Is 17' x 15' Too Small For 2-Rail Scale

Mike,

No space is too small, and - - - -  No space is ever  big enough for what you want.    

You could build a nice switching layout in that space.    Or represent part of a branchline.

However, if you are not interested in operation,   You could do a single or double track loop.   I would stick with 54 or 60 inch radius so there is some straight track area to put in some switches and run some industrial siding into the corners.

Another option is a twice around folded figure 8.     You put a crossover (diamond) at one end and of the room and fold one of the loops of the 8 inside the other.    It can be scenicked as double track, but gives twice as much running room for one train.    

Jim Policastro did a 2-rail O scale layout in 12' x 6'6" -- continuous run. If switching is of interest, all you need is about 12'x3' for North American; about 8'x2'6" for European. I'm working on a design for a 10'x10' room right now (continuous, 40" radius curves).

It's perfect go for it.

Around the room layout for broad curves and an island interior for industry, town, engine facility etc,

My favorite track plan from years past was an HO design that was In Model Railroader called the Smuteye Central.  I always thought what a killer O scale layout it would make.  So here is what It might look like in your 15x17 space.  Russ

HO layout

O Scale 15x17

Opinion here - go for the biggest radius circle or oval that will fit your space, then double- track it, then pull a branch line off at any radius you want and create your switching yard, maybe on another level.

That's what I did - 14x28 - and the giant 17/64 scale 4-10-2s can actually run double-headed with 80 foot cars.  I still have plans for the yard, but no patience to sit and switch cars.  Best I can do is hold a Margarita and watch.

Mike.

Before I make a suggestion I would need two things.

1. Your age.

2. Your health status.

As good as some layouts plans look, if you had a bad back and can't duck under things or reach areas forget them. If your getting to the stage in your life where you want to make it easy for yourself or this layout is going to be the one for the rest of your life think about around the walls.

If your a fit young bloke and want to set the world on fire and build anything you like without the worry of age or health any plan would suit you.

My layout fits in a 28' X 28' room I could show you what would fit in your space by overlaying your space on my track plan if that helps.

Roo.

Wow wonderful information guys thanks.  I'm OK with ducking under for now. I  plan on building the layout at a higher bench height with custom displays below so I can look at my trains and have easy access to them.  Maybe in 10 years my wife will let me have more of the basement but I am not holding my breath.  My  concern is will a 60" radius allow for operation of larger steam locomotives or modern day locos?  I realize there are limitations and concessions in trying to do 2 rail O in such a small space.   Yes in the last few years my hands have gotten larger and eyesight worse I fully expect the trend to continue.  So maybe O is the way to go over S.  All of my kids will be off to college this fall and time to play in the train room. 

Here's a short and very poor quality video of my small loop,the loop is roughly 14' x 8' with a small cramped engine yard off in one corner,I have two hinged sections now,just inside the room door and one to access the window without ducking under,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTN9VM9m5QI

Thank you for the video it looks awesome!!

its a simple layout,before I got to where I am now,I just had a handful of 2 rail diesels,it was a follow up to my main 1/50 diecast hobby and love for miniature machines,fast forward to now,like was said above I wish I had more room,unfortunately in Ireland big spacious rooms are unheard of,I could have put more sidings or another loop inside the original loop but I wanted to leave room for future 1/50 based scenery/dio,I too would love to see other 2 rail layouts set up in tight spaces

Can I suggest you will soon get tired of ducking under. A lift up section is easily incorporated at the building stage.

cheers

 BobC

gbarnewall posted:

Here's a short and very poor quality video of my small loop,the loop is roughly 14' x 8' with a small cramped engine yard off in one corner,I have two hinged sections now,just inside the room door and one to access the window without ducking under,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTN9VM9m5QI

Nice work.

Bob Comerford posted:

Can I suggest you will soon get tired of ducking under. A lift up section is easily incorporated at the building stage.

cheers

 BobC

This is true. Lift outs or gates are fairly straight forward.

I bet that's a good feeling, Graham. 

 

I have plenty of rolling stock I can convert.

