Junior.  you just said the Rev G runs the outer loop fine, and you had problems with the inner loop.  Before spending money on a new TIU, I try switching the feeds from the inner and outer loops, where they connect to the TIU.  If the outer loop still runs fine, there is no problem with that TIU.

Great idea RJR...I will do that first thing! Taking this approach will also prove that I have a track block issue I need to resolve....

Hi All.....

Cracked the case on the Rev. I TIU to check the connections between the motherboard and channel connectors. Loose? You better believe it!

Tighten them all down and reran signal tests on my test track using PS 2.0 and PS3.0 engines. Guess what? 10s across the board for both engines and absolutely no Out of RF Range messages! And I ran 50 screen refreshes!

Guess the first thing I'm gonna do when my Rev. L TIU comes in is open it up and check those connections.

IIRC, my Rev L has lock washers on the terminals (could have been lock nuts or lock tight, it's been a while). I checked it once some time ago after reading here about the loose connections and problems others have had. Also, others here often recommend adding the lock washers to the older TIUs as well. Sounds like you are good as new! I'd probably still check your new Rev L just to be sure.

RTR12,  Probably was chinese loctite.  That's what my Revs H & L had, and it was useless.  Nuts were loose.

Junior, I suggest you purchase a bunch of metric nuts, size M4-70.  My local Ace has them.  Also purchase a bunch of internal star washers; these won't be available in metric but just get the smallest that fit over an M4 bolt.  Internal star washers have the teeth facing inward; external, which won't work because the teeth won't bite into either nut, have the teeth facing outward.  After you've tightened the existing nuts, add a star washer and another nut, and tighten them down.

RJR posted:

RTR12,  Probably was chinese loctite.  That's what my Revs H & L had, and it was useless.  Nuts were loose.

I was really thinking mine had the lock washers, but now you've got me wondering? The only thing I can say for certain is that they were all tight when I checked. Guess I will have to take another look to see what's really in there.

I think mine is an early Rev L, around summer of 2012 or so. The old memory just doesn't retain this stuff like it used to....

"The old memory just doesn't retain this stuff like it used to...."

Cheer up, rtr.  The memory is much better now than it will be next week.  I know from experience.

Gee thanks! Something to look forward to, if I can remember what I was looking forward to... 

At least you reminded me I forgot to look inside my TIU!  

Hi All;

Sorry...was away for a day. 

RJR - I will pick up those nuts and lock everything down.

RTR - BTW.....it's next week.....what did you say?! 

Glad you got it.  Loose connections in the TIU and along the wiring and track can cause issues.  I am not sure your OUT of Range message is Remote to TIU, I think that is engine to TIU again caused by the lower signal.

Some early TIU do not talk well to the PS-3 and some PS-3 engines internal wiring can cause degradation of signal also.  Wiring to close to the processor and signal transformer.

A search will show some post on how the diesel wiring needs to be.  Basically making sure all the capacitors lay flat along board (horizontal) and the wiring above them.  When the wiring lays flat along the board and the caps are up, you may have a PS-3 engine that can hurt DCS signal, including effecting other PS-3 engines.  G

I would like to add to GGG's comment, to inspect the caps soldered connections to the circuit board, if you do have to bend the caps over. Sometime they break loose.

Junior, I don't recall.  By way of excuse, I've been too busy trying to find out what is a TIU, that rtr forgot to look into.

Interesting that MTH went from soldered connections on the initial Rev Gs, to nuts on later models.  You'd think that soldering would be about the same cost & time as putting on nuts & tightening them.

GGG posted:

Glad you got it.  Loose connections in the TIU and along the wiring and track can cause issues.  I am not sure your OUT of Range message is Remote to TIU, I think that is engine to TIU again caused by the lower signal.

Some early TIU do not talk well to the PS-3 and some PS-3 engines internal wiring can cause degradation of signal also.  Wiring to close to the processor and signal transformer.

