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Does anyone have any experience using a TMCC caboose in a TR (Train) setup? 

 

I just got this yesterday and was playing with it.  When assigned the same ID as the engine all works as expected.

 

When assigned a unique ID and added into a train, because it's not the lead engine I cannot get the sounds to trigger with the engine.  I am running in TMCC mode and was wondering if I need to be in CAB1 mode.  According to the ancient manual for TMCC operation the idea is to assign it as a "front" engine.  Not sure what they mean but regardless when assigning it as a forward facing engine it doesn't do a think unless it's the lead engine.  Then of course the loco doesn't sound the horn and such.

 

Just curious if those who have one, how is it entered into the TR (Train) using Legacy?

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I'll be interested to see what you find out.  I've tinkered a bit with the TR setup for stuff like the Vision Line cattle car, but I wasn't totally convinced I could get proper operation.  I ended up just running it as a separate ID.

 

You can get all the locomotives in an MU to sound horns and bells with the TR function, but if you assign the caboose as the lead engine, you won't get any crew talk from the locomotive.

 

FWIW, I've noticed with some Legacy MU configurations that I have to assign the crewtalk to the rear locomotive or both talk, have you noticed that?

Marty,
I am wondering if this might be similar to the problem that I have using the ERR Mini Commander 2 with the Legacy Cab 1 L. Maybe take a look at the thread Cab 1l problem that I posted, just a thought.
Ray
 
Originally Posted by MartyE:

Does anyone have any experience using a TMCC caboose in a TR (Train) setup? 

 

I just got this yesterday and was playing with it.  When assigned the same ID as the engine all works as expected.

 

When assigned a unique ID and added into a train, because it's not the lead engine I cannot get the sounds to trigger with the engine.  I am running in TMCC mode and was wondering if I need to be in CAB1 mode.  According to the ancient manual for TMCC operation the idea is to assign it as a "front" engine.  Not sure what they mean but regardless when assigning it as a forward facing engine it doesn't do a think unless it's the lead engine.  Then of course the loco doesn't sound the horn and such.

 

Just curious if those who have one, how is it entered into the TR (Train) using Legacy?

 

FWIW
 
These are both TMCC units, both the engine and caboose.  I don't know of any way to get the horn, cab chatter and bell in 2 TMCC locos in a TR.  I know in Legacy engines, later ones, you can get all the horns to sound.
 
Never had an issue with the VL Cattle Car as it is accessed via Train Link but the TMCC caboose is to work in conjunction with the Crew Talk and Tower Comm of the engine.  So they both must get the trigger.
 
 
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

I'll be interested to see what you find out.  I've tinkered a bit with the TR setup for stuff like the Vision Line cattle car, but I wasn't totally convinced I could get proper operation.  I ended up just running it as a separate ID.

 

You can get all the locomotives in an MU to sound horns and bells with the TR function, but if you assign the caboose as the lead engine, you won't get any crew talk from the locomotive.

 

FWIW, I've noticed with some Legacy MU configurations that I have to assign the crewtalk to the rear locomotive or both talk, have you noticed that?

 

Last edited by MartyE

Marty,

Had the same issue putting talking caboose together with a TMCC engine as a TR with a Legacy remote. The engine would respond with cab chatter or crew talk but the caboose would not do anything. Then I think I used a cab-1 to put them together as a TR and I think then the Legacy remote activated both to respond to each other. What i'm saying is the Legacy remote would not build the TR but the cab-1 did build the TR.

I do remember that Steve Musso used the Train Link button on the Legacy remote to build the TR with the TMCC talking caboose and a TMCC engine but had to access it a different way.

Hopefully, Steve will chime in here.

Regardless, the Legacy remote did not do what the cab-1 does easily with building the TMCC talking caboose and a TMCC engine.

I hesitate to chime in without actually playing with it, but this is probably a mis-match of command types. It might work if you changed the head engine sound system to type RS4. This will have the undesired side-effect of turning off legacy features like quilling whistle, so I'm not really advocating this as a better solution. Just playing around.

 

But really, the Train Link feature was designed to address this problem with both newer legacy rolling stock as well as the previously shipped TMCC product like station sounds cars and talking cabooses. Then you can keep the head engine legacy and toggle back and forth between triggering the loco and the caboose.

 

Rudy

 

I tried both Cab1 and TMCC command types for both the TMCC caboose and the TMCC engine.  I'm thinking it's just the way Legacy builds a train vs a Cab1.  I'm going to pull out my TMCC base tonight and give it a try.  I'm thinking that TMCC doesn't differentiate between a forward facing front engine and a forward facing middle engine like Legacy does.

