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I picked up a cute little Hornby at York last fall.  I really like it but it just doesn't go as far as it did for the first few wind ups.  I checked it for debris,  oiled all over.  Not sure what the issue is.   Although the first few wind it seemed to take more tension.   Now after a few turns there is a pop noise - like a wind stop maybe?  Don't know if its actually working as designed or not, it the only one I have!

jhz563 posted:

I picked up a cute little Hornby at York last fall.  I really like it but it just doesn't go as far as it did for the first few wind ups.  I checked it for debris,  oiled all over.  Not sure what the issue is.   Although the first few wind it seemed to take more tension.   Now after a few turns there is a pop noise - like a wind stop maybe?  Don't know if its actually working as designed or not, it the only one I have!

If it is popping, it sounds like the spring is broke unfortunately. That is usually a sign of the tension releasing. Sometimes it could be broke where it attaches to the winding axel and can be fixed. I haven't worked on clockworks, but did work on a pull-start spring. I don't have great advice on how to work on them. I just know it isn't easy. One thing to do is to lock the spring with something like a zip tie before disassembling the drive.

George

Clockwork is my favourite motive power. 

I like the pur noise of the governors as they kick in.It’s closer to steam power (in my view ) in that it is a stored energy.
I also enjoy the mechanical aspect and find them more logical to work on then elec-trickery ones.

Here are just few pictures of the many ones I have had over the years...

 

20B6E386-1DEC-4639-BAE8-8E3664DF4DDE4EFA2E53-A8B1-417F-A539-894B6C692B8E87284E83-F48A-4F90-8A34-639427DDB25000615876-3912-4379-A97C-D6EBD05094134D3E9B8D-E03C-4B6C-A3D6-1F13E24C88D4

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I concentrate on collecting O gauge windup toy trains that were made in the USA.  The majority of my collection are Marx, but I'm a fan of Ives, Hafner, and American Flyer too.  Plus, I like the Durham windups even though they are made overseas.  Yes, I do have a few from across the Atlantic as well...

This is a view of part of my windup train collection, as well as my windup layout.  The layout is all two-rail track with no track power... all I run are windups and the occasional battery powered train:

2019July27Layout1

I'll look through my pictures and pick some out for this thread...

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Here are a few of my favorites from the windup fleet:

1912 Ives:

1912IvesFinished3

1922 Ives No. 6... nothing rare, and has a broken pilot, but is a favorite because it is such a nice running locomotive.  I bought it with a motor that had exploded (not unusual when something turns loose and a fully wound mainspring unleashes all that stored energy at once) and did a lot of work to it to get it running.  The governor was broken, so I replaced it with a modified Marx governor.  By happy accident, it runs relatively slow and for a long time:

FinishedIvesOnTrack

1936ish era reversing Marx Commodore Vanderbilt.  It was a "train wreck" that I restored some years ago, given to me by one of my Marx friends.  These early Marx locos with the die-cast drivers and screw-in key are nice running locomotives:

2012-11-21Finished2

Marx Canadian Pacific 3000 - not only is it a hard to find locomotive, it's a treasured gift from (another) Marx friend of mine that also frequents this forum:

Marx3000CP

One last one, a custom I made from some Marx 401 windups... my 1203 Marx Triplex.  Yes, it has three Marx windup motors in it.  It will pull quite a few cars around the layout:

1203-1

OK, that's all for now.  It's hard to narrow down distinctive or favorite windups to post!

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I still have my Hornby 0-4-0 boyhood set with the braking slide, which I run now and then. I'll have to dig it out for pics. All the gents across the pond who used to run timetable-operated, scenicked clockwork layouts have all passed on, but there are a few pics out there. Norman Eagles' Sherwood layout was probably the best known - I have the June 1971 Railway Modeller article around here somewhere, and read it when I get the clockwork bug.

 http://www.binnsroad.co.uk/rai.../sherwood/index.html 

https://reader.exacteditions.c...ssues/60900/page/104

https://reader.exacteditions.com/issues/59883/page/76

 

page 76

 

 

 

WindupGuy posted:

I concentrate on collecting O gauge windup toy trains that were made in the USA.  The majority of my collection are Marx, but I'm a fan of Ives, Hafner, and American Flyer too.  Plus, I like the Durham windups even though they are made overseas.  Yes, I do have a few from across the Atlantic as well...

This is a view of part of my windup train collection, as well as my windup layout.  The layout is all two-rail track with no track power... all I run are windups and the occasional battery powered train:

2019July27Layout1

I'll look through my pictures and pick some out for this thread...

this is really nice, wish I could bring some of my cw over

Cool. I'm new to the forum. I didn't realize there were so many clockwork guys out there!  And actually running them on great clockwork layouts!  It's all great!

I have a few clockwork (windup/I know there is a difference) sets in my collection. The photos are of my Marx and Unique sets. Don't mind the dust, they are on a shelf in my office above the windows near the ceiling.  I have been meaning to get up there and dust!

marxunique

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Just to answer a couple of questions about my layout:  I haven't done a thread on it, although I may do so in the future.  My roadbed is 1/2" MDF that is cut to size using a jigsaw.  I painted it with a textured stone spray paint to simulate ballast.  I really like the look of it, but the downside is that it is a lot of work to make changes to the trackplan.  On my previous windup layout, I used gray sandpaper cut to shape to simulate the ballast... much easier to make changes to the trackplan, and that layout went through several major trackplan revisions.

