Anyone else surprised/disappointed by the color of MTH’s Canadian Pacific Military Heritage engine?

It's not that easy to compare the pics with the catalog.  Do you have a side pic of your engine without the foam inserts that's similar to the catalog pic?

It is also on the wrong prototype.

- Crank

Mike,

The CP site states "CP 6644 wears the camouflage colours applied to Royal Canadian Air Force "Spitfire" fighter planes flown at the Allied invasion of Normandy, France, on June 6, 1944." The picture of the actual engine at their site (below) shows the drab green.

Frankly, I would try to return the engine to the seller especially if you were planning to have this engine lead other drab-green military cars in your collection. Your engine doesn't look like the one in the catalog nor the one in real life!

Wow, usually I see people complain about something that’s a shade or less off. This is not even in the ballpark.

The shade of green used by MTH is like 'FURX' green

Are u sure this isn't a lionel engine?  With that big a goof in color.

Yes it's usually a Lionel goof but this time the other guy did it. Quite unusual for them.

OMG, imagine how the olive drab CP 7020 Army green would have looked if MTH had made that one!!!  This is a really _bad_ outcome with the 6644 D-Day unit.  How disappointing to have ruined a beautiful paint scheme for those of us willing to shell out nearly $500 bucks for this particular CP engine knowing that it isn't the right prototype model (SD70ACe instead of the SD70ACU (SD90MAC rebuild).     These should be recalled immediately by MTH and repainted correctly to the colors that properly honour the D-Day veterans as CP intended and that we buyers wanted and expected.

Photo is from CPR.ca Media page of public use images

That's truly an awful color. 

It’s off a lot.  I would give the same advice to return it or see if MTH is going to address the issue. Unfortunately with their “closure” there may be no fixing it.

Just shows that it can happen to anyone. What the response from MTH is will be the telling part of this thread. This is a rare color mistake from MTH.

Looks like more of a lawn service tribute to me.

If the RCAF aircraft had been painted that bright green during the war I believe they would have been sitting ducks for anti-aircraft fire.  

Uh oh, looks like these were subbed out to the painters at the Lionel factory.

Just have Harry Heike weather it, you'll never notice.

@EMD posted:

The shade of green used by MTH is like 'FURX' green

Good observation.  Here’s the FURX green for comparison.

That color doesn't come close to what I ordered. Thanks Mike for the photos!

I have one of these on order & will be contacting my dealer today. My desire for this engine just evaporated.

What is interesting is that MTH has done such a great job with its other military paint schemes.

Just a heads up for those who ordered this.  MTH does not plan to correct the color.

I saw the real one 2 weeks ago in Unionville OH leading CSX eastbound intermodal Q166. Yes, that color on the MTH model is way off on that camo green. Also, 6644 is an SD70ACU which MTH should of put the paint on an SD80MAC or SD9043MAC mold to at least give the same type of design.

Got mine, also not happy with the green.  How does one go about contacting MTH to say something about it?  If they will take them back to repaint, or do a shell swap for the right color, I'm all for it, as long as I can see an example of the repaint first (Don't want it to come back looking even worse.).  If they will only do refunds, then I'm keeping it as I'd rather have one with the wrong colors over not having one at all.

@mike.caruso posted:

Just a heads up for those who ordered this.  MTH does not plan to correct the color.

Hey Mike, would you elaborate on the source of this info?  Was it a 'no' from someone who was actually empowered to say 'yes' ?

I sure wish the community could raise enough concern that MTH would actually give buyers the outcome they deserve.   Sad way to exit the business by leaving a bad taste with the customer... 

Bryan

Heard this from a major MTH dealer and Forum sponsor.

@Wrawroacx posted:

I saw the real one 2 weeks ago in Unionville OH leading CSX eastbound intermodal Q166. Yes, that color on the MTH model is way off on that camo green. Also, 6644 is an SD70ACU which MTH should of put the paint on an SD80MAC or SD9043MAC mold to at least give the same type of design.

