I know this has been addressed before and in Barry's book, but I'm frustrated. I upgraded my TIUs & remotes to 6.0 with no problem. Now the wifi can't find my tiu. Before the 6.0 upgrade, the wifi worked. I have uninstalled the app, reinstalled the app, unplugged and restarted the wifi unit. The wifi unit is set for MTH and TIU light is on steady, however the result is the same. No TIUs found. Any suggestions
Replies sorted oldest to newest
Today, I switched all the hook ups to my second TIU, but wifi unit still reads No TIUs Found. Could my wifi unit have gone bad? I still need help.
Do you have a dcs remote as well? Can it find the tiu?
Is your device set to MTH in your wifi settings?
Greg. Thanks for the reply. Yes, the remotes pick up the TIU no problem.
Jeff, the WIU is set for MTH, not home. All I can think of is that the 9-pin serial to usb cable is bad, however, it is the same cable that I used to update the TIUs to 6.0.
Would love to know the answer as I'm having the same problem. I've even changed the USB to serial cable and still no luck finding the TIU.
I don't know if it matters for sure, but how is your TIU getting power? Don't go by the lights. Do you have it powered separately?
My TIU is powered via an external wall wart.
I posted a week or two back on this issue. My I phone always finds the TIU. My Android started TIU not found so I bought a @$50, 7in android tablet an it worked fine for a week then started the TIU not found. There has to be a system issue somewhere, in all cases the setup of TIU, Wifi , aux power and track power were not changed. Just turned off and on for run sessions.
I had the same issue with my iPad. I put an engine on the missing TIU track and started it with the remote. The TIU magically appeared on the iPad after an application reboot.
Yeah but I don't have a remote any more.
Sound dumb, not trying to insult anyone but make sure the device bluetooth is connected to the proper device.
just like using your wifi on the phone. Seen people struggle with this and they simply overlooked connecting the device and application.
I have exactly the same problem with all my ipads and phones, my system is new so I didn't have to do any upgrades so I cant comment if the problem is in the upgrade
I have taken lots of screenshot pictures of the fault and I am in touch with MTH tech department
When I get the solution I will post it
I have had the wifi working months ago when I first got it. Just back to running locos and can't get wifi working. I have it set to mth. I connect on my iPad to the mth network using the default mthdcswifi password but it won't add engines. Connection times out and I think said no tiu found. Tiu is powered by. Z4000 and I see red light. My handheld works fine, sees TIU and all engines. I have a new TIU do I need to perhaps update the wifi software?the wifi unit is lit showing tiu connection but the app software under settings says no tiu connection. Tried on iPhone and iPad.
do I need to perhaps update the wifi software?
I expect so, for two reasons:
I appreciate that but it’s frustrating why something would work and then stop for no reason. The Wi-Fi worked fine at one time. The TIU is new so I thought that was current with software. Anyway I’ll check the TIU and Wi-Fi to make sure both are current- the l process to update the Wi-Fi seems a bit more complicated but let’s see.
I have been working on my layout for the last two months. Just this last weekend I finally get a loop put together to run the Polar Express along with other engines. My wifi setup couldn't find the TIU either. My wife's son happened to be over and asked if I was hooked up to the network. I amused it would do this automatically but as it turns out I have to go into my settings on my iPhone (this is where yours and everyone's else's router in the neighborhood is viewed) every time I boot the system and select the MTH network to find my TIU. After that, train life is good.
I'm surprised so many of your are having such a fundamental issue. We need to get to the bottom of it and get things resolved for all of you. There is no reason we know of for you to be experiencing this issue given the current version of firmware in your system. So, let's start with that. Please be sure your gear is updated to the following revisions:
Once you are fully updated, if things still aren't working properly, reset each component. I know it's a pain to reset the app if you have a lot of stuff loaded but, just export it and then import the image after the reset. It's important to get your system to a point that is current and known.
TIU - Reset via the app or remote. A feature reset should be adequate so you don't lose the TIU address.
WIU - Reset by holding down reset button (on top) for 10 seconds or more.
App - Reset by tapping "More > App Settings > App Reset"
There are some things you can try prior to the updates and reset that could be the issue but, given you guys are experienced, I doubt it. Now, just because I said that, don't be embarrassed to come back and update us if it was a simple oversight. I do it all the time. The system is complex and has many elements. It's really easy to miss a step.
Go to "More > App Settings" and make sure the app is set to DCS WIU. (the latest version adds support for the Explorer and this setting may have gotten changed accidentally)
Go to "Settings > Wi-Fi" on your device and verify it is connected to the WIUs MTH network or your home network if you are in HOME mode.
Please report back here with your results. Hopefully, we'll find the culprit in these steps but, have no doubt, the system is actually working fine and getting more and more stable with each app update. We're working on a new update now with further enhancements . It should be out in a couple of weeks.
mrmuggs posted:Today, I switched all the hook ups to my second TIU, but wifi unit still reads No TIUs Found. Could my wifi unit have gone bad? I still need help.
In your case, 6.0 should be close enough. So, if your other gear is up to date, try just resetting the WIU and cycle power on the TIU. That is, power it down completely and then after resetting the WIU, power the TIU back up. If you're connecting the WIU and TIU via USB cable remember TIU is powered by the USB so, unplug it as well.
I appreciate that but it’s frustrating why something would work and then stop for no reason
What changed is that the app is a newer release than what you used previously.
One more thought. There is a known bug wherein if you have multiple WIUs powered up but one of the connected TIUs is not powered up. It causes timeouts and issues because the system doesn't get a response from the dead TIU.
So, for testing purposes, make sure there is only one WIU powered up or, if there are multiple, be sure all TIUs are powered up (red LED).
The update we're working on has this issue corrected. In theory, user's wouldn't have WIUs powered without TIU power but, we ran into it here and so, we're modifying the app to ignore any unresponsive TIUs and just carry on with any that are alive.
This is another example of how the system will keep improving. If you kill all the weird corner cases and unusual bugs, the net result is a more robust and stable system. We've not spent a lot of time polishing the premium app as we were busy developing the Explorer hardware and app. So, now our attention is turned back on cleaning up some things on the power user side.
Firstly I must publicly thank Nicholas Jones of MTH who spent days with me trying to find the problem
We started by updating and resetting everything then removing all from track and adding engines one by one and testing, I got to 3 MTH engines to work then it failed again with the "no active TIU found" message, also TMCC engines failed to load same message.
It did look like a problem with the handshaking between the WIU and the TIU because as previously stated the remotes were still working, it was just the WIU to TIU connection that was failing.
However here is the good news, as a last ditch effort this morning in order to minimize any problem with the connection between WIU and TIU I added a separate dedicated power supply to the TIU via the "power" socket
As of now all my TMCC and MTH engines are running
Well done Nicholas
masoner posted:Firstly I must publicly thank Nicholas Jones of MTH who spent days with me trying to find the problem
We started by updating and resetting everything then removing all from track and adding engines one by one and testing, I got to 3 MTH engines to work then it failed again with the "no active TIU found" message, also TMCC engines failed to load same message.
It did look like a problem with the handshaking between the WIU and the TIU because as previously stated the remotes were still working, it was just the WIU to TIU connection that was failing.
However here is the good news, as a last ditch effort this morning in order to minimize any problem with the connection between WIU and TIU I added a separate dedicated power supply to the TIU via the "power" socket
As of now all my TMCC and MTH engines are running
Well done Nicholas
I'm really glad you got your issue(s) worked out. Thanks for your comments and I'll pass them on to Nicholas.
Let me try to clarify some things that may have been contributing to your woes.
First, if the TIU is connected to the WIU via USB then the TIU itself is powered however, the track may not be. You cannot read engines on the track without track power.
If you power the TIU via fixed 1 input then, the track connected to fixed 1 only is powered. In this case, there is no difference in terms of the TIU behavior. Said differently, if you are having success powering the TIU with aux power then, powering the TIU using fixed 1 will produce the same results. The TIU doesn't know the difference between these power sources.
Finally, TMCC engines cannot be "loaded" into the remote or app. TMCC engines can only be communicated to and do not respond in any way. There is no way for the system to load them or know if they are on the track or not. The user must tell the remote or app that a TMCC engine is active.
Again, glad to hear things are working well now. Even if the cause is unclear. Maybe the track power supply you were using as input to fixed 1 has some noise or something. What is the power supply you were using to power the TIU via fixed 1? Is it operating on 50 Hz?
Thanks for your thoughts, it could well be that the 50HZ 18V AC 10 amp supply to the TIU had some adverse effect on the TIU as you say cycles or even noise causing the TIU to lose its handshaking with the WIU, that might indeed be the case because it all works for the first few minutes of startup ! all I can say is that feeding the TIU directly with 18V DC has solved my problem.
( ps the input 1 and 2 are both permanently supplying power to the track hence my comment earlier that the remotes work fine, the TIU and the WIU were both powered up during the issues that I was having).
It might be worth investigating in case some other overseas users are having issues with 50HZ, and unless its a fluke on my setup then the direct DC power to the TIU might solve it.
