Moving along, all the Mianne stuff is assembled, and I just have to finish wiring the limit switches for the liftgate and it's on to pre-wiring and then putting the top on. I already have a mod in mind for the liftgate control switches, what they supply isn't suitable for my use. My gate is four feet wide, and I need a control on each side of the gate, not one handheld flapping around. The good news is, that should be really easy to do. 
Looks great John! cant wait to see it with the top on! Your moving right along!
Not moving as fast as I like, but at least I'm moving. 
gunrunnerjohn posted:Moving along, all the Mianne stuff is assembled, and I just have to finish wiring the limit switches for the liftgate and it's on to pre-wiring and then putting the top on. I already have a mod in mind for the liftgate control switches, what they supply isn't suitable for my use. My gate is four feet wide, and I need a control on each side of the gate, not one handheld flapping around. The good news is, that should be really easy to do.
Looks like the first trains might be on time!....
.......Pat
Looks good from my house!
Gunrunner at the rate your going Alex M will get his done first and you know how fast he is LOL .
Guy
It's coming along nicely!
-Greg
John: your are making better progress than I am. Have done nothing to the layout/bench work in months. But have got all he drywall complete and painted and started installing and filling shelves.
FWIW Here’s Sean’s video on his method to install switches on each side. Slide up to 8:30. liftgate switch install I’m sure you might build a better mousetrap. Maybe remote control like your garage door...
Looking real good with plenty of space. I did the same and purchased pre-fab benchwork but in some areas the hills and valleys and high lines required some serious mods. The layout also has three lift up sections that simply use hinges and knife switch blades/contacts for voltage continuity. Very easy to do.
Hi John, Please keep your progress and posts published. As you know I'm at least 6 weeks behind you. Tim's moving, Thanksgiving, Christmas & New Years Holidays ain't helping me one bit. But Tim has cashed my check, and put me on the list. John, Please stay in touch on your bench work progress.
Thanks
Tommy
Thanks guys, I'm looking forward to actually having a layout again, it's been a long time coming. The liftgate control I'm thinking about will be relay based so I'm not wiring 120V around under the table, just in one place. I saw that video Ted posted, and that's another way to go, it certainly works, maybe I'll just get lazy.
I talked to Alex, and I think I may beat him this time, he's kinda' snowed under right now.
Next I have to do some pre-wiring before I put the top on.
Looks great, John. I'll look forward to seeing something go on top of the Mianne benchwork! I'm going to give Tim a call a week or two after New Years and ask on the status of my order.
Looks good GRJ! I also saw a fellow on YouTube put switches on both sides of his lift gate. You wont have any problems doing that!
Jim
Made a bit more progress, the liftgate is done and operational. I also installed the protection panels on the side to keep fingers out of the cables. I had to ad-lib a bit on mounting the protection panels, they had a pretty lame design that only supported them from the sides. This is a 48" span, so the Masonite was flapping in the breeze. I added some wood blocks and supports to attach them on all four sides. I just used some old scrap lumber to space them out to the same plane as the legs. I'm hoping the extra blocks on the bottom I-beam help support the liftgate, all the weight of the liftgate is on those two 4 foot I-Beams, makes me a little nervous. The Masonite panels attached top and bottom and the blocks are helping support the weight on the bottom I-Beam, hopefully the liftgate lives a long and useful life.
The only remaining task for the liftgate is to add controls to operate it from both sides, the single control isn't going to do the trick. I saw a couple of Internet solutions, but I have a little problem with them. If you parallel two switches across the connections for the single switch on the control, it all works UNTIL someone on each side flips the switches in opposite directions at the same time. Then you get fireworks! 
While that's a remote possibility, Murphy was an optimist, so I'm not taking any chances!
Here's my latest update, the completed and operational liftgate.
John:
I installed the controller for the liftgate out of sight but within easy reach just under the benchwork. Besides being convenient for me, it keeps curious visiting hands off:
JOHN - When you get it completed I and others I bet would like to see your lift mechanism and wiring.
