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I just pulled the trigger on a Geep 7; it was listed as a #370, but has knuckle couplers, so I guess it's really a #371(?) Here's a photo from the listing:

Flyer GP7

This will be my first AF diesel; I've learned my way around their steamers pretty well, but this will be a new adventure.

In anticipation of its arrival (which should be Monday) I have doing some online research as to what to expect. I don't know if it actually runs; will (obviously) know more once it gets here...

With that in mind, any advice/hints/what to look for would be most appreciated. Thank you.

Mark in Oregon

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  • Flyer GP7
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Mark -- I have a 370, 371 and 372 -- which are all pretty much the same once you get past the plastic shell. I think I'd start by removing the shell and then putting it on the track/test stand to see how well it runs.  The obvious thing to look at - assuming it does run - is the wear on the brushes on the motor.  IIRC, these are held in place by some spring clips (I haven't had one of my Flyer GP-7s apart in a while...).  Likely you may want to clean the commutator - contact cleaner on a Q-tip works.  If its been run a lot, then there are other issues to check out, like wear on the bushings, etc. -- none of which I've encountered, so I've no expertise to offer.  But there are others on this forum who do.

One truck is powered and the other is not.  So its worth pulling the plates off both  - for the unpowered one just to check that there aren't any bent axles or weird wear.  On the powered side, you'll want to check whether the old lube is caked and hardened -- even if not, its probably worth digging it out and relubing.

Then there is, of course, the e-unit - minimum maintenance would be to take contact cleaner to the drum, fingers, etc.  Since you know your way around the Flyer steamers, you'll already know this.

Here's a link to Chuck Harringtons terrific website that has scans of the Flyer repair manuals, parts diagrams, etc.  This is the clearest diagram (for the 371) but you can scroll to either side and find the 370 or 372...  http://myflyertrains.org/gallery/album209/371_2_001

Last edited by richs09

Also on the powered truck, you will want to try to rock the axles back and forth and up and down to determine if the axle holes are worn.

This is a common problem with AF diesels that have seen a lot of run time in their life.  If there is excessive movement, you will want to have the holes drilled out and new bushings installed.  Running a AF diesel with worn bushings will damage the motor and gears over time.

FYI there are different wiring diagrams for the GP7 series of engines.Make note of yours before complete dissassembly.If you take it apart and do a complete cleaning you need make sure you center the field inside the yolk.There two centering screws on each side of the field.Loosen them remove and clean your motor then center and tighten the screws.Diesel motors are bit more tricky than steamers.If you go on YOUTUBE Precision Flyer Repairs has an excellent piece about the parts of diesel  motorl....Best of luck

Thank you Russ, that's good to know. I am re-watching some of those videos with that in mind. It appears that the powered truck is not all that different from the HO scale types used on Mantua/Tyco diesels.

Typically, I don't expect any engine I get off eBay to run when I first get it, so the more I can learn in advance, the better. If I can get this to run as well as my #300 or #310, I'll be happy...is that reasonable?

Thanks to everyone who has chimed in so far; I will let you know how it's going... 

Mark in Oregon

Since the shell was repainted it is not a surprise more changes would be under the hood. That is likely an old selenium disc bridge rectifier. If you want to run this engine on AC either an old Gilbert reverse unit needs to be found and installed or a modern Dallee electronic reverse unit is needed. The Dallee is $45. Rebuilt reverse units are $35, used are cheaper.

...2 hours later... 

Ok, I had this apart and cleaned everything; it was a mess. The shell is stamped "1951", and I'm guessing the grease that had turned to cement was original stuff. 

Anyway, when I apply (DC) power, the lights come on but nothing from the motor. I know that you can by-pass the reverse unit on a steamer by using a jumper between the #2 and #3 sockets, and putting juice to #'s 1 and 4. Is there some way I can do something similar here to by-pass that rectifier, just to test to see if the motor runs?

Thanks!

