Buying on Ebay

It's tough at non-TCA meets where the buyers have little or no recourse.   I was burned once a long time ago on an accessory and now do the following:

1) If the vendor is not a dealer with a brick and mortar store who's website you can visit to verify services, don't purchase engines or operating items unless a test track is available which is DCS or Legacy equipped (if needed for engines/operating items).

2) Even if a box is marked "New" or a vendor tells you an item is "New" ask to open the box to inspect the item.  I had an experience even at York of someone misrepresenting an item. 

Ebay, in my experience,  is good at protecting buyers if an item is misrepresented.  It may take 6 weeks but you will get your money refunded.

-Greg

The train shows in my Cincinnati, Ohio area are put on by the NMRA and they always have a test track for all gauges so the item can be tested before purchase.

Love ebay: have probably made 75 purchases in the last year or two with one bad one and ebay had seller refund my money.

I've seen some sellers on ebay say 'no refunds': unless it says 'for parts only', ebay will get your money back in 99 44/100% of the cases.  Ebay is anal on protecting the buyer.

Just received a Premiere UP sd70ace from a 100% rating seller from ebay...exc price and the item was perfect. Most of my purchases are from forum members though

You run a risk buying from anyone. I laugh at anyone who thinks otherwise.

Ebay does well for the buyer.

I would only ever buy a locomotive* from one of two vendors I've bought from in the past who sell new stuff in the box. Rolling stock, I can fix if something is bad, but that hasn't happened either (with On30 stuff, things don't break so easy as in some other scales).

*I'm not a collector so I have all the locomotives I'll probably ever need, can't imagine ever buying another unless someone makes a On30 Army Baldwin 2-8-2 someday...

That said, I feel more comfortable buying from Ebay sellers than I do from sellers at train meets.  What recourse do I have if I buy something from a train meet seller who either sold me a bad product unknowingly or who's intention it was to make a fast buck never to be seen again ?.  


When I buy or sell at a train show, everything is "AS IS".
Carefully look over the item before purchasing.
The shows in my area have a test track, try the train before buying.

C W Burfle posted:

That said, I feel more comfortable buying from Ebay sellers than I do from sellers at train meets.  What recourse do I have if I buy something from a train meet seller who either sold me a bad product unknowingly or who's intention it was to make a fast buck never to be seen again ?.  


When I buy or sell at a train show, everything is "AS IS".
Carefully look over the item before purchasing.
The shows in my area have a test track, try the train before buying.

Yep, it's not WalMart, people.

Want to be sure you got something that runs well and has assurances attached? Buy it new from a brick and mortar vendor or hobby shop!

My eBay account was hacked, so I closed it. I buy much less there anyway and when I do, its as a guest. I go to Amazon, because its faster if I do not have time. And I am not concerned about feed back. But, I shop LHS's to support them if its more leisurely.  I like options depending on my needs. In SE PA there are several excellent hobby shops.

Mark

For an Australian who models in USA O Scale ebay is great it's really helped me, all the same there are some very good hobby shops in  America to.

But it's the same old story.....

There are ebay sellers who won't sell overseas and there are American Hobby shops that won't sell overseas that's my main gripe, it's very frustrating when you want to buy something and they won't ship overseas.

Getting an inferior product or losing an item is the least of my worries. Roo.

Everyone has a different view of fleabay.  I got screwed big time on fleabay and the guy was an OGR forum member.  I feel very safe buying and selling on the OGR forum.  Never had a bad deal.  My situation as both a LIONEL and MTH tech is I get many calls from people from everywhere asking me to fix the train they got from fleabay.  I flat refuse and that has not made me popular with many.   I have seen horror stories and those problems the bargain hunter ends up with are not going to be my problems.  Yes, some good deals have been scored.   I get many of these calls.  I am aware of the many reasons why people use fleabay.  I am talking about locomotives and nothing else.  If you buy a locomotive with modern electronics and do not know what you are doing, you will pay somebody decent money to hopefully fix them.  

This is a good time for post war guys to buy trains.  They do not have to worry a lot as anyone can fix those trains.  For those buyers, fleabay is a good resource to built a collection.  I do not look for work off the forum but like to run my add to buy inoperative shelf queens.  Any trains I do sell (modern electronics) have been fully gone through by me and I stand behind them.   I wish everyone good luck wherever they buy trains.  

I have been using ebay for 18 years. Most of my collection was purchased off eBay used. Most items I have were made 5-115 years ago and can not be found in the dealer stores. Out of my entire collection I have only had 2 items that I got screwed on. They were easy fixes but received not as described. I have been screwed here on the form before by a fake member and I lost 400$ out of it. I am weary now when purchasing items here on the form.

I have had similar good experiences. I have been on eBay for 20 years now (wow). Was a vary early adopter. Have had thousands of transactions and with enough persistence have gotten satisfaction virtually every time. Just be sure you understand what you are buying. I have goofed a few times by not carefully studying the photos and descriptions 

We all go off our own experiences, but I haven't found buying on ebay to be any different than buying from dealers or from people here on the forum. I've had good deals from all and things that have gone wrong with each.  Some of it is crappy product from the manufacturer, but it is disappointing when a seller misrepresents something - everything sold these days seems to be new old stock or brand new in a box or only taken out of the box for photos. All a bunch of baloney. Still, I as a buyer know this whether I want to admit it to myself or not, and so I take the risk. Caveat emptor, as they say, or rather said. Latin is dead, right?