Now I feel even worse.  LOL  what a shame, the real thing looks so awesome.  

@sinclair posted:

Got mine, also not happy with the green.  How does one go about contacting MTH to say something about it?

Hopefully MTH is monitoring their specific forum here on OGR and will respond.      Hullooo...Andy?  Rich?  Mike???

If they will take them back to repaint, or do a shell swap for the right color, I'm all for it, as long as I can see an example of the repaint first (Don't want it to come back looking even worse.).  If they will only do refunds, then I'm keeping it as I'd rather have one with the wrong colors over not having one at all.

@mike.caruso posted:

Heard this from a major MTH dealer and Forum sponsor.

Maybe if dealers would raise the issue loudly enough as well, perhaps an empowered 'yes' decision maker _at_ MTH can act.

@RidgeRunner posted:

Maybe if dealers would raise the issue loudly enough as well, perhaps an empowered 'yes' decision maker _at_ MTH can act.

Problem you have now is no one knows who will be in charge of MTH or it's released products much longer.  A new entity or MTH in some form?

@MartyE posted:

Problem you have now is no one knows who will be in charge of MTH or it's released products much longer.  A new entity or MTH in some form?

No one in charge?

I contacted my dealer ( Mr. Muffin), as I was considering exchanging this model for one of the other CP military units. Unfortunately all of the other models are sold out, and given that the tooling has been sold to Atlas, the chance of a replacement shell is zero. I believe this is a situation of take it or leave it.

The model's paint scheme looks more like a target than camouflage.

@rthomps posted:

No one in charge?

Yep.  Who will be dealing with it (although previous poster said MTH is not) so that put it to bed.  It is what it is.

@mike.caruso posted:

Now I feel even worse.  LOL  what a shame, the real thing looks so awesome.  

Mike - I have another question for you and/or anyone else who has received this particular MTH engine.

Does the horn on it sound anything like the horn on the Real McCoy shown/heard on your video?

Unfortunately I can't answer that.  I wanted to keep this as "new" as possible because I had a strong feeling I was going to return it.  So I never placed it on tracks, never removed any of the Styrofoam protectants, etc.  All I did was open the box, unwrap the cellophane, and then re-pack it.  

@MartyE posted:

Yep.  Who will be dealing with it (although previous poster said MTH is not) so that put it to bed.  It is what it is.

Here's what it is...

Wow!  That's awful!  And, what an awful outcome that you really have no recourse. 

I like the idea to have it weathered, and heavily!  I would do that if I were in your shoes.

Wow, what do you know, Quality Control first to go. Seems this was mentioned in another thread about the MTH products follow on and service after the "MTH Tooling acquisition".

This may be a little off target and not of much help, but with or without the invasion stripes, I believe the colors as applied by CP and shown in the MTH promo artwork constitute what the RAF called its Temperate Land Scheme camouflage pattern. If you watch the engine fade away against the winter trees in Wrawroacx's  video posted above, you can get a feel for how effective it may have been. And if you watch the trailing green containers, you can see how intemperate the MTH model's colors would have been.

- Mike

@mike.caruso posted:

Just a heads up for those who ordered this.  MTH does not plan to correct the color.

What a hideous locomotive! It looks like a Saint Patrick's day tribute. I think customers have every right to cancel these orders when it is such a strong deviation from the catalog, much less a deviation from reality!

MTH will not fix these because it would be difficult to do so when you no longer exist.  These are strong candidates for the repaint industry.

@RickO posted:

Uh oh, looks like these were subbed out to the painters at the Lionel factory.

Just have Harry Heike weather it, you'll never notice.

Ah...I think MTH owns this... 100%, at least for the next 8 weeks.

Paint the invasion stripes pink and yellow and it call it The Easter Bunny Express. What a disgrace to the veterans it is supposed to honor.

If this is the worst thing that happens to you in 2021, consider some of the alternatives .  Stuff happens.  Keep it, have it repainted or discuss options with your dealer.  Obviously some folks actually like it or will keep it for various reasons. Perhaps your dealer knows someone who wants one?  Or sell it on the Bay, as MTH stuff seems in demand due to panic buying right now.  Not perfect solutions, but some options that come to mind.

