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I'll let this thread go a little longer but we need to promote what we have here including the great threads that members post as well as the producst that our sponsors offer.  Yep, it is nice to get everything FREE on sites like YouTube but they do not promote our hobby rather they bombard videos with commercial interruptions which is why you get FREE content.  HEY....you get FREE content here too!

Last edited by OGR CEO-PUBLISHER

Well this has been a fascinating discussion!  How it went off the rails with younger vs. older I'm not really sure.  The whole purpose to having a YouTube Channel is two-fold:  to generate clicks and shares.  To do this, one must create useful, unique content that the target audience wants to consume and return for.

It is still my belief that a video of scrolling through another company's content while merely stating what is obviously on the screen or in the catalog and freely available is neither useful  or unique.  Create enough of these, and pretty soon your target demo will go elsewhere for content.

There are really two forms of blogs and videos: long form and short form.  Short form videos are going to be about 6 minutes max, and focus on one or two topics.  Long form videos should be no more than 20 minutes max, and cover no more than one or two big ideas in-depth.

Your six minute catalog video for instance could cover "the three big changes for Lionel in the 2022 Big Book Catalog".  They could be the Base 3/Cab App, the further incorporation of MTH tooling to the line, and the expansion of Amtrak rolling stock.  Those are just examples.  Never do more than three topics at a shot, because your audience will tune out or forget the first two after three.

In a 20 minute video, you have the time to really tackle a single topic in-depth, like why the Base 3 is necessary, how it would work with what you may already have, and what equipment you might need if you choose to start Command Control from scratch.  A 20 minute video also allows you the time to editorialize a little if you should so choose, but again you want to limit your topic selection to no more than three.  And those three should be tied together by a single "big idea".

Want to do an unboxing?  Go for it.  But edit severely or speed up the video.  Again, is it unique content?  Eric's fabulous BFIMHO segment is what I'm talking about:  UNIQUE CONTENT!

Less really is more.  Unique content wins the day.

Jon

Last edited by KOOLjock1

Yep, YouTube is one of the main reasons why many folks in this business do not produce videos any longer.  Why pay for a professionally done video when you can go to YouTube and get a video for FREE regardless of the content and quality.

Alan; this comment is spot on! I used to purchase train videos from a production company here in the Atlanta area that in the past specialized in historic railroad videos. When that well ran dry, they started producing videos of current rail operations. I bought a few of these early on but, discovered exponentially better prototype rail videos on YouTube that provide train symbol, locomotive numbers and other info all for free and fast paced, generally being only about 20-30 minutes long. The production company videos contain none of this info and tend to drag on for an hour and a half to two hours. The production company videos have essentially become unwatchable for me as I much prefer the YouTube “channels”. I haven’t watched any of the catalog review type videos mentioned above but, I do enjoy watching videos done by Norm and by Eric Siegel.

I have grown to appreciate YouTube to the point that I very rarely watch network TV any longer with the exception of sports and certain programming on PBS.

Curt

@KOOLjock1 posted:

Well this has been a fascinating discussion!  How it went off the rails with younger vs. older I'm not really sure.  The whole purpose to having a YouTube Channel is two-fold:  to generate clicks and shares.  To do this, one must create useful, unique content that the target audience wants to consume and return for.

It is still my belief that a video of scrolling through another company's content while merely stating what is obviously on the screen or in the catalog and freely available is neither useful  or unique.  Create enough of these, and pretty soon your target demo will go elsewhere for content.

There are really two forms of blogs and videos: long form and short form.  Short form videos are going to be about 6 minutes max, and focus on one or two topics.  Long form videos should be no more than 20 minutes max, and cover no more than one or two big ideas in-depth.

Your six minute catalog video for instance could cover "the three big changes for Lionel in the 2022 Big Book Catalog".  They could be the Base 3/Cab App, the further incorporation of MTH tooling to the line, and the expansion of Amtrak rolling stock.  Those are just examples.  Never do more than three topics at a shot, because your audience will tune out or forget the first two after three.

In a 20 minute video, you have the time to really tackle a single topic in-depth, like why the Base 3 is necessary, how it would work with what you may already have, and what equipment you might need if you choose to start Command Control from scratch.  A 20 minute video also allows you the time to editorialize a little if you should so choose, but again you want to limit your topic selection to no more than three.  And those three should be tied together by a single "big idea".

Want to do an unboxing?  Go for it.  But edit severely or speed up the video.  Again, is it unique content?  Eric's fabulous BFIMHO segment is what I'm talking about:  UNIQUE CONTENT!

Less really is more.  Unique content wins the day.

Jon

What wonderful insights @KOOLjock1. What’s your YouTube channel called? Mind sharing a link. Some of us might learn something.

@Blake posted:

We have a third middle rail running down our tracks on our layouts......anything reguarding professional filming is null and void.......

What the heck does having a middle rail have to do with producing good video? Good grief. Total nonsense like this is one reason why I haven’t shot and produced any new videos for years. Why should I, when “…anything reguarding (sp) professional filming is null and void...” in the mind of today’s audience.

Enjoy your 90-minute video of somebody opening a box.  

