MTH remote control box, in line with Z1000 transformer doesn't work. I wonder why?

Is that MTH remote that little stick thing with some colored buttons on it?  I know that it's infra-red and line of sight.  And, sometimes doesn't behave well under Christmas trees.  Always got my dealer to swap them out for conventional controllers as I never wanted to mess with it.

Fred

It is a slender remote with colored buttons, and it is most definitely line of site to the small control box that is inline between the brick and the track.
If works fine as long as I point it at the control box.

What do you mean my having your dealer swap them out for conventional controllers?
Are you referring to something like the Z1000 that I am using?

Roger,

I may have misread your original post, so my information might not help the situation you are describing.

Sorry,

Fred

I'm pretty sure your problem is feeding the Remote unit with the Z1000 track output terminals.

You can't "daisy chain" a DCS TIU with a Z1000 that way either.  I think the manual calls this out, specifically stating to use the Brick plug directly into the TIU (via pigtail adapter to convert the barrel to banana plugs).

I know you are not using a TIU, but I think it may be the same issue.

-Dave

RWL posted:

...

It will power up when I turn up the power at the Z1000, and will set there making the idling sounds,
but the remote has no effect. I see the light on the control box blinking when I try a command from the remote,
but nothing happens.
However, I can control the locomotive with the buttons on the Z1000 controller.

If I unplug the brick from the Z1000 controller, then plug it directly into the MTH Ready To Run control box,
the locomotive responds to the Ready To Run remote as it should...

So everyone's on the same page, I believe you're describing the following situation:

If you only turn up the Z-1000 controller to the point where the engine starts its sounds (maybe 1/2 way rotation of the knob dial), you are not providing a suitable voltage to the RTR control box to properly operate under DCS control.  I think you'll find if you crank the Z-1000 controller as far Clockwise as it will go, then it might actually start working.  This is sort-of but not exactly along the lines of what Dave is suggesting above about placing a Z-controller between a brick and a TIU.

Since a Ready-to-Run set "just" comes with the brick and the control box (NO Z-controller), it's kind-of sort-of a clue that the Z-controller does not belong in the chain-of-command so to speak. 

Roger have your MTH engine's been program on a DCS with a hand held remote , if so they have a ID in them and they will not work on a DCS remote commander , what you have to do is get someone with a DCS and do a engine reset and then they will work that gives the engine's a O ID number .

Guy

No this locomotive is just as it came out of the Ready To Run set, and has not been near any DCS equipment, and it has not been programmed in any way.
Good suggestion though, and I thank you for it.

stan2004 posted:

RWL posted:

...

It will power up when I turn up the power at the Z1000, and will set there making the idling sounds,
but the remote has no effect. I see the light on the control box blinking when I try a command from the remote,
but nothing happens.
However, I can control the locomotive with the buttons on the Z1000 controller.

If I unplug the brick from the Z1000 controller, then plug it directly into the MTH Ready To Run control box,
the locomotive responds to the Ready To Run remote as it should...

So everyone's on the same page, I believe you're describing the following situation:

If you only turn up the Z-1000 controller to the point where the engine starts its sounds (maybe 1/2 way rotation of the knob dial), you are not providing a suitable voltage to the RTR control box to properly operate under DCS control.  I think you'll find if you crank the Z-1000 controller as far Clockwise as it will go, then it might actually start working.  This is sort-of but not exactly along the lines of what Dave is suggesting above about placing a Z-controller between a brick and a TIU.

Since a Ready-to-Run set "just" comes with the brick and the control box (NO Z-controller), it's kind-of sort-of a clue that the Z-controller does not belong in the chain-of-command so to speak. 

Yep, this is exactly the configuration that I was attempting to use.

Thanks for putting it into a clear pic.

Roger I add a file to my post it might help .

Guy

So, I tried putting the power on the Z1000 all the way up, but still no go with the remote.

Well, thanks for being a good sport and volunteering for guinea-pig duty!   I am somewhat surprised it did not work but so be it.

The specified configuration for the DCS Remote Commander is to just use the brick (no Z-controller in between).  Since you are using the CW-80 for conventional operation, I guess my question is why you are even using the Z-controller (meant for conventional control) as you apparently have "one" DCS locomotive that is command-controllable?

I guess I wasn't clear.

I tried the Z1000 in line with the Remote Commander in order to do away with the CW-80, and to have only one single power feed to the track. The CW-80 is no longer in the mix.

You see, when I do my full layout, I will have 3 separately powered track sections.
- One main outer loop
- One secondary inner loop
- One yard
Each with several power blocks.