@Mike Casatelli posted:

This may be a little off target and not of much help, but with or without the invasion stripes, I believe the colors as applied by CP and shown in the MTH promo artwork constitute what the RAF called its Temperate Land Scheme camouflage pattern. If you watch the engine fade away against the winter trees in Wrawroacx's  video posted above, you can get a feel for how effective it may have been. And if you watch the trailing green containers, you can see how intemperate the MTH model's colors would have been.

- Mike

FWIW, the Canadian Pacific's book "Proud Colours" (by Adam Meeks) notes the Royal Canadian Air Force used the Spitfire as their primary fighter.   From page 68,

"The paint scheme for the World War II locomotive was based heavily on the camouflage patterns applied to Spitfires in the latter half of the Second World War.  After employing green and brown shades for the early part of the conflict, the colours were adjusted in 1942 to the iconic green and gray liveries that the planes wore for the duration of their services lives.  CP's team worked diligently to ensure that the RAF Ocean Gray and RAF green paints used on the locomotive were faithful to the original colours used during World War II.  The black and white striping matches the 18" widths specified for Allied fighter aircraft during the Normandy invasion, and safety appliances on the locomotive were painted RAF Roundel Yellow to echo the accents on the leading edges of Spitfire wings.  The road numbers and class data were rendered in WWII-era RAF standard font, and the locomotive received a unique identifier - CP 6644.  Numbered for the 6th day of the 6th month of 1944, the locomotive is literally in a class of her own."

Sadly, there was not similar diligence to the faithfulness of the original colours for this $500 version.

@RickO posted:

Uh oh, looks like these were subbed out to the painters at the Lionel factory.

Just have Harry Heike weather it, you'll never notice.

RickO - Nah, I tend to think that given Lionel's recent quality control issues, MTH would not have subbed out these engines to the painters at the Lionel factory.  Instead my guess is that the same firm that did MTH's 'FURX' engine did THESE engines too, and decided to use the leftover paint from the previous run.  Either that or there was a paint sale over there.  

Hard to believe it was as simple as a paint code issue/mistake.

Anyone wonder what the CP's take on this would be?

@Rail Dude posted:

Hard to believe it was as simple as a paint code issue/mistake.

Anyone wonder what the CP's take on this would be?

I’m not trying to be smug in any way, but I have to imagine that the shade of green of an Oscale engine from a dying Oscale company registers on exactly zero radars at Canadian Pacific.

As to the model, it seems like a great candidate for a future release from Atlas or Lionel. It may be worth throwing this fish back and trying to hook one later if one them get the colors right.

@Rider Sandman posted:

I’m not trying to be smug in any way, but I have to imagine that the shade of green of an Oscale engine from a dying Oscale company registers on exactly zero radars at Canadian Pacific.

As to the model, it seems like a great candidate for a future release from Atlas or Lionel. It may be worth throwing this fish back and trying to hook one later if one them get the colors right.

I aggree. It is likely that CP will not allow MTH to catalog any of their locomotives in future MTH catalogs.  😏

@Rail Dude posted:

Hard to believe it was as simple as a paint code issue/mistake.

Anyone wonder what the CP's take on this would be?

About the same as the UP and BNSF for all the fantasy paint jobs Lionel has put on locomotives...

Rusty

@Rusty Traque posted:

About the same as the UP and BNSF for all the fantasy paint jobs Lionel has put on locomotives...

Rusty

I'm sure CP is fine with "non-prototypical" paint schemes from any O gauge manufacture, as long as the paint job doesn't look like it was done with a florescent highlighter! 

But in this case we aren't talking about a "fantasy" locomotive...