I understand your TMCC comment, my point was that I could not reconnect them because of the " no TIU found" message, but it works now !
Once again thanks for your efforts
Cheers and a Happy Holiday to all the OGR folks
For me I update the wifi software, I powered the TIU using three power sources, the wifi, the z-4000 in fixed one and another brick. The handheld works fine. The wifi tiu light blinks but the software says no tiu found. If I try to add engine it just times out obviously with no tiu found. I only have one wifi and one tiu connected. I am connected to the mth router and I have tried reset a couple of times. Maybe just a bad wifi router?
Railmonkey,
What revision of TIU do you have? Are you using a USB cable or a USB to Serial adapter?
A blinking TIU light on the WIU means the WIU can't connect to the TIU.
Something to also consider. The WIU can power the TIU via a USB connection but the WIU doesn't provide enough power to fully operate the TIU. You will want to make sure you have power to the FIXED 1 port or the AUX power port.
Its a new tiu region version L how do I check the software version without a computer hookup? It's connected via USB and I have fixed 1 powered in addition to power to the aux power port. Only thing left I can possibly do is do an update to the tiu - I had already updated the handheld and a previous tiu so maybe something is out of sync assuming a new tiu has the latest version may be a wrong assumption
Its a new tiu region version L how do I check the software version without a computer hookup?
If you cannot see the app to see the TIU from the app, then you'll need to use a DCS Remote to learn the TIU's software version Menu/System/TIU Setup/TIU Version
assuming a new tiu has the latest version may be a wrong assumption
It may well be that it has a version of software that's too old to work with a WIU. You should be using DCS 6.1, although it probably would find the TIU if using DCS 6.0. The Rev. L TIU's originally came with DCS 4.2, which would not connect with the WIU.
 | This and a whole lot more about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 1st Edition!" Get the free TMCC & Legacy Addendum here! |
My handheld is 6.0, TIU is 6.1 and the app is 3.0.2 which just updated today. On my iPhone I got a tiu connection but would not add engines. On my iPad I still get no tiu connection. At various times I've reset the tiu and the wifi, tried three different power sources, two tiu' s and even swearing but no luck !
Wanted to do show and tell with the grandkids today but luckily the handheld works. I think I'll set this aside until someone else has an issue or a solution is found. I even tried another older serial tiu I have but that didn't connect either. Last thing that crossed my mind is if the wifi update took?
Thanks for everyone's help tho
Firstly two things, have a lovely time with the grandchildren I am glad the handhelds work, secondly I am not trying to cut across all the advice that you have been given.
With the help of MTH I have been successful after 2 weeks of frustration, the advice I was given was to go back to basics
1. ensure all devices are the current REV
2. remove all devices from the layout taking power off the track
3. because it worked for me , power the TIU directly into the power socket on the side, I used a Lionel starter set power pack 18V DC ( I know MTH and others have said no need, but I am not convinced)
4. power up and make sure all the 3 lights on the WIU are on and steady, no flashing except the Wi-FI when it is connecting
5. put just one MTH engine on the track
6. power up and start the handheld app, you should be able to fined the engine and run it
Good luck
If that works just keep adding engines
Good luck
Hey guys, I continue to experience issues with the DCS Wi-fi App and have attempted various troubleshooting attempts at no avail. It's become extremely frustrating in that I end up not running any trains when I'd like to out of frustration of the app connectivity issues and stop even trying - at the risk of sounding melodramatic, it's impacting my enjoyment of the hobby! I'm actually starting to scour Ebay looking for used DCS remotes to see if that gives me consistently better connectivity. Here's a log of my attempts to isolate and remediate, perhaps someone can review and ensure I'm not missing anything obvious - maybe @MTH RD or @Barry Broskowitz could review my attempts below or provide guidance? Happy to provide any logs out of the app or WIU if that will help
Full disclosure, I work in IT infrastructure, so I've been using some toolsets to assist in troubleshooting (e.g. VMware Fusion, Flame 2 for Mac for Avahi/Bonjour Snooping, PFsense Firewall). I have yet to whip out WireShark in earnest, but that's we're I'm heading next.
Problem Summary:
Despite multiple troubleshooting approaches and attempts to isolate the issue, I cannot find a reliable solution to allow me to consistently connect using the DCS WiFi Android App.
Hardware:
Handheld Devices used (All Android):
1. Google Pixel, Android 9 (Pie) - connected to home WiFI (same subnet and layer 2 network as WIU)
2. Samsung Galaxy SII, Android 7 (Jelly Bean) - Connected to MTH_DCS-365C (dedicated WIU network)
3. Virtual Machine (Android x86_64) Android 7.1 (Nougat) - NAT connectivity with the physical workstation, on same layer 2 network as WIU
MTH DCS Components
1. DCS TIU Rev L (USB)
2. DCS WIU
Firmware/Software Versions:
- App: 3.1.0 Build 49
- WIU: MTH WIFI DCS 20160107-1007 / LuCI mthdcs-v1.1rc1-1-gd26bd7d Release (git-15.205.28457-77acfe0)
- TIU: v6.10
Configuration:
TIU powered via an external 12v/2A Power Source
WIU Wifi switch set to "MTH"
WIU cabled to home network via CAT-5E cable, DHCP address set statically from router (pfsense) (note this wired configuration is outlined in the DCS WiFi user guide - set the WIU to "MTH" but cable the device to the network)
"Default" device is my Google Pixel phone, so ideally I'd be able to connect and us it for controlling the trains
With the above setup, I see transient connectivity issues, with successful connection rates only about 10% of the time when using a wireless android device
Troubleshooting Steps:
Findings:
Fri Jun 29 14:10:20 2018 daemon.warn avahi-daemon[1151]: WARNING: No NSS support for mDNS detected, consider installing nss-mdns!
Fri Jun 29 14:10:24 2018 daemon.warn dnsmasq[1199]: no servers found in /tmp/resolv.conf.auto, will retry
Questions:
mattrain posted:Hey guys, I continue to experience issues with the DCS Wi-fi App and have attempted various troubleshooting attempts at no avail. It's become extremely frustrating in that I end up not running any trains when I'd like to out of frustration of the app connectivity issues and stop even trying - at the risk of sounding melodramatic, it's impacting my enjoyment of the hobby! I'm actually starting to scour Ebay looking for used DCS remotes to see if that gives me consistently better connectivity. Here's a log of my attempts to isolate and remediate, perhaps someone can review and ensure I'm not missing anything obvious - maybe @MTH RD or @Barry Broskowitz could review my attempts below or provide guidance? Happy to provide any logs out of the app or WIU if that will help
Full disclosure, I work in IT infrastructure, so I've been using some toolsets to assist in troubleshooting (e.g. VMware Fusion, Flame 2 for Mac for Avahi/Bonjour Snooping, PFsense Firewall). I have yet to whip out WireShark in earnest, but that's we're I'm heading next.
Problem Summary:
- Frequently, DCS WiFi App is unable to connect to WIU/TIU, despite multiple refreshes of the app, rebooting the phone, rebooting the DCS components
- When a connection is established to the WIU/TIU, frequently the App loses connectivity while performing operations, resulting in loss of control of trains, track, and accessories - I've had a number of occasions where a locomotive's horn or whistle "sticks on" when the app loses connectivity mid-command. This seems particularly prevalent when addressing variable track power voltage
Despite multiple troubleshooting approaches and attempts to isolate the issue, I cannot find a reliable solution to allow me to consistently connect using the DCS WiFi Android App.
Hardware:
Handheld Devices used (All Android):
1. Google Pixel, Android 9 (Pie) - connected to home WiFI (same subnet and layer 2 network as WIU)
2. Samsung Galaxy SII, Android 7 (Jelly Bean) - Connected to MTH_DCS-365C (dedicated WIU network)
3. Virtual Machine (Android x86_64) Android 7.1 (Nougat) - NAT connectivity with the physical workstation, on same layer 2 network as WIUMTH DCS Components
1. DCS TIU Rev L (USB)
2. DCS WIUFirmware/Software Versions:
- App: 3.1.0 Build 49
- WIU: MTH WIFI DCS 20160107-1007 / LuCI mthdcs-v1.1rc1-1-gd26bd7d Release (git-15.205.28457-77acfe0)
- TIU: v6.10Configuration:
TIU powered via an external 12v/2A Power Source
WIU Wifi switch set to "MTH"
WIU cabled to home network via CAT-5E cable, DHCP address set statically from router (pfsense) (note this wired configuration is outlined in the DCS WiFi user guide - set the WIU to "MTH" but cable the device to the network)
"Default" device is my Google Pixel phone, so ideally I'd be able to connect and us it for controlling the trains
With the above setup, I see transient connectivity issues, with successful connection rates only about 10% of the time when using a wireless android device
Troubleshooting Steps:
- Ensure all Android devices with the DCS Wifi App installed are either powered off or not connected to local network other than the device being used to control the WIU
- Attempt Refresh within the app using the refresh icon
- Close DCS WiFi App on Phone
- Reboot Phone
- Reset the application and restore previous locomotive/track/accessory data via an exported configuration file
- Connect with Samsung phone (direct connection via MTH_DCS-365C SSID)
- Reboot WIU
- Reboot TIU
- Reboot both WIU and TIU
- Reset the TIU
- Confirm layer 3 connectivity via IPv4:
- Verify Avahi/IPv6 Discovery:
- Try "Home" wifi connection only on WIU (e.g. unplug the Cat5E and set the setting switch to "Home" rather than MTH)
Findings:
- Greatest success rate is when using the Android VM on my laptop, although even that only has about a 70% successful connection rate
- Greatest failure rate is when using my Google Pixel on my home Wifi network (~10% successful connection rate)
- Despite confirming layer 2 and layer 3 connectivity, frequently the DCS WiFi app is unable to successfully connect to the WIU/TIU
- The WIU System and Kernel logs aren't particularly illuminating - I see some generic warnings, but no red flags:
Fri Jun 29 14:10:20 2018 daemon.warn avahi-daemon[1151]: WARNING: No NSS support for mDNS detected, consider installing nss-mdns!