As to buying from forum sellers being safe, as if we are all in some kind of brotherhood, I purchased 2 items in the last year that came to me broken. And I'm not talking about poorly packed, but broken. I also saw an engine for sale earlier in the year where when I did a Google search to find out more about the model, one of the search results was an earlier post to the forum where the same seller was asking a question about problems he had with the engine. Of course, when it was posted for sale - no mention of the problems but the usual "great runner" banner. 

It's a function of people's integrity which I would bet if you could measure it across selling platforms wouldn't differ from one to another. Some good guys in this world, and some not so good.

Personally I think Ebay is phenomenal. I can peruse items 24/7 and not have to attend any train shows. One thing I dislike is driving to a train show, finding a place to park, pay the admission fee, look through table after table and not find what I am looking for, yet leave empty handed. The last one I went to was a few years back when I was in my early 50's and boy did I feel young!!

Just about all of my purchases were great buys, only a few did I have to send back after it stated no returns due to a mechanical problem not specified in the auction. One thing that I do look for is that they say "tested", or "works as it should".  If you find an item that says "needs a cleaning", "needs TLC" or "not tested", it's best to move on. Sooner or later I will find pretty much what I've been looking for, then of course I'm not really picky. If it has a few scratches or other imperfections I'll still buy it as long as I don't have to return to Ebay and end up buying another part just to return it to operational condition.

MARTY FITZHENRY brought up a very good point.   I believe that buying post-war stuff, from Ebay sellers, is alot safer than buying modern stuff that has electronics inside.  

As BRUK posted, buying from fellow forum members can be risky.  I was disappointed with a purchase I made from a forum member.  I was able to salvage the item however with a bit of work.  

LENNY THE LION pointed out that browsing train meets can be frustrating.  Back in the day, when train meets were pretty much the only way to get a hold of post-war stuff, we were limited to meets and hobby shops that sold used trains.  In those days I found train meets were the better of the two.   Now days I can sit and browse thousands of items, ask questions and take my sweet loving time, to a limit, making my decision.  And as Lenny pointed out, I'm not 50 any more.  

Some ebay sellers will post a Youtube video of what their selling to showing it performs well through all it's functions. I admire a seller who takes it to the next level to remove some of the fear in purchasing on line.

I have bought engines on EBay and haven't had any problems yet. But what gets me is people wanting new price on ps-1 engines and zw transformers that are to high in my opinion. I have also noticed most of these items are not selling. Point is buy at your price or move on.

I have bought a lot of trains from eBay for years. Once I made a mistake and won some slot car track clips that I could not use. The seller was a nice guy and allowed me to return them. Then PayPal was slow to refund me and he intervened and got them to refund.

I won't buy anything with modern electronics on ebay. Period. This year I've bought 3 sets of passenger cars (2 K-Line and one Phoenix) and have had no problems. I also bought a prewar Standard Gauge loco; it was well-represented by the seller, and everything worked out. 

John

eBay is great site to find an item and the choice can not be beat.  But it often will result in a high price due to many buyers bidding on that item plus postage.  If you are fine with the price you get with "Buy it Now" or price you bid and win and with the shipping cost, Great.  The buyer often does not pay sales tax also.

eBay is best for the sellers.  They can set their price or open for bids and normally have many bids to ensure getting the best selling price via the auction.  Then the seller gets the buyer to pay for packing and shipping. 

For the best price one can not beat a train meet unless you luck into a garage sale with an uniformed seller.  Finding trains at garage sales has gotten rare in most places now days.  The choices will be limited to few items and may take lots of effort going to meets or garage sales but some low prices are sometimes found.  Best item choices are had when arriving early and being first to see and grab the item.  Often best prices are the last day and/or last hour of the show where often some sellers will take a lower than desired price rather than take the item home.  I have seen it happen to others and myself.

Charlie

I have been buying on Ebay since 2004 and never had a problem. Got quite a few excellent deals too!

Choo Choo Charlie posted:

eBay is great site to find an item.  But it often will result in a high price due to many buyers bidding on that item plus postage.  If you are fine with the price you get with Buy it Now or price you bid and win and with the shipping cost, Great.  The buyer often does not pay sales tax also.

Charlie

I never had any problems with all of my prewar switchers, most of which I bought on eBay, including 1 or 2 basket cases, but I knew the weren't running, so it wasn't a surprise. 

I did buy a Greenberg's Prewar book from a bookstore that used a different picture to sell with, which I thought was misleading (the cover had a crease from top to bottom). The bookstore offered to have me return it for a full refund, but I preferred to keep it and requested an adjustment in price, which didn't work out.

Charlie...I'm sure you would agree that different times of the year can result in higher prices paid. I prefer buying things from January to September. Once you get close to Thanksgiving/Christmas I try to not to find anything...not always successful at that, though! 

Tom 

In general, I have had very good experiences buying on eBay since 2005, mostly 2-rail rolling stock of various kinds, including both fairly expensive brass and inexpensive but nicely built Athearn and All Nation kits. Occasionally I've ended up with a dog, but that was usually because I didn't look carefully enough at the seller's photos. I have had to request a return and refund only a couple of times (successfully on each occasion). I have complete confidence in several well-established sellers, and I take my chances with the others if the item is interesting and the price is right.