Freight Train Jim posted:JOHN - When you get it completed I and others I bet would like to see your lift mechanism and wiring.
I second that!!!
Nice work John! I hope you figure out your wiring for the liftgate!
stangtrain posted:I installed the controller for the liftgate out of sight but within easy reach just under the benchwork. Besides being convenient for me, it keeps curious visiting hands off:
With a 4 foot span, my arms aren't long enough to reach that from both sides. If I want the outside switch to be disabled, that's easy to do with a simple switch on the inside.
My goal is to have the two switches, one on each side. They'll actually trigger relays in a control box that actually controls the liftgate. There will be an interlock so that when one relay is activated, the other one is locked out to avoid the dreaded short circuit with opposing switches.
John, y when you want out you could always just call the wife and tell her to hit the switch! LOL
Sure, but if she's mad at me, she'll just roll something heavy in front of the liftgate! 
I could see that happening. I know it would at my house! LOL
You just have to make sure you don't do anything to make her mad at you!
Upset wives are a lot like “magic smoke”, sometimes it happens for no apparent reason...
Wonderful progress, John. I'm still envious at having such a large and beautiful environment in which to build. In the spirit of helpful pitfall avoidance I offer this as addendums to previous suggestions.
I would highly recommend the addition of some form of leg height adjusters that make direct contact with the concrete floor. Otherwise, when the table sinks into the carpet as more weight is added it will require constant readjustment. Direct table contact to concrete keeps kneeling to a minimum.
The sliding disc method should be employed with all things moveable along the carpet floor. Dolly wheels just create resistance and leave divets where they rest.
A concrete track plan is needed now. Before a sheet of plywood is laid, take a break and at least solidify a plan for your mainline on paper. Sidings and spurs can easily be added on the fly if necessary.
And here's my own inspired suggestion. To save many unnecessary wiring trips down under, consider the cookie cutter roadbed design table top. Feeders and other electrical connections can be threaded, soldered or fastened from up top long before the scenery is applied. Having a carpeted floor and this type of roadbed would be the ultimate in layout noise reduction.
Bruce
gunrunnerjohn posted:Sure, but if she's mad at me, she'll just roll something heavy in front of the liftgate!
And you would be stuck in the middle of your layout with nothing to do but run trains.
I don't see a problem here 
The carpet has a very thin pad, and it's not a pile carpet. I don't see this sinking to any degree, but I've considered some pads under the legs, just haven't come up with anything yet. Several suggestions have been floated.
For all my storage under the layout (as you can see, it's very open under there), I plan on using carpet glides on some custom storage sleds that slide out.
I'm working on the track plan, still thinking about what I want to do, but I want to finalize something soon.
I'm not sure I'm ready to do the cookie cutter roadbed, I'm leaning toward simple here.
OK, I had a crazy idea! I was looking at possible track plans, and one thing that I don't have is space for stuff like a reverse loop in O72 or larger. I'm thinking, while I'm sure I can do something nice in this space, would it be crazy to add a little surface area?
Here's what I have, but the liftgate has been shifted 30" to the right in my current plan, it just didn't change any surface area.
I'm thinking maybe I should close four feet of the right hand opening and end up with this. That gives me a 10.5' x 8' end that's available for track. I know I'll have some issues getting to the middle, but I guess I'll have to live with that for the flexibility of having more area to work with. The good thing is, I have all the benchwork pieces to do this already.
I'm also planning on a little corner cut to allow more space at the back for the trains to make that curve.
So, what do you think? Crazy? Cool? Must have? My one concern, obviously, is access to the center of the table.
John,
My advice is don't do it. When you're 95 yrs old you'll be glad it's easy to reach the center. Unless you have space for a 100' by 30' layout you will ALWAYS have to make decisions on what you can or can't fit on the layout. Keep it simple so you can enjoy everything 25 yrs from now as I don't believe you are planning to move in the future.
