

County Road 102 Crossing

Arrival

Depart

12:30 p.m. MT

1:15 p.m. MT

Laramie, Wyo.

Laramie Historic Railroad Depot

E. Kearney and S. 1st St.

Arrival

Depart

2:30 p.m. MT

3:15 p.m. MT

Medicine Bow, Wyo.

Hwy. 30 at Medicine Bow-McFadden Rd.

Arrival

4:45 p.m. MT

Rawlins, Wyo.

East Railroad St & Higley Blvd.

Sunday, May 5

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Rawlins, Wyo.

East Railroad St & Higley Blvd.

Arrival

Depart

9:15 a.m. MT

10:00 a.m. MT

Wamsutter, Wyo.

Near Water Tower

Broadway Street

Arrival

11:15 a.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Monday, May 6

Depart

4:00 a.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Arrival

Depart

4:55 a.m. MT

5:10 a.m. MT

Green River, Wyo.

Depot

200 E. Railroad Ave

Arrival

Depart

6:15 a.m. MT

7:00 a.m. MT

Granger, Wyo.

Main Street crossing

Arrival

8:45 a.m. MT

Evanston, Wyo.

1500 Main St.

Tuesday, May 7

No Public Display

 

Evanston, Wyo.

1500 Main St.

Wednesday, May 8

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Evanston, Wyo.

1500 Main St.

Arrival

Depart

9:30 a.m. MT

9:45 a.m. MT

Echo, Utah

Echo Road Crossing

Arrival

Depart

10:00 a.m. MT

10:15 a.m. MT

Morgan, Utah

Morgan Depot

98 Commercial Street

Arrival

10:50 a.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

No Public Access

Thursday, May 9

Celebratory Event

10:30 a.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

 

The Great Race from Ogden – No. 844 and No. 4014

Following the 150th anniversary celebrations, No. 4014 and No. 844 will double-head on their return trip to the Union Pacific Steam Shop in Cheyenne, stopping in communities along the way including Rock Springs and Laramie, Wyoming. 

CC

Friday, May 10 – Saturday, May 11

On Display:

10:00 a.m. – 3:00 p.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

Experience the Union Pacific Rail Car 

Sunday, May 12

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Ogden, Utah

Ogden Union Station

2501 Wall Ave.

Arrival

Depart

9:15 a.m. MT

9:25 a.m. MT

Morgan, Utah

98 Commercial Street

Arrival

Depart

9:55 a.m. MT

10:05 a.m. MT

Echo, Utah

Echo Road Crossing

Arrival

11:05 a.m. MT

Evanston, Wyo.

Evanston Depot

10th St.

Monday, May 13

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Evanston, Wyo.

Arrival

Depart

10:00 a.m. MT

10:45 a.m. MT

Granger, Wyo.

Main Street crossing

Arrival

Depart

11:50 a.m. MT

12:05 p.m. MT

Green River, Wyo.

200 E. Railroad Ave

Arrival

12:45 p.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Tuesday, May 14 – Wednesday, May 15

On Display:

9:00 a.m. – 3:00 p.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Experience the Union Pacific Rail Car

Thursday, May 16

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Rock Springs, Wyo.

501 N. Front St

Arrival

Depart

9:00 a.m. MT

9:15 a.m. MT

Point of Rocks, Wyo.

Black Buttes Road

Arrival

Depart

10:30 a.m. MT

11:30 a.m. MT

Wamsutter, Wyo.

Near Water Tower

Broadway Street

Arrival

12:45 p.m. MT

Rawlins, Wyo.

East Railroad St & Higley Blvd.

Friday, May 17

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Rawlins, Wyo.

East Railroad St & Higley Blvd.

Arrival

Depart

9:00 a.m. MT

9:15 a.m. MT

Hanna, Wyo.

Main St. & Front St.

Arrival

Depart

9:45 a.m. MT

10:45 a.m. MT

Medicine Bow, Wyo.

Hwy. 30 at Medicine Bow-McFadden Rd.

Arrival

12:45 p.m. MT

Laramie, Wyo.

Laramie Historic Railroad Depot

E. Kearney and S. 1st St.

No Public Access

Saturday, May 18

No Public Access

 

Laramie, Wyo.

Laramie Historic Railroad Depot

E. Kearney and S. 1st St.

Sunday, May 19

Depart

8:00 a.m. MT

Laramie, Wyo.

Laramie Historic Railroad Depot

E. Kearney and S. 1st St.

Arrival

Depart

9:15 a.m. MT

9:25 a.m. MT

Sherman Hill, Wyo.

Arrival

11:05 a.m. MT

Cheyenne, Wyo.

UP Steam Shop

Source: Union Pacific Steam Club • Always check the main schedule for any changes……..  (Click here)

Gary Rail-Fan

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