Fri Jun 29 14:10:24 2018 daemon.warn dnsmasq[1199]: no servers found in /tmp/resolv.conf.auto, will retry
Questions:
- How does the DCS WiFi app "discover" the WIU? I assume it's via Avahi/IPv6 discovery or mDNS.
- Can multiple DCS WiFi apps be connected to the same WIU at the same time? My testing indicates the answer is "No"
- When establishing connectivity to the WIU, presumably there is a handshake to the TIU. Is there a way to reliably determine whether the DCS WiFi app is connected to the WIU, but the WIU is not communicating to the TIU?
we get that "no WIU/TIU found" all the time too. we just click ok and then it works for a while.
we do not even have our wiu hooked up to anything else but the tiu.
just not sure these wiu's are all that robust.
I'm guessing on this but I think you get that semi-generic message when there's poor track signal as well?
I get it too and I can't remember why right now. I do know that when the signal is strong and things are right, I don't get that message.
I also have to check my phones wifi settings regularly. If the phone is in stand-by and the WIU is powered down, the phone will switch to my house's router. It won't go back unless the phone's power is cycled with the DCS all powered up, or I make it change thru the phone's settings.
If that occurs, I get no TIU found message.
mattrain posted:Try "Home" wifi connection only on WIU (e.g. unplug the Cat5E and set the setting switch to "Home" rather than MTH)Questions:
- How does the DCS WiFi app "discover" the WIU? I assume it's via Avahi/IPv6 discovery or mDNS.
- Can multiple DCS WiFi apps be connected to the same WIU at the same time? My testing indicates the answer is "No"
- When establishing connectivity to the WIU, presumably there is a handshake to the TIU. Is there a way to reliably determine whether the DCS WiFi app is connected to the WIU, but the WIU is not communicating to the TIU?
To clarify, the "HOME" mode is for wirelessly connecting the WIU to a home router / access point, not for connecting a device with the app installed. As you stated earlier, the MTH mode is for the WIU to connect to a home network via a wired connection and/or connecting devices with that app installed directly to the WIU using the wireless signal from the WIU.
I use MTH mode with my WIU which is wired to my home router and connect devices through my router's wireless network and other devices directly to the WIU using the wireless signal from the WIU.
To answer your questions:
I have researched some of the discovery process and it appears to be a simple IP scan on a particular port. There has been some discussion in the past about how the WIU is discovered by the app. I have found it better to statically assign an IP address in the LuCi web console on the WIU vs. a static DHCP address assigned by the router.
I have had up to 6 devices connected to my WIU at one time. Two connected through my home wireless network to the WIU via a wired connection and 4 other tablets connected to the WIU (in MTH Mode) using the built in wireless from the WIU. Haven't had an issue yet with this configuration.
The WIU will indicate a connection to the TIU when the TIU light is solid purple. A flashing Purple light indicate no connection, or the WIU is searching for the TIU.
Okay, now some troubleshooting can happen directly on the WIU just by looking at the indicator lights. I have had the stuck horn issue you described and using the lights on top of the WIU I was able to diagnose the problem. In my case, when the Horn was stuck I would press the horn button on my phone app (connected to the WIU via wired) and could not see the blue light flash indicating network activity. Then I tried the horn on my tablet (connected via the WIU wireless) and saw the Wi-Fi light flash and the horn shut off. I can't recall if the TIU light also flickered to indicate that it received the command from the WIU (I think it did but will confirm that functionality this evening). It turned out to being a problem with my phone, I rebooted it, and it worked like a champ again.
Are you using more than one WIU?
To clarify, the "HOME" mode is for wirelessly connecting the WIU to a home router / access point, not for connecting a device with the app installed. As you stated earlier, the MTH mode is for the WIU to connect to a home network via a wired connection and/or connecting devices with that app installed directly to the WIU using the wireless signal from the WIU.
I use MTH mode with my WIU which is wired to my home router and connect devices through my router's wireless network and other devices directly to the WIU using the wireless signal from the WIU.
Thanks @H1000 for your reply and tips. Yep, what you describe above is exactly my configuration - I actually ran CAT5E through the attic and down inside the wall so I could "hardwire" my WIU in the event that my connection issues could be attributed to the signal from the WIU to my AP. I keep the Samsung Galaxy connected directly to the WIU using the MTH SSID and my other devices are connected via my network. What is odd is I can see the DHCP lease for the Samsung Phone on the WIU LuCi but I still see the transient "No WIUs/TIUs Found" message in the app on that device:
It does seem to be more reliable after a few refresh attempts within the app, but I'd expect if the phone has an active DHCP lease from the WIU, it should be able to discover on the first or second try.
I have researched some of the discovery process and it appears to be a simple IP scan on a particular port. There has been some discussion in the past about how the WIU is discovered by the app. I have found it better to statically assign an IP address in the LuCi web console on the WIU vs. a static DHCP address assigned by the router.
I set the IP statically for my WIU from the LuCI but am still seeing the "No WIUs/TIUs Found" when using my Google Pixel on my home network with no ability to discover after multiple refresh attempts.
Okay, now some troubleshooting can happen directly on the WIU just by looking at the indicator lights. I have had the stuck horn issue you described and using the lights on top of the WIU I was able to diagnose the problem. In my case, when the Horn was stuck I would press the horn button on my phone app (connected to the WIU via wired) and could not see the blue light flash indicating network activity. Then I tried the horn on my tablet (connected via the WIU wireless) and saw the Wi-Fi light flash and the horn shut off. I can't recall if the TIU light also flickered to indicate that it received the command from the WIU (I think it did but will confirm that functionality this evening). It turned out to being a problem with my phone, I rebooted it, and it worked like a champ again.
Thanks for the tips regarding the LEDs - the behavior is consistent with my experience, I can "see" the WIU receiving my commands via the Blue LED and can confirm TIU connectivity is solid via the pink/purple LED. The problem is really establishing the initial connection with my preferred device (Google Pixel) to even get the Blue light to flicker :-)
Are you using more than one WIU?
Nope, just one WIU and one TIU
I think I am going to see if I can find a used DCS remote somewhere and give that a go. At the end of the day if that gives me a more reliable connection/experience, I'll just use that rather than the app. I do enjoy the "exercise" of troubleshooting the network/WIU/etc, but on the other hand sometimes I just want to run trains :-)
I will try a WireShark packet capture this weekend to see what I can find. I am interested to learn how discovery works, as it has to be leveraging some sort of multicast protocol (whether Avahi, mDNS, or something else). I do see the WIU listening on TCP 38715, which makes me think that once it is discovered, commands are sent via that port
Matt,
Just some extra info, when I exported my configuration file from the WiFi App I found some interesting tidbits near the end. The app stores (the last known good?) IP addresses of the WIU found and an associated port number, and in my case that port was 40588. Below is a sample portion from my file:
"name": "MTH TIU on mthdcs-xxxx ttyUSB0",
"network_address": "192.168.1.251",
"port": 40588
I too have had problem with Samsung devices, more specifically the S7 phone. It had a hard time connecting to the WIU wireless network and didn't like the fact that there wasn't an internet connection available on it. Also the power saving features on Samsung devices in general would play some havoc with the DCS app. I've never really been able to get my Wife's S7 to work with the WIU connected to either wireless network. She didn't seem mind that problem...
How well does it work when you disconnect the wired connection and just run from the WiFi provided from the WIU?
BTW Matt, Checked out you website and layout. VERY NICE!!
Guys,
There are bugs in the import process when importing from a DCS Remote. The TIU identification may be hosed up.
Matt,
Just wanted to see how your progress is coming with your WIU connectivity? Were you able to pinpoint the problem?
I've tried the last couple of nights to simulate your problem without much success.