A search will show some post on how the diesel wiring needs to be.  Basically making sure all the capacitors lay flat along board (horizontal) and the wiring above them.  When the wiring lays flat along the board and the caps are up, you may have a PS-3 engine that can hurt DCS signal, including effecting other PS-3 engines.  G

file:///C:/Users/pcuser/Desktop/Trains/PS3%20board%20wire%20rerouting%20and%20board%20check%20advice%20needed%20with%20photos%20_%20O%20Gauge%20Railroading%20On%20Line%20Forum.htm

Thanks GGG, WillyGee, RJR and Dave for the tips. Geez....so much for RTR out of the box!

WillyGee....not sure what I'm supposed to do with the link you provided....is an access path to a file down load on the OGRR web site?

Junior posted:

Thanks GGG, WillyGee, RJR and Dave for the tips. Geez....so much for RTR out of the box!

WillyGee....not sure what I'm supposed to do with the link you provided....is an access path to a file down load on the OGRR web site?

copy and paste to your address window and the post should show.

file:///C:/Users/pcuser/Desktop/Trains/PS3%20board%20wire%20rerouting%20and%20board%20check%20advice%20needed%20with%20photos%20_%20O%20Gauge%20Railroading%20On%20Line%20Forum.htm

Willy,

file:///C:/Users/pcuser/Desktop/Trains/PS3%20board%20wire%20rerouting%20and%20board%20check%20advice%20needed%20with%20photos%20_%20O%20Gauge%20Railroading%20On%20Line%20Forum.htm

That link won't work. It's a link to a file on your computer's Desktop. It's not a link to the Internet.

try this.

PS3 board wire rerouting

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...ce-needed-with-photo

Junior posted:

Hi All;

Sorry...was away for a day. 

RJR - I will pick up those nuts and lock everything down.

RTR - BTW.....it's next week.....what did you say?! 

RJR posted:

Junior, I don't recall.  By way of excuse, I've been too busy trying to find out what is a TIU, that rtr forgot to look into.

Interesting that MTH went from soldered connections on the initial Rev Gs, to nuts on later models.  You'd think that soldering would be about the same cost & time as putting on nuts & tightening them.

Sorry guys, I've now forgotten what this entire thread was about so I am going to have to start over at the top... 

Actually this has been fun! Side steps the thread a little, but we need a little fun thrown in with all the serious stuff. Glad to have others around that also like to participate in this little off track type of stuff (also helps with the aging process as well!)  

Out of RF range also happens with 900 MGZ interference 

At our train club the other night between 530pm and 1030pm I got that message, three different ps3 engines lost MOVE control but all other things worked on the engines . We have 5 TIUs(all Rev l) in supermode wired passively ,with a master remote . We’ve had issues with Lionel legacy interfering with DCS, so we only use one at a time . After 1030pm everything worked perfectly , why ,because we are blocks away from Republic airport .When I arrived at 530 there was heavy air traffic landing , this has happened several times before . 

After 1030pm no more planes landing ,all three engines in the same remote worked perfectly with full control of everything! Switching back and forth between engines was a breeze! 

I saw the same thing happen at MTH because they too are near BWI airport .

They got around that by tethering their remotes to the TIU with the proper phone cable . 

I now have a spectrum analyzer ,I have to set it up and test for interference.

I would also like to test the digital signal with a oscilloscope which I don’t have yet.

I went to MTH REPAIR SCHOOL and worked on several TIUs and found all kinds of problems with them, from RF ISSUES TO wiring connections. More testing is required to find where the signal degrades and how much interference is around the building . Just my experiences .

Fred B 

MTH ASC

I always liked the approach of tethering the remote.  But... is it possible to tether more than one at the same time (multi-operator scenario?)

Ted,

is it possible to tether more than one at the same time (multi-operator scenario?)

Unfortunately, it is not possible to do so. When a remote is tethered to a TIU, both of those devices will talk only to each other.

However, if you suffer from 900 MHz interference, you could avoid the problem altogether by using the DCS App rather than the DCS Remote. The WiFi frequencies are much less susceptible to interference than is the unregulated 900 MHz band.

Everything that you need to know about DCS is all in MTH’s “The DCS Companion 3rd Edition!" This book is available from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, or as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store!

Everything that you need to know about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 2nd Edition!" This book is available from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store!