Here is a picture of the engine terminal on the new windup layout - it gives a better view of the roadbed:

2019Sept17-2

On my previous windup layout, I cut, painted, and installed extra ties on the mainline.  I did like the look of it, but I haven't yet done the same thing for the new layout... it will need a lot more ties than the old 4x8!  Here is a view of the old layout in it's final form before I dismantled it:

Layout_2019-1

I really liked the engine terminal on the old layout, although it was in a cramped area.  The wonderful little cast iron locos used to congregate there:

EngineTerminal2016April18

I just started on the new layout last year, so I don't have a lot of videos of it yet.  Most of the videos on my YouTube channel were shot on my old layout.  Here is one of a little Lionel diesel switcher that I converted to windup power using a somewhat modified Marx Riser Gear Motor... it runs for almost 8 minutes on a single winding:

Finally (for tonight) here is a pre-war American Flyer #429 that I converted to clockwork power with a custom made, dual mainspring motor with mostly Marx Ratchet Motor internals:

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Ohhh this thread was made for meeeee! ( lol )

I have a peculiar addiction to clockwork and it is combined with the ability to treasure pretty much ALL forms of locomotives, whether they be cartoonish or scale , I embrace the toy-like nature of many offerings and dont get too serious about it . I only really have one main rule ... no plastic

My collection spans pretty much from the early 1900's up to the late 50's with an occasional 60s ( mainly Japan after 1960)

I have pretty much posted every loco and carriage on the forum that I have.... lol .. so will spare you 1000 odd photos and just whack up some faves and oddities 

The first train I collected , a 1920's Karl Bub ( Now I have 6 variations of the same )

A CzechIGRA boxed set

A Mettoy Set (UK)

A French Louis Roussy ( LR ) .... ( I have a particular fondness for French trains)

A Wells Clockwork Minnie and Mickey ( UK )

A Rico HO streamliner set from the late 30's ( Spain)

Clockwork Lionel

British Marx

Perhaps the rarest set I own, a 1934 Bing British made by Stephan Bing when he fled Germany and in the period before he set up TRIX , He also built boats ( another foible of mine , clockwork boats! )

French Charles Rossignol

The Grandfather of the collection 1900's Ernst Planck

Hornby Zulu , one of the first Hornby trains produced C.1922 It was the non-constructional version of the Hornby Clockwork Train (1920) which could easily be disassembled and reassembled as they were constructional like meccano .. The Zulu marked the evolution into tab and slot construction for Hornby.

A slightly later Hornby M1

A mystery Loco possibly Wells/Brimtoy/maybe Bing which is outfitted in a factory cow catcher , possibly for the US Market?

A Johann Hoefler set

Not just tracks either ... I love my Tippco ( Germany) Floor train too!

I also have a few Robilts and Maurlyn's , Aussie trains but they have already made an appearance

I think I have taken up waaaaay too much real estate with this post already but I have one favour to ask from the knowledgeable folk here ... while in essence not train related I bought the item below recently ...

I have searched and searched and come up with ONE reference which denotes it as a BING from the late 20's

Just wondering if anyone has seen it in a catalogue ? (mine is slightly different from the pic I found )

C1927??? Bing??? Sumpfboot??? ( swamp boat)

Still on its way here from Europe ( UK ) no markings I can see and the only reference is here ...

History Toy page

Photo of their version ...

( I think I am on a real rarity here ? apologies for non train subject but I thought if ANYONE knows they might be found in our great group of collectors )

 

 

That looks like a early version of an "air boat" but with pontoons for a hull holding up the clockwork propeller drive.    Love the UK style Bing set.   Bing did some great work.  The majority of the nice Bassett Lowke stuff made before they got their own shops going in the UK was done by Bing.  WJ Bassett-Lowke helped out Bing and Carette(I believe) escape the rise of the Nazi party and helped them get restarted making trains in the UK.   Love the video.  I always keep all of my trains clean and lightly oiled to minimize wear and tear.  But I do run them as I believe they were ment to be run and sitting allows them to get stiff.  I also do not fully wind any of my CW trains or my over 100 year old mantle clock.  I dont know of anybody in the states that can replace a main spring in a CW train.  Not sure our local clock shop would attempt it or not.       AD

Got three American Flyer clockwork engines, here's a No. 1 with a 328 tender. I have posted this picture before, but it's still a good one. Also have two No. 13 Type XIV's, one with a red 119 tender and the other with a closed frame 120 tender. One was a set (No. 13 with 120 tender) and the other I bought coaches at the same time I bought the engine and tender.

No. 1 with 328 below:

20190308_152813

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Fatman posted:

Ohhh this thread was made for meeeee! ( lol )

I have a peculiar addiction to clockwork and it is combined with the ability to treasure pretty much ALL forms of locomotives, whether they be cartoonish or scale , I embrace the toy-like nature of many offerings and dont get too serious about it . I only really have one main rule ... no plastic

My collection spans pretty much from the early 1900's up to the late 50's with an occasional 60s ( mainly Japan after 1960)

I have pretty much posted every loco and carriage on the forum that I have.... lol .. so will spare you 1000 odd photos and just whack up some faves and oddities 

The first train I collected , a 1920's Karl Bub ( Now I have 6 variations of the same )

K

A CzechIGRA boxed set

 

A Mettoy Set (UK)

 

A French Louis Roussy ( LR ) .... ( I have a particular fondness for French trains)

 

A Wells Clockwork Minnie and Mickey ( UK )

 

A Rico HO streamliner set from the late 30's ( Spain)

 

Clockwork Lionel

 

British Marx

 

Perhaps the rarest set I own, a 1934 Bing British made by Stephan Bing when he fled Germany and in the period before he set up TRIX , He also built boats ( another foible of mine , clockwork boats! )

 

French Charles Rossignol

 

The Grandfather of the collection 1900's Ernst Planck

Hornby Zulu , one of the first Hornby trains produced C.1922 It was the non-constructional version of the Hornby Clockwork Train (1920) which could easily be disassembled and reassembled as they were constructional like meccano .. The Zulu marked the evolution into tab and slot construction for Hornby.

 

A slightly later Hornby M1

 

A mystery Loco possibly Wells/Brimtoy/maybe Bing which is outfitted in a factory cow catcher , possibly for the US Market?

 

A Johann Hoefler set

 

Not just tracks either ... I love my Tippco ( Germany) Floor train too!

 

I also have a few Robilts and Maurlyn's , Aussie trains but they have already made an appearance

I think I have taken up waaaaay too much real estate with this post already but I have one favour to ask from the knowledgeable folk here ... while in essence not train related I bought the item below recently ...