More on this issue: My cheap RCA Android tablet was having TIU not found issues again. Usually a shut down- restart would get it going again. So I added a brand new PS-3 engine and it found it Fine. Later I pulled out a PS-2 engine that had not been run for awhile, charged the battery and put it on the track. My RCA searched and searched but could not find New engine. Frustrated, I got My Samsung Galaxy Tab S-2 Android tablet which has the wifi app loaded and it found a new engine ok. I then turned the RCA tablet back on to see if could find the engine and I got TIU not found and on the S-2 it went to, TIU not found. Turned off the RCA and the S-2 worked fine again!. Today I deleted the DCS App on the RCA then reinstalled it and it's working great. I notice that it asked me if I was using TIU WIFI or Commander. Don't remember seeing that before. MY conclusion is that the APP got corrupted some how and started the problems. Maybe the quality of the RCA tablet isn't up to hard usage, so I will see how it stands up now. Haven,t tried both Android devices at the same time after the App reload on the RCA. A issue for another day
Today I deleted the DCS App on the RCA then reinstalled it and it's working great. I notice that it asked me if I was using TIU WIFI or Commander.
Based on that, I'm wondering if the release of the app (not its version) on the RCA device was older. If os, deleting and reinstalling the app yield the latest version.
I strongly suggest that you have autoupdate turned on for all smartphones and tablets that use the DCS App.
H1000 posted:Matt,
Just wanted to see how your progress is coming with your WIU connectivity? Were you able to pinpoint the problem?
I've tried the last couple of nights to simulate your problem without much success.
Hi H1000-
Not much progress unfortunately. I filed a formal ticket with MTH and was told I'd be given a call back within 3 business days... it's since been 5. So much for meeting their SLA.
In the interim, I did setup another device (LG G4 VS986) and completely reset the app on that device and did not import a config from another instance. It seemed to work reliably for the first couple of hours or so but then exhibited the same WIU/TIU connectivity issues as the other devices.
The issues persist and given the transient nature and the fact that it occurs across multiple devices and via different network configurations, I'm inclined to believe it may be the WIU itself. I'd love to test with another WIU but I don't really want to shell out another $150... I'll update this thread if/when I hear back from MTH.
Whelp I found a reliable (although not ideal) fix for my issues:
I broke down and purchased a DCS remote and sure enough it works consistently and reliably, which indicates the issue is north of the TIU. I'm still waiting on a call-back from MTH support, but given the performance of the DCS handheld, the issue must lie in either the app or the WIU. I'm inclined to say it's my WIU. Next time I have a friend over with an iPhone, I'll have them install the app and see if they experience the same issues I have with all of my Android devices.
I'll update this thread if I hear back from MTH support but for now at least I can run my trains consistently when I want.
So I had some recent developments in my testing - had a friend come over last evening with a new iPhone, connect to my home's wireless network and download the Wi-Fi DCS App for a side-by-side comparison. Lo and behold his app connected immediately to my WIU while in my other hand my Android phone (Google Pixel) reported the same "No WIU/TIUs Found." I was able to discover all locomotives and run them a few times around with no issues whatsoever using the iPhone.
So it would appear the issue around WIU/TIU discovery is isolated to the Android port/version of the Wi-Fi DCS Application - given that I've only been testing with Android phones/OSes up to this point, it makes sense that the issue occurs irrespective of Android version, device type, or Wi-Fi connection (MTH or Home) - the root cause is the Android App itself. I still have yet to see or hear a response from MTH support on my earlier ticket, I will likely open another ticket this weekend to see if I can get a call back. Given the results of this latest test, I may procure an older iOS device and attempt further testing for more data, but I'm confident I've isolated it down to app/platform.
At the end of the day, however, a separate iOS device to run my trains defeats the raison d'etre of the DCS phone app - that is to use my everyday handheld device to run and control my trains. For now, I'll just continue to use the DCS remote I purchased and keep an eye for app updates.
I have a Note 9 and the App works fine everytime. but my Asus Android tablet will give me the "Not Found" message everytime. It's on a recent version of Android too. I just gave up using the tablet at this point
mattrain posted:Whelp I found a reliable (although not ideal) fix for my issues:
I broke down and purchased a DCS remote and sure enough it works consistently and reliably,
I've run my DCS trains with a variety of iOS and Android devices:
mattrain posted:So I had some recent developments in my testing
Matt,
I've had some developments in testing as well. A family friend with a Google Pixel phone came over on Sunday and I remember your troubles with the Google Pixel. His phone has worked in the past without issue but he was telling me how he had just upgraded the android version 9. I had him retry the MTH app that was still installed from a couple months ago and we had the same problems you were experiencing, on the same phone that worked perfectly before with an older version of android (I suspect 8.1).
I didn't have much time to test other settings. There are some reports that the WiFi power settings and IPv6 on android 9 can cause some significant issues for some users & apps. I still feel that there is a system setting someplace that is causing you problems.
Hi all,
I dug in a bit more today on this issue and was able to work past a few of the persistent problems I was seeing, where now I can consistently leverage the DCS WIFI app on my Android devices. To summarize the steps I took which seem to have significantly improved performance:
I've found after doing the above, the WIU is much more stable and I'm able to use the DCS WIFI app much more consistently. That being said, the WIU's network stack still appears to be buggy - I still see the network stack freeze up on occasion (can't ping internal or external IP addresses or resolve DNS names). And the fact that assigning the IP address statically within the LuCI interface appears to have broken routing, it would point to some firmware or software bugs within the WIU itself.
The key "tipoff" that there were networking issues with my WIU was the fact that it appeared the WIU was not getting NTP updates (running "date" from the WIU/BusyBox shell, I saw September 2018. Once I reconfigured my network to "statically" assign the IP via my firewall rather than the WIU itself, I was able to update ntp using ntp -p ip_of_NTP_Host)
I was able to troubleshoot my issues within the WIU since the OS is built on OpenWRT Linux and BusyBox:
It was definitely a bit of a learning curve and trial and error, as not having the full BASH shell makes things a bit more difficult.
Hopefully my trials and tribulations will help others if they experience issues. Perhaps @MTH RD can take a look at the WIU firmware for network stability improvements, and at least perhaps work on the static IP configuration settings within the LuCI AP Mode Wired Configuration :-)
To Summarize my environment:
Hardware:
Handheld Devices used (All Android):
1. Google Pixel, Android 9 (Pie - Build number PQ1A.190105.004) - connected to home WiFI (same subnet and layer 2 network as WIU)
2. LG G4, Android 6.0 (Build number MRA58K)
MTH DCS Components
1. DCS TIU Rev L (USB)
2. DCS WIU
Firmware/Software Versions:
- App: 3.2.1, build 53
- WIU: MTH WIFI DCS 20160107-1007 / LuCI mthdcs-v1.1rc1-1-gd26bd7d Release (git-15.205.28457-77acfe0)
- TIU: v6.10
Configuration:
TIU powered via an external 12v/2A Power Source
WIU Wifi switch set to "MTH"
WIU Wireless AP disabled
WIU cabled to home network via CAT-5E cable, DHCP address set statically from router (pfsense) (note this wired configuration is outlined in the DCS WiFi user guide - set the WIU to "MTH" but cable the device to the network)
I don't remember if this was discussed before, have you don a reset on your Wi Fi?
Matt,
This is odd as I have statically assigned IP addresses in my WIU's without issue. My only wild guess at this point is how your Network router handles ARP and RARP replies to ensure all devices on your network are aware of each other. I have run into routers in the past that didn't like wireless devices communicating to wired devices that had statically assigned IP addresses. The solution was to input static entries into the ARP table of the router.
I have used stripped down versions of OpenWRT (Chaos Calmer) on other projects and even a few basic needs wired routers without problems. The first version of the WIU firmware (1.0) was based on Barrier Breaker, the upgrade to Chaos Calmer was nice in firmware 1.1.
I have, use, and enjoy WiFi, Bluetooth, DCS, Legacy, and all the other whizbang stuff that's around in the hobby these days, but to tell you the truth, I think I still prefer the handheld remote for running my trains. I just bought another DCS remote a couple of weeks ago, and I'm thinking of buying another one or two as additional backups for the several I have now. I also have Lionel Legacy (Cab 1L) and several of their LionChief+ locomotives with Bluetooth. I must admit that for easy setup and running, the Lionel Bluetooth works pretty darn well. Bought their Universal Remote as well so I can control up to three of the Lionel locomotives with a single remote. Still, I also had great success running a couple of Lionel Christmas trains with my iPhone.
I'm no techo-geek. I just want to run trains with something close to consistent reliability.
H1000 posted:Matt,
This is odd as I have statically assigned IP addresses in my WIU's without issue. My only wild guess at this point is how your Network router handles ARP and RARP replies to ensure all devices on your network are aware of each other. I have run into routers in the past that didn't like wireless devices communicating to wired devices that had statically assigned IP addresses. The solution was to input static entries into the ARP table of the router.
I have used stripped down versions of OpenWRT (Chaos Calmer) on other projects and even a few basic needs wired routers without problems. The first version of the WIU firmware (1.0) was based on Barrier Breaker, the upgrade to Chaos Calmer was nice in firmware 1.1.
