Just opened my UPS package and low and behold a CNW and a NS arrived.
,And all features worked. Couplers are new and worked very well, sound is great
also. Pulling power - I am very happy! Art
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Just opened my UPS package and low and behold a CNW and a NS arrived.
,And all features worked. Couplers are new and worked very well, sound is great
also. Pulling power - I am very happy! Art
Replies sorted oldest to newest
Can we get pictures of the C&NW unit pleeeeeese??
Ben
Who did you order from?
Brendan
No shipping info via email for my C&NW or the GN and Reading GP's. I have seen sales on Ebay for the GP's with a delivery now quoted as 4 days where before they were listed as when delivered.
Rich
My CC was hit today for the loco. Trainworld also hit me for the caboose.
Brendan
16lbs of trains on the way from Ro!
Rich
richabr posted:16lbs of trains on the way from Ro!
Rich
Now your just bragging!
Brendan
C&NW Baldwin and (I think) Southern waffle and a C&NW caboose. They both had expected 12/17 dates according to the site.
Rich
Must be a lot of waffles; my Baldwin only comes in at 3.4lbs
Brendan
Charles Ro sent me a notice. Mine will be here on the 26th according to the tracking number. Santa is one day late!!!!
I just love that C&NW green w/yellow stripe scheme! I think it all hails back to receiving a set like this one on Christmas morning, 1962:
When I unwrapped my set and saw that spectacular box art (in its pristine glory at the time), my imagination was stirred by the artistic (and in my opinion, very dramatic) nighttime rendering of the lowly little C&N yard switcher. I was hooked on model railroading for life!
Hm. Sorry for waxing nostalgic.
Merry Christmas! Hope all of you receive a ton of fun out of your new little AF Baldwins!
Andre
I wish Lionel would invest in a new Scale BLW S12 switcher for Us O scalers.
Andre
Pardon me while I pull out the dead horse...
This Baldwin has the potential to provide some diversity to the RTR line for Flyer.
But ohhhhh, I will save everyone from my high horse on that. I do have a whole stable full of them.
Ben
prrhorseshoecurve posted:I wish Lionel would invest in a new Scale BLW S12 switcher for Us O scalers.
And we S guys wish Lionel would invest in one tenth of their O line for US!
poniaj posted:prrhorseshoecurve posted:I wish Lionel would invest in a new Scale BLW S12 switcher for Us O scalers.
And we S guys wish Lionel would invest in one tenth of their O line for US!
How about a ‘Sharknose’, they had AAR type B trucks, would these be the same as on the current GP by Lionel, if so that cuts out new tooling costs.
Problem is they only had three operators from new but then they do fit in nicely era wise with other Flyer diesels.
C&NW Baldwin and (I think) Southern waffle and a C&NW caboose. They both had expected 12/17 dates according to the site.
Just got an email from Ro and looks like the GP's are in. Could be the rest of my 16lbs!
Rich
My PRR Baldwin and B&M GP7 arrived today!
Ukaflyer posted:poniaj posted:prrhorseshoecurve posted:I wish Lionel would invest in a new Scale BLW S12 switcher for Us O scalers.
And we S guys wish Lionel would invest in one tenth of their O line for US!
How about a ‘Sharknose’, they had AAR type B trucks, would these be the same as on the current GP by Lionel, if so that cuts out new tooling costs.
Problem is they only had three operators from new but then they do fit in nicely era wise with other Flyer diesels.
Original Shark owners were EJ&E (very briefly owned 4, I think they were sold to the B&O), B&O, NYC, and PRR. Monongahela bought a small fleet from NYC, and the last 2 of those went to the D&H. The D&H units are now tucked out of view in Michigan. Add in the demonstrator paint scheme and that's quite a few ways to decorate a shark (and Pennsy and NYC went through several different schemes as well).
MTN posted:Ukaflyer posted:
How about a ‘Sharknose’, they had AAR type B trucks, would these be the same as on the current GP by Lionel, if so that cuts out new tooling costs.
Problem is they only had three operators from new but then they do fit in nicely era wise with other Flyer diesels.