Mark in Oregon

I don't have any experience with these old rectifiers, so I'm not sure my advice is worth very much.  If you apply power and don't hear anything from the motor -- or see it try to move - you might try to poke around a bit with a volt meter to see if the rectifier is even working.  If you have a DC power supply - even a DC wall-wort that puts out a few volts - you could remove the rectifier and see if you get a response just using DC (you'd have to figure out what the wiring should look like - maybe some combination of seeing how its currently wired and looking at the DC wiring on Chuck Harrington's Flyer repair manual site.

Depending on how much more $ you want to sink into it - if the motor works, you might want to consider the Dallee unit mentioned earlier - it will be a lot more reliable than an old Flyer e-unit.  And you will be able to use your AC transformer.  Without some sort of reversing unit, you won't be able to reverse the loco when running with an AC transformer.

Can you make the motor move by trying to spin the rotor (hard to get at) just to make sure its not locked up for some reason?

richs09 posted:

I don't have any experience with these old rectifiers, so I'm not sure my advice is worth very much.  If you apply power and don't hear anything from the motor -- or see it try to move - you might try to poke around a bit with a volt meter to see if the rectifier is even working.  If you have a DC power supply - even a DC wall-wort that puts out a few volts - you could remove the rectifier and see if you get a response just using DC (you'd have to figure out what the wiring should look like - maybe some combination of seeing how its currently wired and looking at the DC wiring on Chuck Harrington's Flyer repair manual site.

Can you make the motor move by trying to spin the rotor (hard to get at) just to make sure its not locked up for some reason?

Thanks Rich

Point 1: I have several good DC supply units; I just don't know which combination of (2) of the (4) wires I need to hook up to the DC power in order to test the motor.

Point 2: One of the motor bearings was frozen up tight; as I say, I took it all part, cleaned everything and now it turns fairly freely: just not under power. 

Didn't I once say that tinkering with these things is my favorite part of the hobby...? 

Mark in Oregon

It is likely the old rectifier is bad. Hard to be sure from that picture but it looks like the original universal motor and wiring are present. The yellow, red, green and black rainbow cable wires are at the rectifier, unsolder them. This is a simple series universal motor. Ignore the two wires coming from the power pickup for the test. Two of the rainbow wires go to the field and two go to the armature. Connect one field wire to one armature wire. the remaining field wire and remaining armature wire can be connected to any AC or DC power source of 15V or less that will supply at least 1 Amp. If the motor is good it will spin.

Let us know what happens.

Thanks guys! 

While you were responding, I was trying to come up with the correct combination to make this work: there are (5) contacts on the rectifier. I played around with them until I hit upon (from top to bottom) #'s 1 and 4. The motor runs (pretty well) in one direction only (as it turns out, it's "forward", with short nose first). 

I was puzzled as to why only one direction, until I remembered that if you use a jumper in a steam engine, that too will only go "forward", so I guess for now I'll live with it, running on DC, until I get a Dallee unit. I'm guessing those come with some sort of wiring schematic(?)

In the meantime, since I want to run this on AC, how would I re-wire it? I would disconnect the rectifier, then...?

Mark in Oregon

It will only run in one direction on AC without a reversing unit installed. To use AC temporarily connect the two wires in my post above to the pickup wires from the trucks. Hopefully it runs forward. If not swap the two field wires.

The Dallee units come with a connection diagram. The 2A version will work with the 370.

Thanks Tom

So let me get this straight: the two field wires are red and black; the armature wires are yellow and green. The green wire runs from the motor to the non-powered truck connection, not to the rectifier. The rectifier gets a red, yellow and (2) black wires. there is actually a jumper (red) between the black field and the top connector, hence the (5) contacts. If I connect the field and armature wires as you described, then where does the wire from the non-powered truck with pick-up go?

Forgive me for being dense, but I don't want to muck this up: which wires go where?   

Mark in Oregon

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