Interesting - yeah the oddest thing I'd see was from the WIU I could ping within my subnet no issue, but hitting anything beyond the gateway would hang completely, even with other devices on the same subnet having no issues routing out - also DNS lookups were not working using the gateway. I'm not sure about the ARP issue, I'm using PFSense as my router, I'll have a look around the ARP settings, but of all of my devices on my network, the WIU is the only one where I've seen this issue. I did confirm before changing the static setting on the WIU LuCI that the route tables were correct, which is why I think something isn't kosher between the LuCI web interface and the ethernet interface configurations. After changing back to DHCP config on the WIU and setting a DHCP reservation in PFSense, I have not seen the same routing issues.
I did find in the XML export from one device's DCS WIFI app that the IPv4 is stored, so I don't believe that AVAHI/mDNS is required every time the app is launched (although re-iping the WIU needed an app reset to rediscover and re-store the IPv4 info for the WIU, so there must have been some sort of AVAHI/multicast traffic to re-identify the WIU IPv4 address).
I'll continue my testing efforts to see if I can further isolate the issue. I did note that upgrade to Chaos Calmer which is good news! Thanks for your continued support!
This thread is well over a year old, and a lot of us are still having the issue of "tiu not found" with the MTH interface unit. I love MTH trains, but this has been extremely frustrating. One day it works, the next day it won't. My handheld remote is always reliable. For the money I put out for the Wifi unit and the money spent on upgrading the app to premium, I would expect better results. I've tried every remedy here yet I am experiencing the same issues many others are. I had hoped that running my trains through my iPad would have increased my 10 year old grandsons interest in the hobby, but it's done the exact opposite. I'm going to contact MTH and ask about a refund on my app upgrades. I'll try to return the interface unit to the hobby shop where I purchased it, but they are a mom and pop operation and may just tell me to use the warranty. It's really sad, because when it decides to work it's really nice.
Well? it works good for me. If you want to sell yours off, so be it. I think the usual suspects for the wifi not working are the devices dropping the connection, or poor signal which can be caused by a number of issues.
VanceG posted:This thread is well over a year old, and a lot of us are still having the issue of "tiu not found" with the MTH interface unit. I love MTH trains, but this has been extremely frustrating. One day it works, the next day it won't. My handheld remote is always reliable. For the money I put out for the Wifi unit and the money spent on upgrading the app to premium, I would expect better results. I've tried every remedy here yet I am experiencing the same issues many others are. I had hoped that running my trains through my iPad would have increased my 10 year old grandsons interest in the hobby, but it's done the exact opposite. I'm going to contact MTH and ask about a refund on my app upgrades. I'll try to return the interface unit to the hobby shop where I purchased it, but they are a mom and pop operation and may just tell me to use the warranty. It's really sad, because when it decides to work it's really nice.
You've only just joined the forum so I don't know much about you. If you stick with it there are plenty of people to help you here. I'm really getting to like the DCS app more and more over time.
I found that my old phone can cause me a lot of grief trying to run the app. It doesn't stay up to date and the software isn't current. Since I've added a couple of tablets, it makes it easier to figure out what is causing the issue. The tablets work when the phone doesn't, I know it's not the WIU or TIU causing the grief. I have had to reset the app on that phone, several times. I haven't had to yet, on my tablets that are more current in their software.
I also grab the remote first, and it's another good source for troubleshooting. Because I run a lot, when I get something new on the rails, it's easier to troubleshoot any changes.
A big thing to learn about DCS, is that the messages displayed are only hints about what's not working. They are generic messages and don't spell out why they are occurring. "No TIU found" for example, can mean many things. It doesn't (only) mean that there's no TIU connected.
I really hope that someday in the near future, the WIFI is built right into the TIU. Because you need a WIU for every TIU, it only makes sense to me. Otherwise you end up with a system like another manufacturer offers, that needs a separate piece for everything you do. I also wonder if the message "no TIU found" will still pop up! 
Engineer-Joe posted:Well? it works good for me. If you want to sell yours off, so be it. I think the usual suspects for the wifi not working are the devices dropping the connection, or poor signal which can be caused by a number of issues.
VanceG posted:This thread is well over a year old, and a lot of us are still having the issue of "tiu not found" with the MTH interface unit. I love MTH trains, but this has been extremely frustrating. One day it works, the next day it won't. My handheld remote is always reliable. For the money I put out for the Wifi unit and the money spent on upgrading the app to premium, I would expect better results. I've tried every remedy here yet I am experiencing the same issues many others are. I had hoped that running my trains through my iPad would have increased my 10 year old grandsons interest in the hobby, but it's done the exact opposite. I'm going to contact MTH and ask about a refund on my app upgrades. I'll try to return the interface unit to the hobby shop where I purchased it, but they are a mom and pop operation and may just tell me to use the warranty. It's really sad, because when it decides to work it's really nice.
You've only just joined the forum so I don't know much about you. If you stick with it there are plenty of people to help you here. I'm really getting to like the DCS app more and more over time.
I found that my old phone can cause me a lot of grief trying to run the app. It doesn't stay up to date and the software isn't current. Since I've added a couple of tablets, it makes it easier to figure out what is causing the issue. The tablets work when the phone doesn't, I know it's not the WIU or TIU causing the grief. I have had to reset the app on that phone, several times. I haven't had to yet, on my tablets that are more current in their software.
I also grab the remote first, and it's another good source for troubleshooting. Because I run a lot, when I get something new on the rails, it's easier to troubleshoot any changes.
A big thing to learn about DCS, is that the messages displayed are only hints about what's not working. They are generic messages and don't spell out why they are occurring. "No TIU found" for example, can mean many things. It doesn't (only) mean that there's no TIU connected.
I really hope that someday in the near future, the WIFI is built right into the TIU. Because you need a WIU for every TIU, it only makes sense to me. Otherwise you end up with a system like another manufacturer offers, that needs a separate piece for everything you do. I also wonder if the message "no TIU found" will still pop up!
Hi,
While I may be new to this forum, I'm far from new to model railroading and have dealt with the usual frustrations that can come along with tracks, switches, accessories, and trains themselves. 99 out of 100 times there is usually an easy an permanent solution to any issues I may have had, and I typically find my answers through a variety of groups I'm involved in.
So, while I'm experienced at model trains, the Wifi MTH unit is new to me, and as can happen I ran into some issues. I searched the internet and discovered this forum and thread. Before posting anything, I wanted to give an earnest attempt to fix my issue and I feel as if I've tried everything anyone has tried here to find a permanent solution to the issue.
MTH has obviously not found a fix for this issue, and I'm sure they have tried. Personally, I don't think they should be selling the units until they find a fix, but that's just my humble opinion.
I am somewhat confused by your reply, where you start out by saying it works well for you, but the last two or three paragraphs of your reply indicates to me you still have ongoing issues.
Either way, I only posted to voice my frustration in the hopes that it will help to continue to apply pressure to MTH so they keep trying to work on a fix. Right now the unit and app upgrades I bought are useless to me. It's money I could have spent on something else for my layout.
My reply was to say that my old phone was the main source of my issues. I may have rambled off topic a bit. The phone is not up to date on it's software. I tried to delete some stuff to make more storage room after I got a message saying it couldn't do an update because something was full?
I am not up to date myself on all this software stuff on current devices. Yet my DCS app works well for me on my tablets that are current. So my message to you was that I'm guessing it's either your device, or your layout's signal that just might be the problem. I'm just guessing here. You didn't give us anything to troubleshoot with.
I have not seen your name come up on other posts that went into detail on fixing these issues. I only see your conclusion here that you are giving up. It is good to show a company that there are issues. The problem here, may be that the issue is not this particular companies fault? When there's a layout with good signal and a device that's up to date, the usually app works. I think it's the exception, not the rule here, that it's not working for some. I still have a feeling it's the device that just maybe dropping the wifi for some reason.
There have been updates by MTH to fix some bugs that have popped up in older releases that did cause issues. It's not fair to dwell backwards on those, or to blame MTH when users have not updated these fixes. There are plenty of posts by users that are trying to run with old DCS releases that have been publicly stated won't run well with the latest app release.
So your public statement that you are giving up seems to point that's what others with issues should do? Just quit?
Do you know that when the phone or device is turned on (or left on) for example when the WIU is not powered, (some??) devices will revert to the house's router automatically? You may know that. I just haven't seen much info on where you were at when you decided to quit. You maybe far above my skill level on this stuff?
Vance,
MTH has obviously not found a fix for this issue, and I'm sure they have tried.
With all due respect, there is no "issue" as you've described. You're either:
While there certainly are a few bugs in the software, the process does, indeed, work properly.
 | Everything that you need to know about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 2nd Edition!" |
Barry,
Thanks for the reply.
Regarding the various possibilities you list that may be causing my troubles:
It was functioning perfectly for about a day. I spent the money for the app upgrades and it did not work after that point.
To me that indicates an "issue" with the app or hardware and nothing wrong on my end with my set up, tracks, etc. since I was able to set it up and use it.
I can't think of any other reason it stopped functioning.
Again, I loved using it when I bought it and then was a bit surprised I would have to pay additional fees to use all the functions. It was awesome while it lasted.
