Well, I seem to have misplaced the set of fast acting circuit breakers that I purchased three years ago. I was planning to use them on my post-war ZW transformer.
If anyone can refresh my memory as to where to buy them and what to look for, please HELP !!
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I believe I found them on Mouser Electronics.
Dan, I use those on each channel with DCS. I can run three modern engines with smoke and be at 4 amps. The 5 amp version may not be high enough for older motors, but 5amps cover everything I run on one loop. They aren't as fast as electronic models, but they trip fast in a short. I use the 3 amp ones for buildings and lights to protect the smaller wires I use there. The buildings and lights are powered with 300 watt computer power supply that has such a fast overload protection that I have never had a 3 amp breaker trip.
Dan, I use those exact models from Mouser... I chose the 8 AMP rating and my experience has been that they trip very quickly during a derailment. I have been really pleased with how well these work for over 5 years now. I think I drilled a 5/8" diameter hole with a forstner bit and used a small dab of DAP 3.0 black sealant in the hole to anchor them.
Dan,
I use the 10 Amp Resettable Breaker Banks you can purchase them at Train Electrics LLC, you must call to order however 231-631-0047. I like the set of 4 Breaker Bank, easy to install and use.
PCRR/Dave
In the photo there is a set of them just to the right of the DCS HHRC.
Thanks for all the replies. The 8 AMP may be the way to go. I've been used to lower amperages with my LGB stuff, getting used to higher amps from smaller trains seems odd.
Dan,
Hay the 8 Amper's are great, I had some 7 Amp Breaker Banks from the original company Train Electrics bought out (Scotts), however they are no longer available from the new company, and I donated the 2 resettable Breaker Banks long ago, thinking I could purchase more anytime I needed them. Very foolish move on my part, even worse that Penn Hills layout is not being done any more. Bummer.
PCRR/Dave
Dan Padova posted:I believe I found them on Mouser Electronics.
Dan, those are thermal breakers, which I think is all that you need. Fast-acting breakers are at least an order of magnitude more expensive.
I have a 5 amp and 8 amp being shipped from Newark as we speak.
I've been researching circuit protection for my ZW as well. Yesterday at my local electronics supply store, I picked up 2 circuit breakers: a 5 amp and a 10 amp (both thermal breakers), hooked them up to my ZW, and here's how they compare to the trip time of the breaker inside the ZW as well as the breaker on a modern MTH Z750:
ZW internal breaker: 3.79 seconds
10-amp external breaker: 2.95 seconds
5-amp external breaker: 1.12 seconds
MTH Z750 internal breaker: .43 seconds.
Quite a difference here. How fast is needed for adequate protection?
John
BlueComet400 posted:
Quite a difference here. How fast is needed for adequate protection?
What load?
What are you trying to protect? Breakers are for current protection only. Won't save electronics.
I'm trying to protect the few modern MTH trains that I own. I've recently invested in upgrading a PS1 loco to PS3 and don't want to lose any of the electronics. I run mostly prewar.
Breakers are for transformer & wiring protection from over-current, not the trains & electronics, which need over-voltage protection from spikes & transients(many of which happen during a short or derailment).
By the time even the fastest electronic or electromagnetic breakers trip the damage has been done... and it is cumulative. Very akin to hearing loss.
Using fast acting breakers will not do any damage, though.
What you need for the electronics is Transient Voltage Suppression.
Thanks, Rob. I thought the purpose of the breakers was to protect the electronics of our modern trains. That being the case, what do you suggest to protect the trains?
Many thanks,
John
What you need for the electronics is Transient Voltage Suppression.
Ok, thanks Rob. I bought 3 of them yesterday when I bought the breakers; I saw on another thread the ones that Gunrunner recommends, but I wasn't sure what they're for. I'll study the posts in the link you gave me and go from there. If I understand correctly, the TVS protects the electronics in the trains / accessories, and the breakers protect everything else on the layout. Correct?
Thanks again,
John
John,
If you are running DCS the TIU has built in TVS protection, nothing more is required, if not then you must to rig something else up, couple different ways the guys are doing it.
PCRR/Dave
BlueComet400 posted:...If I understand correctly, the TVS protects the electronics in the trains / accessories, and the breakers protect everything else on the layout. Correct?
Well, you are still talking two types of protection.
TVS installation will protect everything on that circuit from overvoltage/spikes.
The breakers that transformers come with are ample to protect themselves from over current. The advantage to smaller breakers for various power districts is to provide more over current protection for wiring that is undersized, and also if one breaker trips it doesn't shut down power from the entire transformer.
John,
Rob is correct, you definitely want some kind of TVS protection thru out your layout and you also want the fast acting 7-10 Amp Resettable Breakers between your Transformer and your TIU, on every Red line leading to your mid track, especially when using the old ZW's & KW's with their slow blowing old type Internal Breakers. I even use them with my modern Transformers, easy to install and easy to use and they safe guards your layout.
PCRR/Dave
Dave, I went to that company's web site and they don't sell the 10 amp resettable breaker anymore. Any ideas?
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