Lionel Rutland Mogul is DOA. Update, video added.

Gary - that is a drag. Is there a factory reset before you reach out for service that can be executed on this engine?

Paul

superwarp1 posted:

My brand new Lionel Rutland Mogul is dead on arrival.  I programmed the TMCC ID, all sounds work, smoke unit works, it moved around the layout a little jerky, figured it needs a break in, backed it to its train. Hit forward and it moved an inch then nothing.  Still all sounds work, smoke unit works but no movement.

the cab light is flashing, what does that mean?

It means you need to send it back! Good old Lionel quality control.

ill be calling Lionel soon.

The cab light flashes a diagnostic code.

1,2,or3. What the error code means is in the back of the manual.

The Loco will reset 3 times via the remote or you can remove power briefly and get 3 more.

Given the erratic operation. I'm guessing the code is flashing for "motor driver stalled".

Something jamming the drivers could cause this as well as dirty track.

Forum member SJC was complaining about traction tires  rubbing the brake shoe detail on his mogul. I'd start there.

Legacy locos have back drivable gears. You can turn them by hand (with some resistance) and check for issues.

RICKO,

Luckily these models are relatively inexpensive, i.e. cheap, so such issues are to be expected?

No. Your absolutely right hotwater. I was just trying to give some info to Gary that might save him shipping charges if it's an "easy"fix.

That's 2 so far with operational issues. There will be more. The thing about Lionel defects is they're always "usual suspects".

I didn't see SJC's post, but I'm not thrilled with the traction tires on my B&M Mogul, either. First, they are mounted on the front wheels which makes changing them more difficult (not sure why they couldn't have been mounted on the rears).

More importantly, the tires seem awfully narrow compared to the width of the wheel, itself. It's almost as if the train is balancing itself on a tire which is too narrow for the wheel. If you look on the video I posted on the recent "Ac-9's Shipping" thread, you can see the train is wobbling a little on the tracks. In addition, the tires seemed out of round. When I track tested it at my local LHS, we saw the wobble and actually took the loco off and tried to true the tires with a very small chisel.  

Gary - Make sure the tires aren't rubbing anywhere. Then I'd try turning everything off and turn the smoke switch off on the underside of the loco and put the loco back on the track and power up and start the engine.  Make sure smoke is off on the remote. Hit the "R" button and you should hear a quick horn/whistle. Try moving forward and see if it goes.  

If that works, I'd power everything down again and re-program under a different ID # with the smoke switch still off and then back to run. If that works, I'd power down again and put the smoke switch back on and back on the track. Run a couple of laps and turn the smoke back on via the remote.

Hot Water posted:

RICKO,

Luckily these models are relatively inexpensive, i.e. cheap, so such issues are to be expected?

I'd hardly call a $600+ engine "cheap".................

As for traction tires, I cut the brake shoes off the front wheels. They are not screwed on. I cut the original tires off to confirm that was the issue. Once confirmed, I reinstalled the extra set temporarily until I could get my hands on thinner MTH tires. I will make it a point to replace again ASAP. 

SJC posted:

As for traction tires, I cut the brake shoes off the front wheels. They are not screwed on. I cut the original tires off to confirm that was the issue. Once confirmed, I reinstalled the extra set temporarily until I could get my hands on thinner MTH tires. I will make it a point to replace again ASAP. 

SJC - I was also thinking of cutting off the original ones, but the replacement ones didn't look any better than the ones that came on it. If you find a set of wider, thinner MTH tires, please let us know the part #. Thanks.

Sounds similar to the tire problem on some of the F3 AA Lionel diesels a few years ago. I have a WM that had that issue.

Remnd me not to buy a used engine from you guys. Cutting off the brake shoes, traction tires? Sheeesh.

Let me suggest if you think something is rubbing, first connect an ammeter between the transformer and track assuming there isn't one on the transformer already. Then check to see the current never goes over about 1 1/2 amps running light. If it does or the current fluctuates greatly then something is dragging down the motor. If its a brake shoe then remove that axle assuming its the one not screwed on and grind the shoe down with a dremel. Shouldn't too hard given the keeper plate allows easy removal of the axles.

Pete

One flashing cab light means the main drive motor has stalled. Give the loco a small push and hit Aux1, 0. Then try to move the engine, it it still stalls and the flash comes back after a few tries, send it to be fixed

I’m going to give it a second look tonight, thanks for the suggestions.   Sad but it seems who ever I  purchase from there’s always some issue

Gary, if you want to call me, I can go through it with you.

I am running conventional and am getting the single cab flash at very low voltage. Will eventually stall the engine requiring a restart.

would this warrant a return to Lionel? First Legacy loco so my knowledge of these issues is non-existent.

Ok, update.  With a careful inspection, no brake shoes rubbing, no binding of the running gear.  I was able with a small screwdriver to turn the flywheel and yes the motor was locked.  I was able to unlock it but after a little running it would lock up again.   At slow speed there’s a  definite bind.  So I removed the plate, and yes added a little grease but it didn’t help.  Check out the video.  Something wrong with the worm gear, axle gear, or the motor itself.

Gary, look for the traction tires on the front set of drivers binding on the brake shoes.  The tires on them are not good.  Your own engine, cut them off and you know what do do then.

They may have put too big of a tire on that engine like they did with my Lionmaster Challenger

Marty Fitzhenry posted:

Gary, look for the traction tires on the front set of drivers binding on the brake shoes.  The tires on them are not good.  Your own engine, cut them off and you know what do do then.

Well those tires sure may be causing that engine to bounce down the track but 100% sure it’s not the cause of the locking up of the motor. When the motor is locked up, everything else moves freely.

but for argument sake I’ll remove the tires and see what happens.

Love these; I have an "older" NYC version.

Side rod screws all snugged down (had a loco lock up when one would hit the main rod)?

Can you tell if the motor is loose in its mount (rocking/shifting affecting gear mesh)? Had that happen on a diesel or two. Check the piston rods/cylinder/crosshead interaction.

It may "work itself out"; had this happen before. Maybe run it for 15 minutes steadily and see it it improves; I don't think you would hurt anything as it does not appear to be under any particular strain. The "binding" makes me think this may not work, but before you send it back - it's on the layout anyway.

Probably none of the above, but they're free.