Not sure if this helps, but when I start up my layout everything gets powered on at the same time. Meaning the TIU and the WIU are both powered up at the same time. My WIU is on my home wireless network.
Have you done a reset on the WIU? Try it, worked for me. Also watch the WIU and wait till the blue Wi-Fi light is on steady, before you start the DCS App
BNSF-Matt posted:Not sure if this helps, but when I start up my layout everything gets powered on at the same time. Meaning the TIU and the WIU are both powered up at the same time. My WIU is on my home wireless network.
- I have a Note 9 and an iPhone and they both work with no issues.
- I usually don't touch the MTH WiFi app for about 2-3 minutes after the initial power on (This is the key step)
- I open the app, click run my trains, and hit the refresh button in the top left
- This process seems to work for me consistently
Me too
I have been using the DCS Wifi application on my layout for over a year and a half with no issues. More recently, I added Legacy successfully (following the instructions in Barry's book to the T).
In recent weeks, I have been running a lot of Post War locomotives, in conventional through the handles of my Post War ZW's (not through DCS). My android phone has had a couple of updates pushed to it in the meantime, so I thought, after reading this thread, I should check the DCS Wifi Ap to see if there were any issues.
I use the start up methodology cited by BNSF Matt, above, except that my DCS Wifi unit is not set to my home network.
I have a signal strength of "10" and very solid DCS operation at every point on my small, Super O layout.
I put my PS3 SP Cab Forward on the track and attempted to add it to the remote-it would not add. I tried this multiple times (at least 10 over a period of about a week) with the same result-the exception being that I would rarely, but occasionally, get the message that there was "no TIU." The locomotive would run in Command through the DCS Handheld with no problem. The locomotive still, by the way, had its factory default I.D. of "1."
I tried to add the Cab Forward again, three times this morning-no go.
I looked at the Ap in my phone, and noticed that I had a Legacy engine programmed in slot "1." The Legacy I.D. is something like 26 (the first two digits of the engine's number), but it is in slot 1 in the DCS Ap. I know from years with the DCS Handheld, that the DCS Slots are the engine numbers for PS2 and PS3 locomotives, but not for Legacy and TMCC engines. If I recall correctly, with the DCS Handheld, if a slot/number is used for a TMCC engine, when a DCS engine is added, it gets the next available number/slot, even though the slot/number of the Legacy/TMCC engine has not been assigned to a PS2/PS3 loco.
Thinking that the DCS Wifi Ap might behave differently, I changed the I.D. number of the Cab Forward from "1" to "6" in the DCS Handheld (slot 6 was not occupied in the DCS Wifi Ap by either a Legacy/TMCC locomotive or a PS2/PS3 locomotive).
When I went to add the Cab Forward to the DSC Wifi Ap, it added immediately as engine #6. This about 10 minutes after the last failed attempt, and from the same spot on the track where it sat all the other times I tried to add it unsuccessfully (I had not moved it from the last three failed attempts this morning). There have been no changes to the layout and no changes to the consist, etc.
I don't know if anyone has experienced exactly what I did, but because I got the "no TIU" message a few times, I thought it might be helpful.
RAK,
I don't know if anyone has experienced exactly what I did, but because I got the "no TIU" message a few times, I thought it might be helpful.
I strongly urge you to report this as a possible bug in the app via More.../App Settings/App Support
BNSF-Matt posted:Not sure if this helps, but when I start up my layout everything gets powered on at the same time. Meaning the TIU and the WIU are both powered up at the same time. My WIU is on my home wireless network.
- I have a Note 9 and an iPhone and they both work with no issues.
- I usually don't touch the MTH WiFi app for about 2-3 minutes after the initial power on (This is the key step)
- I open the app, click run my trains, and hit the refresh button in the top left
- This process seems to work for me consistently
Thanks - waiting to open the app until everything powers up seems to be working. I have two loops going through the DCS and was able to get them both working with the app, but now only one will work again. One loop always works when I wait to load the app, but the other won't now. Am I missing something there? Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!
When you say “two loops” are the two loops on separate TIU channels?
Are they both Fixed Voltage Channels?
Is the power applied to both simultaneously?
Is the TIU powered through the Auxiliary Port?”
My TIU is powered via the Auxiliary Power Port. When the main power switch is turned on to the layout, the TIU is powered up, as is the WIU. I have two loops, each powered by a different handle on a Post War ZW. Each loops goes through a different fixed voltage port on the TIU. DCS comes on both loops with no problem, but each must be powered up through its respective ZW handle in order to add, run, or identify PS2/PS3 locomotives on its loop.
RAK posted:When you say “two loops” are the two loops on separate TIU channels?
Are they both Fixed Voltage Channels?
Is the power applied to both simultaneously?
Is the TIU powered through the Auxiliary Port?”
My TIU is powered via the Auxiliary Power Port. When the main power switch is turned on to the layout, the TIU is powered up. I have two loops, each powered by a different handle on a Post War ZW. Each loops goes through a different fixed voltage port on the TIU. DCS comes on both loops with no problem, but each must be powered up through its respective ZW handle in order to add, run, or identify PS2/PS3 locomotives on its loop.
Ok, to answer your questions:
They are on separate fixed channels. through the same DCS (1 and 2)
I have tried them on separate power supplies (handles) on the same ZW transformer and on separate ZW's. I power up both handles before turning on the wifi and then loading the app.
The TIU is powered via the auxiliary input.
I've never been able to find any engines via the app on the 2nd loop, only the first. I was told in order for the DCS to find and engine initially, it has to be the only engine on the track. True or not?
As I said, both loops worked at one time via the app but now only one works. I run the 2nd loop via the hand held remote and it runs fine, I just prefer the additional options and ease of the app.
In addition, I had a TMCC base wired at one point and was able to discover and run a Lionel TMCC engine via the app, but that stopped working suddenly as well, so I disconnected it and no longer run TMCC (I don't have a Cab-1....yet....)
I didn't alter any wiring or tracks..the 2nd track and TMCC just stopped working.
Any thoughts or input is greatly appreciated.
"I've never been able to find any engines via the app on the 2nd loop, only the first. I was told in order for the DCS to find and engine initially, it has to be the only engine on the track. True or not?"
The first time you ADD an engine to DCS, it usually finds that engine much more easily if the engine is on the track by itself (people make separate programming tracks just for this purpose). Once you add the engine, you should be able to do a "Read" on the remote, or a "Refresh" on the Ap to find it, even with multiple PS2PS3 engines on the track (it should find all of them). This assumes that the engine had a good, charged battery/capacitor in it when it was originally added and so retained its new DCS identity (the number usually changes from the stock, factory "1" to the number of the next available slot in the remote).
"As I said, both loops worked at one time via the app but now only one works. I run the 2nd loop via the hand held remote and it runs fine, I just prefer the additional options and ease of the app."
I don't have enough knowledge to answer this one-perhaps Barry or one of the other Guru's will chime in. I wonder if the DCS signal is turned off on the second loop in the Ap, but is on in the Handheld.
Just out of curiosity, what happens if you roll the outputs of your DCS Fixed Channels so that the first loop is on Fixed 2 and the second loop is on Fixed 1? Do both still work with the Handheld? With the Ap, does the first loop stop working and the second one now work?
"In addition, I had a TMCC base wired at one point and was able to discover and run a Lionel TMCC engine via the app, but that stopped working suddenly as well, so I disconnected it and no longer run TMCC (I don't have a Cab-1....yet....)"
I don't, at present, even have a working Cab-1. I have had one for years, but rarely use it (almost always running TMCC through the DCS Handheld because, for me, it is easier than the Cab-1 and, more recently, through the Ap, which is easier still (for me)). There are some things, I understand, that are easier to do with the Cab-1, but I can't remember what they are.
You really shouldn't be able to "discover" a TMCC or Legacy engine via the DCS Ap. There is no two-way communication with TMCC/Legacy engines, so DCS, regardless of whether you are using the Ap or the Handheld, does not know there is a Legacy or TMCC engine on the track (unlike PS2 and PS3, where a Read/Refresh will tell you which engines are active). You have to either have left the Lionel engine on the active list, and not have done a Refresh, or use "Edit" to move it to the active list to run it in the Ap.
TMCC should not affect DCS operations (other than there are some TMCC electronics that can kill DCS signal strength-people used to put chokes in these TMCC locomotives to alleviate this). The connection is one wire to the outside rail of both loops. If you have a common ground on your layout, all you have to do is to run it there and TMCC will work. Your transformers have to be phased to do this.
The two ZW's on my layout are in phase and have common ground, so I only had to run the TMCC wire to one place to have TMCC on the entire layout.
"I didn't alter any wiring or tracks..the 2nd track and TMCC just stopped working."
It seems to me that there might be something interesting going on with that second loop. What happens if you move the TMCC locomotive to the Active List with the Edit command, can you run it then?
Have you consulted Barry's book regarding wiring and connecting both DCS and TMCC? It makes all of this very, very easy.