Train stuff Ive bought on eBay is generally a little more beat up than I want but not always. Its the 2nd to the last place I look to buy stuff.

I've always had good experiences with E bay.  I've been buying since 2008 0r 9.

Over the last 4 years or so I have bought train stuff at EBay and only had one bad experience when the sender improperly packed passenger cars and they came damaged (couplers came off as well as 1 wheel set). The seller's response was to fix them myself (which I did with cold weld). It was my fault for not getting right back to EBay but the cars (Williams aluminum Santa Fe) were quite nice and the price, not a great bargain, were reasonable). In the future I will contact EBay for any problems and I will continue to look for stuff from them.

John

I've had over 1,500 transactions on eBay since 1997, mostly lower-priced "collectible" items, such as vintage post cards, 1:43 car models, View-Master reels, etc. Only a small % of them needed to work/operate. About 3 times, eBay had to remind the seller to ship the item. The 3 times a low cost item failed to work, I got a replacement without having to return the defective one. Once, about 12 years ago, the seller went belly-up, and I never got the item, but that was a $12. loss.

There is one thing I collect that I have ONLY found on eBay...stereo/3-D photo slides that people took in the 1950s...so eBay has been a blessing in that regard. Also, eBay prices for other items I collect are often 40-60% less than "show" prices (postcard shows, etc.). EBay also gives the collector an array of items to choose from. I'd be lucky to find 1 or 2 old sand pails or cap guns at a flea market or antique mall. On any given day, there are 50-100 on eBay, in varied conditions and pricing.

That being said, I would think twice before I would buy a $800. electric train on eBay. 

I have had my eBay account for more than 20 years, and have bought/sold quite a few trains during this time.

I have bought several engines during this time on eBay, some of which I have never seen at a decent price elsewhere.  I actually prefer e Bay over small local train shows, as I am very selective in what I add to my collection and it saves me a great deal of time.  (Although I will add that I have never yet been to York, which is sad as it less than two hours away!)

I find that the eBay resolution process had greatly improved over the last 3 - 4 years, and my wife an I have occasionally used it for non-train items.  One caveat about the resolution process is don't start it unless you have the item on-hand to return.  I had one item that wasn't as advertised (incomplete) that I could NOT get eBay to extend the item return by even a couple of days.  This was a problem when I sent abroad on a three week trip.

As a seller, I generally will offer items here first.  If they don't sell in a reasonable time, I will move them to eBay (and possibly Craigslist).  As there are no selling fees (thanks OGR!) I can sell the same item here for a little bit less.

Jim

Ordered, many a item on Ebay but I keep away from those who have very little history.  Mostly from the hobby shops that sell on Ebay.  No issues to date.

I guess the good part about being able to deal with the electronics is that given a good enough price, I have no issue with buying on eBay or elsewhere.  If it's at all suspect, I simply discount the price in my mind the cost of the possible replacement parts and make that my limit.  I'd much rather have the electronics defective than get something that's beat up mechanically.

There's the difference, John.  I can deal with and repair most mechanical issues.  Electronics and I are at odds with one another.

Dan, it's not the mechanical repair that's the stumbling block, frequently it's the parts availability in many cases.  Also, significant cosmetic damage to the shell is frequently hard to totally repair without a lot of work and/or expense.

ebay posts and why my train investment is losing money are some of my more favorite posts!!

Love eBay - My approach when it comes to trains - I almost never shop for anything in particular - just look for potential bargains.

Always have a big pile of items in my watch list...win some, lose some.

Gotta cut down on boxcars though! (sure.....)

I actually I have had worse luck at York on big ticket items than on EBay lately.  Being a TCA member / Seller really has no regard if you are going to get a working locomotive or not. And do not rely on test tables at certain halls. They do not have Legacy and DCS command ready tables.

You have to be smart about it. The first year I was taken by one seller and that's all it took. The following year we brought a loop of track and a legacy remote... sure enough 50 percent of my items had to be returned to York sellers that year. Some actually knowingly had repair them and slopped them together for a quick sale....

 Otherwise I would have brought them home and have had to repair them (Some parts are impossible to find as well).

EBay you have to double check on listings, read everything, study the photos, ask questions and if ANY thing looks to good to be true, it usually is. I usually walk away from it.

After more than 18 years buying on eBay, I have few complaints about a wide variety of items I bought, not just trains.

Literally 99 percent of my transactions have been trouble free. That means the items were described accurately, paid for with convenient terms, shipped as quickly as with any other type of dealer, safely packaged and in good working order.

The other 1 percent? I have had only two bad deals that I can recall: One $5 sale (a HeroClix figure) that was never shipped and one altered Lionel MPC locomotive that the dealer claimed ran well in both directions but in reality didn’t run at all. I had to get eBay involved on the second deal because the seller never responded to messages to arrange a return, but it was eventually resolved nonetheless.

In the early days of eBay, circa 2001, before PayPal transactions became the standard for payment, I faced off against one dealer who insisted on a money order or cash for a $3 decal set. No cashier’s check. No electronic transactions. The money order would have cost me more than the purchase price and shipping combined, and cash was the least secure way to make a payment. And he became annoyed when I didn’t make the payment quickly as I mulled over what to do. Over time, eBay forced dealers to improve their payment terms on behalf of buyers.