 

While the TrainLink is an option, it is a couple of button pushes extra to get the desired effect of the caboose and engine interacting.

 

But on a side note, A Legacy Scale Caboose needs to be made.  I see a lot of cool possibilities there.

 

 

Marty,

When you build a TR with a cab-1, you can have 3 engines in the consist and make one the front with the F key and one with being the rear one with R key. As for the middle engine, you do not press neither F or R and it will be the middle one.

With train link, it is an extra step in addressing the talking caboose. With a cab-1, you don't have train link but you can access the talk with 2 button presses.

Steve Musso showed me how to set up a engine/talking caboose consist with train link and it does work but I still prefer using a cab-1 to do that step up as it is easier to access the talking caboose.

I have to try out the cab-1 vs. legacy with a talking caboose to once again verify what has happened in the past while demonstrating TMCC and now Legacy at Greenberg shows with Steve and Ernie.

Marty,

Did a show yesterday with my club. I had a TMCC engine and a talking caboose with me and set up them as a train with a cab-2. Did the build in the remote and they responded with the same key presses as a cab-1 and never used train link to access the caboose tower com and then the engine responding next with its tower com and same routine with the gargled crew talk. Used the warhorse J engine and the talking caboose from the SP warhorse set.

For some reason, I usesd the Santa Fe talking caboose and could not get it to do what I described above and could only access the above routine via Train link only. 

Marty,

 

 I created a lash up in Legacy  with a BB as leading engine and a SP crew talk caboose at the end;BB in Legacy mode, caboose has Train Sound with TMCC and has an ENG-id,  however as command type in Info mode ACC.

When applying Train link in the lash up, the caboose will appear with ENG, and symbols for track and and water tower(considering ACC) on the remote Screen. .

In this case crew talk of the BB and crew talk of the caboose via Train link are Independent and do not interfere.

In case ACC would be replaced by ENG in Info mode, the caboose would be silent in Train link.

Maybe that is a work around.

 

Albrecht

MartyE posted:

Does anyone have any experience using a TMCC caboose in a TR (Train) setup? 

 

I just got this yesterday and was playing with it.  When assigned the same ID as the engine all works as expected.

 

When assigned a unique ID and added into a train, because it's not the lead engine I cannot get the sounds to trigger with the engine.  I am running in TMCC mode and was wondering if I need to be in CAB1 mode.  According to the ancient manual for TMCC operation the idea is to assign it as a "front" engine.  Not sure what they mean but regardless when assigning it as a forward facing engine it doesn't do a think unless it's the lead engine.  Then of course the loco doesn't sound the horn and such.

 

Just curious if those who have one, how is it entered into the TR (Train) using Legacy?

Marty,

I purchased a CrewTalk caboose from a fellow Forum member yesterday, and, after fiddling for a while, I was able to lash it up with a TMCC engine in a train that I can access from my CAB-2. Both the engine and the caboose perform together in response to commands to the train via the CAB-2. Cool!

BUT: today, I want to put the caboose in a train with a different TMCC engine--and I cannot remember what I finally did yesterday that worked, and I have been unable to recreate it.

Did you ever figure this out?

Cheers!

Keith

OK, I recreated how to do it:

First, use the CAB-2 to set up the train (lash-up) with a train link. At this point, you can toggle between the train and the train-linked caboose to trigger the TowerCom and the CrewTalk of the engine and the caboose.

Second, use a CAB-1 to set up the train following the directions on pp. 12-13 of the caboose's owner's manual (https://www.lionelsupport.com/...ents/71-9889-250.pdf). Now--with either the CAB-1 or the CAB-2--when you address the train and initiate TowerCom or CrewTalk, the engine and the caboose will talk to each other.

Cheers!

Keith

I am confused, Which "TMCC caboose" are we talking about? There are two versions:

1. Lionel 6-19889 (et all) Crewtalk cabooses.

2. Lionel 6-29834 and 35 Trainsounds cabooses. (If you don't believe me, look up the #.)

I personally own the crewtalk caboose. When I first got it, I attempted to "MU" it with a TMCC engine. It did not work. I left frustrated. I came back 5 minutes later and redid the "train" and it functioned properly. Just keep trying.

Sidenote 1. The crewtalk caboose works surprisingly well with RS5 engines. I thought they would be talking over each other, but they do not.

Sidenote 2. Anyone have a video of a trainsounds caboose they would be willing to share here or to me privately via email? I have been wanting one, but since I already have the crewtalk one, I am hesitant.