I'm going to try your suggestion about switching the tracks on the fixed outputs on the DCS. I'll give that a shot later tonight and hopefully they both work, or at the very least it helps me narrow down where the issue is. Thanks!
Well, I switched up the tracks with the same results. Anything on the 2nd loop is not recognized but will work with the hand held remote. It has to be something in the app. I may delete it, re-install it, reset it to it's original settings, and start over completely.
VanceG posted:Well, I switched up the tracks with the same results. Anything on the 2nd loop is not recognized but will work with the hand held remote. It has to be something in the app. I may delete it, re-install it, reset it to it's original settings, and start over completely.
can you report what the signal strength is on the 2nd loop to us?
"Well, I switched up the tracks with the same results. Anything on the 2nd loop is not recognized but will work with the hand held remote. It has to be something in the app. I may delete it, re-install it, reset it to it's original settings, and start over completely. "
Just to be clear, you swapped the wires only on the output side of the TIU, right?
I agree with ENGINEER-JOE's question-it would be interesting to know the signal strength of the second loop. It would be interesting to know what the signal strength is on both loops, and if it is different when you swap the output wires of the TIU.
Engineer-Joe posted:VanceG posted:Well, I switched up the tracks with the same results. Anything on the 2nd loop is not recognized but will work with the hand held remote. It has to be something in the app. I may delete it, re-install it, reset it to it's original settings, and start over completely.
can you report what the signal strength is on the 2nd loop to us?
Sure thing but I'm going to expose my newness here
How do I determine what the signal strength is? I can see a voltage amount on the app for the 1st loop, but as I said the app doesn't pick up the signal to the 2nd track so I'm not sure how to tell what the strength is.....
VANCEG,
"Sure thing but I'm going to expose my newness here How do I determine what the signal strength is? I can see a voltage amount on the app for the 1st loop, but as I said the app doesn't pick up the signal to the 2nd track so I'm not sure how to tell what the strength is....."
I think you stated that you DCS does work on the second track with the Handheld. If this is the case, use the "Track Signal" feature under the "More" soft key in the handheld.
RAK,
How do I determine what the signal strength is?
On the Engine Soft Keys Screen for the engine, scroll down to FUNCTIONS and tap on Track Signal.
| Everything that you need to know about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 2nd Edition!" |
Barry,
I was actually quoting VANCEG's question, then answering it.
My apologies for being confusing sir.
I edited my post to correct it.
Barry Broskowitz posted:RAK,
How do I determine what the signal strength is?
On the Engine Soft Keys Screen for the engine, scroll down to FUNCTIONS and tap on Track Signal.
Everything that you need to know about DCS WiFi is all in MTH’s “The DCS WiFi Companion 2nd Edition!"
This book is available from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store!
Thanks for the instructions to determine signal strength. I followed the steps and for both tracks the signal strength is 10 on a scale of 1-10. I have 3 MTH engines and they all work on both tracks with the hand held remote. Any engine I put on track 2 will not work with the Wifi app. In fact, when I try to find it, and when I have both tracks powered up, I get the "can't find TIU" message. If I power down track 2 and refresh the app, it finds the TIU right away, but will only function with trains on track 1. I'm completely at a loss, especially since it did function with both tracks at one point.
“Any engine I put on track 2 will not work with the Wifi app. In fact, when I try to find it, and when I have both tracks powered up, I get the "can't find TIU" message. If I power down track 2 and refresh the app, it finds the TIU right away, but will only function with trains on track 1. I'm completely at a loss, especially since it did function with both tracks at one point.”
Vance, I have the exact same problem. I’ve tried all kinds of wiring combinations to no avail. The only advice I’ve received and tried was to crank up the power which did not work. I am going to fiddle with it some more later today and I’ll report back if I make progress.
bigtruckpete posted:“Any engine I put on track 2 will not work with the Wifi app. In fact, when I try to find it, and when I have both tracks powered up, I get the "can't find TIU" message. If I power down track 2 and refresh the app, it finds the TIU right away, but will only function with trains on track 1. I'm completely at a loss, especially since it did function with both tracks at one point.”
Vance, I have the exact same problem. I’ve tried all kinds of wiring combinations to no avail. The only advise I’ve received and tried was to crank up the power which did not work. I am going to fiddle with it some more later today and I’ll report back if I make progress.
Good luck. Let me know if you find a fix, but I don't think there is one. I think it's a flaw in the app. If everything works fine with the remote, it's nothing we are doing. I too have tried every possible combination of things that could possible be making a difference. The issue is in the app somewhere, and quite frankly I don't think we should be responsible for the fees we paid to upgrade. I'll change my opinion on that if anyone can provide a fix......
The app works fine. The issue is not with your DCS. Most likely a layout wiring issue, DCS interference from TMCC/Legacy engines or defective equipment.
Regardless, it is not any kind of a DCS “bug”.
bigtruckpete posted:“Any engine I put on track 2 will not work with the Wifi app. In fact, when I try to find it, and when I have both tracks powered up, I get the "can't find TIU" message. If I power down track 2 and refresh the app, it finds the TIU right away, but will only function with trains on track 1. I'm completely at a loss, especially since it did function with both tracks at one point.”
Vance, I have the exact same problem. I’ve tried all kinds of wiring combinations to no avail. The only advice I’ve received and tried was to crank up the power which did not work. I am going to fiddle with it some more later today and I’ll report back if I make progress.
What about swapping the outputs to track on Fixed 1 & 2. Does the condition follow the Fixed 2 output on the previous Fixed 1 track, or does the problem stay with the track powered previously by Fixed 2?
Barry Broskowitz posted:The app works fine. The issue is not with your DCS. Most likely a layout wiring issue, DCS interference from TMCC/Legacy engines or defective equipment.
Regardless, it is not any kind of a DCS “bug”.
Barry,
The app doesn't work fine. That's an easy remark for you to make without seeing what is going on first hand. I understand your stake in things with the book providing you some source of income, but please don't speak down to those of us (and there are many) who are having this issue. I find it interesting that when I reported back to you that my signal strength is fine, that you didn't reply, but as soon as I call out an issue with the app, you're quick to come to it's defense (within 30 minutes of my post). My wiring is fine, my signal strength is fine, the DCS is fine because it works with all engines on all tracks with the remote, all my equipment is fine, and there is no interference from Legacy equipment because I have none on the tracks. The only thing that does not work is track 2 with the app. It doesn't take a genius to single out that's the one and only issue. I'm a fairly handy and sharp guy, and usually can find a solution to something like this. Rather than cast blame on where you feel we aren't doing something right, why not try to help further? I've said my piece.
Vance I had a problem similar to what you described. Thought I had a channel 2 problem. Sent the TIU to MTH, they said it was fine and put in the new hardware while they had it. Same problem when it came back and I finally found the polarity of my 180W brick was reversed. Reversed polarity puts power to the track OK but messes up the signal.
H1000 posted:bigtruckpete posted:“Any engine I put on track 2 will not work with the Wifi app. In fact, when I try to find it, and when I have both tracks powered up, I get the "can't find TIU" message. If I power down track 2 and refresh the app, it finds the TIU right away, but will only function with trains on track 1. I'm completely at a loss, especially since it did function with both tracks at one point.”
Vance, I have the exact same problem. I’ve tried all kinds of wiring combinations to no avail. The only advice I’ve received and tried was to crank up the power which did not work. I am going to fiddle with it some more later today and I’ll report back if I make progress.
What about swapping the outputs to track on Fixed 1 & 2. Does the condition follow the Fixed 2 output on the previous Fixed 1 track, or does the problem stay with the track powered previously by Fixed 2?
Hi,
I've switched outputs from 1 & 2. When I did that, everything ran great from the remote as it always does, but the same issue with track 2 occurs when I use the app, so that tells me it's not an issue with the DCS. I've tried different power sources, different engines, any variable I can think of and it still will not read track 2, and the remote ALWAYS finds engines on that track despite all the variables. I thought the app upgrade would have helped, but unfortunately it doesn't.
kgsouth posted:Vance I had a problem similar to what you described. Thought I had a channel 2 problem. Sent the TIU to MTH, they said it was fine and put in the new hardware while they had it. Same problem when it came back and I finally found the polarity of my 180W brick was reversed. Reversed polarity puts power to the track OK but messes up the signal.
KG,
Thanks. I have a separate brick on each output on my newer ZW and only use 135w bricks. Even if I put track 2 on a different ZW I have the same issue. If I have the tracks on separate ZW's, would the polarity on the brick I'm using for track 1 make a difference? If you think it would, what would you recommend as a fix?
There may be different ways to check phasing, but I take what I consider the common side of the transformer output connected together and then take the hot side wires and touch them together. If it doesn't short you are in phase. In the past there have been some problems with phasing from bricks where the ribbed wire and the smooth wire were wired backward. The ribbed wire should be common and the smooth wire hot.
What if you tried using the same powerhouse to provide power to both tracks, and eliminate a problem with using 2 powerhouses, or multiple transformers?