The rest of the problems involved no dishonesty. An usually slow-moving shipment from England that may have been caught up in customs. (My U.K. purchases have usually been about as fast as a UPS Ground shipment.) A damaged running gear component on a fragile N scale brass steamer, which the seller quickly resolved with a price adjustment. An incorrect shipment of some board-game hockey players (wrong team) which the seller made right by sending me the correct order while telling me to keep the incorrect one as well. And (to Marty’s point) a 2001 Lionel locomotive that developed a jerky running pattern that wasn’t always present and which my repair shop was never able to smooth out or diagnose.

That’s it.

My forum purchases have been mostly positive, too, but not perfect. One item arrived damaged due to very poor packaging.

I used to love going to train shows, but the drawbacks outweigh the benefits. Yes, you get to see the product in hand, and you may get to see it run, but is what you want there? Too often, I paid $10 or more for admission/parking and $10 or more for gas only to find nothing I wanted, or worse, buying something of marginal interest because I didn’t want to leave empty handed.

I still prefer shopping for O gauge and N scale trains in brick-and-mortar stores that price competitively, but when I am looking for older and used items, that’s not usually a realistic option. That’s where eBay comes in, and my saved searches always make it convenient for me to find out the availability of a certain item the same day it is listed. Can’t beat that.

"After more than 18 years buying on eBay, I have few complaints about a wide variety of items I bought, not just trains.

Literally 99 percent of my transactions have been trouble free. That means the items were described accurately, paid for with convenient terms, shipped as quickly as with any other type of dealer, safely packaged and in good working order."

Yup. Me too. eBay since 1999. I am careful to check the guy's specs; never below 99% Positive (I will make exceptions for well-known hobby shops, such as Trainz). I don't deal with oddballs, bad photography, political and/or religious agenda, "No PayPal", too many Amurrican flags, high s/h (for 2 reasons). And a few other things.

Been ripped of twice; disappointed several times; dealt with damage (got partial refunds) - but literally 90% of my transactions have been fine. A couple of hundred of them since '99. Some big, some 5 bucks in parts.

So, if that makes me a "stupid fleabay customer", I guess that I'm just not all that sharp.

BTW - 2 years ago I sold - at a low price - a Lionel Wabash TMCC Hudson to a TCA member (I'm one, too) at a swap meet. He complained later to the TCA - and he was a liar - about promises I made on the loco. He wanted some money back. Seriously? I practically gave the thing to him. Needless to say, he got nothing. I emailed my own complaint to the TCA "agent" and heard no more BS on the subject. No eBay involved. Just the TCA in a face-to-face transaction. Makes one wonder.

"BTW - 2 years ago I sold - at a low price - a Lionel Wabash TMCC Hudson to a TCA member (I'm one, too) at a swap meet. He complained later to the TCA - and he was a liar - about promises I made on the loco. He wanted some money back. Seriously? I practically gave the thing to him. Needless to say, he got nothing. I emailed my own complaint to the TCA "agent" and heard no more BS on the subject. No eBay involved. Just the TCA in a face-to-face transaction. Makes one wonder. "

Don't get me wrong though, there was one seller at York that literally handed me his Legacy 600.00 engine and said if you want it, take it home, run it and send me a check or the locomotive back. I could not believe the honesty?!

A New Jersey guy trusting a guy from Detroit?!

Well I thanked him and handed him the money right away... the locomotives ran flawlessly, wish I could give him a shout out in thanks!

I have no issues buying from eBay.  I'd say I've only been "burned" once, but it is something I can fix, if I ever get around to it.  In fact I usually end up with my best deals on eBay.  I look for local sellers and ask about local pickup.  Most times they have come back and given me an offer lower than their original eBay listing (Which you can do on eBay, so still all within the eBay terms.).  So I pay it, then go meet them to pick it up, and we end up talking for a while and they offer me other things they have for sale.

Someone mentioned Paypal. This was a real boon to buyers, especially for low price/high volume purchases (like old post cards). Before Paypal I had to go to the post office and BUY a money order. Then use a stamp to mail it. Then wait for the seller to receive it and mail the item to me (hopefully the correct item). Refunds? Good luck. With Paypal, just click the "pay" box. On a budget? Just transfer a set amount from your checking account to your Paypal account every month or two. 

BTW - 2 years ago I sold - at a low price - a Lionel Wabash TMCC Hudson to a TCA member (I'm one, too) at a swap meet. He complained later to the TCA - and he was a liar - about promises I made on the loco. He wanted some money back. Seriously? I practically gave the thing to him. Needless to say, he got nothing. I emailed my own complaint to the TCA "agent" and heard no more BS on the subject. No eBay involved. Just the TCA in a face-to-face transaction. Makes one wonder.


Sadly, being a member of the TCA means NOTHING. For too many years too many people would blindly sponsor anybody who wanted a signature. And several years ago the TCA did away with sponsorship altogether.
The TCA still can mediate a dispute between two TCA members. Sounds like the mediation went to your satisfaction.

Personally even thou I still do sell on ebay ( I try to disclose every little thing ) I still rather be a buyer than a seller as all it takes is someone that has say a 2343 F unit and it has a crack/slight burn mark/doesn't work what have you and they buy yours and then cry to ebay that you didn't disclose that crac/burn mark and you get a piece of crap back and you are stuck with the shipping both ways and you have to refund their cost of the item. 

