Losing A Great Train Store - Mercer Junction

@G3750 posted:

Yeah, I'm sorry to see this collateral damage from MTH's closing.

@Keith L posted:

Very unfortunately, I expect there to be more closings of stores that primarily sell MTH. This is perhaps a cautionary tale to not base your business on one company's product line.

It's what a lot of folks were saying when MW made the decision to bail out......what's going to happen to dealers who are only carrying MTH and nothing (or nearly nothing) else? As Keith said, a cautionary tale of putting all your eggs in one basket. Not sure why Mercer Junction didn't decide to start handling Lionel/other brands and remain open instead of folding its tent. Maybe just too big an adjustment, although many dealers handled both MTH and Lionel.

Be interesting to see what Stockyard Express and other big MTH dealers are going to do.

I've been there, always wondered how he made  it in a small town. I just figured it was his mail order. Without names I can think of two large MTH dealers in northern Ohio and one in W.V. hopefully their Lionel business and other mfg. will keep them with us.

It is indeed sad. Seems like every few months another store on the mainland closes. I must say I miss not having any kind of hobby stores here. Anyone have photos of Mercer Junction, would love to see them. Don

Glad it's not the result of the virus. Sad to hear of the closing of another well respected shop. Hopefully, when all the restrictions are gone, the Clarks can go on tour again and hit some eastern PA venues. All the best Dave.

As many here already know, Dave's Mercer Junction shop has been my go-to local train store since the day he opened the door. It's a 45-minute drive from my Ohio residence, and I try to visit once a week or so, when possible. Dave is also a close personal friend (best man at my wedding), and he has contributed in significant ways to the magazine (with more hopefully yet to come). He also has been a BIG help in my recent home-moving experience. He assisted with the move itself, and he, along with another member of our informal "Tuesday Train Team" from the Western PA area, dismantled my previous layout's benchwork and they are putting it back together in my new home.

I fully understand Dave's reasons for closing the shop (I will save my comments about the Mike Wolf/MTH closing for my magazine column), but that closing sure is going to leave a very big void in my life. Fortunately, the friendship will continue, as will time that can be spent with Dave and other friends in our great little group. I value the friendship of each and every one of them.

I can't wait for Allan's column, but I guess I'll have to wait. A few comments were made about diversifying a business. My guess is that they weren't made by small business owners. I was a small business and a substantial part of my income for decades was a very large magazine company. When you have a large company that you do business with and that business treats you well, it's difficult to "escape the orbit". And in the 80's and 90's who would have predicted what was going to happen to the print publishing business.

So Dave, I wish you the very best and I do not second guess.

Gerry

@FredRR posted:

Between Iron Horse Hobby, the Imperial Train Shoppe, and now Mercer Junction, western PA is becoming an O gauge desert. Each situation has their reasons, but how disappointing to lose another destination and resource of great expertise. Good luck to you Dave. Hope to see you back in some capacity.

I did manage to visit Imperial Trains a couple of times.  Nice train shop, nice people.  For a 4-year stretch I was driving along I-80 in PA on my way to and from Ann Arbor MI twice a year, and I’d see the exit for route 19 and Mercer.  I used to think “I’ll have to build in some time one of these years and make a side trip up to Mercer Junction.” Unfortunately I never did.

first thing I thought when I read Fred’s post was “Can Brady’s Train Outlet be far behind?”

@Trinity River Bottoms Boomer posted:

It would be a blessing in disguise if Dave joined the O Gauge Railroading staff!

He’s already on the OGR staff!

Not going to second guess anyone's decision to close a business.  I know first-hand how challenging it is to run a small business.  And based on discussions I've had with several dealers and some peeks into the profit margin on Lionel and MTH products, my impression is that one needs to turn a lot of volume in order to make much money - small dealers like Dave are in it for the love of trains.

To put it into a little perspective, let's remember how long some of the glory days lasted.  Despite its 120 year history, the periods of time when Lionel was killing it have been relatively short - a few years before the Depression, late 40s thru mid 50s, and then again for awhile when Richard Kughn owned it.  MTH started small and was hot for what - 15 or so years?  The life spans of two major dealers also come to mind - Train Express got big and built a beautiful new shop, and was a ghost within a few years.  Likewise Allied Model Trains - built the Taj Mahal of train stores and was gone in a few years.