Original Shark owners were EJ&E (very briefly owned 4, I think they were sold to the B&O), B&O, NYC, and PRR. Monongahela bought a small fleet from NYC, and the last 2 of those went to the D&H. The D&H units are now tucked out of view in Michigan. Add in the demonstrator paint scheme and that's quite a few ways to decorate a shark (and Pennsy and NYC went through several different schemes as well).
FYI: EJ&E bought the demos.
I'm not gonna hold my breath for Sharks.
Rusty
Happy for your Rich! They look great... REALLY like that GN!
BUT... yet another thing I'm a sucker for: GN power.
Every time I see one of ya'lls layouts that use track like you're using Rich, I think: "Why didn't I go that route?" back in my S scale attempt.
Andre
Every time I see one of ya'lls layouts that use track like you're using Rich, I think: "Why didn't I go that route?" back in my S scale attempt.
Andre
In a few more years when your fingers are not as nimble and your eyesight a little more fuzzy, maybe you'll be back!
Rich
Make no mistake, Rich, scale S cars with select engine offerings, all w/Kadee's, operating on track like you're using would be a very do-able approach for many of us HO scalers.
As for me, I don't know if I would have the heart to start all over again with S, for I would be sick with regret when looking back at the pieces I had... but which of us truly know our futures, eh?
As for IF the day arrives that HO is too tedious and my hands/eyes are not cooperating to their fullest extent: Well, AT this POINT, my "Plan B" is that I would be interested in returning to "runners quality" traditional 3-rail with the bulk of it being readily available (and quite affordable) Postwar Lionel.
BUT for now... HO it is... and I'm having a lot of fun with it.
Andre
richabr posted:
Fine paint jobs all. I'll admit I was puzzled about the narrow stripe running along the hood, it's not something I've seen before in C&NW switcher photographs. But lo and behold:
Lionel got it right when the 1260 was fresh from the factory.
I received my NorthWestern today and I noticed that the Manual was for a Baldwin Switcher however when I looked at it it did not have any mention of Flyerchief it only shows knuckle couplers and only transformer operation, there is no mention of electro coupler, are all of the Baldwins coming with the wrong manual?
I received my NorthWestern today and I noticed that the Manual was for a Baldwin Switcher however when I looked at it it did not have any mention of Flyerchief it only shows knuckle couplers and only transformer operation, there is no mention of electro coupler, are all of the Baldwins coming with the wrong manual?
Mine is as you described.
Rich
Thanks for the reply Rich. It does not matter just would wish Lionel would put a little more though into the American Flyer line, well getting a new American Flyer train for Christmas is great!
Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.
Thanks for the updates and photos. Are the Baldwin's front and rear headlights directional? Do the latest FCBT GP7's have dual motors? A video of a Baldwin and a Geep would be great.
The folks at Lionel have stated that they can't dual motor the GP7 because the inside width of the long hood is too narrow. The Baldwin switcher hood inside width is wider than the GP7 with room for a second motor.
Rusty
Thanks Rusty. That sounds familiar now that you mention it. Sorry to make for repeated onfo, but do I appreciate your refresher. Does the Baldwin use tiny contact rollers or pw Flyer like pick-up shoes shown in the artist rendering of it in the last catalog? Thanks.
Sgaugian posted:Thanks Rusty. That sounds familiar now that you mention it. Sorry to make for repeated onfo, but do I appreciate your refresher. Does the Baldwin use tiny contact rollers or pw Flyer like pick-up shoes shown in the artist rendering of it in the last catalog? Thanks.
Sorry, I don't have one to examine, one of the guys that do can answer that. However, I would guess seeing that the GP7 and Baldwin now share the same trucks, the Baldwin will have the rollers.
Rusty
I got home late last night and found my C&NW Baldwin waiting on my doorstep. Hooray!
Unfortunately, the sound system failed right away. If I turn the crew talk all the way to the left the sound disappears completely. By turning to the right all i get is a weak rumble. No bell, no horn, no crew talk. The sound switch is on.
Unless anyone here has some ideas I guess it's back to Charles Ro.
I also noted on my receipt from Ro a note that the Legacy Nickel Plate Berkshire and the Pere Marquette Berkshire (both on order) have been cancelled by Lionel. Bummer.