I have searched and searched and come up with ONE reference which denotes it as a BING from the late 20's

Just wondering if anyone has seen it in a catalogue ? (mine is slightly different from the pic I found )

C1927??? Bing??? Sumpfboot??? ( swamp boat)

Still on its way here from Europe ( UK ) no markings I can see and the only reference is here ...

History Toy page

Photo of their version ...

( I think I am on a real rarity here ? apologies for non train subject but I thought if ANYONE knows they might be found in our great group of collectors )

 

 

Nice Plank! 

I’m thinking your swamp boat might be a reproduction. There are a lot of them being made now. I have a few repro Paya windup cars. The people in them look similar to yours.

George

George S posted:

Nice Plank! 

I’m thinking your swamp boat might be a reproduction. There are a lot of them being made now. I have a few repro Paya windup cars. The people in them look similar to yours.

George

My mind went down the reproduction path too George

The bloke also looks like the Marx tractor drivers too However in my searches not even reproduction models showed up ? Which I would assume they would if they were like the Paya re-issues (*cough chinese made )

I didnt pay a lot for it but it was listed rather badly too as possibly an Arnold (which I am pretty sure it isnt  )

I dunno , things like the patina on the brass prop collar etc

It's either been repainted or exceptionally well stored , the ref pic above shows the Bing as painted rather than litho as well ...

I think the only way to figure it out will be when it gets here if I can see the mechanism ?

Another thought I had is after the 1st world war Japan was ripping off some of the weirder toy designs so it might be from that era as well ... Light bulb going off!!!

( rushes to check my photo gallery )

Bingo???

Key on it has the same markings as a post WWI Japanese Automatic Car set up I have ( idea stolen from Technofix)

 

Interesting to note the box this came is has Made in Japan painted out and the car is marked FOREIGN ( which the UK instituted as Made in Germany had "stink" about it at the time , so manufacturers instead had to mark as "foreign, japan did the same on many toys between the great wars )

This set was made by WU which has very limited information ... I hit a brick wall researching this one too

So maybe early Japanese which opens a whole 'nother can O worms

 

 

Last edited by Fatman
artfull dodger posted:

I dont know of anybody in the states that can replace a main spring in a CW train.  Not sure our local clock shop would attempt it or not.       AD

I've replaced a lot of main springs in various makes of windup trains, so if you have one break, don't worry, you can probably fix it yourself. 

I'll do one little plug for my book, "Windup Train Repair"... it's available on Amazon if anyone is interested. 

Gotta keep those windup running!

This little Hornby tank dates to 1928 or so, and is the only CW I own. I bought it so that I could run something during power outages.  It is in "as found" condition, but has a powerful mechanism that allows a good run in comparison to other CWs I have seen. It also has the distinction of being one of the two locomotives that I have sent to the floor of the "concrete canyon", and it survived with a bent cab, which I then unbent. I picked it up in the 90's when one of my TCA sponsors  was closing his train store. I am very fond of it.

hornby tank [4)Hornby Tank

hornby tank [4)

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Last edited by jay jay
WindupGuy posted:
artfull dodger posted:

I dont know of anybody in the states that can replace a main spring in a CW train.  Not sure our local clock shop would attempt it or not.       AD

I've replaced a lot of main springs in various makes of windup trains, so if you have one break, don't worry, you can probably fix it yourself. 

I'll do one little plug for my book, "Windup Train Repair"... it's available on Amazon if anyone is interested. 

Gotta keep those windup running!

I am going to double plug James's book

Most worth getting , and YES you can repair/replace a spring yourself without too much drama

 

I have not exactly replaced springs in windup sets, but I have taken apart a number of Edmonds-Metzel (Early American Flyer) engines and worked on them.  I got a junker for $20 and took it apart to see how difficult it was to take apart.  Then after acquiring other Edmonds-Metzel engines with issues, I started swapping good parts from my junker.  So far, I have swapped out a broken brake lever in one engine, a bad gear in another, and a bad axle/set of geared drive wheels in another.  So that $20 junker has paid off over the years.  

NWL

OK enough people have posted and I dont feel like I am hogging the thread now

A Mettoy Schools Loco ( Eton) (UK)

With carriages and a very early Wells (UK ) crane truck

You have probably seen the Lionel reproductions ( of a sort) but here is an Original Arnold A570 Shunting train from the 30's

Same model (but not mine) lifted from youtube .. mine does work well tho

Kids were easily amused in the 30's lol

 

K.B.N. ( Karl Bub Germany) Set late 20's/30's

Some Brimtoy/Wells/(UK) I got from the Michael D Foster Sale in the UK after he published his latest book .

The USA does have a few in my hands

Ives No5 & 17

Marklin R950

"A Study in Red "  ( Brimtoy Chad Valley & KBN )

1st production of Wittrock ( Denmark ) Hand painted

And then they could afford Lithography and fancy cut out side rods

 

 

 

 

BingBritish ( Stephan Bing in England 1934 as opposed to Bing, British lol )

Wells

Chad Valley

 

Hornby

 

 

JEP

Tipp & Co floor train

Unknown possibly Carette/Distler

Bing

Distler

Robilt

Karl Bub

Ottmar Beckh

Lionel

Bing

 Technofix  240 Rangierende Lok  (1938)

Biller Bahn ( modified to run both narrow and O Gauge)

Karl Bub

 

thanks ! more to come lol

As you can see I dont mind rough n ready just as much as shelf queen

As always I apologise for the quality of some photos as I havent actually sat down with most of the collection for a proper photo shoot , most are taken by people to show me whats coming lol !