Let's enjoy things while they're here, because they won't be here forever, and they will pass.  Let's also be happy that Dave will still be in the O gauge fold, and maybe he'll have even more time to exercise his creativity and share it. 

An unfortunate situation for small businesses when the larger producers close up shop killing their retail outlets.  Sorry for your misfortune Dave, best of luck in the future.

@Bob posted:

Lionel's business model (multi-level distribution) is not very friendly to smaller dealers.

And that's probably the crux of the matter.  Maybe the owner believed someone would step in and buy MTH, preserving the continuity of product delivery.  That didn't happen.  Frankly, the somewhat random, confusing, and often conflicting statements from MTH in the days following their announcement really didn't help the situation either. 

I'm speculating that re-booting a small train store in the Lionel distribution chain would involve:

1. Finding a distributor willing to take on such a store & negotiating terms (from a position of weakness)
2. Investing a large amount of cash upfront in product orders (and maybe even an "entrance fee")
3. Hoping that an adequate amount of product is available and reaches the store in time for Christmas

In any case, it's unfortunate that we are losing an excellent train store in this fashion.

George

Hate to hear this.  I miss the old hobby shops.  I'd pay full-boat if I had a brick-and-mortar hobby shop near me.  Remember the days of going to a train shop and never knowing what you might find?  What fun!  It's not the kill, but the thrill of the chase.

Best of luck to Dave.

@gmorlitz posted:

A few comments were made about diversifying a business. My guess is that they weren't made by small business owners. I was a small business and a substantial part of my income for decades was a very large magazine company. When you have a large company that you do business with and that business treats you well, it's difficult to "escape the orbit". And in the 80's and 90's who would have predicted what was going to happen to the print publishing business.

So Dave, I wish you the very best and I do not second guess.

Gerry

Yes, it's simpler and easier for a small business if they can deal primarily with one major supplier or one major customer. However, that doesn't mean it's a prudent business strategy...

2020 has been a year of eye opening proportions, sadness, crazy politics, deaths, crazy economy and then on our own MTH situation. MTH is closing, nothing anyone can do about it, sooner or later if the opportunity presents itself we all will retire so the best we can do is support who we can, prepare yourself as much as possible and look ahead. Guys like GRJ and all of the Lionel, MTH, and other train certified techs out there are gonna become paramount REAL soon. Some of us are gonna have to be courageous and find out how that $1000.00 train runs and how it’s put together. Our future isn’t as bleak, if we pause, look at this forum and it’s wealth of expertise, other forums that some of us belong to, YOUTUBE etc. It doesn’t rain every single day (excluding the 40 days and 40 nites situation) sooner or later the sun will shine again and we’ll be ready.  STAND TALL, BE FIRM.  First and foremost congratulations to Dave and staff at Mercer Junction, you all have been a pillar in our community, I wish you all the best, take care.    -  MARSHELANGELO

Man this really bums me out. I was wondering about what he was going to sell last time I was in there and realized just how much MTH stuff he had. Him and a few customers were so helpful getting me up and running after 15 years out of the hobby. I really appreciated that and have enjoyed making the trip to the shop from Youngstown on Saturdays after work; partially because it's a nice drive through the country and partially because I like going to a hobby shop and talking to the people there. Hope I can make it back up there before the shop closes!

NUTS.

I live too far to have visited Mercer Junction but realized from its website that it was a quality store. The closure of MTH is worrisome enough but the closure of a first class train store run by a knowledgeable hobbyist and popular proprietor is sad and equally concerning. I'm hoping that another manufacturer will see an opportunity to step into the O gauge market or at least increase its presence therein.

My wife recently closed a family business that had run for more than a century, so I have some idea of what it means to give up on something that was the object of a long-time commitment. My best wishes to Dave...

MELGAR

I know of Mercer Junction through video (actually DVD) and the magazine ads.  When I play my O Gauge videos over and over again (actively, in the background while working, or while I fall asleep on the couch/recliner), I've grown to see the layout builders and narrators as friends.  I met Richard Melvin, for example, once at a train show and I immediately recognized that voice from the Choo Choo Barn video.  I'm sure it would be the same experience with Dave.  I hope you stay active in the hobby, my friend.

Really very sad news. Though I have never been there main reason it’s to far from me ,I have read articles and was all the OGR issue on the store layout. I’m just like everyone else wondering what will happen to our hobby. Thanks Dave for your contributions to the hobby. You will be missed.

