Bob, I'd love to see you succeed in this process. I've looked for a truck, but no luck.

Two things,

1. Why can't ya'll make a casting of the entire piece with out cutting ?

2. Order the vision line truck and cut and modify it to work.

Good Luck,

Ron Howard

bob2 posted:

Mike - you are way out of my league.  I only know lost wax, and even then only enough to get somebody else to do the investment and pour metal.  Cutting Bob's perfect casting was not even discussed - we agreed I would return it intact.  It would kill me to cut it, then find out that the entire process would be too expensive to be viable.  I have not yet packed it for shipment - I will wait until next week.

No word on the cost of the complete Wolfer truck cost.  I don't want to become a pest.  Bob Stevenson is ready to make molds and cast the first set of the Lionel part.  We have not finished our discussion on two piece vs. four piece.  He is the expert, but I foresee problems with the two piece approach.

But hey - if the state of the art is such that a 3D printer can duplicate this casting in wax, that is a non-destructive approach, and we can surely cast that in one piece in brass or bronze, with very little shrinkage.  If Mike can stick a good casting in the bowels of such a printer and deliver a wax or plastic copy for, say, $50 each, we are still in the ballpark.

If you can get someone to make a 3D scan of your good truck, then there's no reason why you cant get it 3D printed. 

I have bought brass parts from the Ways of Shape. They print it in wax then cast it in brass. The natural finish is quite good, without any printing lines/waves.

The big step is going to be getting the high quality scan of the part into a computer. 

 

"Of course we know its O-gauge or no gauge." -- Sheldon Cooper

Last edited by Boilermaker1

Again, I am not an expert in lost wax.  I have limited pleasant experience getting such things done.  True experts have told me it is better to do this in pieces.

I have zero expertise in 3D printing.  If you go that way, I simply cannot help.

As far as Mr. Brasseur is concerned, I have had two contacts with him.  One, he gave me implicit permission to duplicate this casting, and two, he unequivocally indicated that Lionel does not want the Legacy part evaluated for modification.  I have no working relationship with him - he seems like a nice guy, so if and when you decide to go the 3D printer route, have someone who knows the topic contact him.  If you do print a one-piece wax, I am sure I can help get it cast in brass or bronze.  Have the printer increase the size by one half of one percent, to account for metal shrinkage upon cooling.

So, question?  Assuming someone can get this thing coded in some machine language for printing in a 3D printer, what is a good guess for cost each part in wax?

Foundry was just asking about you guys.  He is ready to do the first set at his expense!  All he needs is that cuttable casting - the one that is slightly bowed, but not crumbling?

I told him your ardor may have cooled a bit.  I was ready to invest, as was one other of your fellow forumites.  This makes it a no risk deal!  He of course would recover his initial cost on the subsequent sales.

Still no price on the Wolfer casting sets.  That would be your fallback if all else fails.

I wonder why we have not heard from a hobbyist with a JLC and a Legacy model?  Could it possibly be that one could just completely replace the mechanism?  Or is Lionel not interested in that either?

Is the zinc pest problem only the motor truck section or is it also the pilot assembly, which is screwed onto the motor truck section. Is the lead truck zinc pest infected too?  Harry 

"THE OLD MAN"

Henning's Trains - Celebrating 75 Years, 1939 - 2014

My question is that the section that is the pilot and holds the truck on can be unscrewed from the truck side frame. Does the zinc pest effect the whole unit has shown in the picture or just the big side frame section?  If we need the front pilot section also, I can probably cast this also. The airline ? up to the pilot I can not do in one piece attached to the truck side frame. This is a 12" mold just to do the truck side section. Harry 

"THE OLD MAN"

Henning's Trains - Celebrating 75 Years, 1939 - 2014

I'd take a look at Walt's JLC GG-1 sideframes, you can see first hand what is failing.  I just looked at my JLC GG-1, and that entire piece in the pictures is a single casting.  I don't think the small pilot truck mount is affected, but since mine isn't falling apart, I can't be sure.  I'm not sure what the "airline" is.

Last edited by gunrunnerjohn

I was this close to "signing out" on this project, due to a lack of enthusiasm.  Robert and I now have a collective investment of thirty bucks (shipping is no longer cheap) and I have no personal interest in that the only way I will ever own a JLC GG1 is if one arrives free.

But I see there is still life here.  If Harry wants to do the molds and cast these things, that would be ok - nobody will get rich on this project.  But we really should coordinate!  

Robert may have a bowed casting.  If so, we will saw it carefully into two or four pieces, and then get Harry and Bob Stevenson on the same page so we only do this once.

Yes, it is my impression that only the main casting is failing.  The "air line" as I recall is a separate piece, and will need to be moved to the new casting when the pilot casting is attached.

Although I have no stake in this project, I find this thread very interesting, the efforts being made here very admirable, and sincerely hope it works out for all involved. Best of luck. 

Mark in Oregon

The mold is in progress to make the big side frame section for the motor truck. I will see how this works out . I had 2 complete units to make the molds from. I will not need anymore ( I hope ). I will keep everybody posted here on progress.  Harry 

"THE OLD MAN"

Henning's Trains - Celebrating 75 Years, 1939 - 2014

Harry Henning posted:

The mold is in progress to make the big side frame section for the motor truck. I will see how this works out . I had 2 complete units to make the molds from. I will not need anymore ( I hope ). I will keep everybody posted here on progress.  Harry 

Harry,

 It’s great to hear that you’re going forward with this project.  I’m the guy who originally sent the “pristine” part to Bob2 because I have a JLC GG1 that is infested with zinc pest and I was at the point that I believed that this project needed to get done because there was no other alternative at the time.  I’m sure there are many folks with JLC GG1’s that don’t know about this issue and when they finally discover they have a crumbling truck frame and there are no parts available, they certainly will not be happy.

 I’m confident that you have this project well under control, however if there is anything can do to help bring this much needed part to completion, please let me know!  Again, thank you for your involvement.

 Chief Bob (Retired)  

This is good news!  Please post photos of the completed project.  I will notify Stevenson that we won't need to proceed.

bob2 posted:

This is good news!  Please post photos of the completed project.  I will notify Stevenson that we won't need to proceed.

Would it be wise to wait to see if this alternate plan works out first?

RoyBoy

I think you are right, enough said for now. I will hopefully have a sample in a few weeks. Harry 

"THE OLD MAN"

Henning's Trains - Celebrating 75 Years, 1939 - 2014

Harry Henning posted:

Is the zinc pest problem only the motor truck section or is it also the pilot assembly, which is screwed onto the motor truck section. Is the lead truck zinc pest infected too?  Harry 

When my parts failed, it seemed to just be the main part of the side frames that failed.  The pivoting pilot part mounted to the front of it was sold as part of the whole assembly, so I changed everything.  I don't believe the pilot itself had issues though.  I did re-use the pilot trucks as well since they still looked fine.

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