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The new B6sbs are due out in September.  Was reading the catalog and completely missed 2 new features going into these switchers.  The catalog states:

  1. Bicolor illuminated classification lights on the front of locomotive where applicable. Using a Legacy controller, change the color of the classification lights between white or green
  2. LEGACY® "Real-Time Quilling Whistle" control with instant response for realistic signature "quilling" and correctly timed warning signals: 5 different whistles to choose from for a more customized experience

 

I missed the first round of these when they came out in 2015.  I was fortunate enough to be able to order one this time.  Can't wait to try out the new features.  I wonder what 5 whistles they are building into the sound effects.

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***EDIT*** See Dave Olson's post down the page a ways.  The B6sb will correctly NOT have changing color class lights.  But can the red markers be turned off as they would be off almost all of the time?***END EDIT***

Yep, quite the feature.  Too bad they didn't decide to use it on a locomotive that actually HAD class lights!  Those lights on the pilot beam of a B6sb are marker lights and are off almost all of the time.  The only time they would be on (and they are always RED when on) is when both of the following are true:

1) the locomotive is running in reverse on the Main Line (outside of yard limits) and

2) any cars the locomotive is moving are being pushed ahead of it (coupled to the tender)

I'm sure most buyers of these B6sbs won't know or care. 

Last edited by Bob

Anyone know how close to scale (1:48) this engine is?  I always thought the tender was too big.

Elmer Steurernagel  in PRRT&HS’s The Keystone Vol 35, Number 1, Spring 2002, had a lot on PRR classification lights.  Here are two data points related to the OP.

1929 – shops ordered to remove classification lights from locomotives assigned to yard and freight service (except M1/M1a's and other freight locomotives regularly assigned to passenger service

1940 - PRR ceases to use the train classification rule (extra, second section following) - shops ordered to remove classification light fixtures from locomotive smokeboxes.

Not sure about other roads that used the B6.

AFAIK, all the lights on the pilot beam of PRR locomotives were markers, not class lights, they should all be red.  As Bob mentioned, the would rarely be on.  Class lights are high up on the boiler for long range visibility I suspect.

For the PRR, that was true up to 1942.  Again, from Mr. Steurernagel:

  • June 1942 - PRR adopts smaller oblong (tombstone) marker light fixture for application to smokeboxes in lieu of pilot beam mounted marker lights.  In their housing are two lenses yellow above, red below, not all locomotives were re-equipped with the new markers
  • Aug 1946 - PRR adopts a smaller single red lens round "bulls’ eye" marker light fixture for use on smokeboxes.  This is the most common marker light fixture seen on postwar PRR steam locomotives – however many with tombstone markers retained them until dropped from the roster

The B6 actually won't get the bicolor lights. The GS and one sku of the T1 will.

The B6 lights will have the red front lens and amber side lens like the K4. This is because Pennsy stopped using the green and white lights around 1934.

It will have the 5 different quilling whistle options as will all Legacy engines in the 2020 Big Book. We've picked 3 different pitch levels of the Banshee, the whistle from the M1a, and another whistle that I currently cannot recall. For the Pennsy skus anyways. For other road names, the banshee is there, but the auxiliary whistles are changed.

Dave, I edited my earlier post to include your correction about the markers.  It is GREAT that Lionel is now including whistle choices.  That's something the DCC guys have had for years, but it has been missing in 3-rail. 

PRR in the classic steam era only had two whistles: a single-chime "freight whistle" (a.k.a. the banshee) and a 3-chime "passenger whistle."  The passenger whistle pretty much sounded the same on whatever locomotive it was on but the freight whistle did have a different pitch according to boiler pressure.  The freight whistle on an L1s 2-8-2 with 205 psi would not sound the same as a freight whistle on an I1s 2-10-0 with 250 psi.

@CAPPilot posted:

Anyone know how close to scale (1:48) this engine is?  I always thought the tender was too big.

