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Alex, you know more mechancially than most on this forum.  I'm guessing that the motor itself isn't anything special.  Maybe Frank Timko or someone else who reads this post can transfer the all-important worm gear and flywheel onto a new motor for you?

This is one of the reasons I'm not a fan of having the worm gear pressed directly onto the motor shaft :-(  Really hope you're able to get it running again.

I checked my supply of about 30 different Lionel motors, and the Lionmaster Challenger motor I have is way thicker shaft.  I was surprised - thought they'd be the same.  Seems the other Lionmaster Big Boy's used a different one than this one as well.  Ouch - I have the same engine - hope it doesn't develop the issue.  I have a 11 year old that thinks he isn't pull 30+ cars its boring.

Let us know how it turns out.

Jim

@Ted S posted:

@Alex M I'm curious... do you know what happened, how the worm gear got chipped and bent?  A failure like this can turn an expensive loco into a shelf queen.  I don't want to repeat this scenario with my own trains!

Hi Ted, the worm appears to be able to be pulled off the shaft quite easily. This is not the case, i had a couple of people try and the worm was damaged. 

Alex

The overall diameter of the worm is so small that diameter of the motor shaft diameter as actually larger than the root diameter of the gear. The mounting hole in the gear therefore is blind and does not go through the length of the gear as it does on most all other worms usually found on these motors. There is nothing to push against when trying to remove the gear. Couple that with the fact that it has an extreme interference fit, maybe as much as .003-.004" undersize its near impossible to simply pull off without totally destroying the motor.

Even Lionel realized this was a poor design. Their second generation Lionmaster Big Boy uses a different larger gear. Unfortunately its doesn't fit the 1st generation engine.

I think the only fix here will be a new gear will have to be machined and installed on a new motor.

Pete

@Norton posted:

The overall diameter of the worm is so small that diameter of the motor shaft diameter as actually larger than the root diameter of the gear. The mounting hole in the gear therefore is blind and does not go through the length of the gear as it does on most all other worms usually found on these motors. There is nothing to push against when trying to remove the gear. Couple that with the fact that it has an extreme interference fit, maybe as much as .003-.004" undersize its near impossible to simply pull off without totally destroying the motor.

Even Lionel realized this was a poor design. Their second generation Lionmaster Big Boy uses a different larger gear. Unfortunately its doesn't fit the 1st generation engine.

I think the only fix here will be a new gear will have to be machined and installed on a new motor.

Pete

Hit the nail on the head ! Thanks Pete 

Alex

@Ron_S posted:

What worries me is that Frank Timko is like most of us, aging out, and as far as I know, no one else is providing the motors or items Frank does

Maybe he would be kind enough to run a "clinic" on removing worm gears, remotoring, etc., at an upcoming York (or a TCA meet local to where he lives.)  I know a lot of folks captured John Armstrong's wisdom on video.  With today's technology there's no reason for knowledge to be lost when someone retires or closes up shop.

Alex the bore on the gear will have to be opened up. A Mabuchi 385 has a 2.3 mm shaft or .090”. I have gotten 2.3 mm and 2.35 mm drills from Mcmaster Carr. #8950A41, and 29355A41 respectively. The 2.3 gives a snug fit that can be pushed in by hand. Retaining compound or even CA and bobs your uncle. I mention these specific bits because not all 2.3 mm bits are the same. I know Harbor Freights are way undersize.

I would drill these for you but it would be less expensive assuming mailing costs to get the drills yourself and have them on hand for future projects. It would let you reuse the press on flywheels as well without destroying the motor.

Pete

Lionel parts ,

I did reply to you on your post with the picture of the gear. I’ve also been following this thread whenever I have a chance to. 

Your last comment was unnecessary and like John said a bit harsh,  I was actually going to purchase the gear from you but now I’ll just look else where.

The OGR forum is a happy place for me! It makes one forget about this crazy world we live in, I’m not going to make anyone take that away ! 

Alex 

 

Alex, I was going to give you the gear if you needed it and also drill it out for you. I took the time to find & measure the gear then went and bought a drill bit to drill it out. I figured if you wanted it you would contact me.  

My comment may have been a little harsh and for that I am sorry. I was just a little ****ed that when I try to help people on here & facebook they don't reply or let you know what is going on (if they fixed it or anything else).

Sorry

Do you still need the gear ?

John

 

Alex, I was going to give you the gear if you needed it and also drill it out for you. I took the time to find & measure the gear then went and bought a drill bit to drill it out. I figured if you wanted it you would contact me.  

My comment may have been a little harsh and for that I am sorry. I was just a little ****ed that when I try to help people on here & facebook they don't reply or let you know what is going on (if they fixed it or anything else).

Sorry

Do you still need the gear ?

John

 

Hi John,

Let's wipe the slate clean! 

I do need the gear and I'll email you later on today , so we can make arrangements. ALSO business is business, I will pay you for the gear and any labor. 

Thanks, Alex

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