On ebay now days the buyer has zero risk and the seller has 100% of the risk. 

1500+ eBay transactions as a buyer and seller since 1999.  No problems to date.

After following this forum for about five years, it's pretty clear no one is changing anybody's mind on this topic.  But one thing's for sure--for us postwar/conventional folks, eBay is a dream come true.

rtraincollector posted:

On ebay now days the buyer has zero risk and the seller has 100% of the risk. 

Good point, if I had to dissuade people with eBay, it'd be to try to tell them what a nightmare selling can be.

Almost all of my bad experiences with eBay have been as a seller. People really think that, for example, a 60+ year old book should be as new in condition as something they could buy at the local new bookstore yesterday.

I've had my share of buyer's remorse for items I've sold, too. They got into a bidding war, paid more than they should have, then later claim the item isn't what you said it was, because they probably feel stupid for bidding so much. That's happened a few times on items I've sold...

Ive sold models to people that were from different production runs and the paint didn't quite match what they already had. Then they accused me of repainting them. Ive had people tell me months after the fact that the loco I sold them didn't work. Well it worked when it left my house and now you've had it for three months, what the heck do you want me to do?  I hate selling on eBay, its exhausting then at the end of the month I have to write then a huge check

I bought a 5 pack and add on 2 pack MTH Lehigh Valley heavyweight passenger cars on ebay about a week and a half ago. When I got them out of the box one of the steps had broken off of the coaches in transit as well as the plastic pieces holding the doors in place on the combine had broken off. Wasn't mad as both were easy fixes.

Only problem I have is whether or not my weaver John Wilkes can pull them all!

In all my train transactions my experience here has been 100% positive, from private sellers 100% positive, and on Ebay 95% positive. I ask a lot of questions, get to know whomever I am dealing with, ask for references, and lacking a good feeling quickly follow my gut and withdraw...

I might add that even from my LHS I will test run an engine at the store. ( and my LHS does not require I purchase it first - some may ) I trust them the MOST because they have a local reputation to protect. 

I had only about 4 or 5 problems on ebay out of about 2000 so I can't complain.  I did get ripped off a couple times at York which was my fault for not checking closer. I been a member of the TCA since 1982 and you have bad TCA and non TCA members.

Gene H posted:

I had only about 4 or 5 problems on ebay out of about 2000 so I can't complain.  I did get ripped off a couple times at York which was my fault for not checking closer. I been a member of the TCA since 1982 and you have bad TCA and non TCA members.

Over the past view years I bought a Lionel 2026 from 2 different York dealers. Both engines were marked "runs and smokes great". Neither smoked, and one ran jerky. I won't make that mistake, of going only by someone's word, again.

Chiming in with those folks mentioning selling - many moons ago I bought and sold a lot of train items.  Over the years the selling aspect became a nightmare - too many bad apples claiming the item was not working or was not as described.  eBay never supported me, the buyer was always right.  I still buy but stopped selling years ago.

Now this is irony, I bought a LeMax crazy cars for a layout I'm working on and I paid top dollar for a brand new one. Ive now gotten 2 used ones. This is the first major eBay issue I've had in awhile but I haven't been buying much either.

I love the smell of 5 dollar rolling stock in the morning...

Having bought and sold via eBay since 1998, there has been a huge change in marketplace. I believe this change is in the consumer more than the marketplace as I've bought and sold trains here for about 6 - 7 years and have seen the same changes.

1) Most people know nothing about trains. When kids or grand kids are selling off a collection, or a wife, or just the guy that bought it at estate sale, they know nothing other than what it looks like, this means they often list it as brand new (if it is in the box and looks reasonably new in their view). They aren't trying to screw you, they just don't know better. Take this into consideration and look at the photos, ask questions, the seller wants to sell and not have a hassle down the road.

2) When selling anything used at all, expect the buyer to be entirely unreasonable. This comes from their expectation that although you've disclosed everything you know, and you're clearly stating the item is used, they will expect it to be brand new and fully serviced by you forever and you'll be willing to give them a full refund forever too. This expectation has come from a retail world of "no questions asked" returns, the consumer expects it, even on used trains.

3) Some folks just can't help themselves, they buy something change their mind and want to return it. These same people do this at retail stores every day. You can't change the tigers stripes.

4) There are fakes, scams, etc., everywhere these days. Do what you can to limit being on the losing end. Never send money via PayPal friends and family unless you know the person in real life. If they need you to cover the 3% fee, just add to the transaction, but don't send F&F. On this forum someone sold me an item a few years ago, guess what never showed and the fellow dropped off the earth, when I contested the sale with PayPal and American Express they both advised it was a "gift" and therefore no action could be taken on their part.

Most of these items apply in person at a train meet and online, it is not buyer beware or sell take cover, but just some basic expectations which if consider will help keep the stress down. When a sale does go smoothly and I don't hear from the buyer for weeks after about every issue they have (forgot that one you're their private service tech for life) like where they didn't change the switch from DCC to DCS, or know how to add an engine to their remote, or that they have to add smoke fluid, or lube, etc., it is a joy filled surprise. The same is true when buying, when it show up, looks like expected, runs, etc., what a great day.

Thankfully the old 80/20 rule applies, 20% of sales or purchases are 80% of the trouble.