Ron, I'm sitting with my copy of Linn Westcott's "Steam Locomotive Cyclopedia and comparing what is in his book to my K-Line model and if Lionel's version is indeed made from the same tooling both loco and tender are too large in some dimensions.  The proto tender is 26' 7" long  front to rear sill  the K-Line is 28' 6"  The bottom of the proto tender to the rail head is 32"  The K-Line bottom tender to railhead is 42.91" The K-Line is almost 11" too high and it shows. I lowered mine by 9".  When I was planning I set it on trucks which lowered it the full 11" but it looked too low with the loco sitting high.   The width of the proto tender is 10'0"  K-Line is 10'3".  The top of the proto tender before the addition of the bunker extension is 9'2" above rail head,  K-Line is 10'3" above rail head. The side of tender at the coal bunker not including bunker extension; proto  78"  the K-Line is 88.32"  Ten inches taller.   LOCOMOTIVE; Top stack, proto 14'11"  K-Line 15'3"  Top cab roof,  proto 14'  K-Line 14'9"  Pilot beam to rear cab  proto 33'  K-Line 33'3"  Center line boiler front above rail head, proto 108"  K-Line 111.84".  The boiler diameter at the center of the sand dome, proto 77.45"  K-Line 83.5"    I have three different PRR B6 locos The Lionel 18000  the Williams and the K-Line Of the three the K-Line has the best detail however the proportions are off in several areas the boiler is too fat the top of the stack is too high as a result of the boiler being to tall and the tender sits almost a foot too high.  To me the proportions of the Williams is much closer to the scale drawing in the Steam Locomotive Cyclopedia however it is sorely lacking in detail.   As for the Lionel 18000 if you can overlook the driver spacing the rest of the loco is very close to the original B6s the tender sits at the right height and is the right length.  Strange as it may seem I think I like it best of the three.  Might be the sweat I have in mine changing the 14:1 gearing to 22:1 and adding an ERR AC commander.  It will run just as slow as my K-Line inspite of it's Pullmor motor even if it does growl a bit.  I just turned the sound volume up.   The K-Line does look better with the tender lowered.  The bottom of the tender overlaps the top of the wheels as does the prototype.  I also like it coupled close to the loco but it won't make it through sharp curves. Wish they had moved the rear pickup on the loco forward so that it wasn't so visible.         j

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Last edited by JohnActon

So JohnActon, do I understand you lowered the K-Line tender but not the engine? 

They both appear lower in your picture. I would think lowering the engine would be difficult as the motor driver leaves no space between the shell and the frame.

To install a Cruise M in that engine which is about 1/8" longer than the DCDR it comes with requires a bit a surgery on the heat sink and repositioning of that board.

Replacing the K-Line boards with Lionel's newer RCDR and BEMC boards or RCMC as the new engine likely has might allow lowering the engine though.

Pete

 

Last edited by Norton

Joe,

    I have a Legacy B6 from Lionel’s first release and I have to say it is my favorite Legacy engine that I own. It does everything you could want in a switcher. Great smoke, great whistle (Hooter will loosen your teeth), Legacy control it will run at speed step one all day and never stall. The engine sounds are also outstanding. I don’t think you will be disappointed no matter what classification lights they use.

    Good luck with your engine when it comes in.

JohnB

@Norton posted:

So JohnActon, do I understand you lowered the K-Line tender but not the engine? 

They both appear lower in your picture. I would think lowering the engine would be difficult as the motor driver leaves no space between the shell and the frame.

To install a Cruise M in that engine which is about 1/8" longer than the DCDR it comes with requires a bit a surgery on the heat sink and repositioning of that board.

Replacing the K-Line boards with Lionel's newer RCDR and BEMC boards or RCMC as the new engine likely has might allow lowering the engine though.

Pete

 

Pete, I did not touch the loco only the tender.  I had the loco boiler off the chassis and I believe lowering the loco would be next to impossible. I guess the problem is there is not a constant rate of expansion of  the dimensions.  It was randomly stretched here and there. I'm guessing to make room here and there in order to get the works inside. I noticed this the first time I removed it from the box and it bugs me a bit, not that it is not a nice model it just catches my eye.  That may be the result of having the Williams B6 which is better proportioned if less detailed.  I can fix the details on the Williams and have already bought the extra details to put on it but I cannot change the shape of the K-line casting.  You know I bought a Cruise M thinking the same thing but I just finished a project putting all new electronics in my 1989 Lionel 18000 B6s I got bogged down on that thing for a year but it now has RS4 in the tender and an ERR AC Commander in the boiler as well as 4 chuff per rev smoke and sounds and coil couplers and 22:1 gearing. Now I'm looking for an easy project sometin in a diesel always plenty of room.   I have been buying up MTH Alco DL-109 bits and pieces for some time and now have the parts for an ABA I have 5 A unit shells and one DL-110 B unit shell I will get the ABA works converted to ERR cruise boards gonna have all three units powered and full electronics in each unit so they operate as a lash-up.  Then think about what road name to put on them.  LotsAroom. in those DL bodies.                       j             

For CAP - the B6 had two cabs - one, a longer cab with two sets of windows per side, and another shorter cab (telephone booth shape?) with a single window.

Lionel 18000 got the longer cab more or less correct; Williams did the shorter cab quite well, and K-Line just combined the two.  I think the K-Line cab is incorrect.

Does it have a U-shaped boiler?

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