Well, hold off on that until you make some decisions regarding era and objectives - they may be better sold off to finance in part items that you would rather have later.

Operation is not that important to me.  Even in 3 rail I don't think I could do a lot of operating in this small space of 17' x 15' .  However, I would like a few sidings for industry etc.  What I like is realism and scenery.  I enjoy  watching prototypical engines and cars roll by.   Era is most anything 1940's to modern.  One problem I can see is I like passenger trains. 

Not a bad or a too small space; what constraints do you have in the room beyond a doorway?  All clear walls?  No water tank, furnace, electrical panel, laundry stuff, windows, etc.?  Around the perimeter would seem best to get the max radius for those pass cars post 1940 on main lines, but you also need to work with that entry way, and you also need to avoid making anything so deep that you can't reach realistically.  Height is also something to consider and stacking levels round and round with hidden returns might add extra interest and complexity.  Height also might gain you storage space and access ease, too.  If you go with a short line or branch line you can compress somewhat.

Does anyone have any track plans for a space such as this?

 

More information and a balancing of given's and druthers might seem in order before jumping into the water. 

Here's that little 6'6" x 12' layout I built that Matt mentioned.

...and an old fuzzy video of it:

Jim

Your space is more than adequate. I work in 11' x 17 ' and never felt I had a small space...get busy and enjoy the 2 Rail experience. Here's a photo of my mainline at 50" radius with a 46" radius runaround siding next to it.

Bob

Dear Mike,

First of all, welcome to 2 Rail O scale !!!!

I thought you might see what a layout 12'x 18' can produce in 2 Rail O scale.

When I designed this layout I had as Marty pointed out my" Givens and Druthers".

Givens- At 60 years of age I wanted to use as much off the shelf items as possible.

Prepping the room with proper lighting and other amenities before rather than after layout built.

No more hand laid track or measuring for grades-Atlas track and Woodland Scenics, Mianne benchwork.

Outside main westbound loop to run my trains and act as a" moving interchange track" as a portal to the outside world.

Inside eastbound main track to switch the inbound cars in the 6 industries and set off the outbound cars to the moving westbound moving interchange track.

Trains to peddler freight length- 6-9 cars. Locos 2 axle diesels or 2-8-0. Passenger- 2 cars or RDC /gas electric.

Detail, detail, detail the layout. That is what O scale is all about. O scale size trees, not the mamby- pamby commercial made ones- go outside and look what God has made!!

No turntables or yards-takes up lots of space- starts out as a nice idea until they are populated by locos that don't run and freight cars collecting dust-dust is not weathering !!!- and of course-spiders!!

Druthers- Radius constrains to Atlas 49.5", 45" radius.Turnout-hand thrown-Atlas #5's

I wanted to pop up's in the layout so I put down the good old Harbor Freight anti-fatigue mats.

Welcome to 2 Rail Oscale- You have received some excellent advise from some of the best layout builders on this Forum!! Take heed!!

Try to attend a O scale only show like Chicago at St.Patty's Day weekend since you live in Sheboygan,WI.

John P.Dunn Sr. Scale2Rail Promotions

                            Strasburg Show- 04/22/2017

My space is about 19' x 21, I have a two level layout, 2 track mainline, 56" minimum radius,
I run cab-forwards and any kind of diesels, E7s are my biggest, come on-15' x 17' in a great
space for O scale, use your imagination my friend! You can do it! ncng

John, nice going! That up and over figure 8 is something I've done in N. Makes the run more interesting, I think. Plus you've taken advantage of Atlas' various radii track pieces.

Dan Weinhold (Yep, I'm looking forward to April in Strasburg.)

gbarnewall posted:

Here's a short and very poor quality video of my small loop,the loop is roughly 14' x 8' with a small cramped engine yard off in one corner,I have two hinged sections now,just inside the room door and one to access the window without ducking under,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTN9VM9m5QI

I just watched your video & would like to know more about the massive, yellow, mobile crane at the 20-second mark on the video. Is it a 1:50 scale model of a Liebherr LTM####?

