I received #5413 yesterday. This was cataloged with mixed drivers. Lionel tried this with the ESE from a few years ago with mixed results. My dealer told me they were not mixed for this engine when he opened to inspect so I ordered one. To my delight, all boxpok drivers. Looks great. Couldn't be happier. Here's a few photos.
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That is how my 5413 came - I am also glad - Looks much better - Thanks for posting
I’m just curious, y’all are glad that these didn’t come through with mixed drivers? ....the central had a long standing habit of doing just that very practice....they had issues with cracks, and crank pin failures....they really didn’t care what the wheel looked like, as long as the appliances got back out on the road....so the mixed drivers are very prototypical ......some of y’all cry about the marker lights, but ya don’t want something as real as real gets with mixed drivers? ....sometimes I don’t understand what some of y’all want..........Pat
The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
Nice! That's a blessing for me as I had planned to do that anyways. Thanks for posting the pics and reporting this deviation. The only thing is that I'm starting to like the other drivers too since they aren't painted flat and have the silver ring. Decisions, decisions... It seems like they have nearly everyone covered when you add in the two special runs as well.
Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
I’m very glad they’re happy, I’d want nothing more....it just doesn’t make any sense....I’d be steaming mad if I’d ordered it specifically for having mixed drivers.....and it didn’t.....but I guess ya just never know with this group...something incorrect and they complain, but something incorrect and they praise....?????...........Pat
Maybe they replaced the mismatched wheels on the rails?
Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
Wait a minute. Lionel said they couldn't deliver an engine without class lights because it was already pictured with them in the catalog. Written in stone and could not be changed.
Now they produce engines that don't match the catalog illustration? Whats up with that?
Alright, I know, the disclaimer in fine print. The final product may not match the picture.
I guess that can have it both ways. Not too confidence inspiring for those placing pre orders.
Pete
Sort of like catalogued items that never make production for some reason or another.
The first time I saw intentionally-mixed drivers on a Lionel product I was not impressed, based on this image (New York Central Legacy J-3A ESE Hudson #5429, 6-82536) from Lionel's website:
http://www.lionel.com/products...w-pt-tender-6-82536/
However, when I noticed the delivered product a few months (maybe quite a few months) later in my LHS, as in the picture below, I started to warm to the idea. A slightly different wheel design and a little silver paint on that center driver made a significant difference to me for some reason.
(Sorry for the relatively poor quality -- through glass and low light.)
Ultimately I waited too long and it was gone.
What do you think? Aside from being plausible historically, is it pleasing enough to the eye when compared to the catalog version to catch your interest?
Mike
I like the mixed drivers - of course, not all Hudsons had this done, so I wouldn't want all my J3's this way. Not as common on the J1's as nearly all had spoked drivers anyway.
I even mixed them myself on one of my earlier TMCC J3a's (these locos had "screw-retained" drivers; great feature, and I do just ignore the modest screw-head). I ordered a set from Lionel and changed the main drivers.
Mellow Hudson Mike posted:The first time I saw intentionally-mixed drivers on a Lionel product I was not impressed, based on this image (New York Central Legacy J-3A ESE Hudson #5429, 6-82536) from Lionel's website:
http://www.lionel.com/products...w-pt-tender-6-82536/
However, when I noticed the delivered product a few months (maybe quite a few months) later in my LHS, as in the picture below, I started to warm to the idea. A slightly different wheel design and a little silver paint on that center driver made a significant difference to me for some reason.
(Sorry for the relatively poor quality -- through glass and low light.)
Ultimately I waited too long and it was gone.
What do you think? Aside from being plausible historically, is it pleasing enough to the eye when compared to the catalog version to catch your interest?