I am very sad to hear this news. Dave, I wish you all the best in the future. I had always wanted to go to your store after seeing the OGR video and the ads but being about 6-7 hours away I never made it.

@breezinup posted:

Be interesting to see what Stockyard Express and other big MTH dealers are going to do.

Not sure what Clyde will do .      Visited him this summer.     Judging from the inventory I saw in the store and not even knowing what huge amount he has in his warehouse , I'd say he doesn't  have to make any snap decisions about what direction Stockyard has to go in.

Great guys there in Oberlin.

Are there any hobbies that are thriving to the point that new stores are opening and new brand names are coming online? In our hobby maybe we could count Menards? (which kind of fits both new store and new brand at the same time). I just don't see many thriving, expanding HOBBIES--period. I'm curious to know if even BEDROCK hobbies like antique car restoration are doing well. I have no idea. But when I talk to people about what they are doing with their leisure time, I sometimes get "gardening" or "fixing up my house". But the old stalwart hobbies of the last millennium seem to almost all be going begging.

In some cases the demise of the hobby has been bizarre. For instance, putting cameras into cell phones seems to be destroying the FUN of trying to make great pictures. Just LOOK (if you can stand the pain) at the photographic TRASH that is actually getting PUBLISHED in our national magazines!!

Ah well....curmudgeon mode off!

Don Merz

I spent a lovely afternoon at the Mercer shop a couple of years ago. I just happened to be in that part of the state and had Dave's well known train shop on my "must see" list.  I was not disappointed! Dave was friendly and knowledgeable and willing to share some conversation time with me. Of course I made a couple of purchases and now have a souvenir of my visit.  I wish Dave well wherever life takes  him.

Thanks Dave for being there for all of us who enjoy our wonderful hobby.

Earl

Okay, everybody, let's get into the real world. If you have locomotives, equipment, structures, whatever, you want to see produced then you've come to the right place. Don't think for a minute that the manufacturers, that's made up of O Gauge Railroading advertisers and those who don't, keep a sharp eye out on the OGR Forum so they can receive as much feedback as possible from you guys in order evaluate which product(s) will make a smart investment before producing any of them in the first place? Of course they do!

Mercer Junction is NOT Mr. Dave's profession. He does not do this for a living. He is the drummer for the Clarks and this is just his side business.

Second, Mercer Junction is too good a train store to close. While we are at it, here is the official description:

"Mercer Junction is located in beautiful, historic Mercer Pennsylvania.

"We specialize in O Scale trains and accessories. Our three major manufacturers are Mike’s Train House, Lionel and Atlas .Products from these manufacturers range from starter sets to highly detailed, scale, handmade brass engines and rolling stock. We also stock a full line of scenery supplies, track, switches, scented smoke and O scale figures.

"One of our most spectacular features is the 21’x10’ in store layout. It is used to demonstrate the DCS operating system and allows customers to run their newly purchased trains and give potential modelers an idea of what they can achieve.

"Mercer Junction is not only a retail train store but, more importantly, a destination and source for comradery and learning for the O scale community."

With that being said, Mr. Dave has been known to host seminars for the O scale community. So, I suggest that he do not close it until we see what happens.

As for MTH's "closing" and the impact of the dealers, I would suggest to every dealer that is heavy on MTH stock that they do not close until we see what happens. I can already see that MrMuffinsTrains and the NJ HiRailers are both planning MTH custom runs for next year, which means there is a very good chance that MTH will continue. So, no jumping the gun on that.

You know, I almost feel like laughing my head off at the idle speculation that's been posted since it was announced that Mike Wolf is retiring, thus putting the MTH product line in jeopardy. As one person said, "It's apparently still too soon to know the final results what Mike Wolf and MTH have proposed to do in regards to liquidating the remaining inventory and the future of the business in general." So, I'm certain that the company will continue, overall, and the dealers will still survive. However all this information is confidential and so the thing to do now is remain calm and await the announcement. I am keeping my powder dry for the EXACT same reason.

So, to all those dealers, service stations and customers, Keep Calm, Happy Rails, and May the Odds Be Ever In Your Favor.