Thanks,

Naveen Rajan

Here is a video of my first O scale layout that measured 14' X 16'. I removed the duck under and the track about six years ago when I planned to start another layout. No progress on the new layout as of today.  Jim.

While my space is a little larger I wanted to note that my minimum mainline radius is 56" and 60" and I can run some large engines on it.

Also, Bob, John, ITRRFAN and others, it is great to see you guys making your spaces work so nicely.

Had some fun just playing around.  15x17 looks to be a good size.  Used Atlas 54 inch radius for the curves.  Russ

ChiloquinRuss posted:

Had some fun just playing around.  15x17 looks to be a good size.  Used Atlas 54 inch radius for the curves.  Russ

Hello ChiloquinRuss

I LIKE that track plan of yours as probably in few years, we may get lucky to buy a home (low-cost-home from HUD) and would use such a great plan of yours    I have box of Atlas "O" O99 curves (45.5 inch radius) still sitting in the box not use since 2012 because we live in small apt.  How many Atlas 40" straights are needed for this plan ?

"When people sin, they earn what sin pays - death. But God gives his people a free gift of - eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 6:23 ERV (Easy to Read version)

Tiffany

Thank you Russ.  That provides a nice perspective of what can be done.

I like john's givens and druthers.    I do disagree that yards especially and engine terminals take up space and are used as parking places.    if you are interested in operations, a yard can be a big part of it, and definitely not a storage lot.    For example, on my layout I have a 5 track yard that can hold about 60-70 cars.   My operations include through freights that come from some staging and continue to staging.   They drop off and pickup cars at the yard.   These are cars going to or from industries modeled on the layout.   Then local freights originate at the yard, getting engines from the engine terminal and deliver and pickup cars from the local industries.    In a normal operating session of about 3 hours, every car in the yard is changed.    

So yards and engine houses may certainly have a use on an operating layout.    

Another very important consideration in my opinion in some form of connection to the rest of the world.    This can be a staging track, hidden or not, that holds a train.   Or it can be a track designated as an interchange with another RR that just holds a string of cars.      Having an outside connection gives your operation a purpose and provides a place to send any kind of car.    And if you have two of them, you can send car types not used on the layout, from one to the other justifiably.

"How many Atlas 40" straights are needed for this plan ?"  I've added a passing siding that can be used for a runaround for the peninsula and the industrial area.  Russ

Russ, great job on the track plan but I just want to mention that the prices you show are out of date. For instance, the 7056 40" flex track now lists for $18.25 with a street price of around $17 and #5 turnout lists for $91.95 with a street price of around $87. 

Atlas O off the Internet TODAY! Russ

Russ, that's an old website.  To my knowledge JD Trains is no longer in business. I am not trying to be a jerk. I just want anyone reading this thread to have accurate information. Straight from the Atlas O website it says the retail for a 40" piece of flex is $18.25. Please let me know if you know of a place that actually sells it for $13. I will buy a bunch of it right now. 

From the Atlas O website:

Hi Phil,

Have you ever considered Micro Engineering track?  The quality is nice and it is a little less $  They have different code rail available in O scale.

http://microengineering.com/products_ft.htm

Mike

Mike, yes I have considered it. When I was in a 2 rail club I heard bad things about the ME track but I have decided that I like it. It is a little cheaper than Atlas but I am told it is harder to bend. I have some ME track and I am using it as long straights. I hope to build a layout someday and I will use both ME and Atlas track. 

I didn't mean to get off topic here. This thread is about if a 2 rail layout will fit in a 15' x 17' space and not about the best kind of track. I just wanted to point out that the prices Russ quoted were old and out of date. Unfortunately, Atlas track prices have risen for both 3 and 2 rail track. 

Hudson said:
"Mike, yes I have considered it. When I was in a 2 rail club I heard bad things about the ME track but I have decided that I like it. It is a little cheaper than Atlas but I am told it is harder to bend. "

I dimly remember that ME weathered track is the culprit, not the unweathered track. At any rate, it's more fragile to bend.