Sidenote 3. Yes! A legacy caboose would be a great idea.

Last edited by Nicks Trains

In response to the questions/comments after my last post...

Professor, I'm not sure what you're asking, but if you only want to trigger the interactive dialogue with a CAB-1, then, of course, you only need to create the train with a CAB-1 in accordance with the instructions in the caboose's owner's manual. That's straightforward. However, if you want to trigger the automatic interactive dialogue with a CAB-2, simply creating the train with the CAB-1 will do nothing to the CAB-2. If you want to be able to trigger the automatic dialogue with the CAB-2, you first need to set up the train with the CAB-2 in the normal way. This will take you halfway there. You'll be able to use TrainLink to toggle between the train and the caboose and create the dialogue manually. To accomplish the necessary "tweak" that allows the engine and caboose to communicate with each other automatically by simply pressing TowerCom or CrewTalk when addressing the train, you need to create the train with a CAB-1--in accordance with the special instructions in the caboose's owner's manual--after having created the train with the CAB-2.

Nick, we're only talking about the four CrewTalk cabooses that Lionel produced:

6-19742 Erie - 1998
6-19749 Southern Pacific (part of a set) - 1998
6-19889 Pennsylvania - 2001
6-19890 Santa Fe - 2001

I have no experience with the TrainSounds cabooses.

It is indeed simple to MU the CrewTalk cabooses with a TMCC engine--as long as you follow the special directions in the owner's manual. It's trickier if you want the automatic interactive dialogue to function when addressing a train from a CAB-2.

John, the issue is not with TrainLink. My base is running 1.60, and my CAB-2 is running 1.61. I confess to being OCD about keeping up with the latest versions. As I mentioned above, TrainLink works fine in allowing you to toggle back and forth between the train and the caboose and trigger the interactive dialogue manually. But, to me, the really cool thing about the CrewTalk cabooses is how they automatically produce a dialogue between the engine and the caboose by simply pressing TowerCom or CrewTalk when addressing the train.

I think the issue may be that this special functionally was developed when Legacy was just a melody beginning to form in Neil Young's head. There was no thought to how it would work with a CAB-2. And when Legacy and the CAB-2 were being developed, it's quite possible that with all the many things they were trying to make the new system do--and that it does--no thought was given to accommodating the special functionality incorporated into the CrewTalk cabooses.

Cheers!

Keith

Last edited by Keith L

I think the TMCC engine and caboose worked well because the engine had a significant delay when you triggered tower talk.  I'm pretty sure that meshed well with the talk from the caboose.  Since the Legacy locomotives, or the newer TMCC with RS5 don't have the delay, it throws a wrench into the gears.

I have one of the Erie cabooses, when I get all together in my new place, maybe I can try to get it working with a Legacy engine.

Keith L posted:

OK, I recreated how to do it:

First, use the CAB-2 to set up the train (lash-up) with a train link. At this point, you can toggle between the train and the train-linked caboose to trigger the TowerCom and the CrewTalk of the engine and the caboose.

Second, use a CAB-1 to set up the train following the directions on pp. 12-13 of the caboose's owner's manual (https://www.lionelsupport.com/...ents/71-9889-250.pdf). Now--with either the CAB-1 or the CAB-2--when you address the train and initiate TowerCom or CrewTalk, the engine and the caboose will talk to each other.

Cheers!

Keith

An important clarification:

Between setting up the train with the CAB-2 in the normal way and setting up the train with the CAB-1 following the directions in the caboose's owner's manual, you need to shut down, power down, then power back up.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

I think the TMCC engine and caboose worked well because the engine had a significant delay when you triggered tower talk.  I'm pretty sure that meshed well with the talk from the caboose.  Since the Legacy locomotives, or the newer TMCC with RS5 don't have the delay, it throws a wrench into the gears.

I have one of the Erie cabooses, when I get all together in my new place, maybe I can try to get it working with a Legacy engine.

John, you're correct that the TowerCom from a pre-RS5 TMCC engine and the caboose mesh because the engine's TowerCom has a delay and the caboose's TowerCom does not: when you activate TowerCom when addressing a train, the caboose's TowerCom plays immediately followed by the engine's (delayed) TowerCom.

The CrewTalk works the opposite way. The caboose's CrewTalk has a delay and the engine's CrewTalk does not: when you activate CrewTalk when addressing a train, the engine's CrewTalk plays immediately followed by the caboose's (delayed) CrewTalk.

I haven't tried the CrewTalk caboose with a Legacy engine yet, but I plan to, and I'm interested to see how it will work.

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