Here are some quick phone shots and vids of my new 5418 pulling a few GGD coaches on my layout tonight. Just picked it up. So far so good!
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Looks and sounds great Norm. Enjoy!
Very nice Norm. The sound(and your layout) is outstanding.
Looks & Sounds Good Norm!!!
Really nice Norm. Thanks for the pictures and video.
Tom
Here’s a couple more quickie phone vids:
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Sorry guys I am phone posting, things might get a little sloppy! Let me know if you guys have any questions!
I am still sorting out my plans for this engine. I am definitely pulling the class lights (already turned off) and I’m deciding on what color the smokebox will be. May also swap the headlight.
I am really stoked that Lionel supplied the Kadee adapter and mounting holes in the tender frame. That will definitely make my life easier at the workbench. Good job you guys!
I always wanted the 28072 from way back but this is much nicer. Many differences aside from the controls.
Looks sharp, Norm. In spite of some shortcomings, this locomotive looks like a winner. Can't wait to see it get the Norm 3-Rail scale treatment.
That is one handsome train with those coaches - Terrific Norm!
Thanks for posting was really wanting to see the paint scheme. Looks outstanding
Lookin good!
Enjoy NORM!!! I have the MUFFINs Machine an d really enjoy it.
Awesome videos, Norm.
I like that Lionel appears to have closed the cab to tender gap, ostensibly to the point it'll still run on tighter curves while not impacting.
Norm,
You will roll that new engine into mud! Too new looking for you!
It looks really nice Norm, especially with the surroundings! I don't think I have ever seen a stock car on your layout before. Looking forward to seeing what you do with this one!
Looking forward to seeing what you do with this, Norm. You know you want to add the missing lubricator linkage.
Norm Charbonneau posted:Here are some quick phone shots and vids of my new 5418 pulling a few GGD coaches on my layout tonight. Just picked it up. So far so good!
Your scenery is SUPERB!!!! The Hudsonlooks as if it performs well and looks wonderfully in front of the Golden Gate Depot consist. Bravo!
Norm what happened? It's still shiny...lol
Here are some initial observations using the 28072 Hudson from way back as a point of comparison. I chose the cataloged 5418 J3a because I liked the combination of the Scullins and the standard tender much like the old 28072 TMCC Hudson from way with the 5444 cab number.
The standard tender model has a modern separately-applied coal load and proper Kadee mounts for those of us that like that sort of thing. The photo above shows the adapter box and mounting hardware. The tender frame is drilled and tapped to accept this setup. It appears to be set at the right height for the out-of-the-box tender ride height. I think the ride height looks pretty good so far. I really appreciate Lionel going through the trouble of doing this as it will save so much time on the workbench and it helps bring these models up to date with current model railroading trends. A quick thought - Al Staufer thought the PT tender was aesthetically abominable coupled behind a Hudson. I happen to agree! Paint finish has a nice matte finish to it. The engine-tender gap has been tightened up.
The locomotive shell itself is very much the same overall as the early 2000s model, with some minor alterations for the whistle smoke. There is a smoke hole under the whistle and the throttle dome is removable to access the whistle smoke fill. This is held on by magnets. You may want to pay attention to those magnets as mine seemed to want to go along with the dome after the second time I pulled it off. Nothing a bit of CA can't cure though. Overall, the fit and finish of the shell is nice but I do not like the parting line forward of the booster stack. I also don't like the oversized and incorrectly mounted class lights. These two items don't matter to me at this point as I am planning on removing the class lights and possibly painting the smokebox black. I can address the parting line then. Initial inspection of the smokebox front revealed a complete line of rivets around the outer diameter so removal of the class light may not be as much work as initially thought. The headlight is incorrect on this J3a and I will probably swap it with the PSC version.
The locomotive drivers (Scullin disc phone dials on this cab number) are pressed to solid axles unlike the old model which had screw-ons on Magne-Traction axles. (Remember the first scale SF and NYC F3s having M-T too around this time?) The traction tires are on the rear drivers as opposed to the center blind ones like the old days. I'd imagine this will give the engine a bit more 'bite' on the rail. My tires are a little thick or maybe not seated perfectly giving the engine a bit of wobble at speed. You may see this a bit in some of the quick vids above by observing the cab roof. I may try to seat them a bit more or just run them in. I always expect a bit more traction tire-induced wobble on six-coupled driver steamers as opposed to the eight and ten wheeled steamers I usually run. There are three pickup rollers so it may be less prone to dropping out over power gaps. I usually put 'cheater plug' tethers on my steam engines if they tend to drop out too often, which is most likely to happen over my Atlas #5 switches.
Running qualities are what I expect from Legacy with no jitter or shakes observed at low speed in either direction. Other videos on here were making me a bit nervous but all seems well so far. I really like Legacy's motion controls and think they still have the best in 3 rail O. This engine also sports the back-drivable gears that may have made their first Hudson appearance on the old CCII ESE Hudson.
