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Control Panel

 

I've been playing around with the idea of putting together a control panel for our conventional layout.  The above design is roughly 14 inches tall by 24 inches wide.  I realize I have a bit of dead space where the American flag and Lionel logo are, but wanted to keep some space for expansion.  I envision this being one of those slightly slanted panels that is attached to the side of the table.  Most of the accessories will be activated via buttons on the front side of the table.

The top row of 022c controllers are for the upper level switches and the lower row of 022c controllers are for the lower level switches.  The yellow striping is the upper level track plan and blue is the lower level.  The gray circles in the track are on/off toggle switches  The two black 5132 switch controllers (w/o lights) will be used to control a lionel 497 coaling station.  The red button is for a whistle station.  The black circles below the voltmeters are in-line magnetic circuit breakers.

My questions:

1.  What are your thoughts on the overall layout of controls?  Is 14x24 too big/awkward to use? Should the voltmeters and ammeters be flipped?

2. How do people label the turnout locations so that you can easily tell which switch to throw?  Do you add little numbered flags near the actual switch? Add numbers to the track diagram?

3. In terms of wiring the circuit breaker, voltmeter, and ammeters, should the breakers be closest in series to the transformer or the track?

4.  The 12 switches with incandescent bulbs are starting to really eat up some wattage.  What is the best source for drop-in red and green led bulbs that have the same size bulb and coloring as the incandescents?

5. I was thinking about using 1x4" pine as the frame and 1/8 inch plywood for the surface.  Would this strong enough after I cut the holes in the surface for the meters?

6. Any tips on the material, construction, design, and/or process would be appreciated!

 

Thanks!  Here are a couple old pics of the layout before I added some sidings seen in the control panel track diagram.

 

 

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  • Control Panel
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Last edited by JD2035RR
Original Post

How close to actual scale is your cut and paste of the different pieces?

I note you don't show cables leaving the controllers at all.  The switch controllers, especially, being placed so close together and right up to the edge.

Are you intending to hinge this so you can access the underside for maintenance?

This may just be my personal preference, but I'd probably put the meters (and circuit breakers, I guess) above the transformer, not below it.  This could also help with wires being too close to the edges (meters are likely with terminals near the middle, the ZW obviously has it's outputs on the edge, which is right up against the upper edge of the panel in the above pic.  (inter-related with question on hinge desire).

-Dave

If this will be attached to the side of the layout, it will have to be very structurally robust to hold the ZW.  Often panels like this are located near or next to the ZW which is separately mounted.  Moving the ZW would allow for a larger layout drawing.  Any momentary contact push button switches will operate the switches.  You can get push buttons and then mount them on the layout drawing exactly on the switched track.  Could do lights too.  This eliminates the need to number or label the switches.  Often in a conventional layout there are several electrical blocks.  Toggle switches can be mounted right o the diagram for turning the blocks on and off.

Do a forum search.  Lots of threads about control panels, including one a couple of months ago.

JD,

I think we discussed this in another thread but check out thread linked below on Lionel Dealer Display Layouts. It's many pages but has some good pictures of layouts with PW-style control panels.

Granted most of them don't have the number of items you are planning on (although most have ZWs) but may give you some ideas, especially on attaching to the layout board. 

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...-and-postwar-layouts

 

Just to give you an idea my control panel is 15"X24". I don't have any switch controllers (I use Ross switches with ground throws) but have 3 UCS track controllers, several accessory controllers, block toggle controls, and a ZW and Type Z transformers in basically the same space you're looking at constructing. I did build a shelf below the control panel to hold a TIU and TMCC Command Base. 

 

20190226_201340

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It would appear that you have a Volt/Amp meter pair per ZW channel.  What does each channel control?  On your layout you show multiple engines on the track.  Do you use Blocking to control the engines individually?  Therefore not being sure of the afore mentioned questions, you may wish to add some spdt center off switches to control your blocks.  Just my 2 cents and it may be all it is worth.

Dave45681 posted:

How close to actual scale is your cut and paste of the different pieces?

I note you don't show cables leaving the controllers at all.  The switch controllers, especially, being placed so close together and right up to the edge.

Are you intending to hinge this so you can access the underside for maintenance?

