Skip to main content

After all the testing and such I've been doing, a thought occurred to me.

 

Background: I am using PW ZW Transformers, properly phased and commons tied, and 10 amp fuses on outputs.

 

I am running on FasTrack with switches powered by separate power.

 

All power sources are using a common house circuit through the use of power strips.

 

Now to the question... I have not checked phasing of accessory/switch transformer power with the PW ZW transformers. Is this a possible stumbling block for the DCS signal?

Last edited by Charly
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Cheryl,

Is this a possible stumbling block for the DCS signal?

Typically, an out-of-phase condition would manifest itself when a connection is made between two power sources that are out-of-phase.

 

Since all of your Commons are tied together, that means that any time a momentary connection is made between two out-of-phase Hot wires, there should be noticeable sparking and the possibility of a fuse blowing or a breaker tripping.

 

Typically, this would occur in out-of-phase electrical wiring when a train transitions from one track block powered by one transformer to a track block powered by another transformer that's out of phase with the first transformer, or when a switch track that is powered by a transformer that is out-of-phase with respect to a track power transformer, operates the switch track's automatic non-derailing mechanism.

 

If you aren't seeing anything resembling this, I would expect that your transformers are in-phase with respect to one another.

Last edited by Barry Broskowitz

OK, just thinking...

 

The only other factor I can see causing signal problems is that FasTrack is sectional.  I've double checked all the wiring and it's in order.  The only other thing I could do is make smaller blocks of track sections.  Not really read to do that

 

The layout is running pretty good, but it has it's moments .

 

Thanks again for your help.

Usually a track block or loop can be as large as 90 to 100 ft and still operate O.K.  The two variable channels on the TIU can be set to fixed, which allows for four DCS fixed signal systems.

With our larger modular layout, (Fort Pitt Hi-Railers), we split two loops.  Use (2) Track outputs off the DCS for one loop, (1/2 the loop clockwise, Fixed #1, 1/2 the loop counter clockwise, Variable #1 set to Fixed). The loops are simply unplugged at the half-way distance.   This reduction in total track length per DCS channel is a relatively easy fix, may be a first step in solving your problem.  Input to the TIU Fixed#1 and Variable #1 is the same Output from one side of a Z4000 transformer.    

Last edited by Mike CT

The phrase "Layout is running pretty good, but it has its' moments" leaped out at me with some thoughts.

 

Do you have several cars with constant voltage lights?   Do you have several TMCC engines?   Pull all of those off the track and check your DCS.   If everything suddenly runs perfect then I suspect that you have some CV (constant voltage) boards interfering.  

 

Mike,

Usually a track block or loop can be as large as 90 to 100 ft and still operate O.K. 

What is your basis for this statement?

 

The current guideline, as developed by Jim Barrett some time ago, sets the maximum length of a track block as having no more than 11-12 track joins. With all 3 foot sections of track, this would be a block that's 36 feet long, at best.

Layout is already something like that.  Half is on VAR1 and 2 of TIU 1, and other half is on VAR1 and 2 of TIU 2.  The dividing point is center of layout.  Signal is dropping in switches and randomly through out layout.  Track is FasTrack which has all commons tied unless isolated section.
 
Just thinking out loud, so to speak, to try and understand the control problems.  Not so severe as to prohibit operation, just baffling.
 
 
Originally Posted by Mike CT:

Usually a track block or loop can be as large as 90 to 100 ft and still operate O.K.  The two variable channels on the TIU can be set to fixed, which allows for four DCS fixed signal systems.

With our larger modular layout, (Fort Pitt Hi-Railers), we split two loops.  Use (2) Track outputs off the DCS for one loop, (1/2 the loop clockwise, Fixed #1, 1/2 the loop counter clockwise, Variable #1 set to Fixed). The loops are simply unplugged at the half-way distance.   This reduction in total track length per DCS channel is a relatively easy fix, may be a first step in solving your problem.  Input to the TIU Fixed#1 and Variable #1 is the same Output from one side of a Z4000 transformer.    

 

There aren't any lighted cars on the layout, TMCC engine is on unpowered track, and to my knowledge there aren't any CV boards present.
 
The symptoms occur with only a single engine on the layout.
 
Originally Posted by Trevize:

The phrase "Layout is running pretty good, but it has its' moments" leaped out at me with some thoughts.

 

Do you have several cars with constant voltage lights?   Do you have several TMCC engines?   Pull all of those off the track and check your DCS.   If everything suddenly runs perfect then I suspect that you have some CV (constant voltage) boards interfering.  

 

 

Which "connections" are you refering to.
 
Gremlins are everywhere, lol.  I can certainly sympathize with that.  My only Lionel Op Acc are the Fueling Station, Dispatch Board and the Gateman, and they are rarely used.  I put them on the layout as they are from the childhood of my BF.  Nostalgia, ya know.  Presently they are not on deck as I'm just rebuilding.  Just track some loose buildings, freight cars and engines.  I don't like cabooses lit, looks like a weannie roast they're often so bright.  So no lights there either.
 
Thanks for chiming in!
 
Originally Posted by Susan Deats:

Cheryl, the only accessories that interfere with the DCS signal are the postwar operating accessories with the ac motors with brushes and they have to be running to cause interference.

 

To keep my signals strong I occasionally have to retighten all my connections.  There's a gremlin in my Run Room that loosens connections.

 

Last edited by Charly

Try powering the FasTrack switches on track power. Put the jumper back, disconnect the separate source power wires and put them back in place.

 

I had some issues and while searching for a solution and finding other problems, it seems that unless you are running conventionally and need live switches in "dead" track situations, powering them from track power is the simplest and most reliable configuration.

 

They are designed to primarily run that way, use very little power, so won't really impact conventional operation.

 

I can't explain or speculate on an electrical reason, only that my research and experience with the recommendations of many reveals that they operate the best and cause the least amount of problems powered by track power.

Last edited by Moonman

Add Reply

Post
The DCS Forum is sponsored by

OGR Publishing, Inc., 1310 Eastside Centre Ct, Suite 6, Mountain Home, AR 72653
800-980-OGRR (6477)
www.ogaugerr.com

×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×
×