Triang factory overpaint ( was a blue export but then made to BR)

Maurlyn (australia)

Even got a Marx

Hornby Saddletanks ( HO )

Masudaya ( Modern toys)

Mettoy

Multiple Jouef ( with a technofix in the foreground)

Wells

A Gaggle of late model Hornby HO Clockwork

Loren Bolz ( LBZ)

Johann Hoefler

Real French Hornby BB-8051

Hachette Hornby reissue

Bing

C.B.N ( a few theories but no definitive maker lol)

American Flyer

J de P ( Jep)

 

Louis Roussy

Unique Art

Hafner

Hafner

HWN (Wimmer)

From this boxed set which even includes a tiny tin steamroller on a flat car

Jep

Jouef 1950s (HO)

Rico Renfe set 1930's ( HO )

Hafner

Hornby tricolour set

Joyline

Marklin

Well, now that I am laid off from work indefinatly(FCA) its time to play with some trains. The Duke of York came yesterday, but I cannot find my #10 clock winding key to save my life now.  I know I have one some where!   My other live steamer and coaches should be here today, so time to run some steam since I cannot find my winding key.   Pics of the Duke shortly, our power is out so it a bit dark in the train room.    AD

Fatman, C.B.N. is Karl Bub.  According to Bowes  (Issmayer & Bub Trains - The Secret History) it was possible that immediately after WWI Bub changed the trademark to CBN because of anti-German sentiment.  His book also has a picture of a boxed set with the locomotive sporting "CBN" under the cab windows while the box cover clearly shows the windmill KBN logo.

I enjoy running clockwork trains almost as much as collecting them!  So, here are a trio of older videos of mine showing some windup trains in action...

First up is a train that actually doesn't belong to me - it was a cooperative project between myself and Steve Eastman, who is very active on this forum.  It's a wonderful Ives No. 19 that basically needed a new mechanism built inside the original motor plates:

Next up, a little American Flyer clockwork running in passenger service around my old windup layout:

Finally, a Joy Line passenger train making the rounds:

Ok, here is my Bassett-Lowke Duke of York.  These were a prize give away if your dad/uncle/grandpa chain smoked enough BDV cigarettes to get the coupons needed to get one.  Guess there were lots of smokers or familys that smoked  as there are lots of these out there,  I have heard 100,000 of these were made at a loss at the BL factory in the UK.   There was also a Bing 0-4-0 that was part of the BDV coupon give away, anybody have one of these?  Would love to see what it looks like, hope to add that one to my collection eventually.  ADDuke

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artfull dodger posted:

Well, now that I am laid off from work indefinatly(FCA) its time to play with some trains. The Duke of York came yesterday, but I cannot find my #10 clock winding key to save my life now.  I know I have one some where!   My other live steamer and coaches should be here today, so time to run some steam since I cannot find my winding key.   Pics of the Duke shortly, our power is out so it a bit dark in the train room.    AD

Protip#1 ( lol )

One of the best tools for us clockwork guys is a clockmakers Spider

Has every loco covered pretty much ( up to #10 usually ) Available online pretty easily

Fatman posted:
artfull dodger posted:

Well, now that I am laid off from work indefinatly(FCA) its time to play with some trains. The Duke of York came yesterday, but I cannot find my #10 clock winding key to save my life now.  I know I have one some where!   My other live steamer and coaches should be here today, so time to run some steam since I cannot find my winding key.   Pics of the Duke shortly, our power is out so it a bit dark in the train room.    AD

Protip#1 ( lol )

One of the best tools for us clockwork guys is a clockmakers Spider

Has every loco covered pretty much ( up to #10 usually ) Available online pretty easily

I have one of each hanging on the wall.

Steve

I got a Key on the way.  I must have let my #10 go with the last engine I had a few years ago that used it.  I am not planning on having a lot of CW models.  I wanted atleast 1 in the collection though.  Next will be a electric driven BL Royal Scot, but I want the 20v AC drive model.  With being on layoff at work, that is all on hold right now.   Just gonna enjoy what I have now for awhile.    AD

1906 Clockwork windup train

The Austin Tinplate Trackers used to setup every year at the SAMRA Model train show in San Antonio, Texas. For many years one of their elder members would run his clockwork train pictured above. On one wind it could go all around our layout. It belonged to his dad and I think he said the engine and 3 orange cars were from 1906 and the yellow car was from 1903. It was always nice to see it run next to the big modern equipment.  

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Last edited by Texas Eagle 77

Well I don't have too much in clockwork but here are a couple of "fun" sets...not too rare but fun anyway.

Here is a set called the Red Flyer...its Marx from the late 40's. 

Marx Wind up ExpressMarx Wind Up Express - Departing

Here is a late Marx set, from the 70's.  I love the motto on the box (top left)..."We make it...It can take it!"

All plastic, including the track, but O gauge nonetheless.

Marx mechanical set box topMarx mechanical set contents

Best Regards, Don McErlean

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Wow Big Mark, way to up the ante with the beautiful Vauclain and the Ga 1 Märklin Scotsman. The only larger Locos I have are a Bing Precursor Tank in Ga I and a Bing Bowen Cooke in Ga II.

ok so this is the seldom seen Bing for BL NBR Short Precursor

NBR Tank Loco

and a very scarce NER Bing for BL 0-4-4 Tank loco

109 Bing B-L NER 0-4-4 Tank

and the Märklin LNWR Experiment

212 Marklin Experiment

Cheers

Roland

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I need a bib for my drool over these rare and beyond my means models!!   If I had some of those O gauge ones, I will do away with the gauge 1 track on my outdoor railway and retrack with gargraves and built a line to be operated by clockwork. The outdoor raised line has 10' diameter curves and 40' long straights.  Plenty of room for a multi station clockwork railway.  And the temptation is strong, but I would have to sell my gauge 1 live steamer and track to afford a scale change and pickup more gauge 0 motive power/rolling stock.  

 

Last edited by artfull dodger
rdigilio posted:

Wow Big Mark, way to up the ante with the beautiful Vauclain and the Ga 1 Märklin Scotsman. The only larger Locos I have are a Bing Precursor Tank in Ga I and a Bing Bowen Cooke in Ga II.

ok so this is the seldom seen Bing for BL NBR Short Precursor

NBR Tank Loco

and a very scarce NER Bing for BL 0-4-4 Tank loco

109 Bing B-L NER 0-4-4 Tank

and the Märklin LNWR Experiment

212 Marklin Experiment

Cheers

Roland

Very nice Roland, a friend has a NBR short precursor tank like yours, in fact I recall he has something like 6 different pre grouping versions, including the hard to find ones like the NBR, Caledonian etc. Your NER "M7" is off the scale though! I've seen a fewe gauge 1 examples, I actually missed one a couple of years back, annoyingly, but I've never seen another O gauge example. The Marklin Experiment is a lovely loco too, I know a couple of friends who have LNWR examples, but I've just got the LMS version, shown here at an event with a friends LNWR.WP_20200115_19_12_07_ProWP_20200115_19_12_24_ProWP_20200115_19_13_16_Pro

 

And here's my Experiment with my Bowen Cooke tank, photographed at the same event.