-Greg
Often when a reverse loop is used there is a consideration for a second reverse loop. With one loop, when a train is reversed, it must back through the loop to reverse back.
Bill
GRJ,
IMHO reversing loops are overrated. They serve a purpose, but for the amount of real estate they consume I find i5 hard to justify.
But that is just me, you mileage may vary.
I also believe access issues will arise from the enlarged table top.
Reverse loops with minimum 072 curves take up precious square footage but add greatly to running variety and interest. Both of the loops on my layout hold more than 2, 20 car freight trains in waiting while keeping the mainline open for traffic. The next best alternative without using up as much real estate would be more sidings where possible.I
Bruce
I say go for it John.
An interesting track arrangement that might work if you had room off one outside corner for your reverse loop, would be to connect it to the main layout via a wye. That would give you infinite reversing possibilities. Also a little more real estate for accessories, structures or scenery. Reach wouldn't even be that bad.
It could even work with your updated benchwork plan. And you only need one reverse loop because the wye allows you to enter from both directions.
I have to follow this thread....looking great so far and it might get me jump started.
Big_Boy_4005 posted:I say go for it John.
An interesting track arrangement that might work if you had room off one outside corner for your reverse loop, would be to connect it to the main layout via a wye. That would give you infinite reversing possibilities. Also a little more real estate for accessories, structures or scenery. Reach wouldn't even be that bad.
It could even work with your updated benchwork plan. And you only need one reverse loop because the wye allows you to enter from both directions.
I was thinking like Elliot, a WYE. Perhaps near the wall corner and build a loop table towards the column/ shop area. If not a loop, just a single line as long as the longest train you will run, which is more prototypical and requires less space. Drive in, back out. Back in, drive out. Either way. On this design, we gave up loops and ran the siding into a closet.
That would permit you drive the trains right into the shop. You could also park a train, bring it out behind one, back the first in and park that complete train. That was part of the operational reason for the above design.
I couldn't find your track plan to tinker with something, but, I think that you get the idea.
Less disruptive to the original design and permits changing direction.
John looks like going to be a great layout! are you going to do any elevated tracks above regular layout? tunnels mountains draw bridges?
I say go for it, also. It gives you twice the distance before the train repeats its route in the same direction. My layout is a 7' wide U shape. I have an access hole on one side, but none on the other. Using a small work platform, I can reach the center. I will have buildings and streets in most of the hard to reach places, and they won't derail or have dead spots to deal with.
gunrunnerjohn posted:stangtrain posted:I installed the controller for the liftgate out of sight but within easy reach just under the benchwork. Besides being convenient for me, it keeps curious visiting hands off:
With a 4 foot span, my arms aren't long enough to reach that from both sides.
My goal is to have the two switches, one on each side. They'll actually trigger relays in a control box that actually controls the liftgate. There will be an interlock so that when one relay is activated, the other one is locked out to avoid the dreaded short circuit with opposing switches.
John- what about a simple set of 3-way switches to control power to the lift gate? One switch on each side in a discrete location would send power to the controller. Once the gate is moved you can flip the switch on the other side and kill power to the controls. Add a pilot light at each switch location to confirm if power is on or off. Here is a basic 3-way schematic. Several other options here.
As the guru of all things electronic, I'm sure you have a great control system planned but I'm a firm believer in the KISS method.
Bob
I'm still thinking on the added surface area. The worry is as stated, it'll be a big expanse that's hard to reach.
FWIW, I was considering a long single loop that actually had two reverse loops, both in the expanded area. One would be elevated and go over the first one, so you'd have two complete loops around the table and just make the loop and go down the other way. The entry and exit from each of these loops would be on opposite sides of the layout. Reversing trains would be simple in that case, just two pairs of switches between the two tracks gets it done, one pair for each direction. I'd also like to have a separate loop around that can be switched in and out to either be a separate run or contiguous with the main double loop.
