MTH smoke unit fan, is the side with the dot on it. positive its been awhile since I last messed with a smoke unit.

Yes

If you go by the color coding, the gray wire on the harness goes to the side with the dot.

Has that been consistent vendor to vendor?? G

@GGG posted:

Has that been consistent vendor to vendor?? G

Not trying to doubt you in any way, I just missed the the target detail of your question.

Did you mean different smoke fan motor vendors? In this case, I had older smoke motors from a repair kit, some from Midge right before she left, and a pile recently of new motors from MTH parts and sales. All followed the same convention.

Or did you mean other brands like Atlas or something using MTH parts?

Or using a an MTH smoke motor into a Lionel unit as a replacement?

In case there is any doubt, when you apply the power the fan should turn in the direction indicated below.

Pete

Yes different mth vendors, the smoke fan has had appearance changes over the years.  Some have a paint dot or mark on side of can, or the copy right symbol in the plastic end piece.  One batch had the armature winding too close to the output end and longer screws could ground out the motor, etc...

The motor turns CW as Pete showed.  I always check with a 9V battery for rotation, then wire accordingly. Put a drop of oil on output bearing, install impeller and I give it a run in forward and reverse with the battery.  Cleans any corrosion off, if any on the brushes.

Frankly, I am not sure the smoke output is off much if wired in reverse.  G

Thank you, all for your help. Vernon, I'm putting an MTH fan motor in a Lionel smoke unit.

@GGG posted:

Yes different mth vendors, the smoke fan has had appearance changes over the years.  Some have a paint dot or mark on side of can, or the copy right symbol in the plastic end piece.  One batch had the armature winding too close to the output end and longer screws could ground out the motor, etc...

The motor turns CW as Pete showed.  I always check with a 9V battery for rotation, then wire accordingly. Put a drop of oil on output bearing, install impeller and I give it a run in forward and reverse with the battery.  Cleans any corrosion off, if any on the brushes.

Frankly, I am not sure the smoke output is off much if wired in reverse.  G

I greatly appreciate the notes and comments from those who have been doing repairs way longer than I have been in the hobby. There is definitely history, vendors, and events, as well as specific knowledge that just is not well documented from what I have tried to study. I went from 0 to what I know now in 4 years, but it doesn't compare to your experience and the shear numbers of engines, scenarios, parts vendors and so forth you have seen and learned first hand.

I too use a typically used 9V battery that is lower voltage for testing just as you described, and more importantly, I test after assembly with the battery too for the same reasons.

Just like my day job- trust, but verify.

All extremely valid advice when doing repairs or even just servicing your own fleet.

@Steelie posted:

Thank you, all for your help. Vernon, I'm putting an MTH fan motor in a Lionel smoke unit.

That can be a big no-no depending on the type of Lionel smoke unit you’re servicing,…..the units that have monitored motors sometimes don’t like the MTH motors and will trip a fault code as soon as you try and fire it up,…..it’s not mentioned, but are you working on?..

Pat

FWIW, I've personally used tons of MTH motors in Lionel locomotives, including many with the RCMC and diagnostics.  I've yet to see this issue come up, and I must admit, this is the first mention I've ever seen of it.

I would expect the diagnostics to primarily react to motor current, and my testing of Lionel and MTH motors gives MTH motors the edge in low current operation as a rule.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

FWIW, I've personally used tons of MTH motors in Lionel locomotives, including many with the RCMC and diagnostics.  I've yet to see this issue come up, and I must admit, this is the first mention I've ever seen of it.

I would expect the diagnostics to primarily react to motor current, and my testing of Lionel and MTH motors gives MTH motors the edge in low current operation as a rule.

Some of the newer legacy dual units use a much smaller motor, especially for the whistle side,…..

Pat

@harmonyards posted:

Some of the newer legacy dual units use a much smaller motor, especially for the whistle side,…..

Different story Pat, I agree that Lionel has a smaller motor (shorter) that may preclude using the MTH motor.  In that case, clearly you have to use the Lionel motor.  Also, though usually the motor will fit, occasionally, the Lionel motor with the diagonal holes is also required for certain smoke units.