WP_20200115_18_44_12_Pro

For fun today here are a Märklin,a Bing for B-L (ca1913), a lithographed Carette for B-L (ca 1911) and the Enameled Carette for B-L (ca 1907) It is interesting to note the early Carette is closer in size to the Märklin and is a similar colour (we are talking English trains here ) to the Carette Gauge III Sterling Single. The Bing and Litho Carette are very similar in size & livery.

atlantics copy

I had to paste the Carette enameled loco from a different shelf so it may be slightly larger then real life , but not by much,

 

Cheers

Roland

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Last edited by rdigilio

Another American Flyer back on the rails today:

AF2020-14

I don't know how much extra time I'll be able to get in the shop during this social distancing time - I'm working from home, but the past week has been very hectic with work - hopefully I can get some repairs knocked out.  A mainspring arrived in the mail today, so I took some time out to install it, and as a result this little AF project ran down the track for the first time today.  It needed a bit of motor work, including new side plates:

AF2020-13

I'm doing what I can to keep the clockwork trains running.  There is a certain Dorfan clockwork that is still lurking on my workbench as well... 

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Last edited by WindupGuy
WindupGuy posted:

Another American Flyer back on the rails today:

AF2020-14

I don't know how much extra time I'll be able to get in the shop during this social distancing time - I'm working from home, but the past week has been very hectic with work - hopefully I can get some repairs knocked out.  A mainspring arrived in the mail today, so I took some time out to install it, and as a result this little AF project ran down the track for the first time today.  It needed a bit of motor work, including new side plates:

AF2020-13

I'm doing what I can to keep the clockwork trains running.  There is a certain Dorfan clockwork that is still lurking on my workbench as well... 

Something vaguely familiar about that.

Well, the pictures that have been posted so far in this thread really do take my breath away.  I have never seen locomotives of these types much less be able to collect any.  So I will fall back to the mundane and just put out "what I got!"  Here is a little Marx "Joy Line" wind up loco from the mid-thirties I expect.  This one has a 3 car passenger consist but it also came with a freight consist with such cars (as labeled on the car) as the "Hobo Rest" boxcar and the "Venice" gondola.  What a hoot!  At least with these you can never lose the key

 

Marx Joy Line Loco

Well...Keep Winding

Don McErlean

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  • Marx Joy Line Loco
Don McErlean posted:

Well, the pictures that have been posted so far in this thread really do take my breath away.  I have never seen locomotives of these types much less be able to collect any.  So I will fall back to the mundane and just put out "what I got!"  Here is a little Marx "Joy Line" wind up loco from the mid-thirties I expect.  This one has a 3 car passenger consist but it also came with a freight consist with such cars (as labeled on the car) as the "Hobo Rest" boxcar and the "Venice" gondola.  What a hoot!  At least with these you can never lose the key

 

Marx Joy Line Loco

Well...Keep Winding

Don McErlean

A nice loco Don. It may be smaller but is nothing but mundane - especially if it when viewed through the eyes of a 5 year old during the depression - not even the real flying Scotsman would have looked so grand 👍

I concur @Jamie Thompson

The big boys although now made of "Unobtainium" to a lot of us , were " Do not Touch !" to many kids of the era I am betting LOL!

And just like them we have to drool from a distance in many cases even now . Thats why I like this hobby, there are so many facets and directions one can take collecting these object d'art that it caters for all

Each and every one was someones pride and joy , which is why I dont mind collecting "roughies" and toy-like variants as much as highly prized ones . They all gave smiles And the toys that were loved and used the most show the battle scars and wear them proudly .

Even when a kiddy's Dad could not afford a "real" train set I bet the smile on his face was wide unwrapping something as simple as ...

I don't have any shelf queens except a 403 switcher , All my "toys " my kids have been able to run depending on age , I like things that need fixing , if they ( the kids ) get to play with them they may grow up loving them and keeping my "stuff" when I'm gone. I'll buy stuff just for them after fixing  it up , if damaged I'll refix it. Thats the beauty of it , keep it going , let youngsters play with it ,to enjoy it like most of us as kids , I still have my Lionel 202 set I got when 8 years old. Here's a Hafner 1010 I fixed up for my grand daughter she calls it Barnie , and there are others. 

How many of you folks acually repair items other than clean and lube ? I know some are very good at detailing , but can they do a "Sir James" the windup guy on them. Whats the use of having a 63 corrvet in the garage if you never drive it ? 

Anyone care to differ !imagesHafner 1010 grape repaint 001 was a mess

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Fellows you are right!  Sometimes as a collector I forget these were TOYS and Fatman’s right each one was someone’s pride and joy. The mid-thirties were tough times and I bet that little joy line set did bring joy.  Jamie Thompson thank you for the comment on my Joy Line loco. 2-2-Twain guy WOW!  If the blue loco is the “after” on that Hafner it’s just super!  Great work!

Stay safe safe and healthy every one 

Best Regards

Don McErlean 

 

 

2-2-twainguy posted:

How many of you folks acually repair items other than clean and lube ? I know some are very good at detailing , but can they do a "Sir James" the windup guy on them. Whats the use of having a 63 corrvet in the garage if you never drive it ? 

Anyone care to differ !

I've had people contact me that are attempting their own windup train repairs, so I know there are some other kindred spirits out there.  Hopefully, threads like this will help draw other fans of mechanical trains out of the woodwork, including those who like to tinker on the mechanisms.