MrMoe50 posted:What if you tried using the same powerhouse to provide power to both tracks, and eliminate a problem with using 2 powerhouses, or multiple transformers?
I don't think that's an option. The powerhouses I use have specific plugs that fit into the ZW. I need one for each power source (handle). Is there a work-around for that?
kgsouth posted:There may be different ways to check phasing, but I take what I consider the common side of the transformer output connected together and then take the hot side wires and touch them together. If it doesn't short you are in phase. In the past there have been some problems with phasing from bricks where the ribbed wire and the smooth wire were wired backward. The ribbed wire should be common and the smooth wire hot.
Ok, I've checked for phasing and I'm all good there as well. I even tried powering the tracks from different transformers as well. I can' think of another variable. I just reset the entire thing and started from scratch as well. Same thing - the app finds anything on track 1 but nothing on track 2. I would slightly buy into the argument that it's something with wiring/power, but I've tried every variable imaginable and the results are the same. The remote works fine with everything, and it's just the app that won't find the 2nd track. I'm in a number of Facebook groups and I'm finding it's a very common problem and a lot of people are just giving up on it. MTH doesn't help either as their website doesn't offer any new support.
VanceG posted:Barry Broskowitz posted:The app works fine. The issue is not with your DCS. Most likely a layout wiring issue, DCS interference from TMCC/Legacy engines or defective equipment.
Regardless, it is not any kind of a DCS “bug”.
Barry,
The app doesn't work fine. That's an easy remark for you to make without seeing what is going on first hand. I understand your stake in things with the book providing you some source of income, but please don't speak down to those of us (and there are many) who are having this issue. I find it interesting that when I reported back to you that my signal strength is fine, that you didn't reply, but as soon as I call out an issue with the app, you're quick to come to it's defense (within 30 minutes of my post). My wiring is fine, my signal strength is fine, the DCS is fine because it works with all engines on all tracks with the remote, all my equipment is fine, and there is no interference from Legacy equipment because I have none on the tracks. The only thing that does not work is track 2 with the app. It doesn't take a genius to single out that's the one and only issue. I'm a fairly handy and sharp guy, and usually can find a solution to something like this. Rather than cast blame on where you feel we aren't doing something right, why not try to help further? I've said my piece.
Why would you even think that it has to be the app? Does the app know or care what track it is?
You seem like you'd rather defend your layout than try proper troubleshooting to get to the heart of the problem.
If we all leave, you are the one that still has the issue. Don't take it as casting blame, take it as where to look for possible issues. We are not there and have no idea what's wrong, other than any limited info that you provide.
VanceG posted:MrMoe50 posted:What if you tried using the same powerhouse to provide power to both tracks, and eliminate a problem with using 2 powerhouses, or multiple transformers?
I don't think that's an option. The powerhouses I use have specific plugs that fit into the ZW. I need one for each power source (handle). Is there a work-around for that?
Can’t you just power both TIU inputs for both tracks from the same ZW handle, thus being the same powerhouse?
Engineer-Joe posted:VanceG posted:Barry Broskowitz posted:The app works fine. The issue is not with your DCS. Most likely a layout wiring issue, DCS interference from TMCC/Legacy engines or defective equipment.
Regardless, it is not any kind of a DCS “bug”.
Barry,
The app doesn't work fine. That's an easy remark for you to make without seeing what is going on first hand. I understand your stake in things with the book providing you some source of income, but please don't speak down to those of us (and there are many) who are having this issue. I find it interesting that when I reported back to you that my signal strength is fine, that you didn't reply, but as soon as I call out an issue with the app, you're quick to come to it's defense (within 30 minutes of my post). My wiring is fine, my signal strength is fine, the DCS is fine because it works with all engines on all tracks with the remote, all my equipment is fine, and there is no interference from Legacy equipment because I have none on the tracks. The only thing that does not work is track 2 with the app. It doesn't take a genius to single out that's the one and only issue. I'm a fairly handy and sharp guy, and usually can find a solution to something like this. Rather than cast blame on where you feel we aren't doing something right, why not try to help further? I've said my piece.
Why would you even think that it has to be the app? Does the app know or care what track it is?
You seem like you'd rather defend your layout than try proper troubleshooting to get to the heart of the problem.
If we all leave, you are the one that still has the issue. Don't take it as casting blame, take it as where to look for possible issues. We are not there and have no idea what's wrong, other than any limited info that you provide.
You obviously haven't read through everything I've tried to remedy the situation before posting or you wouldn't make the comments you made. I've made exhaustive attempts at troubleshooting. Again - rather than throwing premature barbs at me, I'd appreciate any constructive feedback based on the things I've tried - and posted. I'm not trying to defend my layout by any means. I just want the app to work. If you told me to hang my layout from the ceiling I'd try it at this point. Read through what I've tried and let me know what possible variable there may be other than the one constant - which is the app. While you're at it, Google the issue and you'll find it's pretty common. I guess in your opinion none of us know what we're doing.
MrMoe50 posted:VanceG posted:MrMoe50 posted:What if you tried using the same powerhouse to provide power to both tracks, and eliminate a problem with using 2 powerhouses, or multiple transformers?
I don't think that's an option. The powerhouses I use have specific plugs that fit into the ZW. I need one for each power source (handle). Is there a work-around for that?
Can’t you just power both TIU inputs for both tracks from the same ZW handle, thus being the same powerhouse?
That's a good idea to see if I can isolate the issue. If that works, then I'll know it's something related to the power source. I'll give it a whirl now. Thanks for the suggestion.
You do have another variable here besides just the app....the WIU. Not sure how it would have any effect on your issue though, but it is a piece of the puzzle when using the app.
Have you tried switching the USB cable that coonects the WIU to the TIU?
Just tossing stuff out.
VanceG posted:Engineer-Joe posted:VanceG posted:Barry Broskowitz posted:The app works fine. The issue is not with your DCS. Most likely a layout wiring issue, DCS interference from TMCC/Legacy engines or defective equipment.
Regardless, it is not any kind of a DCS “bug”.
Barry,
The app doesn't work fine. Tha…..
Why would you even think that it has to be the app? Does the app know or care what track it is?
You seem like you'd rather defend your layout than try proper troubleshooting to get to the heart of the problem.
If we all leave, you are the one that still has the issue. Don't take it as casting blame, take it as where to look for possible issues. We are not there and have no idea what's wrong, other than any limited info that you provide.
You obviously haven't read through everything
Yes, unfortunately, I have wasted my time reading thru this and following it closely. But don't let that fool you. I read thru every post about DCS, not just yours.
You seem very defensive and would rather challenge than listen. So I'm out. You'll probably find patient people who will help you here. Good luck. Maybe lessen up on the jabs in the future for others trying to help. We are not punching at you. You seem to think we are.
That is the best language I can use here without getting reprimanded for bad taste against your post.
Wow...Talk about casting stones! 
Engineer-Joe posted:VanceG posted:Engineer-Joe posted:VanceG posted:Barry Broskowitz posted:The app works fine. The issue is not with your DCS. Most likely a layout wiring issue, DCS interference from TMCC/Legacy engines or defective equipment.
Regardless, it is not any kind of a DCS “bug”.
Barry,
The app doesn't work fine. Tha…..
Why would you even think that it has to be the app? Does the app know or care what track it is?
You seem like you'd rather defend your layout than try proper troubleshooting to get to the heart of the problem.
If we all leave, you are the one that still has the issue. Don't take it as casting blame, take it as where to look for possible issues. We are not there and have no idea what's wrong, other than any limited info that you provide.
You obviously haven't read through everything
Yes, unfortunately, I have wasted my time reading thru this and following it closely. But don't let that fool you. I read thru every post about DCS, not just yours.
You seem very defensive and would rather challenge than listen. So I'm out. You'll probably find patient people who will help you here. Good luck. Maybe lessen up on the jabs in the future for others trying to help. We are not punching at you. You seem to think we are.
That is the best language I can use here without getting reprimanded for bad taste against your post.
I would agree you've wasted your time going through this thread because by your own admission you know nothing about the newer stuff. I'm not defensive in any way, other than to make a point when I'm being criticized by someone with no knowledge on the subject. I'm more than eager and willing to listen to advice, but you haven't offered anything. When you have something to offer, I'll be glad to listen.
Just this week, feb, 2019- my wiu would not find my tiu until I added a wall wart ( about a 12 volt) to provide additional power to the tiu with its barrel connector. The tiu already had the red light on, since I was powering the tiu fixed 2 terminal in from the variable handle 2 out from on my z4000 transformer, setting it at 19 volts. Previously, I had run trains using the old remote from 2002 but when I bought the wifi unit & downloaded the $25 premium dcs app, the wiu would not find the tiu until I added the wall wart for additional power
Just like most everyone else I invested in this wifi nightmare and spent hundreds of dollars only to sit here with the same frustrated messages no TIU Found. I have basically just given up on the MTH WIFI system. It's really frustrating that people put that kind of money into a product and basically stuck with it. I think they call that the cost of conformance?
Hopefully someday they will come up with a real fix that works
Access to this requires an OGR Forum Supporting Membership