My new avatar: my 2-year-old great grandson introduced to Lionel trains at Christmas. In love, he was. I let him play with my old, unbreakable stuff. Got to get them young

Phil, no problem.  I did some more research and you are quite right about the severe jump in Atlas pricing.  Hobbylinc had the best.  Anyhow the original question was more about the QUANTITY of parts and not the pricing.  So that part of the chart still applied.  Anyhow here is the Hobbylinc chart.  Russ

Just as a sidebar if you play with the flex and make your own curves it's cheaper than buying the pre-made curve sections.

Second sidebar, the ME weathered rail is awful.  Also the switches are very fragile at the throw-bar and frog end of the points.  Atlas are very well built and will take heavy usage with the bigger diecast steamers.  Russ

I am about to start building my 2nd 2R layout and it will be a mere 12 x 14. I had to downsize to make room for my other hobby in the other end of the room. It will be smaller than I would like but anything is better than nothing. I started to switch to HO but I would rather have a little bit of O scale than any other scale.

It all depends on what you want. 17x15 is the equivalent of 9.3x8.3 in HO for example. If you want a continuous run then you don't have many options. JDunn has really maximized his space for continuous run.  What if you don't want pop-ups or broad stretches that you can't reach across? Then an around the room is your option which pretty much dictates the track plan.

Your mileage may vary, but I have come to a point that it is more important for me to get the type of railroad that I want and not just take whatever I can get to get big trains running. If I have to drop to S scale or HO to get what I want then so be it. You may be fine with that though. Is it too small of a space? That all depends on what you want to do. If you really like yard or passenger operations you probably wouldn't have enough room. If you like the layouts posted above then you are probably in good shape.

Good luck

I have a ton of 2 rail o but lately I have been having a ball with ON30.  O scale structures and detailing, but HO size trackage.   Most equipment will work on 36 radius curves.  If you haven't made the jump yet it might be worth a look.  Russ

This has ben a great thread guys, thanks, sorry I am late to the party. I have been trying to do something in O 2-rail for years, I have several locos and maybe 50 cars acquired over the years, mostly old Atlas and Intermountain cars. I really like the look of Proto48 but can't see installing $50 trucks on $5 cars!

I have about the same amount of On30 and have been planning a sectional layout to be set up outdoors or at shows, I can only fit 2-7' sections and a switching lead in my garage at a time. I really just want to run some trains! So have begun planning a loop of standard and On30 in my 12x18 foot barn but am frustrated I can't fit a 48" loop with some storage shelves and other features I want to keep so have been investigating if I can sell off all my 2-rail and On30 and buy used S scale stuff instead but there seems to be limited availability of steam locos (I like 1929) so am undecided and just running On30 on EZ-Track for the moment...

My 2-rail sections set up at the Emmett Cherry Festival 2016: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...C8&frags=pl%2Cwn

My On30 temp layout: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...rw&frags=pl%2Cwn

Silly train stuff I do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...1U&frags=pl%2Cwn

For layout design you may want to consider around the wall concept running the track  twice around over under with a meandering right of way dodging obstacles with cosmetic curves.

Duck under / pop up access is only for those who will never have a health problem, never grow old or deny reality like I did on my previous layout.

For great prices on good condition used flex track get yourself to an 0 scale show.  Same goes for  turnouts.

There may be a good quantity at the Strasburg PA show if I have any left.

jonnyspeed posted:

It all depends on what you want.

Pretty much sums it up.

When you know your needs you need to shop around.  Do a bulk order and have them have Atlas to ship direct to you.  This will get you the best price.  If you have a favorite dealer try working through them.

Consider Micromark who carries both Atlas ans ME track.  They often have sales and free shipping.  Right now a case (18 pieces) of flex is $250.

Jan

If you go the traction route, you could go down to 12 inch (or less) radius. Very little space problems.

Might me a little small if you're going to model 2 rail scale in 1:1 

Back to this topic.  The past few years have been a whirlwind. I closed my shop, took care of my ill, elderly father who recently passed away and I'm on my 3rd job.  I'm ready for some trains!