Those of you that know me are aware that I really like to run my windup trains!  But to be fair, I do have some shelf queens (not to mention more "future projects" than I'll ever get done).  There are some locomotives that are in my collection because of their historical significance and not their operational ability.  For instance, I am a huge fan of the Marx Commodore Vanderbilt.  I have examples of the earliest mechanical CV's with the swing-peg with the wheel governed motor.  Those motors are notorious for their poor operation due to the design of the governor and issues with zinc pest.  I do my best to make them operational, but as a practical matter, the wheel governed Marx rarely see the rails.  They just aren't going to run great without modifying the mechanism, and I want to keep them original.  

Regardless, I do my best to make my locomotives operational.  For the rarer of the breed, I attempt to keep them as original as possible.  However, sometimes I like to explore the limits of what can be done with windup trains, and have built motors for more pulling power or long distance operation...

LD_V2_Internals

So many projects, so little time... 

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Mike, we are on the same page.  I have quite a few common locomotives - mostly Marx - that I bought just to run.  I would say my engine with the most miles on it would be a plain-Jane Marx 833 with a late model riser-gear motor that I installed.  It is one of my train show locomotives that sees constant operation during our local meet, and more operation on my layout the rest of the year.  As of now, the only problem it has had is a broken die-cast mainspring hub... they are under a lot of stress, and occasionally fail.  I machined a new mainspring hub out of yellow brass a few years ago, and the motor has been running without any problems since then.

The broken mainspring hub.  It failed in the journal area that rotates in the sideplate:

DSCN9803 [533x800)

I have been keeping an eye on the drive axle pinion gear, as it is showing quite a bit of wear.  I plan to run it to failure, and then I have an idea for a good, durable repair on it.  

This is my portable windup layout, with a typical windup train display of mine at our local train show.  The 833 is the locomotive on the inside loop with the freight train, and the outside loop is occupied by a Marx CV in passenger service:

2016TrainShowDisplay

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Two versions of the Hafner M10000. The blue version has single axle cars that connect together to make an articulated train, and also has a battery powered headlight. 

The red train has individual two axle cars that couple together.

Both have a bell that dings as the clapper hangs down below and bounces along the ties. The blue set came boxed with a figure eight track set up with banked curves. My O gauge track runs  completely around the outer20200323_12170020200323_12171820200323_121511 walls of my 25'x30' basement and these trains can make a complete circle on one winding.

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Guys:  This is really turning out to be a hot thread and the pictures are really amazing.  Windupguy - great lay out and collection.  Steamwolf - I admit to being jealous, where did you find the green / yellow "Bogota " type cars, they are really neat.  I have the red and blue but no green.  MarkS - welcome and the AF Zepher is neat.  We with had a number of M1000's from several manufacturers but the Hafner ones in the box were new to me, never saw them before...Thanks for posting.

Finally, as I reviewed the posting of JHZ53 i spotted what looked like an M-O goods set (id of the loco was hard, it could also be a type 20 or close) Know it has to be post '48 as it has BR livery on the tender.  What struck me is that I have a very similar M-1 Goods Set with the 3435 tender instead of the BR livery making it perhaps late 40's (48 or so).  It is very similar to the one in JHZ53's picture except my open top wagons are imprinted with "Pre-Nationalization" livery (LMS & LNE).  Anyway here are some pictures.

 

Hornby Set box editedHornby M-2 Set [edited)

Well I guess I have to go back to distancing myself from everyone...not that they mind!

Don McErlean

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  • Hornby Set box edited
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Haven't a clue what happened with the photos in my last reply, but here they are again. And it isn't all rare, high end stuff at Carne Towers, here's a Mettoy Eton with 2 matching Pullman cars.WP_20200115_19_12_07_ProWP_20200115_19_12_24_ProWP_20200115_19_13_16_ProWP_20200115_18_44_12_ProWP_20170401_15_50_21_Pro[1)WP_20170411_18_21_29_Pro [2)And finally, my accumulated herd of 1920s type Hornby No1 tank locos, acquired over the course of more than 25 years. A couple of cheeky electric interlopers hiding among them, but can't redo the photo without them right now!

 

Cheers, Mark

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Don McErlean posted:

<SNIP> Steamwolf - I admit to being jealous, where did you find the green / yellow "Bogota " type cars, they are really neat.  I have the red and blue but no green.  <SNIP>

Don McErlean

Don, an eBay user "garmarx" had them, along with one of the two Seaboard clockwork FM diesels. I'm still sour that another bidder sniped the Seaboard caboose. I've purchased several unique things from him in the past including that loco and some other freight cars. He's a super good dude and always packs stuff very well. 

Last edited by SteamWolf

Steamwolf:  Thanks for the tip.  I will see if I can find "garmax" on the Bay.   I am waiting on 2 E-bay packages at the moment.  One an AF Prewar passenger set where I won an auction (meaning I likely paid too much)  and the other a French Hornby clockwork set (just engine, tender and one passenger coach + a modest amount of track but still in the box ) where we bargained to a final price but no auction.  I liked this seller because not only was his price reasonable but he was willing to bargain and he offered free shipping.  That should be at my place in about a week.  Will post pictures when it arrives. 

Again thanks for the comeback on the coaches

Don McErlean

Don McErlean posted:

<SNIP>

Don McErlean

Yeah! No problem. He's got a pile of new marx up right now.

I hear you on the 'paid too much' thing, happens to me all the time. What really chafes my dish is the stupid global shipping program... but that belongs someplace else, there are a modicum of adequate sellers on there still.

Tin! Windup! There! Now my post is relevant! 

Last edited by SteamWolf
jhz563 posted:

@Don McErlean

Here's a couple extra pics of my Hornby loco.  I don't know anything about Hornby, so I appreciate your investigative work.  I love the logo on the tender.

20200324_22101320200324_221032

Hiya

You have a Hornby No 20 Loco and Tender in British Rail livery from the mid 60's .

These were probably about the most produced loco and at the cheapest end of the range , but yours looks to be in quite nice condition , there are lots out there, but not too many really nice ones.

 

 

 

As you will see they came in both "Goods" and "Passenger " versions , boxed with 2 carriages or wagons and a oval/circle of track . Set numbers were No21 ...