EDIT: I also noticed (like others) that my new Baldwin came with the "non-FlyerChief" instruction manual.
However, I would guess seeing that the GP7 and Baldwin now share the same trucks, the Baldwin will have the rollers.
Rusty, once again you are correct.
Rich
Craig Donath posted:I also noted on my receipt from Ro a note that the Legacy Nickel Plate Berkshire and the Pere Marquette Berkshire (both on order) have been cancelled by Lionel. Bummer.
The Legacy Berks were cancelled at the end of September and discussed into October.
Basically, they couldn't be built for the "too good to be true" MSRP.
Rusty
Thank you Rusty and Rich. The tiny rollers work OK on home layouts with very good to excellent track work. Those typically don't have much of a gap between any rail or track sections. Club layouts on the other hand can a different matter. The tiny rollers sometime get caught in gaps of 1/8 of an inch or even larger.
Santa did it right as my Baldwin arrived today and not on the 26th.
As said earlier the manual inside the box was wrong. I called Charles Ro and they said they had no other calls about the manual. The Ro employee I talked to said that they would contact Lionel by week's end and find out about getting the right manual. I tried calling Lionel but after waiting 20 minutes I gave up.
Now to try it on the layout!!!!
MERRY CHRISTMAS
Well, the Baldwin has a bad sound chip and I have called Charles Ro. They will be sending me a FedX label so I can send it back. When they get it they will send me a new engine. DARN not Christmas present yet.
Anybody else had problems with this Baldwin?
I wrote my contact at Lionel and when he gets back to the office later in the week he is going to check on the manual situation and get a download manual set up.
Roundhouse Bill posted:Well, the Baldwin has a bad sound chip and I have called Charles Ro. They will be sending me a FedX label so I can send it back. When they get it they will send me a new engine. DARN not Christmas present yet.
Anybody else had problems with this Baldwin?
I wrote my contact at Lionel and when he gets back to the office later in the week he is going to check on the manual situation and get a download manual set up.
My Baldwin went back to Ro this morning with the "no sound" issue. I got a return authorization yesterday but wasn't offered a shipping label. It cost me $15.55 to ship it back. So much for the savings for early purchase. Oh, well. I just hope it comes back fixed. It's a fine looking engine.
I also mentioned to Ro about the wrong manual issue, but they didn't seem to say they were aware of the problem. I suspect everyone is in the same boat.
Mark
Nice review!
Ben
I have been talking to Ryan Kunkle of Lionel online. He did not know that there was a problem with the manual. He is going to get it available online ASAP. He sent me a copy, which I tried to get attached here, but it didn't seem to get finished even after 10 minutes. I can send it to you if you email me at billstrains@aol.com
Thanks for the manual, I have been using the APP. to run my blue tooth engine and it seemed to work well, however I am a little puzzled when I went thru the Baldwin manual, first off when I use the APP. on the Baldwin I noticed that the engine ID is not loaded, while it function with the APP. it does not pick up the Baldwin number? everything else seems ok. it operates with 1234 number shown, second when I went thru the manual I noticed that the APP shows on page 15 volume control it allows you to control pitch and custom levels how do you get to that screen, I cannot find it.
also when I load the Santa FE 2849 when you read the screen it states it has smoke which I know it does not?
Does the APP ever get updated maybe I do not have the latest?
it seems that nobody proof reads any of this stuff do they have the same issues on the Lionel (3 rail) side?
while I am happy that we get some attention from Lionel I would have hoped that it would have had a little more attention to detail.
Happy New Year to all
thanks Mark that worked great I deleted the APP and it loaded up correctly, still there are things in the manual that I do not think are accessible on the flyer chief APP, maybe that is Lionels way of saying if you had 3 rail Lionel your life would be better!
So, let me see if I got this right, the new Flyonel Baldwin’s came through with outdated instruction books, and the ones put online to correct the situation contain erroneous information on top of it all? How inept is that?
Also, Regarding the too small electrical pickup rollers on the trucks, are these just supplemental to the pickup already provided by the wheels, or will the loco not run without them?
One has to be amazed that Lionel has been making toy trains as long as they have, and yet they still keep making mistakes like these...