Yes I have bought this engine also and after I received it was also outraged by both the green and the grey colours they used. Both colours are to light.  It is almost the same as MTH used on the first release of the CNR 6060 steam loco green. It was also way to bright with the colour corrected on later releases. They also did not fade the edges of the camouflage like on the real engine. Almost like they rushed this through production, because the other 3 releases are perfect except for them being on the wrong engine chassis. I through my MTH dealer sent MTH all the info they needed, stressing that they are built on SD9043 chassis and should be using those molds. A quick cash grab by MTH on a hi demand engine paint scheme.
  I don't believe Atlas will be making these at all because they generally build Canadian Pacific engines very accurately, and I don't think they purchased the SD9043 molds from MTH. If they were to continue on the SD70ACe chassis it would be in the trainman line if at all. So Lionel is our only hope , and the CP heritage ones in the last catalog were even stated as fantasy engines by Lionel. the road numbers are totally made up.

On the commentary about Atlas, I hope they are watching. I assumed (incorrectly) that Atlas could start producing at the MTH factory with little to no concern. That is, they could simply do marketing and sales of products produced from the MTH tooling at the MTH factory. NOT!

This will be a stain on the MTH legacy, if MTH does not step up to the plate and make this right.

As posted on this forum, I've seen a number of bad paint reproductions from Lionel, but this one takes the cake. Worst ever!

Count me in as one of those who has made the biggest MTH (and overall model train) purchase blunder ever. I jumped through a few hoops to get a line on what I thought would be the most attractive of the Military tribute engines, after promising myself I would never buy another MTH Product from a company closing up shop.

Mine has yet to arrive but these pictures are absolutely heartbreaking. What a disaster. I should have listened to my heart in the first place. $600 US down the train! Arghhh !!

@Kyle Miller posted:

Count me in as one of those who has made the biggest MTH (and overall model train) purchase blunder ever. I jumped through a few hoops to get a line on what I thought would be the most attractive of the Military tribute engines, after promising myself I would never buy another MTH Product from a company closing up shop.

Mine has yet to arrive but these pictures are absolutely heartbreaking. What a disaster. I should have listened to my heart in the first place. $600 US down the train! Arghhh !!

Return it and get your money back. You shouldn’t have to pay for something that is so incorrect. We all deal with some issues with small paint discrepancies to get the models we want but this is a big blunder. You shouldn’t accept it if it bothers you.

Thanks @MartyE

Adding further injury to my tale of woe is I'm in Canada, unable to cross the border to pick it up, so  I've had to pay international shipping then import taxes on this thing. Sending it back will be another $70 USD, probably making it $300 extra just for me to open the box long enough to choke on it before sending it back. I'd best head up to the beer store for a 6-pack to drown by sorrows and wash away this pain! I love this hobby

Kyle Miller - Been there with you buddy, both living in Canada and heading for the beer store - that is.  Hang in there, eh!

@Kyle Miller posted:

Mine has yet to arrive but these pictures are absolutely heartbreaking. What a disaster. I should have listened to my heart in the first place. $600 US down the train! Arghhh !!

It's not a total loss.  You'll still have a working engine (hopefully).  If it bothers you that much, I suppose you can try to get it repainted.

I did keep the one i purchased, in case there will be no others. If a better one is made down the road, Ill sell this one. Repainting it would be pretty difficult because of all the little decals.

@Wrawroacx posted:

I saw the real one 2 weeks ago in Unionville OH leading CSX eastbound intermodal Q166. Yes, that color on the MTH model is way off on that camo green. Also, 6644 is an SD70ACU which MTH should of put the paint on an SD80MAC or SD9043MAC mold to at least give the same type of design.

Great photo and video Tom. 🤓

I imagine she's really busy like always, but Christine Braden may be worth a shot to contact in order to correct the paint.

Or we can add a Canadian Pacific military tribute locomotive with correct paint to the ever growing “Lionel next catalog wish list” thread. As a military veteran and Canadian Pacific fan, I would love to have this locomotive!

@GenesisFan99 posted:

I imagine she's really busy like always, but Christine Braden may be worth a shot to contact in order to correct the paint.

Great idea Gary.