Last edited by Rich Melvin

Everybody take a few deep breaths. Part of the atmosphere at OGR is keeping things calm and reasonable. Personal/emotionally charged attacks get threads locked or deleted.

The age bit thing is misguided. I don't think age is relevant. Some people are trying to point out that (usually) the same guys barking about video games taking away from this hobby are the same people barking about how dumb it is to feature model railroads on social media or something to that effect. That's the frustration and it definitely happens. But arguing with those people is not the way. You gotta side step them and keep going.

YouTube has its strong points and benefits. It's not mandatory programming though so it's all good.

What's this about feeding YouTube spam?  Another scrapple devotee thread?  Pig parts is pig parts.

What, me worry?

I love me some spam but scrapple wasn't my thing. I tried to like it but ooph...I couldn't do it haha do they make a jalapeno scrapple like they make a jalapeno spam? I would try it!

My two cents.  I believe that one of the purposes of youtube is sharing.  In that context, you don't need professionalism.  Does that take away from some of the professional level videos wtih the same subject?  Sure.  Does that mean every video is watchable?  Certainly not.  Sometimes people watch things just to see something, not to be impressed with the production values.  When I go to someone's house to see a new loco, I am not expecting a prepared presentation.  Sometimes, I'm just satisfied seeing something I otherwise wouldn't have.

Brendan

@Rich Melvin posted:

AMEN!

I spent my professional life producing good videos for various corporate clients like The Hoover Company, US Air, OGR, and many other corporate clients. The junk I see that passes for "good" video on YouTube today truly saddens me. Jump cuts, shaky camera work, improper use of microphones, audio loaded with room tone and echo instead of being clear, no attempt to script the video so it makes sense, poor or no editing, audio levels all over the map, and my biggest peeve, vertical video.

I am almost ashamed to say I'm a "video professional" these days, for fear of being lumped in with the people who produce the crap that passes for good video on YouTube today.

I understand there is some value in the hobby-related videos that are being produced, and I have found that most of them are OK. But some of the click-bait nonsense that is put up there is truly awful...and that includes the guy showing a train running around a loop for ten minutes. 

Michael Bay is that you, it must be hard thinking you are the greatest but nobody else does.   Maybe you could start a YouTube channel and teach use non "video professional" types how to not make junk.

We are just normal people that like to make videos of our trains. Most of us use our iPhone and don't have loads of equipment to be better than poor or no editing.   

I have a utube channel. I didn’t start it to be a professional. I started it because.

1: I don't have a real layout yet and have to set up & break down every time I want to run trains.

2: I can go back & watch my own videos & see my own weathering art and eliminate a lot of that set/ break down time.

I film with my grainy iPhone, never thought I would have a following, let alone have ppl send me their trains to weather & detail. It’s not why I started a utube channel. Moral of the story.... this is supposed to be fun. Dont spoil someone else’s fun by nitpicking at it.  utube is not just for professional video engineers. It’s a creative outlet for anyone with something to share, no matter what age you are or what topic you are passionate about. Or what your video skills are.

Enjoy, and leave the young guys alone. They are the future of the hobby!
Im DjsOgaugeTrains on youtube.

Last edited by Dj'sOgaugetrains

Good Evening Everyone,

I think a lot of good points have been made on this thread. Everyone has their own opinions and though we may not agree with them we should still have class when responding. Offending one another will do two things, create tension between forumites and get this thread deleted. I don't think we should let our emotions get the best of us because one thing we ALL have in common is we love trains. This forum allows us to express that love. It's even more evident that we love this hobby based on some of the "passionate" commentary.  The powers that be have allowed the author to post the thread and express his thoughts. They also have allowed us to respond to that initial comment. Sometimes we complain when a thread is deleted but when it gets ugly I can see the necessity in doing so. Keep in mind that newbies are coming to the forum regularly and we don't want their introduction to be one of negative interaction and childish behavior. Let's show everyone reading this that we can have a chat about something as subjective as this obviously is, but remain respectful to each other. Anything else is really doing too much.



Dave

Last edited by luvindemtrains
@Rich Melvin posted:

I’m not the greatest, not by a long shot. I’m just an average guy who learned a profession, tried to do it well, and made my living doing it for a lot of years.

Thanks so much for your “wonderful” comment.  

I think you're missing the main takeaway of his post - maybe offer up some constructive criticism or tips to some of the young guys.  Or post a Youtube video about how to make a good Youtube video.  

And to put my money where my mouth is, I'll suggest to some of the young guys doing the videos, if you struggle with the "ums" and "uhs," just keep in mind silence is fine.  If a word isn't coming to mind, there's no need to fill the gap with an "um."  You can be quiet - your audience will think you're being dramatic or something.  Same goes for public speaking.

Last edited by Mark Holmgren 110217

I think you're missing the main takeaway of his post - maybe offer up some constructive criticism or tips to some of the young guys.  Or post a Youtube video about how to make a good Youtube video.  

And to put my money where my mouth is, I'll suggest to some of the young guys doing the videos, if you struggle with the "ums" and "uhs," just keep in mind silence is fine.  If a word isn't coming to mind, there's no need to fill the gap with an "um."  You can be quiet - your audience will think you're being dramatic or something.  Same goes for public speaking.