So far so good. I recently sold off all my NYC freight power with the intention of sticking with PRR (and a few stragglers here and there that took a wrong turn somewhere) but always wanted a proper Hudson because everyone should own a Hudson at least once or twice.
Excellent review! Like the idea that there is no jitter or shakes.
I have a question, Norm...may I come over and play? And may I bring my 50th Anniversary Set?
Norm Charbonneau posted:"Here are some initial observations using the 28072 Hudson from way back as a point of comparison. I chose the cataloged 5418 J3a because I liked the combination of the Scullins and the standard tender much like the old 28072 TMCC Hudson from way with the 5444 cab number."
"So far so good. I recently sold off all my NYC freight power with the intention of sticking with PRR (and a few stragglers here and there that took a wrong turn somewhere) but always wanted a proper Hudson because everyone should own a Hudson at least once or twice. "
Norm,
Looking forward to your chosen modifications. When Lionel does something well, it is usually fabulous. Their issues with incorrect paint colors, lettering or whistle sounds when the previous runs were correct I just don't understand.
I should have mentioned I am running it in full Legacy mode, base ver. 1.6 and CAB-2 ver. 1.61. I am using a 135W Powerhouse through a Legacy PowerMaster 180W version. I have yet to try Bluetooth, perhaps I'll demo it when I film a full video of it later. I filmed some unboxing and first run footage but it's kinda lame/boring.
Greg, bring it over. Maybe we can swap boilerfronts. 
I see that it is unavailable on the parts breakdown on the CS site.
Bobby, looks like Lionel got the black right! 
The graphite is a little too silver for my tastes, especially considering the darker colors Lionel has used in the past. I saw some fuschia colored Lionels last night when I picked this up and saw the new J. Glad my engine is black!
Looks excellent Norm. I'll have to catch the other bits later, back to work before heading home.
Norm thanks so much for sharing your videos and detailed info about the loco. If you have any occasion to remove the shell, I would like to know what gear ratio Lionel used.
If you need an "excuse" to run NYC power on your layout, you can just call it a detour move ;-) It's always amazing to see the fruits of your labors on the Forum! Happy Thanksgiving!!
I may get into it at some point Ted. I hosed it pretty good with smoke fluid already to film the videos so I probably want to give it a thorough cleaning before weathering (and turning the smoke off for good probably). I am not sure what frame it's using as the original had provisions for a mechanical puffer-style smoke unit. I'd imagine it's been reworked for the modern lash-free driveline and smoke units.
In any case, here's a video of it on my layout pulling my GGD collection:
Norm, first rate!! I was blown away at 2:09 in your last video!! Never knew that my loco's were capable of such performance! Out of curiosity, when loading the smoke unit, how many drops were you adding at a time? Thanks!
Norm Charbonneau postedI am not sure what frame it's using as the original had provisions for a mechanical puffer-style smoke unit. I'd imagine it's been reworked for the modern lash-free driveline and smoke units.
In any case, here's a video of it on my layout pulling my GGD collection:
Friendly FYI: The chassis/frame utilized for the Century Club II Empire State shrouded J3a (2005-6) was designed to accommodate the lash-free drive line and fan-type smoke unit to which you alluded.
Awesome pictures and videos of your J3a in action!!
Bob
FYI the TMCC Hudsons used a two lobe cam on the forward axle to both move the lever on the puffer unit and close the chuff switch. That cam can be easily (due to the screwed on drivers) changed out with a 4 lobe cam and the puffer unit replaced by a fan unit. That frame will accomodate both systems.
Pete
Norm, thank you for the videos! It is always a treat to see trains running on your magnificent layout.
Happy railroading,
Don
Norm;
A beautiful engine on an AMAZING layout - thanks for sharing. I have the 5418 on order... hopefully it will be in when I get back home next week.
Oh man outstanding engine, cars, layout everything. Looking forward to the blu-ray video of your layout.
Thanks Norm. Great review and great videos!
Great video....!! And beautiful engine....
I have a 5 year old son who is into trains (almost) as much as I am... when he heard the video he ran over to see what was playing. First thing out of his mouth was “Is this real life...?” A true testimony to how authentic your layout is.... I keep waiting for the post announcing your first “How to make your layout look like this!” class... Awesome stuff Norm...
Happy Thanksgiving to all...!!
I recently obtained a brand new 6-28072 and am thrilled with detail and performance. I look forward to what you do for weathering. It is very difficult to find color pictures of these engines while still in service. Thanks for the info.
Happy Thanksgiving
Norm, throughly enjoyed the Youtube video, backed up and watched portions multiple times. The high speed run across the bridge was beyond outstanding.
Norm, Thank you for the videos. I will come back and watch them when I need motivation to keep working on my layout. Very nice work.