As of late, I have been selling all of my 3 rail O.  I  forgot I had purchased a bunch of Atlas O 2 Rail rolling stock.  Wow are they nice even the Trainman cars.  Recently my wife said maybe after retirement we move and I could have the entire basement! For now I'm going to clean the 15' x 17' room and build benchwork.  I may go with Atlas 49.5 radius track.  My era will not surpass the 90's the latest model loco would be a dash 8.  Most everything else early diesel and possibly some steam.  I want to buy a 2 rail locomotive so thought I'd reach out to you fellows for opinions.

From my understanding my options are Atlas, M.T.H.  or Sunset Models.   I like the looks of the  Sunset models, (CNW SD40-2)  but they are a little more money and seem to need larger radiuses from what I could read on their website.  I'm not sure but I think I only need a DCC system as the M.T.H locos will run on DCC? The only thing that bugs me about the M.T,H diesels is how high the body looks above the trucks at least in the photos.  I only have pictures to look at so I'm hoping you fellows can shed some light on what you like about the locos and do not like.  Also, I am used to the cruise control feature and worry that with the Atlas and Sunset locos I may  not get as good of slow speed operation.

Lastly in the spirit of train kinship I want to answer these questions and make a video so other guys like me may consider the 2 rail rout.  The size and detailing of scenery is so appealing in O it is what keeps me dreaming about it.  Yes there are limitations in two rail O.  However, I'm sure there are plenty of other people out there like me who lack information/experience in two rail O and would go for it if examples are there.

What are the pros and cons of different manufactures' engines

What DCC system? I want user friendly, easy to read etc.  Big hand friendly.

Any dealers out there who discount off of MSRP for Sunset Models?

It so nice to have this distraction thank you in advance for your help people.

@Classy Woods, LLC posted:

What are the pros and cons of different manufactures' engines

The pros of the Sunset Diesels are they come with the horizontal drive system and are very smooth runners. The con is they cost more. The opposite is true for Atlas and MTH (which by the way in case you haven't heard MTH sold most of their diesel tooling to Atlas and is most likely closing up shop). Atlas and MTH come with the "China Drive" system which doesn't have as smooth a start up as the horizontal drive but are smooth at higher speeds (like over 15 SMPH) and are usually pretty dependable. I have yet to have a "China Drive" fail on me but I did have two locomotives with the China drive system that came with one bad motor out of the box. I am not an expert but I believe Sunset has more road specific details on their locomotives than the other companies. Atlas does have a few switchers with the horizontal drive system in it.

What DCC system? I want user friendly, easy to read etc.  Big hand friendly.

I like the NCE DCC system which is what I use. It is popular among O scale guys. The owner of NCE is a O scale guy. There are other good systems out there but I could not name all the pros and cons of each system.

Any dealers out there who discount off of MSRP for Sunset Models?

There isn't anyone that I know of that gives more than a slight discount for Sunset.

It so nice to have this distraction thank you in advance for your help people.

Your wife sounds like a real keeper!

I also wanted to say thank you to Classy Woods, LLC for starting this thread. I read so many times on this forum where someone says I am going with 3 rail simply because I can run a Big Boy on 36" radius curves. This thread shows that 2 rail can be done in a smaller area and the enthusiast can still have fun. Many Sunset stream models can negotiate a 56" curve. I once knew a guy from the club I once belonged to who had a Sunset Challenger and it was rated for 56" curves.

@Classy Woods, LLC posted:

Any dealers out there who discount off of MSRP for Sunset Models?

I can not answer your question. However, since the markup on most diesel and steam locomotives is only       $ 100 I doubt it. Passenger cars run about $ 20 for an aluminum model and even less on the plastic cars. Hardly seems worthwhile for a dealer to handle Sunset / Golden Gate. Some dealers may though.

R. Heil - Sunset Models / Golden Gate Depot

Here’s a short video of the first train around the newly laid mainline connection. The layout is in a 19 x 21 foot space.  The over under aspect required 3% grades and 42” radius curves but I felt it was worth it for a longer run and scenic possibilities.

https://youtu.be/7AgVxTqLkrk

Peter

I am SLOWLY building a new 2 rail layout in our 12.5'x13' spare bedroom. It is an around-the-wall layout, with a center peninsula coming out into the center of the room. Min. radius is going to be 36', but most of it will have 42". This is my 3rd, small, 2 rail O scale layout. I have 44 tonners, a 70 tonner, and an SW9. Most cars are 40 footers, but I do have a few 50' cars. Can't do a lot, but can do continuous running, and have some interesting switching planned. My last 2 rail layout was in a 10'x11' spare room. However, it was 2' wide, around 3 of the walls. Switching only.