Bob, my idea for the liftgate control is two relays with a simple logic interlock to avoid them ever being energized at once. The control switches will be low voltage, and I'll just lift the guts of the liftgate control and plug them into my modified control. I won't change the wiring at all to the liftgate so it can be returned to stock if desired. The only 120 volts will be inside the liftgate control box. I want dual control that are a single switch that always works, and of course I can add a disable switch if I feel the need.
Go for it John. You can stand on a small 6-7" high stool and increase your reach considerably. Long term satisfaction and operating fun over rule the exaggerated "reach" problems we talk about. Anyway you will never have a derailment--probably just wiring errors .
I am considering a lift-out, probably not that large. There are 2x2 sections in the framework, so that would be a good size for the liftout. I'd make it right inside the loop so I'm not moving any track.
John, the blue line was the lift up and the red would not be filled, so you could walk in when you needed to. It would still be around the room.
I was thinking more along the lines of something like this. Either one or both could be fitted, depending on exactly what ends up in those locations.
Surely those will work, I was trying to avoid ducking under.
I'd only be ducking under to work on things, so I don't mind. I like the idea of having more real estate, so I think I'll go that way.
Works for me. It's not like you're going to be ducking under all the time. My guess is you'll take your time doing things right the first time to minimize problems. You will probably be ducking quite a bit though as you build and when you add landscaping. Looking forward to following the build.
The deed is done. I now have a 10.5' x 8' chunk to do the stack O72 reverse loops, should be sufficient to get it done.
Man, can you imagine having to have done that with regular benchwork? That's a big plus for Mianne and your investment has already paid some big dividends for you.
Yep, it was just bolt a few parts in place. The bonus was I already had all the parts I needed to stick it in, do it was a 15 minute job.
gunrunnerjohn posted:The deed is done. I now have a 10.5' x 8' chunk to do the stack O72 reverse loops, should be sufficient to get it done.
That’ll pay off when you send your first steamer backing down the loop to couple on to an outbound....****loads of fun!........Pat
Don't you love my little test loop on the floor? I just build the layour around it, can't wait to lose that and be able to test stuff on a real layout!
gunrunnerjohn posted:Don't you love my little test loop on the floor? I just build the layour around it, can't wait to lose that and be able to test stuff on a real layout!
Who cares!.....LOL!....let’s see the reverse loop!....I want one so bad...but I just can’t give up the real estate!....I’m jealous!....
......Pat
I didn't want to have a big expanse that I couldn't easily reach from the floor, but the realities of the space I have, that's the only way I could see getting two O72 loops at that end. Now the mainline will be a large folded dogbone, so I can run continuous on about 100 feet or so of track. Not huge, but enough to have a decent sized consist and not be chasing my tail.
John, You just showed how easy it is to alter what you buy from Tim and get it ready for a tabletop. I'm looking forward to seeing you progress.
Mark Boyce posted:John, You just showed how easy it is to alter what you buy from Tim and get it ready for a tabletop. I'm looking forward to seeing you progress.
Mark, don’t let him fool you, he’s most proud of the loop on the floor!.......Pat
LOL
Pat, you are quite right!!! He is!!
Hey, at least the loop on the floor is functional, don't knock it!
I'm glad I delayed putting wood on, I think I'll like this much better than what I had planned before.
I'm glad I had a bunch of spare pieces, I just dug into the inventory and had everything I needed to stick that section in. It really is easy to modify, I ended up modifying the original plan as well, I moved the lift-gate and reconfigured one of the sections to give more space under the layout. It was a piece of cake.
gunrunnerjohn posted:Hey, at least the loop on the floor is functional, don't knock it!
I'm glad I delayed putting wood on, I think I'll like this much better than what I had planned before.