John
RickM46 posted:Norm, first rate!! I was blown away at 2:09 in your last video!! Never knew that my loco's were capable of such performance! Out of curiosity, when loading the smoke unit, how many drops were you adding at a time? Thanks!
Thx Rick, I used about 10 drops at a time, hitting it again just as it petered out. Maybe I should use more but I'm about to slide the smoke switch to 'off' anyway and clean it up.
Ted S posted:Norm thanks so much for sharing your videos and detailed info about the loco. If you have any occasion to remove the shell, I would like to know what gear ratio Lionel used.
If you need an "excuse" to run NYC power on your layout, you can just call it a detour move ;-) It's always amazing to see the fruits of your labors on the Forum! Happy Thanksgiving!!
Ted, I think the gear ratio is about ~20:1 judging by the exposed setscrew on the encoder assembly. I found I could turn the drivers and see the setscrew cruise by without taking anything apart.
I have posted a few of Norm’s videos before and it’s simply the best I have ever seen and sets a standard for excellence that I could never emulate but I’ll try
Bob Bubeck posted:Norm Charbonneau postedI am not sure what frame it's using as the original had provisions for a mechanical puffer-style smoke unit. I'd imagine it's been reworked for the modern lash-free driveline and smoke units.
In any case, here's a video of it on my layout pulling my GGD collection:
Friendly FYI: The chassis/frame utilized for the Century Club II Empire State shrouded J3a (2005-6) was designed to accommodate the lash-free drive line and fan-type smoke unit to which you alluded.
Awesome pictures and videos of your J3a in action!!
Bob
Beautiful! video is amazing.
Do these have the water scoop steam effect?
Norm Charbonneau posted:RickM46 posted:Norm, first rate!! I was blown away at 2:09 in your last video!! Never knew that my loco's were capable of such performance! Out of curiosity, when loading the smoke unit, how many drops were you adding at a time? Thanks!
Thx Rick, I used about 10 drops at a time, hitting it again just as it petered out. Maybe I should use more but I'm about to slide the smoke switch to 'off' anyway and clean it up.
Thanks Norm!! I usually add 1 drop per minute of run time and do it after 10 minutes - 10 drops - purely a guess on my part. Anything less, and I think you are just wetting the funnel and resistor and not the batting. Got a good idea of smoke fills from 'laidoffsick' and his videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRcpFRtA6IY; and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1asUWbJtfok
SandJam posted:Bob Bubeck posted:Norm Charbonneau postedI am not sure what frame it's using as the original had provisions for a mechanical puffer-style smoke unit. I'd imagine it's been reworked for the modern lash-free driveline and smoke units.
In any case, here's a video of it on my layout pulling my GGD collection:
Friendly FYI: The chassis/frame utilized for the Century Club II Empire State shrouded J3a (2005-6) was designed to accommodate the lash-free drive line and fan-type smoke unit to which you alluded.
Awesome pictures and videos of your J3a in action!!
Bob
Beautiful! video is amazing.
Do these have the water scoop steam effect?
Sean, the twelve wheel tenders do not have the water scoop “spray” affect.........only the PT tenders have this.....Pat
The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
Norm Charbonneau posted:The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
Quite right Norm!.....IF and Only IF they scooped water that slow, I doubt it’d even come out the vent escapes. If it did, it surely be complete liquid form....I never understood hitting that feature at a slow rate of speed.......but I guess they just think it’s cool looking........Pat
harmonyards posted:Norm Charbonneau posted:The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
Quite right Norm!.....IF and Only IF they scooped water that slow, I doubt it’d even come out the vent escapes. If it did, it surely be complete liquid form....I never understood hitting that feature at a slow rate of speed.......but I guess they just think it’s cool looking........Pat
two reasons I activate at whatever speed I want:
- I think it's fun
- To cause apoplexy among others
I set up a Kadee 805 using the supplied adapter and hardware. It rides a tad low. The gap in the beam may not be the prettiest either but it won’t bother me too much. I may try to grind the adapter down a bit to raise the coupler height. Let’s see how much it bugs me.
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Try the pilot truck from the ESE Hudson looks better
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That does look better! What is the diameter of those pilot wheels? I may order it.
The part number is 6308000950 not sure of diameter it is a little bigger than what’s on there and works fine — it’s $22
Norm, you can try mounting the coupler to the Lionel adaptor minus the couplers lid. You will have to file down the boxes mounting bosses flush. This should get you closer to the right height. I have filled in the rear of some of my tenders with brass stock to frame the coupler better and eliminate that big empty look needed for the coil coupler.
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I may try that Dave. I built up beams on a few tenders, maybe I’ll do this one if it bugs me enough. If I don’t use the lid, I will definitely have to fill in the beam.
Here is the PSC tender beam on a 3rd Rail tender with airhoses and cut bar added.
