SuperChiefer84 posted:

Jon, if the TMCC receiver board is not the issue (no programming) then the RCMC board must be where the engine ID is stored or should be stored correct?

Wouldn't it make sense for Lionel to have a backdoor something or other that they can access for programming.  If it were to leak, I'm sure the high tech guys here would be able to take advantage of it.  If not re-programming, are we talking about throwing away the boards and replacing?  I would love to see the production numbers on this set.  at 5 minutes per train, it will be a while in the process.  I'm glad I can run some other stuff during their absence.  

Bryant

TCA 18-73717

What’s a shame is that items like these, ones with known defects, will continue to be sold to uninformed hobbyists by all the dealers with no mention of the defect.

Happens all the time.

They should all be recalled, repaired, tested, and then returned to the dealers.

Buyer beware.

Craignor posted:

What’s a shame is that items like these, ones with known defects, will continue to be sold to uninformed hobbyists by all the dealers with no mention of the defect.

Happens all the time.

They should all be recalled, repaired, tested, and then returned to the dealers.

Buyer beware.

You are correct. I just checked and at least 3 major online hobby shops are still in stock and offering them. 

Went to my LHS today, and they were unaware of the issue until I told them. They tested their Alco's and RS11's while I was there and both had the issue. They were packing them up and sending them back.

Shame too, because I was going pick up a BN RS-11 but will hold off now. With that said I was able to see the Halloween one in action, and I was blown away by the sounds, really cool!

Just got off the phone with Lionel Service.  We were going through the RMA generation and was told to hold a minute.  The young man came back on and told me they would be getting back to me to arrange the RMA.  He told me he never heard the issue we are experiencing.  My gut is that they are working on a protocol for the repairs.  I think the quantity will be pretty high.

Bryant

TCA 18-73717

tangoman posted:

just called lionel. they are not taking any warranty work on these engines at this time. said to call back in a week. grrrrr not happy. 

I did better than you.  My Lionel guy said he would call back when they are ready.

 

Do you really think he will call back?  Let's see.

Bryant

TCA 18-73717

I'm a little surprised to hear that, considering that Dave was on this  thread weeks ago explaining what they were going to do to fix them. And since I sent my original set back to Concord for a refund about 3 weeks ago I know they have a set to work out the fix on. I guess Bryant is right...they need time to set up a protocol.

I emailed Katie on June 27 about the problem, so I know they are fully aware of the issue.  Given that Lionel is usually quite fast about warranty repair, it says to me this recall will be very big.  Still, returning my set to my retailer is out of the questions since I think Lionel will come up with a fix and the Railsounds is the best I have ever heard.  One wonders how something like this could slip through quality control, assuming there is a quality control

Pennsyforever

pennsyforever posted:

I emailed Katie on June 27 about the problem, so I know they are fully aware of the issue.  Given that Lionel is usually quite fast about warranty repair, it says to me this recall will be very big.  Still, returning my set to my retailer is out of the questions since I think Lionel will come up with a fix and the Railsounds is the best I have ever heard.  One wonders how something like this could slip through quality control, assuming there is a quality control

Pennsyforever

I agree with you.  I will look for a set  of Santa Fe s at York. I'm just going to hand them over to Dave to fix when I see him there. 

J Daddy posted:
pennsyforever posted:

I emailed Katie on June 27 about the problem, so I know they are fully aware of the issue.  Given that Lionel is usually quite fast about warranty repair, it says to me this recall will be very big.  Still, returning my set to my retailer is out of the questions since I think Lionel will come up with a fix and the Railsounds is the best I have ever heard.  One wonders how something like this could slip through quality control, assuming there is a quality control

Pennsyforever

I agree with you.  I will look for a set  of Santa Fe s at York. I'm just going to hand them over to Dave to fix when I see him there. 

Having been one of the original posters on this topic with my NYC locos, I could not help myself.  I just ordered the UP version also.  I told my dealer that the packing should be good because it is most likely going to Concord after I receive them.  They are beautiful engines and will be a nice diesel puller when not using my new Challenger, which is being delayed as we speak.

Am I nuts?  Yes.  I have 2 complete Acela sets running flawlessly on my layout.  Who can top that in returning for punishment.

Bryant

TCA 18-73717

J Daddy posted:

I agree with you.  I will look for a set  of Santa Fe s at York. I'm just going to hand them over to Dave to fix when I see him there. 

Good luck.  Dave and Dean didn't attend last fall and Lionel not at all in the spring.  If Lionel continues to focus on other shows I doubt we'll see any technical folks at York for some time.

Marty

 

Below the Signature...

" Number One, make it "O"!"

 

Bryant Dunivan 111417 posted:
J Daddy posted:
pennsyforever posted:

I emailed Katie on June 27 about the problem, so I know they are fully aware of the issue.  Given that Lionel is usually quite fast about warranty repair, it says to me this recall will be very big.  Still, returning my set to my retailer is out of the questions since I think Lionel will come up with a fix and the Railsounds is the best I have ever heard.  One wonders how something like this could slip through quality control, assuming there is a quality control

Pennsyforever

I agree with you.  I will look for a set  of Santa Fe s at York. I'm just going to hand them over to Dave to fix when I see him there. 

Having been one of the original posters on this topic with my NYC locos, I could not help myself.  I just ordered the UP version also.  I told my dealer that the packing should be good because it is most likely going to Concord after I receive them.  They are beautiful engines and will be a nice diesel puller when not using my new Challenger, which is being delayed as we speak.

Am I nuts?  Yes.  I have 2 complete Acela sets running flawlessly on my layout.  Who can top that in returning for punishment.

Good for you Bryant!! I'm on my 3rd NYC set after returning the first 2 which were no good. Even after 2 disasters I still got another because the good outweighs the bad. Taking your advice (thank you) I ordered my new set from Steve at MrMuffins and the third time was the charm. This set has none of the serious issues the first 2 had and I am enjoying the heck out of running them! Thanks again Bryant and Steve!

BNSF-Matt posted:

@JamesRx Glad to see you have a working set now. Even though this ID issue is a bummer, the set gets an A+ in every other category for me. I will wait it out and see what options Lionel has for folks. 

Thanks so much Matt! I have spent so many hours close up with these engines that I know Every tiny imperfection, including many that a normal person would never notice! But even with all that, and I am a bit of a perfectionist, I still would not trade them because what’s great about them outweighs all the flaws. I don’t know anything about market share in the O gauge train market but I would venture to say that if Lionell could get control of their quality issues they would rule the market because no other trains in this price range have the realism in terms of look and sound that Lionel has. They obviously put a great deal of effort into the design, but just can’t get the QC we are looking for and I’m sure that’s just economics.

Well, i got 4 sets of these.  I tested all of them in engine #1 and they all worked great.  I seldom program until I run them...  too many legacy engines all with similar cab numbers.

I programmed my Santa Fe last night as train #4 shut it down and restarted it worked fine.  I will try again tonite...

Bob

Lionel Fan and Super "O" Track Enthusiast

Super O Bob posted:

Well, i got 4 sets of these.  I tested all of them in engine #1 and they all worked great.  I seldom program until I run them...  too many legacy engines all with similar cab numbers.

I programmed my Santa Fe last night as train #4 shut it down and restarted it worked fine.  I will try again tonite...

Just FYI.  Shutting down does not seem to be the issue.  It seems to rear its ugly head if you kill transformer power to the track.  I have learned to park my ALCOs in the front of the layout until I get them sent back.  At this point I hope the UPs I ordered are fine.  I really don't care if they have to go back also.  Kind of "part of the practice".  I have many other trains to play with until then.

Bryant

TCA 18-73717

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