Jeff

I wandered into the dream world that is the 2 rail sub forum. Only in this alternate reality would someone wonder if 17x15 was too small. I am running 3 rail and am looking at a~9x5 layout.

I recently finished the benchwork and track for my 14 by 14 O scale layout.  It's a twice around track plan with a couple passing sidings.  I have 56 inch minimum mainline radius so I have very limited straight track.  The twice around is an over/under that the upper track is switched off to a small yard.  I'm still laying the yard track but I have basically 5 sidings.  You have to make a lot of compromises in a limited space like I had, but I can run 3 trains on the layout but not all at the same time.  I agree with the other comments that you'll have to determine your priorities, but it can be done in the space you have.  Good luck!

Here is a 2-rail 14'x16' O scale railroad I found on Youtube:

Rusty

Rusty, that's too funny!  You have posted from YouTube the same layout the owner posted earlier!  LOL

Peter

From my understanding my options are Atlas, M.T.H.  or Sunset Models.   I like the looks of the  Sunset models, (CNW SD40-2)  but they are a little more money and seem to need larger radiuses from what I could read on their website.  I'm not sure but I think I only need a DCC system as the M.T.H locos will run on DCC? The only thing that bugs me about the M.T,H diesels is how high the body looks above the trucks at least in the photos.  I only have pictures to look at so I'm hoping you fellows can shed some light on what you like about the locos and do not like.  Also, I am used to the cruise control feature and worry that with the Atlas and Sunset locos I may  not get as good of slow speed operation.

There are lots and lots of different O scale models.    You can find all sorts of things at O scale shows on the big ugly auction site.    Of course all the older brass stuff and other stuff requires you to install you own electronics unless you stick with straight DC,      As you say, MTH stuff generally sits too high on the trucks.    You can verify this by looking at simple equipment diagrams, or scale drawings of the prototype.     I personally like single motor drives.   I have yet to see a dual motor one that is quite as smooth in operation - my experience and opinion.     Given that I consider the Atlas SW9 a very good model both for detail and operation.    As you say the Sunset models are better detailed.     In that space, I would shy away from 6 axle locos.    they do generally require broader curves and the size is more overpowering on a smaller layout.     That said, I have a pair of Sunset E7s that easily track around 48 inch radius curves.    

As for control, I think DCC is more practical.    We just saw that MTH is shutting down and the future of DCS is in question.      With only one supplier, it leaves you very vulnerable if they go out totally.    On the other hand DCC is supported by at least a half dozen suppliers.    Most of your cost for DCC will be in Decoders if you have any number of locos.    They car compatilbe with any DCC system.    Throttles are not interchangable.

Lastly in the spirit of train kinship I want to answer these questions and make a video so other guys like me may consider the 2 rail rout.  The size and detailing of scenery is so appealing in O it is what keeps me dreaming about it.  Yes there are limitations in two rail O.  However, I'm sure there are plenty of other people out there like me who lack information/experience in two rail O and would go for it if examples are there.

What are the pros and cons of different manufactures' engines

Two motor locos do not run as smoothly in my opinion.    MTH models generally sit too high.    Detail is more road specific on Sunset stuff.    Older brass has become much cheaper as buyers want to have electronics pre-installed rather than learn to do it them selves.   

What DCC system? I want user friendly, easy to read etc.  Big hand friendly.