Bill in FtL
Bill Nielsen posted:Also, Regarding the too small electrical pickup rollers on the trucks, are these just supplemental to the pickup already provided by the wheels, or will the loco not run without them?
Bill in FtL
I did a continuity check on an FC Geep last year. Unless something has changed, the rollers are the only source of electrical pick up, the wheels are fully insulated from the electronics.
Rusty
If that’s the case, I’m glad I didn’t order any of the Geeps or Baldwin’s, because it sounds to me like the engineering simply isn’t there anymore. Does each truck pick up from both rails, or is it only one rail per truck pickup?
Bill in FtL
Bill in Ftl, each of the two trucks have rollers for each rail. I have the GP7 FlyerChief first series and I have never had a problem with the rollers on it.
Bill Nielsen posted:One has to be amazed that Lionel has been making toy trains as long as they have, and yet they still keep making mistakes like these...
Bill in FtL
But how long have the chinese been making them ? j
I must have missed it, did some report an issue with the rollers? I don’t see any first hand issue brought up on this thread.
Ben
JohnActon posted:Bill Nielsen posted:One has to be amazed that Lionel has been making toy trains as long as they have, and yet they still keep making mistakes like these...
Bill in FtL
But how long have the chinese been making them ? j
Long enough, almost 15-20 years. However, we don't know what the turnover in the factories is like.
Lionel's products are designed here... So if a product fails or has a weak link because of a design issue, well...
Rusty
Rusty, I have been told by Lionel people that they aren't completely designed here. Engineers on both sides of the Pacific do design work based on Lionel's direction. In fact there are times when Lionel doesn't even own the tooling.
banjoflyer posted:Bill in FtL .
The pickup rollers have been on AF diesel engines for some time now. The AF 6-48065 Commemorative GP9 had them way back in 2007:
So it's good you haven't ordered any of them in the last 11 years.
When operated on track with large gaps between the rail ends you could have a problem. However, if your track is installed like that you've got bigger problems than snagged rollers.
Mark
Mark, you are correct! Actually, that pic sums up why I have no Flyer Geeps, besides not being able to stomach their stamped sheet metal handrails, I think the 6 wheel journal trucks are an abomination, and the four wheelers aren’t much better. Those tiny little rollers can’t possibly do well in turnout frogs, unless you used closed frogs, which might be less of a problem. I do still like the Flyer Atlantic’s (and most of their other Steam) however, so go figure! I gritted my teeth over those awful molded-in boiler handrails on the Berkshire, which spoil an otherwise nice model, but the Flyer Geep handrails and trucks are simply too much for me to take. A friend of mine ordered the AF Baldwin, and I’m waiting to see it. I just hope he’s not as disappointed as I would be (it’s his first S Gauge loco). He loves his LionChief O gauge diesel loco, which actually looks pretty good, even to me. And I do also very much like the Lion/Flyer Chief Control System, especially the BlueTooth versions.
Bill in FtL
Bill in FtL, You should look at the new FlyerChief GP7 as Lionel has installed a new more correct truck. Gilbert used the disproportionate truck in 1950 so it could use the same power truck chassis as the PA. It was never corrected. However there are real GPs with 6 wheel trucks.
Roundhouse Bill posted:Rusty, I have been told by Lionel people that they aren't completely designed here. Engineers on both sides of the Pacific do design work based on Lionel's direction. In fact there are times when Lionel doesn't even own the tooling.
Enter and exit....the flionel mikado and pacific...
Ben
NotInWI posted:I must have missed it, did some report an issue with the rollers? I don’t see any first hand issue brought up on this thread.
Ben
I seem to recall a discussion in another thread where the too small rollers would snag and come off of the truck. If the rollers are the only contact points, that would be a disastrous result!
Bill in FtL
I got both FlyerChief NS Baldwin and Reading GP7. This is some solid engineering. Simple and rugged in the PW sense...yet colorful with a splash of modern graphics applications. These certainly have a superior drive train to the Gilbert ancestors.
NotInWI posted:Roundhouse Bill posted:Rusty, I have been told by Lionel people that they aren't completely designed here. Engineers on both sides of the Pacific do design work based on Lionel's direction. In fact there are times when Lionel doesn't even own the tooling.