Don Merz, I can’t totally answer your question about automotive restoration but my favorite show is Graveyard Carz (a Show where they restore Mopar Muscle cars) and from watching the show they seem to have more work than they can handle. My friend actually called them once and asked how much would it be to restore his car. They told him a flat fee of $70K. This was years ago and I bet it’s more now but folks are still sending their cars there. The one Chrysler show I go to every summer had been growing every year until 2020. I think the automotive hobby is fine.

Nikhil, I certainly hope you are correct but I fear the worst.

Local Hobby Shops have an almost impossible task:

- first the margins are so slim on "trains"- meaning Lionel MTH or any of the other major brands.  Years ago, the "retail margin" was 40%, today, its more like 20-25%.

-  second, ANY locomotive is a lot of money.  A set locomotive, sold separately, for, say $ 180, makes the retailer about $40.  A Legacy at $ 1400?  Forget it- the inventory cost is over $ 1000, and the market so limited- it would sit for months, maybe a year- and have to sold at a discount to get it off the shelves

- A LHS may keep even a set steamer for 6- 8 months or longer, before he sells it.  That $160 would move 3 or for times in a Lego set, RC cars,  or in model rockets.  So- the LHS only stocks a few freight cars, and set at Christmas.

- AND he has to stock HO and N, as well as O Gauge/Scale. 

- Then the BTO selling model.  The local shop owners don't want to demand money up front (the customer knows the LHS won't have to pay for it until 30 days after it arrives).  So, when the ordering customer doesn't respond to the LHS phone calls to come in, take his locomotive that sounded so good 6- 8-12 months earlier, and pay for his order,  the LHS is stuck.  Soon, the owner develops a policy of demanding payment- 50% or maybe 100%, up front.  And the customers start buying online anyway.  WE are a problem- the buyers.  WE shop price on the internet and order from a mega dealer to save 10%.

The BTO thing might be essential for a train company- but it is a potential disaster and at a low margin, for the LHS.

While I don't know Dave personally, he and his store certainly became a great resource for many here on the Forum.  I have not made it there since I am on the wrong end of PA (15 minutes from Jersey, not 15 minutes from Ohio )

I am sorry to see his store go, hopefully he stays active as a contributor as a hobbyist even if not a proprietor any longer.  Like others, I wish him and his staff well.

-Dave

@Hudson J1e posted:

Don Merz, I can’t totally answer your question about automotive restoration but my favorite show is Graveyard Carz (a Show where they restore Mopar Muscle cars) and from watching the show they seem to have more work than they can handle. My friend actually called them once and asked how much would it be to restore his car. They told him a flat fee of $70K. This was years ago and I bet it’s more now but folks are still sending their cars there. The one Chrysler show I go to every summer had been growing every year until 2020. I think the automotive hobby is fine.

Nikhil, I certainly hope you are correct but I fear the worst.

There's no right or wrong in what I am doing. It's just being positive.

Another factor we may have to pay attention to is the upcoming election in 2 weeks. That might determine the future of this economy. So let's hope and pray while we work on our ideas or hope for the best :-)

@NIKHIL posted:

.......................and pray while we work on our ideas or hope for the best :-)

Maybe that's what we have all been missing . 💒🕌🕍     🌄

"Likewise Allied Model Trains - built the Taj Mahal of train stores and was gone in a few years."

The causation is not entirely correct.  Allied was a long-standing train shop on the west side of Los Angeles founded around 1946.  The family built an incredible Santa Fe themed station in Culver City on Sepulveda Blvd. in the '80s as I recall.

By all accounts, it was a very successful enterprise.

The property apparently was more valuable as an electronics retailer than a train shop & the property was leased for a tidy sum (as reports were at the time).  Allied Model Trains moved across the street into a much-diminished property.

The store closed several years later.

Boy, MTH shutting down has had more fuel for the OGR threads than York public or private argument ever had.

And that's saying something.

Always sad to see another hobby store disappear.   The last O scale serving hobby store in my home city closed before my time (with the now nearest over 3hrs away).

I've never met Mr. Wolf, nor know too much about MTH as I haven't really been in the hobby long, but seeing all the fallout, closures, livelihoods/jobs/fixtures of the community vanishing,  and uncertainty stemming from literally one mans retirement makes me wish that things went down in almost any other way.  Maybe something that didn't set off a detrimental cascade akin to a small wrecking ball to the very hobby MTH helped build up?