Mike
It’s not plausible historical, it is historically correct.....the cataloged picture is correct. When these appliances came in for servicing, they were very time sensitive to get back on the road. Especially if a defect was found in the middle of a turn around.....the central’s shops had to hurriedly get them back in revenue ASAP. There wasn’t always time to put pretty paint on drivers. Painting drivers was most likely the furthest things in their minds when motive power needs to be fixed, fueled, and back out on the road......Pat
Norton posted:Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
Wait a minute. Lionel said they couldn't deliver an engine without class lights because it was already pictured with them in the catalog. Written in stone and could not be changed.
Now they produce engines that don't match the catalog illustration? Whats up with that?
A prime example was the Union Pacific FEF-3 model that was specifically notated in the catalog as being produced with the CORRECT Sellers Exhaust Steam Injector system specific to certain FEF-3 road numbers. When the models of road number 838 were delivered, all they were was a renumbered "844", having the Worthington Feedwater System. Lionel people NEVER offered any explanation!
Pete
harmonyards posted:Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
I’m very glad they’re happy, I’d want nothing more....it just doesn’t make any sense....I’d be steaming mad if I’d ordered it specifically for having mixed drivers.....and it didn’t.....but I guess ya just never know with this group...something incorrect and they complain, but something incorrect and they praise....?????...........Pat
Well, it is a little odd that they prefer not having the mixed drivers after ordering the version of the engine that was supposed to have them. 
I'd be happy, too, because I think the mixed drivers look weird, but I wouldn't have ordered this engine in the first place.
breezinup posted:harmonyards posted:Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
I’m very glad they’re happy, I’d want nothing more....it just doesn’t make any sense....I’d be steaming mad if I’d ordered it specifically for having mixed drivers.....and it didn’t.....but I guess ya just never know with this group...something incorrect and they complain, but something incorrect and they praise....?????...........Pat
Well, it is a little odd that they prefer not having the mixed drivers. Makes one wonder why they ordered the version of the engine with mixed drivers!
I'd be happy, too, because I think the mixed drivers look weird, but I wouldn't have ordered this engine in the first place.
And to each his own, and yes it does look weird, but it’s what did happen on the Central on quite a few locomotives......Pat
Wonder why Lionel didn't offer any versions of the J3a with roller bearing rods?
NVisich posted:I received #5413 yesterday. This was cataloged with mixed drivers. Lionel tried this with the ESE from a few years ago with mixed results. My dealer told me they were not mixed for this engine when he opened to inspect so I ordered one. To my delight, all boxpok drivers. Looks great. Couldn't be happier. Here's a few photos.
Maybe I am misreading the OP’s post but I believe NVisich ordered his 5413 Hudson only after his dealer had received their shipment of these engines and informed NVisich that the delivered engines did not have mixed drivers as illustrated in the catalog.
breezinup posted:harmonyards posted:Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
I’m very glad they’re happy, I’d want nothing more....it just doesn’t make any sense....I’d be steaming mad if I’d ordered it specifically for having mixed drivers.....and it didn’t.....but I guess ya just never know with this group...something incorrect and they complain, but something incorrect and they praise....?????...........Pat
Well, it is a little odd that they prefer not having the mixed drivers after ordering the version of the engine that was supposed to have them.
I'd be happy, too, because I think the mixed drivers look weird, but I wouldn't have ordered this engine in the first place.
What NVISCH said was; "My dealer told me they were not mixed for this engine when he opened to inspect so I ordered one." Now I understand that to mean that he had not ordered one because of the funky look of the mixed drivers and when he found that they were not mixed, he then ordered one.
NVISCH, please correct me if I am wrong.
Hot Water posted:Wonder why Lionel didn't offer any versions of the J3a with roller bearing rods?
They would have had to make new rods. AFAIK only the Lionel Dreyfuss Hudson got roller bearing rods besides the Niagara. That engine has metric spaced drivers. The unsteamlined J3s have inch spaced drivers like the Pullmor Hudsons.
There is about a .025" difference. I have tried to put the Dreyfuss rods on my J3 but no soap. Another opportunity lost to save a few cents.
Pete
Big Jim posted:breezinup posted:harmonyards posted:Jim 1939 posted:The engine they ordered WAS pictured with mixed drivers. They are saying we are happy anyway.