I'm glad I had a bunch of spare pieces, I just dug into the inventory and had everything I needed to stick that section in. It really is easy to modify, I ended up modifying the original plan as well, I moved the lift-gate and reconfigured one of the sections to give more space under the layout. It was a piece of cake.
The reversing loops are a great idea, and a lot of fun....Grandad always said the most fun he had was during the war when he worked OT as a hostler, when man power was short he got the chance to back down a hudson on the reversing loop to couple on to a train just brought in by an electric at Harmon......anytime he told that story he’d say..”I was a big dog that day”.............Pat
Is this stiff sturdy enough to stand on it?
Hey John
You’re well on your way, and it looks great ! I’m might slow you down a bit , I’m going to need quite a few Super Chuffers and Generators. 😀
Alex
TrainHead posted:Is this stiff sturdy enough to stand on it?
Depends on your size. I was wondering the same thing so I talked to Tim a bit. He's never had anyone tell him it broke. He is aware of a 200lb man walking on a layout.
I did an experiment. I bought two legs and one beam. I put it together and sat on it. It took some work to balance it. Once 100% of my weight was on it, it shattered. I weigh 280lbs. Hope that helps.
John, wouldn’t the weight be distributed better with more legs and decking? Seems like your test just showed the strenght of a single beam, by chance a 48” beam? I wonder how a 1x4 would hold up spanning just 2 legs? And I don’t see many people putting their weight on it single beam like that.
Kinda off topic, but I agree, not a valid test. Same size dimensional lumber would fair no better in my opinion.
Of course you can shorten the beams and add more legs. This stuff is pricey enough and doubling the legs and shortening the beam would double the price.
No, a 4 foot 1x4 is not as strong because of the MDF core on the I-beam. A 2x4 would be stronger.
If you were climbing on your layout there is a good chance that at some point all of your weight would be on the middle of one beam. The way the plywood attaches wouldnt offer a whole lot of load distribution to other legs. Dont forget the additional weight of scenery and such!
I didn't do this to be exact. I did this because if it HAD worked, then I'd spend the $2k on the stuff. I'd really hate to spend this money and find out it won't support my overweight self. This was a true worst-case test and man if it passed I woulda been so happy! I actually bought 2 beams and the legs were not damaged, so I could do some more testing but I'm pretty sure 280lbs is not going to be supported.
Like it was said already, this is off topic. This is not about my layout. I hope I helped answer the question of can you walk on top of this stuff. The answer is "maybe."
Now...back on topic...hey John, you running trains yet?!
gunrunnerjohn posted:Don't you love my little test loop on the floor? I just build the layour around it, can't wait to lose that and be able to test stuff on a real layout!
That's funny to me...it beats a chalk outline on the floor....don't know why I didn't just leave the circle of track on the floor when I built my last layout. Makes me shake my head at myself.
-Greg
Tim seems to think that I could put my weight on a finished section without it breaking. I'm going to avoid that if possible, because I'm chicken! I really need it to support my layout, I'm not looking to create an elevated dance floor for midgets!
Alex M posted:You’re well on your way, and it looks great ! I’m might slow you down a bit , I’m going to need quite a few Super Chuffers and Generators. 😀
Just a bump in the road Alex.
Personally, in 50 years of layouts, I never thought of building one where I would have to climb up on it. Though I am only 170 pounds, I wouldn’t want to hurt myself at my age and with my physical problems. That said, I can see the Benchwork should hold you fine as Tim said. He would know
Looking great John(sorry been busy not checking messages lately). Its always good to dry test fitting something in, I always had some issue even if I did it. Like grandpop used to say, "measure twice, cut once." My reply was, "well, I do that but I still can't cut straight."
Its starting to really come together. Pretty soon you'll be testing how the track keeps up or drops its current, leveling off the track, getting nice even grades, all that sort of stuff. You'll get that new engine(or old new engine) out on the tracks, smoke steadily rising, and then you notice the powers not on, oops.