Rather than cut the existing bar off of the Lionel tender you might be able cut the top off the PSC beam and splice it on.
Pete,
Member of the void the warranty club.
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In leu of buying the entire ESE pilot truck, I buy these axle sets, (actually, I have bunch leftover from the semi-scale days) .........these wheels are just a hair, and I do mean a hair bigger than the ESE pilot wheels....however, they are the exact same size as the MTH Dreyfus and ESE front pilot wheels.....no problems installing these onto J3 (28072) ......a little tiny bit of brake shoe clean up is all that’s required.....Pat
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Norm Charbonneau posted:The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
It was just a question, why is everyone so nasty on this forum lately?
They are toys, not real engines. Maybe the guys are just having fun.
SandJam posted:Norm Charbonneau posted:The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
It was just a question, why is everyone so nasty on this forum lately?
They are toys, not real engines. Maybe the guys are just having fun.
Don’t get your drawers all bunched up.....nobody directed anything directly at you .....I believe I answered your question earlier.......Pat
So far I ordered the ESE Hudson pilot truck from Lionel and the 4419/4420 NYC headlight and bracket from PSC. Not sure when I'll see these parts. I really wish I could order the plain boiler from the 50th Anniversary Hudson. To tell the truth, I'm not even sure how much the incorrect headlight and smaller pilot wheels bug me. I may get back to tweaking the height of the Kadee mount in any case. I also ordered hardware to mount Kadees to all the GGD coaches and head end cars shown in the vids. The express reefer is already converted.
The undersized pilot wheels really detract from the overall effect of the locomotive as this excellent model of Ron H's clearly illustrates. I don't think he will mind me posting it over here from another thread that has run out. This a Williams 'Masterpiece Series' Hudson from some years ago if memory serves me correctly.
It's sitting on Ron's 'custom' 3 rail track as well, just look at that rail profile.
Has Lionel ever made a full-scale pilot truck? Am thinking we had one available for the 1990 700E as an option and it looked really nice. Can't remember if it was from Lionel or aftermarket...
I'll have to throw in with the anti - PT tender group - from a visual standpoint it just appears too large and overpowers the locomotive. Fine with the Niagara but not the Hudson even though it was prototypical in some cases. The 12 wheel unit looks 'just right' :-)
c.sam posted:Has Lionel ever made a full-scale pilot truck? Am thinking we had one available for the 1990 700E as an option and it looked really nice. Can't remember if it was from Lionel or aftermarket..
I posted a picture of the scale pilot truck for the 1990 1-700E Hudson in this thread.
Norm Charbonneau posted:My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
I guess that got by me...?
Mark in Oregon
question for norm--in one of your j3a videos there is a brown P&LE box car withe the NYC cigar band number 5993 in the background--could you be so kind as to tell me the manufacturer? Thanks
20centuryhudson posted:question for norm--in one of your j3a videos there is a brown P&LE box car withe the NYC cigar band number 5993 in the background--could you be so kind as to tell me the manufacturer? Thanks
This is an old Weaver car.
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Mark, if you look closely you can see a big drop of smoke fluid get ejected from the stack. Normally it would landed on an adjacent engine or piece of rolling stock but this one looks to have fallen into the ballast.
Thank you Norm
Love the video!
Norm, I'm not sure what smoke fluid you are using, but I've had issues with fluid spitting from smoke units. It does make a mess sometimes on the boiler itself. Last year, I purchased some Lionel Premium Smoke Fluid and that issue went away. It has worked well for me.
Thanks for sharing your layout. Stellar.
I believe I am using the Lionel stuff (label is long gone). In any case, this is always a nice feature:
I think I may keep this a non smoker.
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Hi Norm, long time since I caught up with you. I was out of the hobby for years except for an occasional loop of Christmas track. And now dabbling in prewar tinplate in a very modest way.
Thought I'd say hi. You are still, for my money, the best three-rail modeler out there and one of the best in any scale. I look forward to catching up with your work.
Norm. Absolutely. Great solution.
Norm, I was so impressed with your video of the #5418 NYC Hudson. It runs very well.
Sincerely, John Rowlen
20centuryhudson posted:Try the pilot truck from the ESE Hudson looks better
@20centuryhudson, what is the product number of the ESE that you mention?
Thanks!
Picked up my 5405 (has whitewall tires like it would for a builder photo) today and struggled to carried it up the stairs to the layout room. After lube put it on my small O36 layout and started to run it. Two observations: 1. It was worth the 19 year wait as I could not afford one in 2000 - 2001 - sure smokes a lot - like a MTH engine 2. With the 6 wheel tender trucks has no problem navigating O36 curves - its a true third rail engine.
I believe the ESE pilot truck number is 6308000050
Norm Charbonneau posted:Mark, if you look closely you can see a big drop of smoke fluid get ejected from the stack. Normally it would landed on an adjacent engine or piece of rolling stock but this one looks to have fallen into the ballast.