This may just be my personal preference, but I'd probably put the meters (and circuit breakers, I guess) above the transformer, not below it.  This could also help with wires being too close to the edges (meters are likely with terminals near the middle, the ZW obviously has it's outputs on the edge, which is right up against the upper edge of the panel in the above pic.  (inter-related with question on hinge desire).

-Dave

Thanks Dave. Scale is pretty close. I used excel as a background grid as graph paper of sorts.  Good point on leaving extra room for the wiring to exit the controllers and bend down into holes. I definitely need more spacing between them. 

Hinging it is another good idea. I would surely need to have the ZW anchored separately from the panel. I’ll have to play around with that. 

ogaugenut posted:

If this will be attached to the side of the layout, it will have to be very structurally robust to hold the ZW.  Often panels like this are located near or next to the ZW which is separately mounted.  Moving the ZW would allow for a larger layout drawing.  Any momentary contact push button switches will operate the switches.  You can get push buttons and then mount them on the layout drawing exactly on the switched track.  Could do lights too.  This eliminates the need to number or label the switches.  Often in a conventional layout there are several electrical blocks.  Toggle switches can be mounted right o the diagram for turning the blocks on and off.

Do a forum search.  Lots of threads about control panels, including one a couple of months ago.

I think mounting the ZW separately to the side might be the way to go, for stability and possibly hinging the rest of the panel. The momentary switches in the diagram are probably the most logical way to go, but I like those darn 022c controllers too much. They’re too big, eat up too much wattage, are difficult to clearly assign to the turnouts, but I like them too much to get rid of them...maybe I could add the diagram switches and tie them into the 022 wiring. 

I have seen a lot of panels on the forum, they are really cool. Thanks for chiming in. 

johnstrains posted:

JD,

I think we discussed this in another thread but check out thread linked below on Lionel Dealer Display Layouts. It's many pages but has some good pictures of layouts with PW-style control panels.

Granted most of them don't have the number of items you are planning on (although most have ZWs) but may give you some ideas, especially on attaching to the layout board. 

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...-and-postwar-layouts

 

I really enjoy that thread. The dealer display slanted panel is what I’m going for, although most are quite short, less than 10 inches or so. Also, a lot of those dealer displays had the controls mounted right on the table top. 

AAB81A87-2EB8-4FDE-896C-1A802213EB86

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Lou1985 posted:

Just to give you an idea my control panel is 15"X24". I don't have any switch controllers (I use Ross switches with ground throws) but have 3 UCS track controllers, several accessory controllers, block toggle controls, and a ZW and Type Z transformers in basically the same space you're looking at constructing. I did build a shelf below the control panel to hold a TIU and TMCC Command Base. 

 

20190226_201340

Thanks Lou. Seeing the same space in reality helps bring it into perspective. I didn’t realize those Zs were so big! 

Loose-Caboose posted:

It would appear that you have a Volt/Amp meter pair per ZW channel.  What does each channel control?  On your layout you show multiple engines on the track.  Do you use Blocking to control the engines individually?  Therefore not being sure of the afore mentioned questions, you may wish to add some spdt center off switches to control your blocks.  Just my 2 cents and it may be all it is worth.

Thanks Jim. I do have a relatively simple blocking system set up. The upper level (yellow on the diagram) is controlled with the left handle. The lower level is controlled by the right handle (blue on the diagram). Between the upper and lower loops are passing sidings that are independently blocked (on/off) both of which are powered by the right handle. I plan to block the sidings on the upper level to park an engine or two. 

One inner dial is for switches and the other is for accessories. 

JD2035RR posted:
johnstrains posted:

JD,

I think we discussed this in another thread but check out thread linked below on Lionel Dealer Display Layouts. It's many pages but has some good pictures of layouts with PW-style control panels.

Granted most of them don't have the number of items you are planning on (although most have ZWs) but may give you some ideas, especially on attaching to the layout board. 

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...-and-postwar-layouts

 

I really enjoy that thread. The dealer display slanted panel is what I’m going for, although most are quite short, less than 10 inches or so. Also, a lot of those dealer displays had the controls mounted right on the table top. 

AAB81A87-2EB8-4FDE-896C-1A802213EB86

Agreed,  you would probably want something longer.

I think those Lionel panels were attached with a carriage bolt arrangement. I've seen a good how-to on these somewhere. Could have been here on the forum? Also, I think CTT Magazine did a series on building a PW display that used these attached panels.