And No.20

 

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jhz563 posted:

Well I checked this whole post, and I didn't see this little gem anywhere.   When is a Lionel not a Lionel- when it's a Schylling!?  I don't know anything about the company,  but I love this little hand car. 

20200324_220247

Complete with it's own lunchbox style case!

20200324_215834

20200324_220318

 

They made a non-Lionel version also in green I believe.

jhz53: As Fatman showed you, you have a No.20 loco and wagon.  These were made from 1954 - 1968 (about the end of production in Gauge O).  The key thing about the logo on the tender is that it was the first recognition by Hornby of railway nationalization in the UK which had actually taken place in 1948.  The MO locomotives represent perhaps the largest production in Gauge  O and were sort of the base sets available (a bit like Lionel 0-27).  In the Postwar era they became more toy like and were pointed at the "playroom" than than at the serious modeler.  The No 20 is a member of the  MO "class" and was the first Hornby Gauge O trains to appear in the British Railways livery .  The MO Goods set (freight) and Passenger Sets were revised in 1954 and became known as the Goods Train Set No 20 and Passenger Train Set No.21. The No 20 loco and tender were in a dark green livery, lined in orange and black with a cabside number in British Railways style.  The logo you like so much on the tender is known as "The Lion and Wheel" emblem and was the first representation of BR.  The No 20 wagon that appeared in your first picture, is the same wagon as the MO wagons BUT instead of being decorated in the livery of individual railways came in BR standard grey without any specific lettering.  Why did it take from 1948 to 1954 for Hornby to recognize railway nationalization...who knows?  There were always shortages of materials and production in the postwar years and they could hardly keep up with demand so there was little incentive for a substantial change in the product line especially at the "low" end where it was likely that their patrons (primarily children) would care that much. 

By the way, as an interesting sidelight you are seeing the near end of Gauge O production.  Hornby had discovered a very strong market interest and sales in their  "Dublo sets" Gauge OO or near HO . In fact they had determined that the market was so strong for these smaller sets that even though a Dublo set cost about 1/2 the price to make in production as compared with O they could sell it for 2X what they traditionally sold the Gauge O sets.  In addition, given the continual shortage of materials in the postwar era, they could make nearly twice as many trains with the same amount of material.

I have a M1 Goods Set from 1948 (according to the dated inspection slip still in the box) and it is in the pre-nationalization livery.  The construction of the engine and most of the litho is identical to your No. 20 except it carries "Hornby" in black letters under the cab windows and the engine number vice the "Lion and Wheel" on the tender.  My wagons are identical to yours in construction but the livery is again the pre-nationalization railway names.  Here are some pictures:

 

Hornby M1 Locomotive Hornby M1 open LMS wagonHornby M1 open LNE wagon

Great stuff guys and it was really interesting trying to research the data.  Note:  For your interest, most of the data that I found was contained in..."The Hornby Companion Series, The Hornby Gauge O System by Chris and Julie Graebe", New Cavendish Books, 23 Craven Hill, London W2 3EN, 1985.  This is a really neat book however it is about 75% - 25% devoted to the pre war era and it does have a higher concentration on the more expensive lines. 

Best regards everyone

Don McErlean

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  • Hornby M1 Locomotive
  • Hornby M1 open LMS wagon
  • Hornby M1 open LNE wagon

This item is not a train but it winds up and was made by Marx. It is a prototype model for a windup stationary engine that apparently would have been used to power various accessories.  The flywheel is the same part used on  Marx prewar steamrollers. The rest is hand painted including gauges, pipes, and a Marx logo. The base is marked "7-12-38, Erie, #1640".  I'm not aware of Marx ever putting anything like this into production.20200326_16563620200326_16571620200326_165803

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20200326_165056

Well guys the "E-Bay Fairy" arrived at my doorstep today and left a great package.  It is a Marx, clockwork (Mercury), Circus Train.  NO it was not originally made by Marx it is a custom paint job by (at least to me) an unknown modeler.  As you will see from the pictures however, whomever actually made it did an outstanding job even the paint, which I am sure was sprayed on looks like a baked on paint job.  Anyway, the engine motor works great, it came with an oval of track and THE KEY!!

Anyway I hope you agree, this thing is going to be fun to run around the layout and maybe the Christmas tree.

Marx Circus Train - total train

Here is the full train

Marx Circus Train - loco

The loco, a Marx wind up Mercury I believe.

Marx Circus Train -tender & dump

The "oil" tender and a dump car - perhaps to offload base material for the animals

 

Marx Circus Train - pole car and Performers car

The "Pole Car" for the poles to erect the tents (and yes it has a load of "poles"aboard) the the "performers car"

Have a great weekend fellows...I'm off to the Circus

Don McErlean

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  • Marx Circus Train - total train
  • Marx Circus Train - loco
  • Marx Circus Train -tender &amp; dump
  • Marx Circus Train - pole car and Performers car
Don McErlean posted:

Well guys the "E-Bay Fairy" arrived at my doorstep today and left a great package.  It is a Marx, clockwork (Mercury), Circus Train.  NO it was not originally made by Marx it is a custom paint job by (at least to me) an unknown modeler.  As you will see from the pictures however, whomever actually made it did an outstanding job even the paint, which I am sure was sprayed on looks like a baked on paint job.  Anyway, the engine motor works great, it came with an oval of track and THE KEY!!

Anyway I hope you agree, this thing is going to be fun to run around the layout and maybe the Christmas tree.

Marx Circus Train - total train

Here is the full train

Marx Circus Train - loco

The loco, a Marx wind up Mercury I believe.

Marx Circus Train -tender & dump

The "oil" tender and a dump car - perhaps to offload base material for the animals

 

Marx Circus Train - pole car and Performers car

The "Pole Car" for the poles to erect the tents (and yes it has a load of "poles"aboard) the the "performers car"

Have a great weekend fellows...I'm off to the Circus

Don McErlean

Nicely done fantasy piece. FYI, it’s a CV, not a Mercury 

Steve

Mark S. posted:

 

Mark, what a neat and simple design. Fascinsting! Maybe there wasn't the same fascination with clockwork stationary steam engines than there was with the real thing at the time. Mamod was founded in the UK a year before that prototype, and Wilesco, albeit 38 years in the manufacturing industry by then, only began making stationary engines in 1950.