Thanks Norm; it took me a couple of viewings, but I see it now... 
Mark in Oregon
20centuryhudson posted:I believe the ESE pilot truck number is 6308000050
Thank you.
Will posted:Hi Norm, long time since I caught up with you. I was out of the hobby for years except for an occasional loop of Christmas track. And now dabbling in prewar tinplate in a very modest way.
Thought I'd say hi. You are still, for my money, the best three-rail modeler out there and one of the best in any scale. I look forward to catching up with your work.
Hey will, nice to hear from you! Hope all is well!
Larry Mullen posted:20centuryhudson posted:I believe the ESE pilot truck number is 6308000050
Thank you.
I found 680-2529-050. Is it the same? This was for one of the Legacy ESEs. The p/n I mentioned has a ground wire assembly with lugs for the same price.
SandJam posted:Bob Bubeck posted:Norm Charbonneau postedI am not sure what frame it's using as the original had provisions for a mechanical puffer-style smoke unit. I'd imagine it's been reworked for the modern lash-free driveline and smoke units.
In any case, here's a video of it on my layout pulling my GGD collection:
Friendly FYI: The chassis/frame utilized for the Century Club II Empire State shrouded J3a (2005-6) was designed to accommodate the lash-free drive line and fan-type smoke unit to which you alluded.
Awesome pictures and videos of your J3a in action!!
Bob
Beautiful! video is amazing.
Do these have the water scoop steam effect?
Outstanding layout, and absolutely beautiful in every category !! Very impressive'...
SandJam posted:Norm Charbonneau posted:The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
It was just a question, why is everyone so nasty on this forum lately?
They are toys, not real engines. Maybe the guys are just having fun.
Hi Sandjam' 😏
You don't understand'. These are real engines to the true enthusiast , and become alive along with everything layout related. When a model railroader has invested Thousands of Dollar$, it becomes more real than many can imagine'... So I get your point. But cannot agree with the toy concept'.. regarding this particular layout'... Please take another look at the videos. I think you will understand my narrative here'... 👀
c.sam posted:Has Lionel ever made a full-scale pilot truck? Am thinking we had one available for the 1990 700E as an option and it looked really nice. Can't remember if it was from Lionel or aftermarket...
I'll have to throw in with the anti - PT tender group - from a visual standpoint it just appears too large and overpowers the locomotive. Fine with the Niagara but not the Hudson even though it was prototypical in some cases. The 12 wheel unit looks 'just right' :-)
I put a Lionel scale pilot truck on my Mercury-service 5344 (ex-Lionel "Santa Fe" - Warhorse) streamline project Hudson. These are Lionel parts and drop right into the 700E-DNA locos, as well as the Williams die-cast "zoom-zoom" Hudson clone. I find them on eBay. They should not fit the new Hudsons as made; never tried to adapt one, but there's an idea....
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Quarter Gauger 48 posted:SandJam posted:Norm Charbonneau posted:The water scoop smoke ooze feature is gross, gimme a break. Guys keep lighting it off while they run their engines at 2mph too.
My almost complete disdain for smoke units can be seen if you look closely at 0:20 in the video I posted.
It was just a question, why is everyone so nasty on this forum lately?
They are toys, not real engines. Maybe the guys are just having fun.
Hi Sandjam' 😏
You don't understand'. These are real engines to the true enthusiast , and become alive along with everything layout related. When a model railroader has invested Thousands of Dollar$, it becomes more real than many can imagine'... So I get your point. But cannot agree with the toy concept'.. regarding this particular layout'... Please take another look at the videos. I think you will understand my narrative here'... 👀
Very well put!...nice!...😉......Pat
I pulled the class lights and filled the smokebox front (came out so-so). Also sanded the seam down in front of the booster stack and also experimented with grinding the heads off of the hinge screws. I painted the smokebox MM Engine Black:
Also Kadee’d up all the GGD cars seen in the vids.
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Norm Charbonneau posted:I pulled the class lights and filled the smokebox front (came out so-so). Also sanded the seam down in front of the booster stack and also experimented with grinding the heads off of the hinge screws. I painted the smokebox MM Engine Black:
Also Kadee’d up all the GGD cars seen in the vids.
Looks real good Norm, nice work!.......Pat
I got the ESE pilot truck today. The wheels are much closer to 36” and the wheelbase is correct at a bit over 7’. I had to transfer the front link from the stock one and had to grind the pivot standoff down a bit to get more vertical travel.
The pilot wheel centerlines are a bit closer to where they should since they are not on a stretched wheelbase as the stock one has an 8’ wheelbase.