I can't be feeding each of those three track sections with two separate power supplies, hence the attempt at daisy chaining the Z1000 and the Remote Commander.

In the end I want to be able to handle all of my locos with one single power supply (3 in total) to each of those track sections, and I had planned for each to have its own Remote commander in line.

I hope that gives a better picture of what I am trying to accomplish.

I believe a workaround may be to make a jumper wire from the Lock-On terminals to plug into the Z-Controller. That would have one track for remote control and then whatever you are doing after the controller.

You can get terminals or bare wires behind the Lock-On nuts.

You do need to control the voltage for LionChief or Lionel electronic engines and limit the voltage to 18 volts. The Z-1000 can output close to 20 volts.

THE PICTURE ABOVE  SHOULD SAY IT ALL !    MY PICTURE is your diagram with the Z controller crossed out ! 

HOPEFULLY You will have your MTH trains running soon 

Moonman posted:

I believe a workaround may be to make a jumper wire from the Lock-On terminals to plug into the Z-Controller. That would have one track for remote control and then whatever you are doing after the controller.

You can get terminals or bare wires behind the Lock-On nuts.

You do need to control the voltage for LionChief or Lionel electronic engines and limit the voltage to 18 volts. The Z-1000 can output close to 20 volts.

So are you saying that I should try putting the Z controler downstream of the Remote Commander box?
I am not using this type of track, so I don't have this type of lock on.

RWL posted:

Moonman posted:

I believe a workaround may be to make a jumper wire from the Lock-On terminals to plug into the Z-Controller. That would have one track for remote control and then whatever you are doing after the controller.

You can get terminals or bare wires behind the Lock-On nuts.

You do need to control the voltage for LionChief or Lionel electronic engines and limit the voltage to 18 volts. The Z-1000 can output close to 20 volts.

So are you saying that I should try putting the Z controler downstream of the Remote Commander box?
I am not using this type of track, so I don't have this type of lock on.

yes, the concept is the same.

When you direct connect the brick to the remote commander module you have joy with the MTH engine via the remote.

I just thought that if you jumpered off of the track connection that you could feed your other existing setup with the Z controller and switches.

I also want to repeat that you do not want to use the Z-brick direct voltage for the Lionel equipment.

RWL posted:

Moonman posted:

I believe a workaround may be to make a jumper wire from the Lock-On terminals to plug into the Z-Controller. That would have one track for remote control and then whatever you are doing after the controller.

You can get terminals or bare wires behind the Lock-On nuts.

You do need to control the voltage for LionChief or Lionel electronic engines and limit the voltage to 18 volts. The Z-1000 can output close to 20 volts.

So are you saying that I should try putting the Z controler downstream of the Remote Commander box?
I am not using this type of track, so I don't have this type of lock on.

I have same question.  Moonman, are you suggesting putting the Z-controller between the DCS-RC and the track like this?

RWL, if you have a "pigtail" cable with the mating barrel/coax plug, you might try this.  There are also screw-terminal adapters for less than $1 that would allow you to feed the DCS-RC into the Z-controller barrel/coax input jack.  I'd think you'd need to set the Z-1000 controller to its max CW setting...but I was wrong the last time!

Moonman posted:

...You do need to control the voltage for LionChief or Lionel electronic engines and limit the voltage to 18 volts. The Z-1000 can output close to 20 volts.

Just to be clear.  Are you saying the Z-1000 bricks that have a nameplate output voltage of 18V output 20V?

There was an issue with some versions of MTH bricks that had higher nameplate output voltage greater than 18V (as shown in photo) and indeed output the higher voltages.

stan2004 posted:

RWL posted:

Moonman posted:

I believe a workaround may be to make a jumper wire from the Lock-On terminals to plug into the Z-Controller. That would have one track for remote control and then whatever you are doing after the controller.

You can get terminals or bare wires behind the Lock-On nuts.

You do need to control the voltage for LionChief or Lionel electronic engines and limit the voltage to 18 volts. The Z-1000 can output close to 20 volts.

So are you saying that I should try putting the Z controler downstream of the Remote Commander box?
I am not using this type of track, so I don't have this type of lock on.

I have same question.  Moonman, are you suggesting putting the Z-controller between the DCS-RC and the track like this?

RWL, if you have a "pigtail" cable with the mating barrel/coax plug, you might try this.  There are also screw-terminal adapters for less than $1 that would allow you to feed the DCS-RC into the Z-controller barrel/coax input jack.  I'd think you'd need to set the Z-1000 controller to its max CW setting...but I was wrong the last time!

Yes, and then use the Z-Controller to feed the other tracks conventionally.