Benchwork - Laying Track

Hi Dave, Thanks for getting the grades under control so to speak. I thought I had the tracks on the bridge the same level as the first pic shows??? Is this the area you are referencing? Great idea on the 096 curve turnout, that certainly makes a lot of sense.  as does moving the other curved switch and getting grades in check!  Will the bridges work with the height differences? Having a 4 inch height difference is 16 feet added vessel clearance which gives the Bascule bridge a purpose.

John, yes, you did have the bridge tracks the same height, so poor choice of words, but the grade to the switch at 2” was 3.5% and 3% in the other direction. The other track was 3.1% to the top. The grade from the yard switch to the curved switch was 2.9% and the single track before the yard switch was also 2.9%. Now, if you put the switches on the grades you might be okay percentage-wise, but I think you’re asking for trouble if you include switches on the grades, especially the more complicated curved switches. I also try to avoid beginning and ending grades on switches because all grades need an easement and including the track connected to the switch might result in you ending up with an actual grade higher than you want or flexing the switch itself.

Even though it makes sense to me, my color-coding scheme might be causing some of your difficulties. Unlike RR-Track, I don’t know of another way to select tracks on a grade except 1 at a time or by color-coding. For me the former is tedious because I edit grades a lot. I suppose I could stop color-coding all the other tracks, but it makes it a lot easier to keep things straight on layouts with dual mains, etc.

My rationale for posting them with color is so folks can readily see things. My expectation is that you would then make or copy the changes to your file. I add the color to make my editing process easier and quicker. I add the Daz to the filename to distinguish my file from yours. If you want it to be your new file, I expect you to rename it and drop the Daz. If it would help, I can remove the colors from the photos and SCARM files I post.

FWIW, grade tracks and only grade tracks are colored purple. All other “flat” tracks, regardless of height, can be clear, a single color or the multiple colors I use. To get rid of my colors, all you have to do is set the track color to None, then Select All in the Edit menu and hit the Track Color button. The color button only affects tracks, so this is what you get.

Thanks for clearing things up for me. I am learning everyday and you are an exceptional teacher. The colors are great and I see the advantage when selecting track for grades. I agree with keeping switches level and hopefully that will reduce trouble areas. I feel like it is getting close to a final plan, which as Mark says, will be modified as needed when unexpected issues arise.  And I will swap names when I post a drawing I altered (messed with) so as to keep things orgainized.

John, it’s up to you what you do with the names, I was just offering my thoughts so you understand why I do what I do. In some threads we have multiple people offering suggestions, so we add our initials or something to the filename just to keep versions straight.

I have started putting a copy of your drawings in a separate folder named Daz Gold so I do not alter it and can always go back to the correct drawing without my 2 cents added.

Another topic: Dave, I know you have the 3" rule for getting track close to walls. Can you or anyone else chime in on how much room is needed between track and wall to build a mountain going up the wall? I know it could be a straight vertical cliff, however there still needs to be some room to have a bare minimum base. Thanks All

That made me laugh out loud, Daz Gold. 😂😂😂

In programming I always kept a version that was considered GOLD until the new version was fully de-bugged and tested. Glad you laughed!

Well, I did/do too, just never referred to it as Gold.

Our computer manager always said, “Back up your gold!”

That’s what I was taught when I was starting to learn how to model in solid works.

John, Missing your updates. Anything new?

I’m curious too. I was going through my files today and realized it’s been awhile since you posted. Hopefully everything is okay.

All is ok with me, needed to focus on family a bit. Thanks for asking

Hello All,

It has been a busy time for us and will still be to a certain extent, however some railroad building can start next week. Took a trip out to Conn. to move our daughter out to Pa. Long time coming but worth the wait for sure. I did squeeze in a stop at Ross Custom switches and picked up a 27" turntable ,which Steve put together for me to pick up in just two days! Steve HUGE Thanks!!! Now to be able to have some bench work completed so it can be installed. It was great to see Steve and he was as hospitable and friendly as always. Steve is a Great guy, and great to do business with, not many people can accomplish what he has done. Steve constantly delivers HIGH quality American made products at fair prices. That combined with his support and the backing of his products with follow up service is just outstanding! Many kudos to Ross Custom Switches and Steve for making them possible.

Now back to unloading the U-Haul LOL

Glad your you and  your family are healthy. I look forward to following your build.

John, I assumed you had been busy with something or other.  I'm glad you got your daughter moved from Connecticut.  I hope all goes well for her here.