Joe Fauty posted:

Only thing I can add is that I use white pegboard for the base. It is not that pretty but the holes are there ready to use.

With respect to turnout identification I make small signs with numbers on them. The top printing designates siding, mainline, yard etc but the numbers are unique and not repeated.

Turnout ID 004

Dirty Dog Railway 0017

Nice signs - I like that they look part of the scene. I like the pegboard, but really like the drawer slides 👍

About a Control Panel ...
My L-shaped O-gauge layout is placed in an L-shaped room, which is an addition to the rear of the house. Aisle space around the perimeter is limited, so I didn't have room for a slant-mounted control panel which would consume most of the aisle space.  Instead, I installed two pull-out sliding shelves placed near the angle of the "L."  See attached pix.

One slide-out panel is for some control buttons and all the O22 switch controllers -- like you, I prefer the iconic look and feel of them. Each switch controller is numbered, and there are corresponding "ID flags" at each switch (some of which are semi-hidden from view from the control panel). With an apology to Old McDonald's Farm, I used yellow flex-plastic livestock ear tags as the "flags." They are big enough to be seen from nearly 20 feet away.

The other pull-out shelf holds Lionel and MTH "bricks" -- a PM-1 for track power and TMCC gear, and two MTH Z1000 "bricks" for accessories, building lighting, and switches. The 110v power to everything on the layout comes from three different wall outlets with power cords going to power strips mounted on the undersides of the five layout platforms. Each outlet has a remote control gizmo with a hand-held controller device - bought from a local "Big Box" store.  When I push its three buttons, the AC power to all three circuits is turned on/off. In effect, the gizmo is a Master Power Switch.

Like many  other hobbyists, I mounted the pushbutton controls for the operating accessories on the perimeter fascia board of the layout; each button is mounted near its accessory. I use Lionel #90 control buttons for that purpose if possible.

I used a different method for track power to the upper level; I installed a PC power supply (90 watts) for DC voltage as track power for three short trolley lines. That DC power is routed through three voltage controllers mounted in a small black box with a small knob for each; handy for individual speed control of each trolley. I installed four 110v power strips underneath the upper platform - which provides power plug-ins for 36 DEPT 56 porcelain lighted buildings from their NORTH POLE VILLAGE collection. I used the voltage reduction strips made by Dept 56 to provide 3v to the lamps in most buildings to avoid running 110v wires everywhere. So far, so good; no overload problems.

The advice offered by other OGR FORUM members makes practical sense. One final comment ... consistently apply a color code to all wiring, dress-up the wires neatly to avoid the look of "an explosion in a spaghetti factory, and (like meticulous computer or military electricians) attach wiring numbers to each wire for identification later.

Carry on ...

Mike Mottler     LCCA 12394
mottlerm@gmail.com

 

 

 

 

 

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IMG_3790

Uncouple and UCS Tracks Upper Left.   My switch controllers are laid out in the order the switches are in my Layout.  The Atlas Twin is used to control exit signals from my yard lead.   The Connector with the yellow switches are on/off for track power at the end of my yard tracks.  The Atlas Connectors with the green switches are block control for both yard tracks and mainline tracks. 

Steve

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Mike H Mottler posted:

About a Control Panel ...
My L-shaped O-gauge layout is placed in an L-shaped room, which is an addition to the rear of the house. Aisle space around the perimeter is limited, so I didn't have room for a slant-mounted control panel which would consume most of the aisle space.  Instead, I installed two pull-out sliding shelves placed near the angle of the "L."  See attached pix.

One slide-out panel is for some control buttons and all the O22 switch controllers -- like you, I prefer the iconic look and feel of them. Each switch controller is numbered, and there are corresponding "ID flags" at each switch (some of which are semi-hidden from view from the control panel). With an apology to Old McDonald's Farm, I used yellow flex-plastic livestock ear tags as the "flags." They are big enough to be seen from nearly 20 feet away.

The other pull-out shelf holds Lionel and MTH "bricks" -- a PM-1 for track power and TMCC gear, and two MTH Z1000 "bricks" for accessories, building lighting, and switches. The 110v power to everything on the layout comes from three different wall outlets with power cords going to power strips mounted on the undersides of the five layout platforms. Each outlet has a remote control gizmo with a hand-held controller device - bought from a local "Big Box" store.  When I push its three buttons, the AC power to all three circuits is turned on/off. In effect, the gizmo is a Master Power Switch.