Happy buying or selling --

Jason

The only warning I have about buying on Ebay is there seems to be an increase sale of items from china, that is a too good of a deal, Don't walk but run from that. Perfect example the other night there was one that claimed a 2343 runs great $29.95 with free shipping. Bottom line if the deal seems to good you know it is. also another hint on these they have 0 feedback and that's because Ebay shuts them down and they open a new account as fast as ebay does it. Yes because of there guarantee ebay will refund your money but your supporting a crook doing so. And this is some of what drives Ebay fee up. 

rtraincollector posted:

The only warning I have about buying on Ebay is there seems to be an increase sale of items from china, that is a too good of a deal, Don't walk but run from that. Perfect example the other night there was one that claimed a 2343 runs great $29.95 with free shipping. Bottom line if the deal seems to good you know it is. also another hint on these they have 0 feedback and that's because Ebay shuts them down and they open a new account as fast as ebay does it. Yes because of there guarantee ebay will refund your money but your supporting a crook doing so. And this is some of what drives Ebay fee up. 

I agree 100%, eBay has good deals but you have to do the homework on the item being sold and the seller.  I always select "US Only" when searching the auctions.

When someone is selling a Pre-War train set and states untested but shows picture of the train on tracks on their layout?

RonH posted:

When someone is selling a Pre-War train set and states untested but shows picture of the train on tracks on their layout?

Ron,

I assume you are making an ingest comment that shows an example of a clear indicator of a dishonest seller. Yes, run from this, no reason that engine couldn't have been tested before listing.

Ron brings up a good point, look for other things in the pictures that tell you about the auction other than the item itself. A little detective work goes a long way.

When I sell trains on eBay, I include videos of the train running and demonstrate as many of the operating features as possible.  I then promptly take pictures of the train so that items on my layout and lighting environment in the pictures will match what is in the video. IMO, this adds a good piece of mind for the buyer.

H1000 posted:

rtraincollector posted:

The only warning I have about buying on Ebay is there seems to be an increase sale of items from china, that is a too good of a deal, Don't walk but run from that. Perfect example the other night there was one that claimed a 2343 runs great $29.95 with free shipping. Bottom line if the deal seems to good you know it is. also another hint on these they have 0 feedback and that's because Ebay shuts them down and they open a new account as fast as ebay does it. Yes because of there guarantee ebay will refund your money but your supporting a crook doing so. And this is some of what drives Ebay fee up. 

I agree 100%, eBay has good deals but you have to do the homework on the item being sold and the seller.  I always select "US Only" when searching the auctions.

I report the item to ebay when I come across them

I really don't get the animosity towards Ebay or even why it is called fleabay on this forum.  If you are buying a used item from a private seller in this forum or on ebay expect there may be something that is less than perfect.  Sometimes the transaction will work, sometimes not.  My limited ebay experience has been by and large positive but my expectations have not been very high.  My equally limited experience here has provided a wider variation.  Some folks have been beyond exceptional, one or two not so much.  Live and learn.  Again, this is a for a used or previously owned item. Ask a lot of questions, develop a sense of who you are dealing with and either buy or not.  Both ebay and the forum provide ample opportunities to exchange products, neither site cares for a minute what I think so proceed with caution and enjoy the hobby.

Folks,

I’ve been buying train-related items on Ebay for many years (I am not a seller) and its one big example of caveat emptor.

I’ve had virtually 100 percent success as a buyer and from reading this thread that seems to be the case (or very close) for many others. The one bad one I had was a tinplate crossing signal that was DOA. Seller returned my funds, no questions asked, within minutes after I sent an email.

I have no special advice that hasn’t already been mentioned: read descriptions very carefully, check feedback, and ask questions if needed.

Btw, see a lot of this these days: “I’m not a train expert…” and “…not tested…” and “…pictures are my description…” When I see those I quickly move on. Those are red flags for me so no sale. There are always other sellers with the same items who know how to effectively craft a for sale listing.

johnstrains posted:

 

Btw, see a lot of this these days: “I’m not a train expert…” and “…not tested…” and “…pictures are my description…” When I see those I quickly move on. Those are red flags for me so no sale. There are always other sellers with the same items who know how to effectively craft a for sale listing.

I don't - those are often the best buys - and fresh from the attic goods.

I don't expect a "Factory Fresh" type of guarantee on used trains...sure seller experience is a consideration - but not enough to keep me from bidding.

Want a group of nit-pickers? Try selling in the high-end audio segment...I'm something of an expert - plenty of sales and tech experience - but I rarely sell that stuff on eBay just because that groups is so full of overly obsessive nit-wits and downright thieves.

I knew I'd jinx myself by posting on this thread!

Just received a Hogwarts Express 5972...it was weak listing with misspellings - and won for 25 bucks.

I didn't expect it to work - and knew a few details were buggered up.

The guy shipped in a box that was more like a paper shirt box - totally mangled...half open.

More details broken - and for sure - she's locked up tight.

But - this is the kind of buyer you take a chance on - Im still going to leave positive feedback.

Based on his handwritten label - this looks like an old-timer - not going to take him to task.

For the money - its not worth the effort - and still very likely I could list in properly and sell for more than I paid.

Win some - lose some!

I've had good luck buying from overseas...China, UK, Germany, Netherlands, Australia. However, the Canadian postal system can really flatten packages.

Roving Sign posted:

...The guy shipped in a box that was more like a paper shirt box - totally mangled...half open....more details broken - and for sure - she's locked up tight...But...Im still going to leave positive feedback.