Thanks Gary, Dallas,

Can anyone enlighten me, Christine Braden's role and or position at MTH ? Looking for any help or at least an honest answer )

@Kyle Miller posted:

Thanks Gary, Dallas,

Can anyone enlighten me, Christine Braden's role and or position at MTH ? Looking for any help or at least an honest answer )

None. Is a great custom painter.

OK folks, here's the first sneak peek of my new Engine, it's beautiful in it's own right, but that green looks NOTHING like the real thing. Argh.

I initially was kicking myself (very hard I might add) for not pre-ordering one.

However, this paint fiasco and MTH saying "tough noogies" when asked about them taking the shells back for a repaint, proved that lady luck was on my side. I hope the new owner of the mold or the primary  competitor will make a correct version.

Bryce

@Kyle Miller posted:

OK folks, here's the first sneak peek of my new Engine, it's beautiful in it's own right, but that green looks NOTHING like the real thing. Argh.

Well, for what it’s worth, I can barely see the locomotive from the scenic backdrop. The camouflage works!

That's a shame. I passed on buying one mostly because of the incorrect body. I do hope Lionel will take a shot at making them and use the SD90MAC long hood with the SD70ACe cab (and the correct paint!).

Rob

MTH should have offered a different shell, like your other CP.

My heart sank like a stone when I received mine! I jumped through hoops to get one at the last minute, deliberately chose the Military Heritage scheme. And then waited anxiously to see it. The shock of seeing the St. Paddy's Day Lime Rickey express instead was traumatic. Yikes.

Yes, I too am incredibly disappointed in the model!  But, when has MTH as a company producing O-Scale ever cared about making things right?

Soooooo...MTH has announced the Canadian Pacific Military Heritage engines will be issued in RailKing Imperial.  Caveat emptor. 

Just the luck of the Premier buyers, the Imperial D-Day 6644 comes out in the correct green. 

RailKing Canadian Pacific "Military" SD70ACe Diesel Locomotives Announced | MTH ELECTRIC TRAINS (mthtrains.com)

The idea of a camo paint job is to blend into the surroundings, not to make it easy to spot from a passing airliner. I usually don't fret over stuff but this one is almost comical.

Good grief.  Even the new 30-20945-1 Imperial art presentation is the _wrong_ green.  In a twisted sense of humour, this art is dang close to the horrible Premier version as delivered. 

For comparison, here's the 2020 v2 20-21499-1 correct art that made customers believe.    Caveat emptor. 

Wow, I thought only Lionel made that kind of painting error!

What is it with paint that they get it so wrong?

Look at the bright side, it might arrive before the St Patty's Day layout goes up!

My goodness! Maybe the strategy this time is to show artwork so completely off the mark the real production item can't possibly be as bad! Or maybe they've decided the Railking version should match the Premier edition debacle! I thought the same thing - this colour is a Train Wreck too. Thanks @Ridgerunner for reminding us what it was supposed to look like )

I originally wanted one of these.  Looking at the miss on the color, not even close, I am glad I missed out.  Maybe this will be re-run by Atlas.  One dealer I talked had suggested that to them already and getting it right.

John

MTH Amtrak F40PH 20-20682: Amtrak Blue Does Not Match Previous Amtrak Diesels, Cars, etc. | O Gauge Railroading On Line Forum (ogaugerr.com)

@RidgeRunner posted:

Good grief.  Even the new 30-20945-1 Imperial art presentation is the _wrong_ green.  In a twisted sense of humour, this art is dang close to the horrible Premier version as delivered. 

For comparison, here's the 2020 v2 20-21499-1 correct art that made customers believe.    Caveat emptor. 

Maybe a social faux pas to reply to one's own comment, but WTH...  For the Imperial buyers, it looks like MTH did the new 30-20945-1 in more correct paint.  Congratulations to these buyers and a sigh of welcome relief for them for sure.  Mr. Muffin provides the following photo in his 3/26/21 email.

Credit Steve Nelson aka MrMuffin

I should let this go, but dang, it sure would show some respect toward the Premier buyers if RF and MTH hooked up with Atlas to produce similar correctly painted Premier 6644 replacement shells for the infamous 20-21499-1 model.  