Careful that 'connecting rod' doesn't poke your eye out! 

Last edited by SteamWolf
Mark S. posted:

This item is not a train but it winds up and was made by Marx. It is a prototype model for a windup stationary engine that apparently would have been used to power various accessories.  The flywheel is the same part used on  Marx prewar steamrollers. The rest is hand painted including gauges, pipes, and a Marx logo. The base is marked "7-12-38, Erie, #1640".  I'm not aware of Marx ever putting anything like this into production.20200326_16563620200326_16571620200326_165803

Very interesting find there Mark !!!

Looks Like Marx were diddling with a clockwork powered version of the Hess( germany) Dynamobil

I just happened to pick one of these up myself recently

Well, you know the movie..."The Postman Always Rings Twice" ... well it worked.  Today after receiving my Marx Circus set yesterday, I got delivery of another "e-bay" find also clockwork and it has been are real challenge in sorting it out.  It was advertised on the bay as "Hornby" which it is in one sense, however when I got it opened and looked at the lithographed logo on both the engine and cars it read..." Fab En France, Mecanno Paris, Serie Hornby" so it is actually French Hornby.  As best I can figure, this set is part of the French "Train Express" which was the equivalent to the English MO trains.  The loco number on the tender is 3615 while the logo under the cab window is a manufacturing mark.  While it likely does not make much difference in value, it is a "new" make for my collection and just a little different from the standard Hornby set.  Here are some pictures:  Note - I have no idea what might have once been put into the 4 rectangular holes in the cardboard that are just outside of the ends of the straight track.  In addition, this set did not come with the box "top" which would likely have yielded more data. It did however come with a complete oval of track including a set of "stop" rails AND THE KEY!!  By the way, the motor runs really nicely, smooth and without any gear noises. 

French Hornby MO set- set in boxFrench Hornby MO set - full setFrench Hornby MO set - loco

 

Maybe I should have saved this for Front End Friday ... note the smoke lifters which seem to be far more common on continental loco's than on those designated for the UK market. 

BY THE WAY ...anyone know what happened to the "Buy / Make anything new for your layout - tinplate version" ?  It seems to have disappeared from my listing.

Have a good weekend, Best Regards, stay healthy

Don McErlean

 

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  • French Hornby MO set- set in box
  • French Hornby MO set - full set
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This French Hornby train was available in 3 versions. No 1 with 1 passenger car (as you have), No 2 with two cars and No 3 with 2 cars and a small station like this:

Before the war the locomotive did not have smoke deflectors; so your version is postwar.

The rectangular holes in the box are for the sleepers of the curved rail. I assume the box top looked like this, since M0 and Train Express had the same box tops:

Regards

Fred

 

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Last edited by sncf231e

Fred THANK YOU! I was fairly sure that you and some of the other experts would have some additional information on the set.  I was fairly certain it was post war as my reference showed the picture under that category with the comment that the MO trains "re-appeared" in 1956 after "being discontinued in early 50's" and then ran almost to the end of production in 61. 

That box lid is spectacular, far cooler than the normal Hornby box.  I know now why someone kept it sometime in this set's life.  When you mention "sleepers" for the curved rails I expect you mean that they would be raised on the outer circumference to help keep the train on the track on the curves.  Is that correct? 

Thanks for posting the data...

Don

Don McErlean posted:

 

BY THE WAY ...anyone know what happened to the "Buy / Make anything new for your layout - tinplate version" ?  It seems to have disappeared from my listing.

Have a good weekend, Best Regards, stay healthy

Don McErlean

 

Was moved to the Photo Forum. This makes no sense because every thread now is basically a photo thread, so just group by subject.

Will posted:
Don McErlean posted:

 

BY THE WAY ...anyone know what happened to the "Buy / Make anything new for your layout - tinplate version" ?  It seems to have disappeared from my listing.

Have a good weekend, Best Regards, stay healthy

Don McErlean

 

Was moved to the Photo Forum. This makes no sense because every thread now is basically a photo thread, so just group by subject.

This makes no sense. This thread will be moved too, and then nobody will have any idea what’s going on. There will be no classification of discussions because they have photos. Next, they will add a whole sub-classification under the miscellaneous-photos section that mirrors the rest of the forum. Come-on Man!

George

Mark S. posted:

This item is not a train but it winds up and was made by Marx. It is a prototype model for a windup stationary engine that apparently would have been used to power various accessories.  The flywheel is the same part used on  Marx prewar steamrollers. The rest is hand painted including gauges, pipes, and a Marx logo. The base is marked "7-12-38, Erie, #1640".  I'm not aware of Marx ever putting anything like this into production.20200326_16563620200326_16571620200326_165803

I was looking for something like this to drive old German steam toys. I don’t really want live steam on my layout for safety reasons.

George

Don McErlean posted:

Well I don't have too much in clockwork but here are a couple of "fun" sets...not too rare but fun anyway.

Here is a set called the Red Flyer...its Marx from the late 40's. 

Marx Wind up ExpressMarx Wind Up Express - Departing

Best Regards, Don McErlean

I have the same Marx Red Flyer set, my only wind up. Need to work on the flint for the sparking effect.

EE8C4B26-ED3D-4706-A500-C51B2D5F691F_1_201_a4F062B67-62AC-4FB1-956C-6BDDC023F76E

9BE08D40-C967-4F6D-9AD1-3A1839F9EC5D

Original instruction sheet.

3A55B7E1-431A-448D-8004-22DA0C0BE3387F010ECC-753E-4BCC-8CB1-0D79B1814F3E

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Jim O'C posted:
handyandy posted:

Nothing special, a less than mint Hafner set and a couple of Marx locos.

 

 

NIMG_20200108_183931

looks like a couple of bodies were swapped here. red/brown brown/red but I like the contrast.

Yeah, I was going to switch them back, but found one coupler mount broken off of the brown frame. That explained the switch.

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