Right there, in two sentences, describes the utter folly of the whole "user feedback ratings" nonsense on EBay. Someone ships a piece of crap that has broken parts, doesn't work and is badly packaged, and he still gets positive feedback? Ridiculous.

It's just one of the MANY reasons why I never, ever buy ANYTHING on Ebay.

Dan Padova posted:

As I read through postings on pretty much any subject having to do with purchases , here on the forums, there are those that have said they will not buy anything from an Ebay seller under any circumstances.  ....

I sure don't understand why, Dan. I joined eBay in 2001, and have made countless transactions .... both O and HO, including some expensive stuff, and lots and lots of non-train items, too.

Completely happy with eBay. Couple of hiccups along the way were promptly resolved. The biggest problem I ever had was of my own making, as the seller of a new, expensive (for HO) Y6b steam engine, that I accidently misrepresented. The buyer and I ended up becoming long distance train buddies, as I corrected the problem with him.

eBay is a valuable and irreplaceable resource.

EBT Jim posted:

Dan Padova posted:

As I read through postings on pretty much any subject having to do with purchases , here on the forums, there are those that have said they will not buy anything from an Ebay seller under any circumstances.  ....

I sure don't understand why, Dan. I joined eBay in 2001, and have made countless transactions .... both O and HO, including some expensive stuff, and lots and lots of non-train items, too.

Completely happy with eBay. Couple of hiccups along the way were promptly resolved. The biggest problem I ever had was of my own making, as the seller of a new, expensive (for HO) Y6b steam engine, that I accidently misrepresented. The buyer and I ended up becoming long distance train buddies, as I corrected the problem with him.

eBay is a valuable and irreplaceable resource.

Speaking of long distance buddies, I sold a couple of items to a fellow in Australia, maybe ten years ago.  We're still communicating regularly.  

I have been and Ebay buyer/seller for 20+ years. I understand everyone's comments here, however, I am in northern California. This this is where there is no York, or the numerous train shops and mail order houses that are  on the east coast. Therefore, going  somewhere to actually put my hands on it is slim to none.

I have bought on Ebay, and never had any may issues to speak of. I have also purchased items from forum members with no regrets. Quit frankly, Ebay gave me access to items I would have never had, and made wonderful relationships with those sellers. They even knew which items I was looking for. However, I normally purchase the locos from a dealer.

Joe Gozzo

Right there, in two sentences, describes the utter folly of the whole "user feedback ratings" nonsense on EBay. Someone ships a piece of crap that has broken parts, doesn't work and is badly packaged, and he still gets positive feedback? Ridiculous.

But if he sold it here, that would be OK.
On EBay the buyer has recourse if he/she chooses to use it.

I understand why Roving Sign doesn't want to leave neutral or negative feedback. I think he knew the seller wasn't up on trains, paid a low price, and took a chance. I've purchased similar lots.
But I handle the bad ones a bit differently.
If I feel the seller was probably honest, but lacking in knowledge, I will send the seller an email explaining the issues with the sale, and not leave any feedback at all.

Agree with trainlover - for some of us there are no other options to buying through an internet source. So far I've had good results with Ebay and one purchase through Craigs list. Also good results direct from some dealers. Regardless of the source, I don't have the option of looking at the actual item until it is delivered to the door. In this case, the old adage about location, location, location applies to the buyer as much as the seller.

A few have noted "poor packaging". I've had the problem of "over-packaged"...paper or cardboard items I've bought that run a high risk of damage just getting them free of the packaging. 

OGR Webmaster posted:

It's just one of the MANY reasons why I never, ever buy ANYTHING on Ebay.

There you have it folks, you don't have to worry about bidding against Rich! 

For the record, the only (knock on wood!!!) bad experience that I have had buying online was from one person on the OGR Forum.

I just purchased a locomotive on ebay that I thought I'd never have the opportunity to purchase. 

As others have already stated ebay may be our only chance at finding that rare item that's special to the individual buyer.

it 

Ebay has morphed into something I really cant stand as a seller

1- Sellers can NOT leave negative feedback

2- Evrything is geared for the buyer  Any item that is brought up to a case goes the buyers way no matter what  The seller has to pay the return shipping also

3- The fees are astronomical

4- There are too many buyer that take advantage of this to get partial refunds

I still sell on ebay because I prefer not to get the haggling emails from Buy Sell boards

As a buyer on Ebay you should have no qualms buying anything because a return, refund, or partial refund is just a click away

Good point on obtaining items.  Local shows are nice but ebay offers the entire country/world as a 'shopping flea market'. 

I have lionel/MTH/3rd rail, etc but I'm mostly into HO modeling and I can purchase very nice (most have never been run) brass locomotives.  The price of most brass engines are around what they were selling for in the 70's-90's so, with inflation, they are extremely cheap.  Usually, at flea markets, anyone selling brass engines usually has them way over priced.    The same with a lot of Lionel products: a lot of stuff that was thought to be hard to get, isn't.  

Without ebay, I would never have been able to get my collection of 'train stuff'.

Some items are very hard to find.  I have two geiger turntables that were made back in the 70's.  On ebay, someone had a complete motor mechanism for 10 bucks that I now have as 'backup' for spare parts.

One can input 'saved searches' of items that you are interested in and ebay will notify you, via email, when one is for sale.  Sure saves me a lot of time, checking every day/week to see if that item is available.