Here are some before and after shots:
Also got the GGD cars ready to weather:
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Question Norm the wire that goes from the frame to the pilot truck — the previous J3a from awhile ago doesn’t have it this one does — is its purpose just a ground ? Is it necessary? Thanks
Just a ground strap. It couldn’t hurt being there that’s for sure! I’ve had engines with bad grounds (especially diesels) before so I appreciate the extra connection. This engine also has three pickup rollers and doesn’t stall at any speed on my Atlas #5s.
Really enjoying this thread..
Beautiful, Norm!
Peter
Here are some of the cars I finished:
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Rockershovel posted:Really enjoying this thread..
...me too!
Mark in Oregon
I purchased Mr Muffins special run Hudson that didn’t come with marker lights. I thought Lionel was supposed to offer boiler fronts without lights or each engine was supposed to come with them? The head light really bugs me and I’ll be switching out sooner or later. Same with the front truck. Otherwise she’s a great runner, and sounds great.
We fly toy RC airplanes in a city park. Granted some of the turbine guys have over $20,000 in each plane, but they are still just toys.
Why do people take such offense at hobbies being called toys? Hobbies are great and they keep us sane. If you're not getting paid to do it, it's a hobby.😀
Used to be if you excused any problem on a model by saying its only third rail but that offended people too. Lionel brought back 2 models in the last two years that have sold well that I wanted - the PRR H10 last year and the NYC J3a this year - two great toy locomotive.
Finished weathering the GGD coaches, combine, and observation car last night. I will finish the Hudson when I get my PSC headlight and bracket.
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Its up to you Norm but you can use the existing bracket after cutting off the headlight. If you use the PSC bracket you will have to number it and add the nameplate.
The weathering looks great BTW.
Pete
Norm Charbonneau posted:
WOW! That smokebox paint looks fantastic! Where can you find it?
Pete, thanks. I got the bracket just in case. It seemed a bit brutal to grind that poor headlight off its base. I was planning on flicking the plate off the Lionel headlight and transferring it. PSC doesn’t have a lens nor a reflector so I will have to deal with that when it shows up.
Nick, that is straight Model Masters Engine Black acrylic airbrushed over the original silver. I also hit the firebox with it:
Here is the nasty parting line getting dealt with. I managed to blast a river or two off and didn’t notice until I painted the smokebox. A couple of carefully placed drops of medium thick CA restored them:
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Hello Norm
I have admired your work and tried to copy onto my own rolling stock. I have a new Hudson 28072 that I want to weather. Where do you find color pictures to use as a guide?
Thanks
Ray
Ray Marion posted:Hello Norm
I have admired your work and tried to copy onto my own rolling stock. I have a new Hudson 28072 that I want to weather. Where do you find color pictures to use as a guide?
Thanks
Ray
Ray
It seems to me that there was a fairly recent thread about this very thing...perhaps someone here can verify that...
Mark in Oregon
Norm Charbonneau posted:PSC doesn’t have a lens nor a reflector so I will have to deal with that when it shows up.
I managed to blast a river or two off and didn’t notice until I painted the smokebox.
Norm,
Just paint the inside of the headlight with Molotow Liquid Chrome. Let it pool and you'll be amazed at the results. As for the missing rivets, I use Archer Fine Transfer rivet decals with excellent results.
superwarp1 posted:I purchased Mr Muffins special run Hudson that didn’t come with marker lights. I thought Lionel was supposed to offer boiler fronts without lights or each engine was supposed to come with them? The head light really bugs me and I’ll be switching out sooner or later. Same with the front truck. Otherwise she’s a great runner, and sounds great
That’s not what I recall about the boiler fronts. Pat’s offered his version without the marker lights with a second front with light included at no cost. However, when I spoke with Pat the day my engine shipped he told me Lionel had not sent the boiler fronts with lights yet so he could ship them with the engine. So far no boiler front but I have not given up hope.
Mike
Strummer
You are correct about the thread. I am hoping Norm may have another alternative.
Ray
I’m sure I posted this project on another thread, but I’ll put it on here for Norm to see...this is a cheap doming set I bought from Harbor Freight .... many sizes, and one perfect for the cored PSC NYC headlights...simple to make, and as Big Jim replied, just flow in the Molotow liquid chrome.....instant reflector...the doming set will even perforate the brass sheet from the formed bowl. Clean it up with fine paper and your off....notch it for light leaks into side number boards if desired........Pat
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Ray, I have yet to find a decent non-streamlined Hudson photo in color. I am just going to do some standard airbrush weathering with some minor drybrushing. I plan on going for a medium weight effort with acrylics. I'll probably do a coat of flat clear then Grimy Black of varying intensity over the boiler and tender. I prefer to shoot clear first for a bit of sheen kill and it also provides a bit of tooth for washes and low-lights if I do them. I use Grimy Black sparingly over clear. I feel like clear over the applied colors tends to make things look glazed and it takes out some of the subtle variations of the applied colors. Drivers and running gear will get Grimy Black and maybe a touch of RR Tie Brown. I may take the rods off as I kind of like the factory finish on them, maybe they'll get a bit of flat clear and a light black wash. The last bit will be some drybrushed streaks from saturated steam here and there. Even B&W photos are useful for figuring out where to put them. A little bit goes a long way with that effect.