My goodness, nice to see the proper colours in place for the RailKing engine.

I can't let it go either - the paint job on the original is a disaster and there's NO WAY that should have made it through to production.

I for one would gladly trade in my Lime Green Premier version shell, and pay for a replacement shell if it could ever happen. PLEASE Atlas and MTH - make it right !

Shame on MTH for not correcting the Premier version. Good to see that they got the RK version right.

MTH ain't the only ones missing on the correct paint colors. I ordered this bad boy expecting the color to be like the first picture and when it arrived.... well, you can see. It's not terrible but it's not what I expected. 1st picture Lionel catalog, 2nd picture courtesy of Mr. Muffins trains website.

MTH is usually not too bad with color choices, at least they corrected their mistake with the Rail King version.

This is the kind of botched paint scheme I would expect to see with Lionel.

@Cogen1981 posted:

MTH is usually not too bad with color choices, at least they corrected their mistake with the Rail King version.

This is the kind of botched paint scheme I would expect to see with Lionel.

This is MTH’s error. Lionel had nothing to do with it. “What-aboutisms” ranks right up there with the my dog ate my homework excuse.

@Madockawando posted:

This is MTH’s error. Lionel had nothing to do with it. “What-aboutisms” ranks right up there with the my dog ate my homework excuse.

Ahhh...the camel's nose is under the tent...

@RidgeRunner posted:

Ahhh...the camel's nose...

Yeah that kind of happens when someone throws in a gratuitous dig at Lionel in an MTH thread. An unforced error on their part.

@Madockawando posted:

Yeah that kind of happens when someone throws in a gratuitous dig at Lionel in an MTH thread. An unforced error on their part.

Relax...

This defensive behavior is weird

Anyone who is familiar with this hobby knows Lionel is synomous with paint color problem, so it's relevant to the topic

@Cogen1981 posted:

Relax...

This defensive behavior is weird

Anyone who is familiar with this hobby knows Lionel is synomous with paint color problem, so it's relevant to the topic

Doubling down doesn’t correct the first error, nor does make Lionel responsible for MTH’s paint problems. I didn’t bring Lionel into this thread

@Madockawando posted:

Doubling down doesn’t correct the first error, nor does make Lionel responsible for MTH’s paint problems. I didn’t bring Lionel into this thread

Camel noses, mad ducks, I must've hit a nerve...

This is true, you did not bring Lionel into this thread, nor did you bring any interesting or contrasting points of view either. This was not a dig against Lionel, just an attempt to show how quality control has fallen across the spectrum.

@Rail Dude posted:

Camel noses, mad ducks, I must've hit a nerve...

This is true, you did not bring Lionel into this thread, nor did you bring any interesting or contrasting points of view either. This was not a dig against Lionel, just an attempt to show how quality control has fallen across the spectrum.

Well since YOU want to talk about Lionel let’s talk about Lionel. I have a couple of the Lionel Legacy CP military themed locomotives on order. Can’t wait to get them. No doubt Lionel will do these locomotives right: they will look great and will be fun to run with the Lionel Legacy system. I have been collecting Canadian themed rolling stock from Lionel, Atlas, and MTH to pull behind them.

When the Lionel CP locomotives arrive I will be sure to post a review here with pictures.😉

Now, now you guys; as my mom used to say: "fight nice..."

Mark in Oregon

I’d send that thing back to the Incredible Hulk or whoever sold it.

Return it to the dealer and get your money back.  That will make the dealers more likely to influence MTH to get it right next time and you have no obligation to spend your hard earned money on something that is not what was represented.  

If the dealer gives you a problem about the return, don’t do business with them anymore and make a complaint with your credit card company.  Generally, unless you have bad credit or regularly make such disputes, they will give you your money back.  Have photos of the original catalog art and the delivered product ready, as well as some photos of the real thing.  Some difference in shade is probably unavoidable, but you are not being unreasonable here - that locomotive looks like it is painted for the St. Patty’s Day parade, and that is a good thing in terms of making it easier for you to show how different it is from what was advertised.  If the difference were less noticeable, it would be harder for you to make the argument to a train-layman.