One can also click on the 'sold' option to see what 'like' products sold for to see what current prices are for an item. Although the price can vary by time of year and even by week.  I've bought items that I thought was a very good buy, only to see, a few weeks later, people paying a lot more for the same item.  This is in relation to brass locomotives where the overall quality is a lot narrower 'field' versus 3 rail items that can vary widely on condition.

My view on buying, I pick, ahead of time, what I think the item is worth to me.  If I get it, great, if not, there will be more of the same, sold later.  Items that I really want, and don't come up often, I will pay more for, but that is rare.

 I also find auction houses a very good source for items.  Stout seems to be the best for knowledge of 'train stuff'.  When viewing products, it's obvious some 'houses' have no knowledge about trains.  Stout puts in lots of pictures and a well detailed description of the item.  One must remember to add the 19-25% that they add to the price of the item plus shipping.  One can put in a bid ahead of time, which is nice, as you don't need to be 'online' to win and, again, if I win, great, if not, keep looking.

Another thought about buying on Ebay.  I like to take my time looking.  As was mentioned, Ebay is like a world wide flea market, although buying from overseas can be costly on the postage end.  I do attend train meets that are not too far from home.  I'll drive an hour.  I have been to York three times.  It's two hours from me, almost 100 miles.  That's pretty close to a tank of gas.  York is so big that it clutters my mind.  I loose track of what is where quickly.  Smaller meets are much easier for me to browse.  That's why I don't like shop-pain at malls.  There's just too much going on.  

Adding to BlueLineC4, I know of one 'Buyer' with two "Positive" feedback entries which point out that he did not pay.  I asked the administrators about 'buyers' who do not pay and was told that after three 'no pay' events, they might caution that 'buyer' not to do it anymore.  The wording in the feedback may be negative but it is still a Positive entry.  John in Lansing, ILL

rtraincollector posted:

Personally even thou I still do sell on ebay ( I try to disclose every little thing ) I still rather be a buyer than a seller as all it takes is someone that has say a 2343 F unit and it has a crack/slight burn mark/doesn't work what have you and they buy yours and then dry to ebay that you didn't disclose that crac/burn mark and you get a piece of crap back and you are stuck with the shipping both ways and you have to refund their cost of the item. 

On ebay now days the buyer has zero risk and the seller has 100% of the risk. 

I have sold on eBay for 17 yrs . Only got burned once on a Lionel 3520 gen. car . I had one from a guy who was from a rich family . He got all the toys as a kid , he did not like trains ,he was 50 and wanted to unload all of this in one sale , I got a station wagon full of in the crisp box postwar trains some never opened . The generator car was sold they buyer said it was not as described , I told him to send it back , he sent back a different one , I did not check it right away and refunded him

He kept the mint one . It was my fault . Now any postwar Lionel like that I sell , I mark with invisible blacklight paint in little dots in a few spots .

Also as a seller , if you put a lot of pictures , and this disclaimer , look at pictures , if you see something email your question before you bid , and make full description and state NO RETURNS , if you do not accept these terms DON'T BID . I have never lost out from eBay , never had to give money back , and if they left negative feedback it was removed .

I list all the glaring flaws and even small things and refer them to the pictures as the determining factor for bidding under the above terms . Tell it like it is , most bottom feeders on eBay know they won't win a dispute . I insure the item for the full value of the item sold price . If they say it is damaged file a claim , you are not out anything .

I recently bought a hopper from a seller who sells a lot , they item arrived totally wrecked from poor packaging , I emailed them the picture it was priority mail and $50 insurance , item was like $30 , I got a full refund and so did the seller and I was told to keep the damaged item.

I gave a very positive feedback , I have had some of my expensive custom cars sell for $200-300 and once a coupler was broke off from the heavy dropping or handling . I had it insured for the full value , the customer wanted to keep the car and repair it , I requested $50 in damages plus shipping to and fro with pictures documenting the damage , I got $75 from USPS in about a week or 2 and sent the money to the customer he was thrilled . Bottom line make an accurate listing and insure and track it .

Another thing many sellers are not super train freaks so many times they don't know , just look at their selling history of completed items , sometimes they sell all kinds of stuff . I think common sense people skills resolve 99% of these issues .

ebay seller since 2000

Scratchbuilder1-48 posted:

Also as a seller , if you put a lot of pictures , and this disclaimer , look at pictures , if you see something email your question before you bid , and make full description and state NO RETURNS , if you do not accept these terms DON'T BID . I have never lost out from eBay , never had to give money back , and if they left negative feedback it was removed . 

This won't save you at all as a seller, if the buyer claims it's not as described. Got burned selling a Locomotive Cyclopedia once like that. The listing says AS-IS and plenty of photos. the buyer said it was more messed up than that. Ebay denied his claim and he appealed and got it overturned.

EBay actually refunded his money directly out of their pocket, something I'm told happens from time to time when I called eBay about it. But I got to keep the purchase money, but he got the money and the book. The eBay guy on the phone says you only can have that happen once and only under special circumstances, so it's not a tactic anyone can use to get free stuff.

But the buyer can claim something broke or was messed up along the way and you WILL have to accept the return in such a case, no matter what you said in the listing. I've confirmed that with eBay, too.

That's why I rarely sell on eBay, but rarely have issues buying from it.