I’m very glad they’re happy, I’d want nothing more....it just doesn’t make any sense....I’d be steaming mad if I’d ordered it specifically for having mixed drivers.....and it didn’t.....but I guess ya just never know with this group...something incorrect and they complain, but something incorrect and they praise....?????...........Pat
Well, it is a little odd that they prefer not having the mixed drivers after ordering the version of the engine that was supposed to have them.
I'd be happy, too, because I think the mixed drivers look weird, but I wouldn't have ordered this engine in the first place.
What NVISCH said was; "My dealer told me they were not mixed for this engine when he opened to inspect so I ordered one." Now I understand that to mean that he had not ordered one because of the funky look of the mixed drivers and when he found that they were not mixed, he then ordered one.
NVISCH, please correct me if I am wrong.
You are correct! I had no interest in the mixed drivers. As soon as my dealer confirmed otherwise, I ordered it.
I ordered this engine with the mixed wheels because it came with most of the items I wanted. PT tender and marker lights and two sets of boxpok drivers. Plan was to replace the scullen with boxpok. The other engine offered by Lionel with the PT tender came with all scullen drivers. I don't like scullen drivers, always thought they looked weird. This was before Mr Muffins offered his engine that had all boxpok drivers (but no marker lights). Considered Mr Muffins engine, but decided I was not going to stiff my dealer. Glad Lionel changed the drivers.
rrgeorge posted:Plan was to replace the scullen with boxpok.
You would have had your work cut out for you... these drivers aren't attached to their axles with Phillips screws!!
Yes - Found that out when I got the engine. Thought this engine was going to be like the one with the phillips screws. Glad Lionel "fixed" the drivers.
I asked Muffin to change my Hudson order from his special run J3A to the catalog 5413. I saw a brass O scale 2 rail version of this engine and really liked the look of the center disc driver.
Apart from the missing 9v battery connector I’m pleased with this engine but the change in driver types is very disappointing
Thanks,
Richard
Here's a summary of all of them;
This version has polished sidearms and cylinder covers;
marker lights and the 6-wheel tender
This version has the white wheels and trim; polished side rods and
cylinder covers; marker lights; and the 6-wheel tender.
PT Tender with water-steam effect
This version is all black; darkened siderods; marker lights; and
Lionel 1931460 - LEGACY J3a Steam Locomotive "New York Central" #5413 w/ Bluetooth - Sale Priced at $1349.99 - 2 Left
This version has darkened siderods; polished cylinder covers;
marker lights; and the 6-wheel tender
Lionel 1931470 - LEGACY J3a Steam Locomotive "New York Central" #5418 w/ Bluetooth - Sale Priced at $1259.99 - 1 Left
This version has darkened siderods and cylinder covers;
marker lights; and the PT Tender with the water-steam effect
Lionel 1931480 - LEGACY J3a Steam Locomotive "New York Central" #5452 w/ Bluetooth - Sale Priced at $1349.99 - 3 Left
This version has the darkened siderods and cylinder heads; no marker lights - as the Hudsons were first made; and the PT Tender with the water-steam effect
Lionel 1931810 - Legacy J3a Hudson 4-6-4 Steam Locomotive "New York Central" #5415 w/ PT Tender + Bluetooth - Custom Run for MrMuffin'sTrains - Sale Priced at $1349.99 - 3 Left
LEGACY J3a Steam Locomotive "New York Central" #5413 w/ Bluetooth
This version is the one I would have purchased if Lionel had catalogued it the way it was actually produced. The mixed drivers were the number one reason I passed on this version. I bought Pat's Trains custom version, number 5416, which is very nice, I prefer the 12 wheel tender over the PT tender. I don't care about the PT tender's water scoop simulation since I turn smoke off. However, I prefer 5413's darker side rods and cylinder caps over the brighter ones on 5416. The class lights on the boiler front, even if not prototypical, look fine to me.
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