Good luck.

@Madockawando posted:

This is MTH’s error. Lionel had nothing to do with it. “What-aboutisms” ranks right up there with the my dog ate my homework excuse.

As the owner of Lionel's Navy Blue T&P F units, their Santa Fe Alco PA's with F unit Warbonnet striping and their Pennsylvania J1 with a bad sounding whistle it doesn't matter if all their other products may have been perfect when the ones we wanted were not.

@Ray Lombardo posted:

If the dealer gives you a problem about the return, don’t do business with them anymore and make a complaint with your credit card company.  

Ray,

I ran into this problem with a preordered BTO item which was painted neon red. The dealer had a 14 day return policy and they still gave me a hard time returning the item when I mentioned paint color.

His response was "we have no control over paint color"

I had to show the retailer the written return policy on the receipt before he gave in, and allowed an exchange for store credit

I will not mention the retailer, but he is a very big one. This experience has really deterred me from new purchases from this vendor or manufacture.

I too was surprised by MTH's miss on these units.  A betting man though would put his money on MTH's color choices over Lionel's any day of the week.

@MichRR714 posted:

I too was surprised by MTH's miss on these units.  A betting man though would put his money on MTH's color choices over Lionel's any day of the week.

When the Lionel versions of these CP locomotives come in it will be interesting to to have a side by side comparison.  In fact, it seems like lots of people are certainly demanding for a side by side comparison.

As for Lionel's color problems, a few months ago someone started a thread complaining loudly about the colors of an RS-11 CV Legacy locomotive. There was great laminations and breast beating over it. I ( and others) offered to purchase the locomotive at the price it was purchased at. No sale. When it came right down to it, the owner of the offending Lionel RS-11 locomotive would rather continue to have his retinas burned by the horrible paint scheme then get his money back.  If Lionel's paint was so bad, why did other hobbyists jump at the chance to purchase it and if it was so bad why did the owner insist on keeping it?

As for the MTH CP locomotives is anyone interested in purchasing them from the offended owner?

@Cogen1981 posted:

Ray,

I ran into this problem with a preordered BTO item which was painted neon red. The dealer had a 14 day return policy and they still gave me a hard time returning the item when I mentioned paint color.

His response was "we have no control over paint color"

I had to show the retailer the written return policy on the receipt before he gave in, and allowed an exchange for store credit

I will not mention the retailer, but he is a very big one. This experience has really deterred me from new purchases from this vendor or manufacture.

What did you do with the locomotive?

@mike.caruso posted:

I received the Canadian Pacific SD70ACe military tribute diesel today.  Does anyone else have this yet?  I’m very surprised at the huge discrepancy between the model as depicted in the catalog and what they ended up producing.  

Here's what the catalog showed.

Here's what UPS delivered an hour ago.  I know that catalog photos may not be a 100% true representation of the colors in the final product.  But to me this isn’t even close!  LOL    This looks more like a tribute to the boys down at O'Malley's on St. Patty's Day than a tribute to the members of the Canadian Armed Forces.  

Who else has ordered this?  Does this look like what you were expecting???

To me it looks like a cartoon version of what was shown in the catalog.

@Madockawando posted:

If Lionel's paint was so bad, why did other hobbyists jump at the chance to purchase it and if it was so bad why did the owner insist on keeping it?

You'd have to ask those folks.  I can only speak for myself and tell you that I've broomed several Lionel mistakes that burned my retinas.  My conversations with other hobbyists confirm that I'm not alone.

@Madockawando posted:

What did you do with the locomotive?

I returned it for store credit,....I said it in my previous post

@Cogen1981 posted:

I returned it for store credit,....I said it in my previous post

Oh Okay. That's good.

Wow, Caruso - That is stunningly bad.  Sure as heck isn't olive green.  Good luck with all that.