Like many  other hobbyists, I mounted the pushbutton controls for the operating accessories on the perimeter fascia board of the layout; each button is mounted near its accessory. I use Lionel #90 control buttons for that purpose if possible.

I used a different method for track power to the upper level; I installed a PC power supply (90 watts) for DC voltage as track power for three short trolley lines. That DC power is routed through three voltage controllers mounted in a small black box with a small knob for each; handy for individual speed control of each trolley. I installed four 110v power strips underneath the upper platform - which provides power plug-ins for 36 DEPT 56 porcelain lighted buildings from their NORTH POLE VILLAGE collection. I used the voltage reduction strips made by Dept 56 to provide 3v to the lamps in most buildings to avoid running 110v wires everywhere. So far, so good; no overload problems.

The advice offered by other OGR FORUM members makes practical sense. One final comment ... consistently apply a color code to all wiring, dress-up the wires neatly to avoid the look of "an explosion in a spaghetti factory, and (like meticulous computer or military electricians) attach wiring numbers to each wire for identification later.

Carry on ...

Mike Mottler     LCCA 12394
mottlerm@gmail.com

 

 

 

 

 

Great insight, Mike! I like the livestock tags. Good advice on the wiring, it can easily slip into the ratnest category if you’re not diligent. 

Steve24944 posted:

IMG_3790

Uncouple and UCS Tracks Upper Left.   My switch controllers are laid out in the order the switches are in my Layout.  The Atlas Twin is used to control exit signals from my yard lead.   The Connector with the yellow switches are on/off for track power at the end of my yard tracks.  The Atlas Connectors with the green switches are block control for both yard tracks and mainline tracks. 

Steve

Nice work, Steve. Is your panel on a separate table/cart?

JD2035RR posted:
Steve24944 posted:

IMG_3790

Uncouple and UCS Tracks Upper Left.   My switch controllers are laid out in the order the switches are in my Layout.  The Atlas Twin is used to control exit signals from my yard lead.   The Connector with the yellow switches are on/off for track power at the end of my yard tracks.  The Atlas Connectors with the green switches are block control for both yard tracks and mainline tracks. 

Steve

Nice work, Steve. Is your panel on a separate table/cart?

Yes  Basically a plywood box on casters.   Here is the back.

IMG_3793

Steve

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TheDude23112 posted:

no matter how much you plan, later on you wish you had more space....

Probably one of the best pieces of advice here!   Been there.....wished that.

-----------

One more bit of advice....   When that time-of-life comes, and the layout must come down, and you or others will have to sell/give away the parts and pieces...... please,Please, PLEASE remember the controllers, buttons, and other devices on that control panel that are to be paired to their accessory/track!!   I cannot tell you how many times we (wife and I) have been called to help the heir(s) handle an estate of trains, only to find that the layout has been dissembled and the 'control panel' or randomly place buttons/switches/controllers are no where to be found...'We threw them out.  No time/inclination to take all that wiring/screws apart!', etc.....as evidenced by the lengths of cut wire still dangling from the accessories/track pieces themselves.   Not a good thing for the next owner.  Sometimes we get lucky and can alert them to this before family demolition mayhem takes place.  Yes, it takes time to salvage all those control panel pieces, but it's worth it.....IOHO.

Or, leave your heirs a humorous reminder fastened beneath the control panel: "The items on this panel go with the layout pieces they control!!!   If you throw this control panel and all of its pieces away......I will haunt you forever!!!"

FWIW, of course.

KD

JD2035RR posted:

My questions:

1.  What are your thoughts on the overall layout of controls?  Is 14x24 too big/awkward to use? Should the voltmeters and ammeters be flipped?

It's not too big imo. I'd flip the meters above the ZW because 1. those covers are often brittle and I'd fear smacking one in an emergency shut down. 2. the control should be as close to you as possible. I think most folk have a habit of belly-ing up to a unit.  (on the other hand, a shirtless belly may be a little heat sensitive. I guess it depends on the i dividual )

2. How do people label the turnout locations so that you can easily tell which switch to throw?  Do you add little numbered flags near the actual switch? Add numbers to the track diagram?