Enter and exit....the flionel mikado and pacific...
Ben
Not sure what you're trying to say here.
TRW
Roundhouse Bill posted:Bill in FtL, You should look at the new FlyerChief GP7 as Lionel has installed a new more correct truck. Gilbert used the disproportionate truck in 1950 so it could use the same power truck chassis as the PA. It was never corrected. However there are real GPs with 6 wheel trucks.
Hi Bill,
The only EMD hood units I’ve seen that used six wheel trucks were called SD’s rather than GP’s, and all axles were powered on them. I know other locomotive brands such as Alco, used six wheel trucks but only 2 of the 3 axles were powered, the third axle was an idler (called A1A truck’s, I think), to better spread the weight load on lighter duty track such as found on branchlines. SD locos were also usually longer than similar GP’s. What were the six axle GP versions called?
I’ve seen the newer flyer trucks, and while they do look better, they still aren’t quite right (and Flyer still has those flat handrails)...
Bill in FtL
Bill Nielsen posted:SD locos were also usually longer than similar GP’s. What were the six axle GP versions called?
Bill in FtL
In the finest tradition by Lionel since the 1989 when they added 6-wheel trucks to their modified O Gauge so-called GP20 to make an equally so-called SDL39, they called any Flyer GP with 6-wheel trucks an SD.
And yes, an SD9 was not usually, but always noticeably longer than a GP9:
And before anybody asks, the SDL39 was purpose-built for one railroad only, the Milwaukee Road. All axles were powered:
Rusty
Received my PRR Baldwin and am happy to report it all works as it should, very much enjoy running via my Android Bluetooth Lionelchief ap V 2.30. This thing pulls like the dickins! Sound is loud but easily adjusted by the ap. IMO, the paint is NOT Brunswick green to my eye, but black for sure. I know B. Green can vary in darkness. Next to a black freight car there is no difference. Compared to the other models offered, it is very plain, but I'm a Pennsy guy, so there you are! This model will really creep along, and the drive system is smooth.
S -
Is it possible that Pennsy had them in black and not Brunswick green in real life?
Ben
Charles Ro sent me an email with the Baldwin manual today. It looks like Lionel is following up as appropriate. I would expect everyone who bought the Baldwin will get the manual from their dealer.
My friend brought his new Baldwin by the club’s display at the library yesterday and we ran it on the loops of SHS S-Traxx we have set up on the stage. It does look nice and appears to run nicely, but our display track is just a pair of simple loops with no turnouts. He did mention that his temporary layout at home is all Lionel S FasTrack, with one turnout for a siding. He volunteered that the loco s really noisy when passing over the turnout. After looking at the tiny rollers, I am guessing that they are the source of the noise when going through the turnout. Correct me if I’m wrong, but don’t the FastTrack turnouts have a set of 3 points, two at the entrance to the turnout, with a third in the frog, essentially making it operate as a closed frog with no gaps for the roller to drop into? If that’s the case, why is it so noisy going through the turnout. After seeing the too-small rollers in person, I am convinced that they will cause problems in a turnout, especially ones with conventional open frog design, snagging as the go over the unavoidable gaps in the frog. I also do not like the fact that this model has all eight wheels equipped with traction tires, which will require frequent replacing as they age and loosen up. There is no good need for so many rubber tires on a loco, especially a switcher. I much prefer my American Models switcher even though it has it’s own issues (at least traction tires aren’t part of its problems!).
I hope everyone enjoys their new AF Baldwin switchers, and while they do look to be improved over earlier issues, I’m glad I didn’t order one myself.
Bill in FtL
I just got another new GP-7 and one of the new Baldwin Flyer Chief locomotives. My top loop is S-Helper track with turnouts and the lower loop is American models track and their #5 turnouts. I have had no problems with the small pickup rollers on either track system. The locos performed as advertised! I had 14 cars of mixed parentage behind the Baldwin and it operated smoothly. No original Flyer Baldwin even one with a can motor and extra weight performs as well.