As information, research into the types of coal used by specific railroads and their supply of water, is always helpful on determining weathering characteristics. For some examples:
1) The New York Central RR generally had/used two types of coal, i.e. one "higher grade, higher BTU Bituminous" for steam locomotives assigned to passenger service, and a slightly "lower/less expensive Bituminous" for all other freight power. Thus, NYC passenger locomotives tended to look less "sooty".
2) The New York Central RR had VERY good water throughout their system, plus an EXCELLENT Water Service Dept. to maintain boiler water treatment chemicals. As a result, most NYC main line steam power tended to NOT have all those white/light mineral deposits all over the tops of their locomotives (as compared to, say the Union Pacific steam locomotives).
3) Weathering steam locomotive running gear machinery tends to be a bit of a mystery to many. It is also worth researching the various lubricants used throughout the different machinery. The plain type side rod bearings used a hard stick grease (Texaco Hi-Tex 8, primarily), while the roller bearing side rods used a soft grease, which was used very sparingly. Other parts of the machinery, such as driving box jaws, received Machine Oil from the mechanical lubricator, while both the valves and cylinders were supplied with Valve Oil (sometimes referred to as 'Steam Oil'), which was supplied by another mechanical lubricator and forced into the steam flow to the valve chest and cylinders. All of these different lubricants leave different looking "deposits" throughout the running gear. Thus, there is rarely any "rust" appearing on the running gear of a main line steam locomotive.
Thanks Jack.
Headlight situation is a little funny right now. Trying to get PSC to get a cored one out to me but it's not clear they are available. My paper version of their catalog doesn't list one. Maybe I missed something in the ordering instructions. 
Norm, The Uncored one is PSH-4420 listed as NYC headlight. The cored version is PSH-4743 described as a Niagara headlight. Harmon pictured the 4743 above.
Pete
No kidding! Thanks Pete, I will see if I can change my order.
Norm and Jack
Thanks again for your valuable info. I am old enough to remember steam but too young for the details. I don't mind ruining a car but a little worried on the engine. I am watching with anticipation. Jack hope to run into you again. Always enjoy your comments.
Best
Norm, if PSC is out of stock of 4743, and you need one, I have spares so you can finish your job......you can just replace it when they get back in stock......Pat
They are in stock and available on ebay. PSC has been selling on eBay for some time. Handy if you only need a few items. Seller name "j-tprantle".
Pete
Norm, I finally got back to look through this topic, and you know what? This is now my favorite Hudson topics out of the 6 or 7 I think I've had my eyes in. I really love how you ran it through the different speeds and opened it up full boar.
The layout just opens my mind to some of the old photos and videos I've seen on YouTube. I love all your work, the weathering, scenery and even the customizing the engine.
Question, has your layout been run in the magazine(I think I may have seen it but oddly can't remember)?
PSC prices are a little higher on eBay than in the catalog. Email them what you want and they will send you a invoice in a few days. With PSC you need to be patient. They have plenty of the 4419 and 4420 NYC style headlight and bracket
Thx for the help with the headlight fellas. I was thinking j_prantle on eBay was PSC. He has the headlights on the bay but not the bracket, that's why I emailed them as I was hoping to get both parts together. I was planning on trying to transfer the Lionel lens, numberboards, and front oval/numberboard to the PSC assembly. I'm assuming the lit numberboards in a Pyle headlight were lit separately and was thinking I may use the class light circuit to light them with some 0402 SMD LEDs I've become a fan of.
The TMCC J3s came with a single incandescent in the headlight that also lights the numberboards in the headlight. Even if you use the cored headlight it will get pretty crowded in there if you separate the headlight from the numberboards. The numberboard inserts are actually designed as light pipes so the source of light doesn't have be directly behind them on center.
Pete
Kind of a lame pic, but the 0402 SMD LEDs are tiny and very bright! Those leads are like 40AWG teflon insulated. You can barely see the LED sitting out there at the ends. GOR bulb and ceramic LED from some Weaver markers for compar-o.
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PSC parts showed up this week. Mulling over my options here. Not sure if I want to grind the Lionel headlight off it’s base and mount the PSC one in its place or use the PSC bracket and mod the smokebox door for it. A bit of work either way. The reflector is a brass lampshade made by Miniatronics I think. I stuck it in my Dremel and filed it’s OD down a bit to fit the headlight. Not sure about the lens yet. I am going to carefully fit the numberboards from the Lionel headlight.