Dave, I'm really hoping I don't see smoke from any orifice except the smoke stack on any of my stuff!
I have been taking my time as once I finish a step, I really don't want to go back and repeat it!
gunrunnerjohn posted:Dave, I'm really hoping I don't see smoke from any orifice except the smoke stack on any of my stuff!
I have been taking my time as once I finish a step, I really don't want to go back and repeat it!
Yeah, it really is a PITA when you are doing something, get it all set, and then you have to take everything all back apart. I have visions of my Uncle Eddie(God bless him) working on my grandfather's Ford Golden Jubilee tractor trying to figure out what's wrong with it. He had pulled so much stuff apart the first fee times that he just left it open to the bare bones to work on it. He had gotten that working back to better than it was first day off the factory floor. Well, now the tractor has had a few bad years of my sister's boyfriend trying to work out what isn't working on it(he's a mechanic, can fix all sorts of things, my uncle was a wonder with vehicles, tractors, and pretty much everything else). Needless to say I wish my uncle was alive because he would either fix it or bury it.
Hopefully John you won't have any of those sorts of issues. Of course trains aren't tractors, but they can be temperamental at times. May that never happen(unless you forgot to turn the power on like some have done).
I disagree that reverse loops are over rated. Racetrack track plans soon become dull. Having the ability to change direction or even hold a train in the loop while other things are taking place adds to the fun. Of course those of you with outbuildings dedicated to a layout or basements the size of a high school gym will have a different opinion, in my small crappy basement the linear solution with loops at each end and in the middle provide endless variation.
Once I lay in the reverse loops, I plan on one additional loop all the way around. It will have switching to allow me to either join it to the big folded dogbone for an additional loop, or to run it as a separate independent loop that doesn't connect to the main loop. Finally, there will be the sidings for industry and the like. I have in my future (near future) plans to add a yard off to the left side down the wall of the basement extension. That will give me more parking space for staging. It also gives me something to do after the main track plan is done. I won't say "until the layout is done", we all know that never happens.
gunrunnerjohn posted:Once I lay in the reverse loops, I plan on one additional loop all the way around. It will have switching to allow me to either join it to the big folded dogbone for an additional loop, or to run it as a separate independent loop that doesn't connect to the main loop. Finally, there will be the sidings for industry and the like. I have in my future (near future) plans to add a yard off to the left side down the wall of the basement extension. That will give me more parking space for staging. It also gives me something to do after the main track plan is done. I won't say "until the layout is done", we all know that never happens.
Excellent thinking GRJ! Exactly what I plan to do when I get a little more space in the train room! Actually considering a double main loop with a crossover and option to run around the room. May be a challenge using Fastrack though.
Jim
John, Even with months of planning, RRTrack designs and input from many, it still evolved once I began building, using fastrack left me without many options for on the fly custom bends, but it all began to take shape when I laid it down, and wound up with a reversing elevated section which added that function and gave me a lot better layout for multiple operations.
I just wish I had more real estate for a larger yard than I got, fortunately, switching is not a huge part of my fun.
I really like the way you optimized and kept the 072, I just couldn't get that much space and wound up with 060 and 048 main lines.
I have too many things that run on O72 to sacrifice that part. I'm working on the track plan in AnyRail, I want to get the main loops figured out, then add the rest of the industry sidings, etc. Of course, I want to leave room for scenery and buildings.
I'm sure once I actually start laying track that it won't end up exactly like the plan.
gunrunnerjohn posted:I have too many things that run on O72 to sacrifice that part.
I'm sure once I actually start laying track that it won't end up exactly like the plan.
Good thinking again GRJ! I decided on 072 on the outside main right away. Not only will it allow bigger engines, but it just plain looks better. Its easy for me to not have a track plan at all. Just keep moving it around until I like something. Then move it again. Sooner or later it will all come together. That's the best thing about Fastrack!
Jim
I have an idea of what I want, once I lay it down in the CAD, I'll see if it's realistic to have it.