I never had the luxury; I just use memory. I also prefer to use the dual controllers to pair up turnouts (even if I have to re-work and rewire the functions) Gramp's wasn't using duals and I never had an issue there either. Signs for guests or kids might be nice though.  Marking the numers on the map & controls seems enough to me.

3. In terms of wiring the circuit breaker, voltmeter, and ammeters, should the breakers be closest in series to the transformer or the track?

Doesn't matter much. Ideally wire should be as short as possible, but your only adding a foot or two. I think visually they would be seen better up high though.

4.  The 12 switches with incandescent bulbs are starting to really eat up some wattage.  What is the best source for drop-in red and green led bulbs that have the same size bulb and coloring as the incandescents? 

 No source, just a reminder some may be dc only.

5. I was thinking about using 1x4" pine as the frame and 1/8 inch plywood for the surface.  Would this strong enough after I cut the holes in the surface for the meters?

?.. Running a frame around them will help. On top or underside. Nothing fancy. Just a runner along the weak edges to beef up the area. Wood or metal really. I think 1/4" would be better in the long run. I think 1/8 might be too thin. I like things to be quite solid.

6. Any tips on the material, construction, design, and/or process would be appreciated!

Don't hit your thumb with a hammer 🔨 . ( I think you'll do fine)

Thanks!  Here are a couple old pics of the layout before I added some sidings seen in the control panel track diagram.

I wish I had a big box of those arcade buttons 😎  How did you like working with them? The color variation really adds some "pop" too.

I'm lacking the proper composer panel to change text style & color today, there are comments above mixed into your text.

Vary wire colors all you can and suppliment with numbers.  Relying on one or the other... I'd use color because its easiest to spot without flipping tags around to see the number.  Paint on the ends of repeated colors is another way to organize a few repeats.

Run wire into bundles and secure them well on both sides of a hinge, leaving plenty of slack so being open wont stress the two points.(like an1" up to a foot of slack)  If the looms want to jam into the hinge area, use a long, light spring on a zip strip and cabinet to pull it out of the way as you close the panel. (like how a screen door spring keeps the stop chain in check)

Panel shots:

IMG_7365IMG_7378

This RR is almost all old school.  The panel surface is simple Masonite screwed into the plywood frame.  The frame lifts up with a HD piano hinge.  Many folks go to a  big box store and get some Plexiglass custom cut deck.  Washer head screws hold the Masonite in place.  Incomplete in these photos.  1/4" tape colors depict which block, power source and MTH terminal block circuit.

The lower deck rolls out on 22" drawer glides.  The slack in the wires is accommodated by routing each bundle straight down through the terminal drawer bottom then loop back up to attach to the terminal blocks.  Raising the switch panel or sliding out the drawer does not place any flex strain on the wires or their terminals, the bundle loop simply rolls with the movement like the power control cables on an elevator.

Sorry for curved example.  A straight side panel is actually easier to work with. 

The deck is coated with  decoupage satin clear coat which holds the tape in place.

IMG_8409IMG_8410IMG_8413

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Last edited by Tom Tee

I don't know if these thoughts have already been mentioned, but I'd try to leave a small area for future growth - for when something gets added like a couple of toggle switches or another switch controller or two.  Furthermore, keep in mind that you'll be using the transformer the most, and you'll be reaching over the meters every time. You might find yourself in the situation of having to look around your hand on the ZW lever trying to watch the meters at the same time.  You may want to swap the meters and the ZW - just something to consider. Otherwise, this is a pretty nice setup.

Dale

Thanks all for the great advice. Wow, there are some nice panels with very professional wiring. I hope to make mine half as well. 

I did a little measuring, and in reality, the 14 inches from the top to bottom seemed like too much, especially when moving the zw to the bottom with all of the weight out there. I think I will be making it less deep but wider - approx 10x29 seemed less obtrusive. 

EB1A5D61-A5CE-4FD3-8DC1-53DC0EDC87F0

I agree moving the meters above the zw is ideal.  With the smaller dimension, the meters will need to on an angle and above the zw. I’ll need to build a box like this 

FC2D0F0E-7B20-48D2-87C9-1542A224F430

Or similar to the shape of TomTee’s Dallee devices for a meter box:

134A4D6E-1B28-4435-9B62-50B94C204B42

 

Thanks again and keep the ideas floating in. 