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Norm, I’m doing the same thing as you. Only difference is I have no skill in this area and will be giving this project to Harry Heike. I need to replace the boiler front anyway as I received mine broken. When Lionel sends it to me I’ll send it to Harry. One thing I should do is take a pic of my 3rdrail J3 headlight for how it should look like.
Metal tape reflector. It’s not just for smoke units anymore! 
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Well I swapped out the headlight (a lot more hassle than I thought!) and got it set up with some weathering. Here’s how it looks now:
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Headlight looks great Norm. Isn't always a hassle when something that should be simple messes with you?
As usual Norm, your work is fantastic. Thanks for sharing your progress with us.
Charlie
Thx guys. Youtube is up. This is how it will roll for a while. Smoke will stay off but it's already too late, it looks like someone rubbed a ham sandwich all around the whistle hole. 
Norm, I so much totally enjoy just seeing your work on your layout and train operation; it is so well done; thanks for sharing. Falcon70
Norm;
Amazing... I have the same engine, as delivered (from Lionel, that is) and I love it. Unfortunately, I have neither the artistic skill nor patience to do what you have done - you are a true artist. While I have enjoyed your videos in the past, the scene in this video showing the train passing outside the office is genius. Thanks for sharing.
P.S. I was going to ask how you know what a whistle hole that has been rubbed with a ham sandwich looks like, but I’ve thought better of it - but it makes me glad that the first thing I do with a new engine is turn off the smoke!!!
Looks real good Norm, nice work.....video turned out beautiful.....now I’m hungry for a ham sandwich....😉...........Pat
Simply the best I’ve ever seen — Norm is the gold standard in my book
Hey Norm - Why do you not like smoke on these beautiful locomotives you run? I've been sitting here watching some of your videos and am seeing the one with the double headed K4s with both of them smoking. WOW - really looks great!
Merry Christmas to you sir...
A NY Central Hudson running under pennsy signals—such a sin LOL
I love the Pennsy, and may be guilty of all kinds of sins for saying so, but the when you speak of a "Hudson," anyone with any sense knows that you're talking about a NYC J 3. There is not a line out of place, it just looks beautiful. And as far as its running on Pennsy ROW, they were just lucky that day! Fantastic job of making it "look real."
c.sam posted:Hey Norm - Why do you not like smoke on these beautiful locomotives you run? I've been sitting here watching some of your videos and am seeing the one with the double headed K4s with both of them smoking. WOW - really looks great!
Merry Christmas to you sir...
I think he's just trying to avoid the inevitable glop of smoke fluid that may/will come out of the stack and onto his finish.
Amazing. Hoping I can get 10% of the realism you have there on my layout.
Norm, where did you get the front truck. Looks 100% better than out of the box
Glad you guys liked the video! Merry Christmas! 
superwarp1 posted:Norm, where did you get the front truck. Looks 100% better than out of the box
Gary, Norm posted this back on page 2 of this thread;
”So far I ordered the ESE Hudson pilot truck from Lionel and the 4419/4420 NYC headlight and bracket from PSC.”
20CENTURYHUDSON posted part# information;
“ The part number is 6308000050 not sure of diameter it is a little bigger than what’s on there and works fine — it’s $22”
***EDITED*** Corrected part number above to match part number listed on website.
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20centuryhudson posted:A NY Central Hudson running under pennsy signals—such a sin LOL
Not to mention the color video....all wrong. 
Looks great Norm, very inspiring to those of us "beginners". Theres alot that can be learned viewing the details of your scenery.
If you haven't already.
I think you should post some of your stuff over on the 2 rail forum just to p*** those guys off LOL!
GregM posted:superwarp1 posted:Norm, where did you get the front truck. Looks 100% better than out of the box
Gary, Norm posted this back on page 2 of this thread;
”So far I ordered the ESE Hudson pilot truck from Lionel and the 4419/4420 NYC headlight and bracket from PSC.”
20CENTURYHUDSON posted part# information;
“ The part number is 6308000950 not sure of diameter it is a little bigger than what’s on there and works fine — it’s $22”
Great, wondering why Lionel wouldn’t use these to begin with. Oh well I’ll get one on order.
Why not just use 2 rail scale wheels in the pilot truck ? I have run my 2 rail scale cars on Atlas 3 rail track.
The part number is 6308000950 not sure of diameter it is a little bigger than what’s on there and works fine — it’s $22 is this a lionel part number. can not see it listed in their parts order listing?
tangoman posted:The part number is 6308000950 not sure of diameter it is a little bigger than what’s on there and works fine — it’s $22 is this a lionel part number. can not see it listed in their parts order listing?
I have discovered many items I search for flash a full screen for an instant and then come up with item not found. Sets, engines, parts, etc. Don't know why. I called once and they couldn't locate the set number either.
The part number is actually 6308000050.
I also corrected my previous post with the incorrect part number.
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That video is absolutely gorgeous...