Your on the right track John (pun intended). AnyRail was my third and last program and by far was the the easiest to use, at least for me. Like others have already said it gets you started. Good thinking sticking with the 072 curves. There's much more flexibility with motive power and passenger cars. Even after I started to lay the track I still tweaked the plan the way I wanted to. In the end mine looks kind of sorted like my AnyRail plan.
I put O72 on my 3 rail highline as I had to go around 2 tight curves on my T shaped line to stay near the walls. I thought that it would be big enough as many engines list it as a minimum curve. It does work and one of the curves is inside a tunnel so it won't look too bad. However if I had more room, I would go bigger. When I run, I always slow down on those 2 curves as it appears the equipment is on the edge of derailing. It doesn't, but it looks like it wants to. Our grandson also slows down there without being told to. I installed a retaining type wall inside the tunnel to protect from derails.
I have to believe many posters that state, go with as big of curves as you possibly can.
I recall one of John Armstrong's layout books discussing "cosmetic curves" and using landscape and structures to "hide" tight curves (which 072 is with scale equipment) . I won't be building a layout, but I hope John that you can incorporate those into your layout.
Well, one of the O72 reverse loops will be under the other one, that sort of hides it.
Engineer-Joe posted:I put O72 on my 3 rail highline as I had to go around 2 tight curves on my T shaped line to stay near the walls. I thought that it would be big enough as many engines list it as a minimum curve. It does work and one of the curves is inside a tunnel so it won't look too bad. However if I had more room, I would go bigger. When I run, I always slow down on those 2 curves as it appears the equipment is on the edge of derailing. It doesn't, but it looks like it wants to. Our grandson also slows down there without being told to. I installed a retaining type wall inside the tunnel to protect from derails.
I have to believe many posters that state, go with as big of curves as you possibly can.
Sounds like you have a built-in prototypical "speed restriction": not really a bad thing, is it?
And it sounds like your grandson is a natural-born engineer.
Mark in Oregon
Strummer posted:Engineer-Joe posted:I put O72 on my 3 rail highline as I had to go around 2 tight curves on my T shaped line to stay near the walls. I thought that it would be big enough as many engines list it as a minimum curve. It does work and one of the curves is inside a tunnel so it won't look too bad. However if I had more room, I would go bigger. When I run, I always slow down on those 2 curves as it appears the equipment is on the edge of derailing. It doesn't, but it looks like it wants to. Our grandson also slows down there without being told to. I installed a retaining type wall inside the tunnel to protect from derails.
I have to believe many posters that state, go with as big of curves as you possibly can.
Sounds like you have a built-in prototypical "speed restriction": not really a bad thing, is it?
And it sounds like your grandson is a natural-born engineer.
Mark in Oregon
Mark, Good points about Joe built in speed restriction and his grandson's attention to what is going on!!
gunrunnerjohn posted:Well, one of the O72 reverse loops will be under the other one, that sort of hides it.
Got to like a fella with a sense of humor.
My new layout will have the Mianne lift-bridge, and it'll make access to the center of the layout much easier, especially as flexibility starts to wane in my later years. However, I have identified an issue with the bridge, specifically the hazard to my head! If you're under the bridge and misjudge the height as you duck under, you can whack your head on the I-beams. The edges are actually very sharp and square, and I have a couple of cuts on my noggin to prove it. I considered rounding the edges, but that would only be a partial solution, so I dropped into my local Lowe's store and picked up some 1/2" split pipe insulation. A perfect fit, and a nice padded place for my head to land on, no more cuts!
Hi Gunner, Tommy Thompson here. Have followed all the reply's for many months on your progress. Well Done !! I made a brief mention back on page 1 or 2 that I was a few months behind you in ordering and was then waiting on Tim to build. Tim called today and is shipping on Monday 02/04. Its great when a plan begins to unfold. Thanks for all of your comments and updates. I listened to all of them.