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Last edited by JD2035RR
JD2035RR posted:

Thanks all for the great advice. Wow, there are some nice panels with very professional wiring. I hope to make mine half as well. 

I did a little measuring, and in reality, the 14 inches from the top to bottom seemed like too much, especially when moving the zw to the bottom with all of the weight out there. I think I will be making it less deep but wider - approx 10x29 seemed less obtrusive. 

EB1A5D61-A5CE-4FD3-8DC1-53DC0EDC87F0

I agree moving the meters above the zw is ideal.  With the small dimension, they will need to on an angle and above the zw. I’ll need to build a box like this 

...............................................

Thanks again and keep the ideas floating in. 

Are you against the panel being in 2 pieces with a noticeable break in the surface?

I ask because if you want to eliminate the problem of the ZW weight, you could just mount it permanently in a static position and the rest of the panel could hinge up around it.  Look at the purple lines I added below (too thick, but wanted them to show):

You could then go back to the 14" if you want to.

You would of course need much more slack in the 8 wires coming off the ZW posts to the meters and circuit breakers so that the rest of the panel could hinge all the way up(since the transformer will not move), but you would lose the concern of the panel supporting the weight of the transformer at all.

The trigonometry to get the same angle as the hinged panel is something that has to be calculated, but you could probably do something like support the upper edge by cutting a 2x3 or 2 at the proper angle and height to support the part of the panel with the transformer on it (I'm assuming a flat (horizontal) solid surface underneath the panel here to anchor the 2x3 (s) to).

-Dave

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  • mceclip0

For wire differentiation you can further uses colored electrical tape.  I only have 12 colors of wire but I also have 12 colors of electrical tape plus number tape.

On my RR there are 9 power districts but most of the wires go to one common panel so in is not uncommon to find several different wires with the same color insulation but the tape and numbers break it down.  Circuit chasing is easy here.

Just like in house wiring, tape the wire ends to denote variant usage.

toy boxes 015< This is a flip up 2' X 16' yard.

Plus check out any of  Mike CT or Elliott's electrical photos.

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Last edited by Tom Tee

Dave, I like the idea of keeping the ZW static and the hinged panel around it. My concern with the meters flat behind the zw on the same plane is that the will be hard to see back there. Maybe I will keep the transformer area sunken ( flat with the base of the panel box and have the flip up panel surround that area. I think I can gain enough height with the slope so the meters are easier to see. 

Tom, your panel is a work of art!  I picked up some colored tape like you suggested.      The wire I’ve been using is 16awg speaker wire. I picked it up cheap a while ago, but it has taken effort to try to keep things logical and organized with only 2 colors. The tape should help. I also notice that the really nice ‘professional’ wiring jobs like yours keep the wires bundled and give plenty of planned slack. 

JD2035RR posted:

Dave, I like the idea of keeping the ZW static and the hinged panel around it. My concern with the meters flat behind the zw on the same plane is that the will be hard to see back there. Maybe I will keep the transformer area sunken ( flat with the base of the panel box and have the flip up panel surround that area. I think I can gain enough height with the slope so the meters are easier to see. 

..........................

Be careful that you will still be able to raise the handles to max voltage if you do this (it may not even just be "max" that is a concern, it could interfere before that). 

As shown in your picture, the handles stick out behind the imaginary vertical plane of the rear "wall" of the chassis when raised to higher voltages.

Without having a ZW in front of me right now to look, it's probably something like half way or so where the handles stick straight up (when on a flat surface).  After that, they break the imaginary plane that defines the back wall of the chassis (and therefore, could hit your sloped panel)

-Dave

JD,

Thank you. The slack on stranded wire is allowed so as to be able to lift a length of track should that be necessary to R&R a turnout or whatever w/o breaking a solder connection.

On solid wire I use a piece of 5/8 dowel or a sharpie pen and wrap the feed several times to again to provide sufficient extra length allow lifting the track from the roadbed for service.

Where you see the white duct tape  there is a routered out recess for the feed to clear a support cross member.  You re looking at the backside of four tipple tracks from the same circuit.  The entire yard is on 16 feet of piano hinge.  The wooden brace is just a support to hold the decking up while wiring.

I made a big oversight as I'm used to panels folding out towards me and didn't mention it.