I’m horrible with uumms & uh’s. Sometimes when I’m talking for my channel I just wanna go Duuuuuuhuhuhuhuhu.....🤪 good tip! Thanks

Ain't it funny how people are worried about new people joining the hobby, but meanwhile the older folks are raining on there parade. I'm an 19 year old who has made a pretty good name for himself. I repair trains for people, do upgrades, and have a successful YouTube channel I would say. I'm nothing special, but that's the point isn't it. Be yourself and make a video. I do agree some content is better than others. Social media in general has allowed lots of people to make videos and content that may not be interesting to a more sophisticated person. However, at the end of the day YouTube videos aren't meant to be world class productions. Rich I give you all the credit in the world. I watched tons of your videos as a kid especially the tmcc video. I will never be able to make high end productions with twelve cameras facing towards the same object. In all honesty nobody will do that on YouTube because that is not what it is about. Its not a documentary. Its young and older people sharing their views and life in the hobby. I'm sorry if some videos annoy you guys, but as a fellow train YouTuber with a good following, I just ask that you don't rain on our parade because of a few people who just don't have the right style of editing or video making. Hope this was insightful.

I agree! Not sure why all the negativity just because someone puts the effort in to share something with everyone else.  Videos don't just happen; some can take a lot of time to make.  When I started mine a long time ago I did it to share all my work (and mistakes) on my layout build because I could not find it anywhere else.  I'm not a professional actor, so yes, I "Um and Ehh" a lot in mine because it's just shooting from the hip, no script.  The catalog reviews were fun to watch!  Maybe that one you saw wasn't, but just skip it and move on to one that is.  I think all the guys making videos are doing a great job and I look forward to them every time they release one. (RJ's Trains, Sid's Trains, RBP Trains, Nix Crossing, JD Stucks, Chris's Trains and Things, Dagryffin Hobby, Hennings Trains, and on and on).

I mean if you think some of their videos are long, come watch mine LOL, I love to go on and on with detail and people can't handle it, HA-HA.

But I am doing it my way.  Some people do appreciate all the detail.

I get so many ideas from the content all these guys share.  I hope they continue making videos forever!

@Prr7688 posted:

What does the payout actually look like for someone with your view and subscriber numbers? Does it actually "help your bottom line" in terms of train related purchases?

It is different for every YouTuber and depends more on views and watch time than the actual subscriber count. I don't want to give specifics but I made enough in 2021 before taxes to purchase the VL Class and then some. Not bad for someone who films videos using his phone, a free video editing software, and no formal editing education.

Yea, it stinks that the viewers have to watch an advertisement or two but, YouTube and Google now add advertisements to videos regardless of whether or not the creator wants them or not. At least it is still free and not a $20 DVD with more ads to promote other products.

I am a young guy (21 years old), I just graduated from college, have a corporate entry-level job, I have bills, I pay rent. The extra money coming in from YouTube I am extremely grateful for and has definitely allowed me to pick up a few extra trains throughout the year. 

I'll let this thread go a little longer but we need to promote what we have here including the great threads that members post as well as the producst that our sponsors offer.  Yep, it is nice to get everything FREE on sites like YouTube but they do not promote our hobby rather they bombard videos with commercial interruptions which is why you get FREE content.  HEY....you get FREE content here too!

This site certainly bombards us with commercial interruptions too, even those of us who pay!
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First forum topic 7 page-downs on my 1920x1080 screen!

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@superwarp1 posted:

What’s everyone’s secret to a 1000 subscribers? Don’t you need at least a 1000 to do live feeds?

oh Jon don’t try to get out of it now, you really stepped into it.  Lol

You can use some third-party software to do live streams before hitting 1000 subscribers and there are videos on YouTube that can explain how to do that way better than I can.

I say getting to 1000 subscribers takes a mixture of things. The first is regularly uploading, at least once a week, videos longer than 8 minutes. The YouTube algorithm loves that and shares your video with more people. The second is a large-ish collection and a nice-ish layout because nobody wants to see the same three trains every video. Lastly is good video production quality, maybe not on the level as some others have expressed on this thread but your videos have to be watchable and engaging for the average person.

I think that when I post a link to a YouTube video onOGR it gets hurried into a sub forum. And even with a simple title like “Lots of trains running” the thread gets maybe 100 clicks. That’s just thread clicks who knows if even half of that 100 actually look at the video.

but on YouTube I have videos ranging from 200 to 15,000 views. I think I know where my audience is

Here’s a link to my channel!😀

https://youtube.com/c/OGaugeGreg

@rplst8 posted:

This site certainly bombards us with commercial interruptions too, even those of us who pay!
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First forum topic 7 page-downs on my 1920x1080 screen!

GHEEZZZZ....I think you are a little confused here or perhaps just don't understand my post.  Regardless, we can't make everyone happy obviously as is evidenced in this post.  To interpret the list of topics that come before this thread as "commercial interruptions" is just plain .... well, I will just leave it alone.

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