Best regards
Tommy
gunrunnerjohn posted:…. A perfect fit, and a nice padded place for my head to land on, no more cuts!
I came to the post expecting more to see. I guess we all have our..... issues?
I'd laugh at you for this but I've done it too many times to remember.
…..Wait. 
What were we talking about?
Tommy, glad you're getting your benchwork soon. I'm working on the track plan so I know where to do the pre-wiring. Then I'll start putting the top on.
gunrunnerjohn posted:My new layout will have the Mianne lift-bridge, and it'll make access to the center of the layout much easier, especially as flexibility starts to wane in my later years. However, I have identified an issue with the bridge, specifically the hazard to my head! If you're under the bridge and misjudge the height as you duck under, you can whack your head on the I-beams. The edges are actually very sharp and square, and I have a couple of cuts on my noggin to prove it. I considered rounding the edges, but that would only be a partial solution, so I dropped into my local Lowe's store and picked up some 1/2" split pipe insulation. A perfect fit, and a nice padded place for my head to land on, no more cuts!
Great idea, John. I'm off to Lowe's tomorrow.
gunrunnerjohn posted:Here's what the original plan looked like. I'm removing some of the extra legs in the middle as I want more storage under the bench. The diagonals were only there because he was using some stuff I already had. After seeing the plan, I decided to remove those so that space under there is all open.
John, sorry I missed this back in December. Have you noticed anything negative about removing those center legs? Is there any weakness in the center as a result? Thanks.
Dave, Thank you for looking at John's topic and asking the question. I've been following from the beginning, but totally forgot John said he was going to do away with some of those legs.
John, I am curious too how you think that will work out!
DoubleDAZ posted:gunrunnerjohn posted:Here's what the original plan looked like. I'm removing some of the extra legs in the middle as I want more storage under the bench. The diagonals were only there because he was using some stuff I already had. After seeing the plan, I decided to remove those so that space under there is all open.
John, sorry I missed this back in December. Have you noticed anything negative about removing those center legs? Is there any weakness in the center as a result? Thanks.
No adverse effects I can see. Tim actually just did it that way to use as much of the benchwork pieces that I already had. I specifically asked about that and he said it's no problem to remove them. Since I had more 24" and 48" pieces, picking up a little hardware was enough for me to change it around. Much of the other side and back don't have the legs in his original design, so it's hard to believe these were required.
Great thread on the Layout. I finally read the whole thing. Great work and ideas.
I used Sievers Benchwork to build a 12 X 14 layout. I laid 1/4 inch pegboard on it instead of plywood, and indoor/outdoor carpet on top of that. I routinely walk on the layout to get to some shelves and cause no ill effect. 180 lbs. I did the pegboard because it was flat compared to the plywood at Home Depot and I can poke a wire anywhere I want with holes on a 1 inch grid. And I did a lot of that.
I agree on liking reversing loops. I have a reversing upper level and lower level on the 048 loops that make for some interesting play time. The ramps are around 9 ft in length using MTH risers with the Fastrack tops on them. If I start the engine out correctly, it runs up and down and repeats without intervention. Then I have an 060 and an 072 loop as well, all of which are connected by switches.
Interesting idea Chuck, I'd like to see a picture or two of your layout.
Chuck, I’m also curious, especially how you are supporting the upper level loop. I seem to remember reading about your using pegboard.
John, thanks for the reply to my question.
I used the MTH risers, graduated and fixed height, that come with the Fastrack clips on the top. I used some sort of self tapping screws about an inch tall to fasten the base of the riser to the pegboard below the carpet where advisable. Here is a close picture of them. I like mostly track and wire as you can see.
BTW, I just step on the Fastrack with slippers on to walk on the layout...somewhat infrequently. And there are two access holes in the middle of the layout that you cannot see well...they are 2 by 4 foot openings. I cannot afford to gain weight and keep using them.
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