They are all good and bad.     The biggest problem you have is that the designers often write the user manuals.    therefore they know the stuff so well, they make assumptions in their explanations inadvertantly.    This sometimes make them hard to understand.      The best advice is to get a system that other modelers in your area use.     That  way you can find someone local to ask questions and give advice.     This is especially true as  you begin.   Once started it all starts to make sense.      Also with local guys, if you have a problem, they may have seen it and fixed it.   Most system, including NCE and Digitrax, have large "master" throttles that you can program the system with and program decoders.     They also have smaller utility throttles that are just for running trains.     These smaller ones work really well and are not as confusing as the master throttles for day to day use.    The CVP system I know does programming on a big panel, and their throttles are more like the utility throttles.

NCE, Digitrax, CVP (EasyDCC), and Lenz are major suppliers.     MRC has a low end system that  I don't much about.    You should look at each one and hold and fiddle with the various throttles to see what  you like.    One feature of the Digitrax utilitly I like is the reversing switch is a togle with center off, so you have a definite stop when you a loco to stay in one spot.

Any dealers out there who discount off of MSRP for Sunset Models?

It so nice to have this distraction thank you in advance for your help people.

Thank you guys.  Please keep the info coming.  I'll buy a DCC system and put down some track to experiment with.  I have to find a locomotive.  I saw a Dash 8 Atlas Trainman online that may be a good start since it is larger so I can push the envelope so to speak regarding radiuses.  I'd love to try a Sunset Models locomotive if I could find a used one.   I'm not afraid of electronics or modifying locos so that is at least good.  I'm actually very excited about all of this!  Unfortunately, where I live I'd be hard pressed to find a 2 rail O person.  Milwaukee would be the nearest connection. 

You can go around the wall and work with 72" radius for at least one circuit and maybe even a twice around folded figure eight for large engines.  You can also feature tighter curves for industrial switching with smaller engines inside that dimension.

Be careful in building a limited use layout for engines which hold your interest for right now.

Who are you going to be in 5 or 10 years?

Interests change and you may wind up making something you may regret.

@prrjim posted:

They are all good and bad.     The biggest problem you have is that the designers often write the user manuals.    therefore they know the stuff so well, they make assumptions in their explanations inadvertantly.    This sometimes make them hard to understand.    

Well said.  We used to use interns who were computer illiterate... amazing how well the users manuals turned out.  We also had them do the in-house beta testing as well... when the programmers finished the alpha testing and it was *bug free* the interns could find the first bug in the software in about a minute.

Still excited and felt like posting  pictures of one of my two rail cars.  This is an Atlas Trainman car and looks great!  This is further affirmation for me as I can see the detail and be part of it.  That's O scale to me.

I have yet to see whether 15' by 17' is the size of the room or the size of an island layout.

The initiator of this thread needs to let us know which it is.  Based on the answer, there will be additional questions before sound solutions can be offered.

Regards,

Ed

Hi Ed.  That’s the room size.  It will be an around the wall layout.

@Hudson J1e posted:

Mike, yes I have considered it. When I was in a 2 rail club I heard bad things about the ME track but I have decided that I like it. It is a little cheaper than Atlas but I am told it is harder to bend. I have some ME track and I am using it as long straights. I hope to build a layout someday and I will use both ME and Atlas track.

I didn't mean to get off topic here. This thread is about if a 2 rail layout will fit in a 15' x 17' space and not about the best kind of track. I just wanted to point out that the prices Russ quoted were old and out of date. Unfortunately, Atlas track prices have risen for both 3 and 2 rail track.

Hi Phil.

I've had some experience with ME Flex. The Weathered is very difficult to work with; the non-weathered is harder to flex than the Atlas as the ties seem to have more "bite" into the rails, but rocking the track back and forth around a curved form will bring it into line. Similar to the technique for bending Gargraves flex.

Here is a 16 ft by 30 inch switching layout that I am building. I built this to wet my feet in 2 rail O scale. So far it is a hoot. I have a few more structures to complete. Eventually this will be incorporated into a 38 x 16 layout in a garage/workshop that I am having built. Cheers all.

Pete

Pete, very nice!

Dan Weinhold

That’s awesome Pete! Great idea to build a small layout that can be added on to a larger layout later on.

Thank you Matt for the information.

Pete you packed a lot of operation in that space.  I bet it will not only be fun to operate but you will come up with some clever scenery as well.  Thanks for sharing.