  I also strayed from the limits of a "shelf mount".

With that weight, attachment to the outer frame, might pull and twist the frame /facia board . If not to the floor with legs, I'd run cantilever arms like this one, tied to the layout board runners, or to the other side of the frame, or "long enough", or leg to leg, etc. etc.  

Flipped up and away from you, that is a lot of weight too. So I like the stationary idea, or even the zw on one door, the meters on another. Another runner going front to rear to support/stop both doors and hold an equal share of the weight on the right side of the zw. (a hidden clasp on the zw door out of sight, accessable via the meter door is how a gaming cabinet control panel would remain fixed tight, yet quickly accessable.

Split doors on the switch banks side too? Screwed down the center map panel or even hinge too? 

Even a flip open to the left or right is a possiblity for just one door to swing open a little easier.

 

Adriatic posted:

I made a big oversight as I'm used to panels folding out towards me and didn't mention it.

  I also strayed from the limits of a "shelf mount".

With that weight, attachment to the outer frame, might pull and twist the frame /facia board . If not to the floor with legs, I'd run cantilever arms like this one, tied to the layout board runners, or to the other side of the frame, or "long enough", or leg to leg, etc. etc.  

Flipped up and away from you, that is a lot of weight too. So I like the stationary idea, or even the zw on one door, the meters on another. Another runner going front to rear to support/stop both doors and hold an equal share of the weight on the right side of the zw. (a hidden clasp on the zw door out of sight, accessable via the meter door is how a gaming cabinet control panel would remain fixed tight, yet quickly accessable.

Split doors on the switch banks side too? Screwed down the center map panel or even hinge too? 

Even a flip open to the left or right is a possiblity for just one door to swing open a little easier.

 

Not taking over the OP's thread, but why include my panel?  Just curious

 

I used it to try and illustrate what looks like (it might be) a cantelevered panel support ...? (2x4 jutting out from the leg just behind the control panel.)  

  I was not getting an attachment tool on this thread so was limited to copy /paste of what is on the site already or I would have found a different example, or highlighted, cropped, drew it etc. etc.

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These pinball back and game panel latches are pretty versitile. These would be mounted as above or on the cabnet sides reaching up. (above & fwd of the small crossbrace). 

Out of the two pics below. One loom sure is pretty, but it's not the one I ever would want to have to work on. You'll be there an extra hour cutting ties and retieing. God forbid you need to replace one.  The "birds nest" would be easier to deal with.....a few more zips I could call something like that done no problem.(not mine, random photos)

thth [1)

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Now I know most of you here conventional runners but myself being 100% command the lack of any control panel or control center was one of the reasons I only use command. My handheld controls everything, why build a control panel when I don't have to. 

There are allot of good looking control panels here and if I was running conventional I would copy one from right here. 

Dave

Adriatic posted:

th [4)th [2)

These pinball back and game panel latches are pretty versitile. These would be mounted as above or on the cabnet sides reaching up. (above & fwd of the small crossbrace). 

Out of the two pics below. One loom sure is pretty, but it's not the one I ever would want to have to work on. You'll be there an extra hour cutting ties and retieing. God forbid you need to replace one.  The "birds nest" would be easier to deal with.....a few more zips I could call something like that done no problem.(not mine, random photos)

thth [1)

Those are great ideas, Adriatic. I didn’t think of taking inspiration from arcade panels, but it’s a very similar job that’s being performed. Thanks!

david1 posted:

Now I know most of you here conventional runners but myself being 100% command the lack of any control panel or control center was one of the reasons I only use command. My handheld controls everything, why build a control panel when I don't have to. 

There are allot of good looking control panels here and if I was running conventional I would copy one from right here. 

Dave

I certainly appreciate being able to control it all from the remote. I think if/when I get a command system like Legacy, I would still keep the panel for switches and other items. If I needed to make some quick switching maneuvers,  I think the panel with tactile controllers is better.  

For example, I think it would be easier to hit 3 switch levers/buttons on the control panel rather than interfacing through the remote multiple times ie SW, 1, Aux 1.....SW, 2, Aux 2.....SW, 3, Aux 1

Conventional: 3 touches

Command: 9 touches

Being able to use the remote anywhere is clearly an advantage, but for most small layouts, I think control panels work nicely  in parallel with a command system.  

 

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