Bill Nielsen posted:My friend brought his new Baldwin by the club’s display at the library yesterday and we ran it on the loops of SHS S-Traxx we have set up on the stage. It does look nice and appears to run nicely, but our display track is just a pair of simple loops with no turnouts. He did mention that his temporary layout at home is all Lionel S FasTrack, with one turnout for a siding. He volunteered that the loco s really noisy when passing over the turnout. After looking at the tiny rollers, I am guessing that they are the source of the noise when going through the turnout. Correct me if I’m wrong, but don’t the FastTrack turnouts have a set of 3 points, two at the entrance to the turnout, with a third in the frog, essentially making it operate as a closed frog with no gaps for the roller to drop into? If that’s the case, why is it so noisy going through the turnout. After seeing the too-small rollers in person, I am convinced that they will cause problems in a turnout, especially ones with conventional open frog design, snagging as the go over the unavoidable gaps in the frog. I also do not like the fact that this model has all eight wheels equipped with traction tires, which will require frequent replacing as they age and loosen up. There is no good need for so many rubber tires on a loco, especially a switcher. I much prefer my American Models switcher even though it has it’s own issues (at least traction tires aren’t part of its problems!).
I hope everyone enjoys their new AF Baldwin switchers, and while they do look to be improved over earlier issues, I’m glad I didn’t order one myself.
Bill in FtL
I'm currently looking over the FC Baldwin and will post about it later, but I'm going to sidetrack a little here and address Bill's comments:
Yes, the rollers will make things nosier when crossing switches. The points and frogs are essentially "broken rail" and not a solid section. My scale trains are also sound nosier when crossing switches. It's the nature of the beast.
Here's a photo of the SHS switch frogs, of which the Lionel FasTrack is similar to the redesigned SHS switch.
This is the major source of the noise. As can be seen, there are gaps before and after the frogs and even small gaps on the moving frog point on the right example. Each gap will be a source of extra noise. Add in the fact there will be an adjoining track joint on each side about 5 inches inches away and you get more rail joint noise from wheels and rollers. It becomes like have three 5" straights together instead of one 15" section.
I wasn't able to get a clear shot of the rollers over the frogs, but admittedly the rollers will have a rougher transit over the original SHS design than the moving point used later by SHS and Lionel. The rollers will cross, but not drop into the frog on the original design.
Now, both designs can be silenced somewhat if a small piece of plastic is glued into the gaps on either side of the frog, but the noise generated through the frog points will still exist. Again, the nature of the beast. Even the prototype is louder when crossing switches.
As to the rollers themselves, well I would prefer they not be the only source of electrical pick-up. I would prefer that would augment wheel pick-up like the old Gilbert Flyer, but unfortuanely I don't think Lionel's going to go through the added expense of going back to the old method.
Rusty
Rusty!
I am excited to see your review. Do you think you will get it up today???
Ben
NotInWI posted:Rusty!
I am excited to see your review. Do you think you will get it up today???
Ben
If not today, tomorrow for sure. I'll be posting it in this thread.
Rusty
Good points of view and reviews.
PS The Berkshire manual on page 15 also provides incorrect volume control directions. Correct: Hold down the cab chat/shift button while turning the throttle knob to desired volume. Not the bell and whistle buttons at the same time for 3 seconds or more. All that did for me was simultaneously sound the whiste and bell. Learned this from watching an AF Berkshire YouTube video kindly posted by a train club. Or, of course, use the LionChief app which I think is terrific with the additional functions and adjustments that you can access with it.
I do not feel the small roller pickups will cause any operating problems. I do not have a Baldwin but do have a GP7 with those rollers. A picture is below. Also I included pictures of a narrow angle crossing where one of the turntable leads crosses a main line. The final picture is of one of my turnouts. None of these cause any problems for the small rollers on the GP7.
NotInWI posted:My son running the C&NW with the IPad.
I was disappointed with last years flyerchief GP7. The Baldwin blows it away.
Ben
Ben,
The Baldwin looks and sounds great. But I have one of the Geeps from last year (UP) and it performs great too. I cannot see or hear any difference. And my 7 year old grandson loves it, especially with the Flyer Chief controller. For him, it's tied with the Polar Express, and that one was in a movie
And the Bluetooth option is kind of cool to me. It give you more flexibility in adjusting any functions.
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