I know something new may come out of MTH's ashes, but its too bad it had to intentionally combust in the first place.  I cant help but feel a little critical of how events are unfolding...

A lot of speculation as to the future of MTH on the boards.  Some people calling MTH's demise premature and we are counting them out too quickly. (6 months now). One has to wonder if there is a MTH savior / buyer, then someone is doing the MTH retailers and shops a great disservice by keeping it all quiet for so long. Granted it's none of our business but you would think that the shops selling your product could at least be clued in.  I can't imagine the angst and worries some of these folks are having to endure.  How many more stores will close because they have no reason to believe that there will be a MTH line and then they announce they had a deal in the works for months.

Personally as much as I hate to see Dave's store close up, I can imagine he's probably sleeping better than a lot of other folks dealing in the MTH line.

The Chinese probably own the controlling interest in all tooling made in China.

Once the MTH story is complete, I would think they (the Chinese) would offer the use of that tooling to anyone willing to pay.  Would it be DCS?  To offer it in DCS would mean a service network that might have to be developed, unless the MTH service rolls over to a long-term company.  Do they (the Chinese) want to form a new company and go into selling through distribution to retail?  Maybe not.

More likely- the MTH offerings come back as Lionel, Third Rail, Atlas, or another "brand", and probably having Lionel/ Legacy/ TNCC innards, to take advantage of existing service infrastructure.  I don't know anything, but I understand business, and what "controlling interest" means.    At least I think I do.

And, I doubt if a Menards would be interested in selling locomotives-  (a) they don't sell "trains" in retail stores all year- in the fourth quarter only in most locations.  (b) Having locos would carry the same problems that the local hobby shops have as far as slow inventory turnover, and (c) having to be concerned with dozens of road names.

And why is Menard's in trains at all??  Can it be justified financially?  I HOPE so- because then it will last.

Or is it because of the love of trains by "the old man"?

@Trinity River Bottoms Boomer posted:

Like you mention NIKHIL, Dave doesn't rely on Mercer Junction alone to butter his bread......and Mike Wolf?  Well, if anyone thinks that he is sitting all by his little lonesome in some abandoned caboose crying his eyes out as a result of shutting down MTH you need to join NIKHIL and me in the Real World.  Believe me, Mike is laughing all the way to the bank and couldn't care so much as a worn out rusty brake shoe if anyone is having a fit because he or she may not be able to obtain THE ONE AND ONLY model locomotive they're be wishing upon a star over for years and years, PERIOD!

Thank you,

The Trinity River Bottoms Boomer

Derailed in Deutschland

I think that statement is a bit harsh and untrue.  I always found Mike to be genuinely interested in his customers.  Just because he is probably happy to retire and most likely financially sound doesn't mean he doesn't still care.  I think that's one of the most ignorant statements I've read.  Sure the real world Mike is moving on to a well deserved retirement but painting him with a pretty broad brush as being an uncaring mogul is uncalled for and pretty negative light on the man that done tremendous good for the hobby.

I admire Mike for retiring and reclaiming his life. If you've ever run a business then you know how the thing can consume you until there's nothing left but a burnt-out shell. I never understood why Gates stayed at Microsoft so long. Ballmer got that one right--he left still young and healthy, ready for the next challenge. Of course in retrospect, Gates has made up for his earlier "mistake"!

Don Merz

I think we should get back on topic and keep the kudos coming for Dave and Mercer Junction.  Truly a great place!

@MartyE posted:

I think we should get back on topic and keep the kudos coming for Dave and Mercer Junction.  Truly a great place!

Thanks, Marty, for steering this one back on course.

A couple of the posters here need to "give it a rest."

Does anyone have pictures of the store layout?  I thought I did but can't find them.  While it wasn't a super big layout, it had a lot of cool scenes on it.  And right smack dab in front of the window!

Store Layout.      19 pictures, Photobucket file.

Dave was associated with a train club, Mercer Area.  Sad note: The Mercer block community had seen some revival of small business, Dave's store one of them, My wife commented there was also a quilt materials store.  Sad to see small town America, quickly disappear.   

Dave was very good, making Sedum trees.

The layout was walk around, Power was from the basement below.  An interesting old, old building that required a very long masonary bit to access the basement ceiling.   Thanks Dave, for letting me be part of a great experience.  Mike CT.