Congratulations on getting the turntable from Steve!  That will be a great feature on the layout.  I wish I had room for one.  I never even had room when I modeled in N scale.    Steve seemed like a great guy when I met him at York, and everyone says so.  I, of course, was buying some Ross switches.  I went to C.T. McCormick a few weeks ago to get the last 3 Ross switches I needed.  That was the third time I got some from Jeff.

@Mark Boyce posted:

John, I assumed you had been busy with something or other.  I'm glad you got your daughter moved from Connecticut.  I hope all goes well for her here.

Congratulations on getting the turntable from Steve!  That will be a great feature on the layout.  I wish I had room for one.  I never even had room when I modeled in N scale.    Steve seemed like a great guy when I met him at York, and everyone says so.  I, of course, was buying some Ross switches.  I went to C.T. McCormick a few weeks ago to get the last 3 Ross switches I needed.  That was the third time I got some from Jeff.

I hope I have room! LOL

First, thanks to all who have helped and inspired me along so far. For some reason I am struggling to get an overall table height. I will have some unreachable areas that I will use a topside creeper to access for the build and for running trains. The lower I have it the easier the reach, however I do not want to have it so low that the main perspective is looking down on roof tops. At this time I have an L-girder design for the most part and legs are 40"  to 42" high (they are adjustable) So my question is: Do I cut existing legs lower than 40", or use the 40-42" height or consider cutting new legs longer than 42"  The 40" maybe a little low, however for myself I would sit on a rolling stool and run trains from that perspective. All opinions are needed and welcome.

Also has anyone used a 27" Ross turntable? And if so which roundhouse did you use? (Korber, Brennan, Altoona etc.)

Easy question to answer: 42" unless you are under 25 years old. The ease of working under the table is more important than a few inches difference in perspective.  You can increase table reach by standing on a small stool. 

Thanks Bruce

How much time is spent underneath the table during construction and after construction. I do have some difficulties with underneath work.

Thanks in advance

John

My layout is 42” high, and I wish it was 48 or 50. Trains look better, and it’s easier to work underneath.  Also, more storage underneath. JohnA

John,

Of course it depends on the type (duck-under or walk-around) , overall size, and whether or not you want to hide the wiring under the surface. Most of my time spent under the table has been associated with the track and accessory wiring. 

I originally picked 36" legs for my duck-under style table of 22 legs. I soon realized that was a colossal mistake once I started wiring in the track. I used an automobile tire jack, going from leg to leg with a lot of shims and 2 x 4's, to raise the table surface to 41 1/4".  (Leg is actually 40 1/4" now)

Everyone has a different situation and physique so it's hard to make a one-size-fits-all decree. But since you have the option to use a leg in that 40 to 42 range, that's what I would consider.

John, I agree with 40 to 42 inches.  I have tried to make as much wiring as possible accessible from the aisle while sitting on my roll around stool.  I have managed pretty well considering I haven’t had to pull with stuff under the layout of wire.  I wouldn’t have been able to reach in as far if the top was lower.

John,

Roundhouse and turntable placement, and the space needed based on choices, has been previously discussed on this forum.  See:

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...plan-design-part-two  or

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/topic/turntable-7

I found these by advance searching for "roundhouse turntable angle," and there are lots more.  If you read all the way through track-plan-design-part-two, you will see there is a lot of math involved to find what combinations will fit your available space.

Chuck

Thanks Dave, Bruce, Mark, and everyone else's input for table height. I will be using the 40-42 inch height. This is adjustable with bolts drilled into bottom of legs for adjustment. The build will have a similar lift bridge as Mark has on his layout. So I have to be aware of how high the bridge clearance needs to be for full up position. So in that respect I have a height restriction. Of course the bridge is in the area of an I-beam holding up the house, so that will not be moved.

Again Thanks to all

They always put those pesky I beams where you don’t want them.  😉  I think you are making a good choice and looking at all the obstacles.  Just don’t buy a 48” long bridge when your opening is only 26” like I did!  😄

Ok here is the first baby step on L-girder bench work. I am still not set on the top material, as plywood prices are outrageous to say the least. Extruded foam (2" thick) is getting a lot of points from what I have read in the forum. Having essentially two main lines at different heights will have me make some supports from plywood as Mark and many others have done.  Not sure how that interfaces with foam board. The more I read, the more questions I have and then learn I know even less than when I started. lol

John, it is a good start.  Yes it is bad lumber prices have gone so high.  I use a 2” sheet of foam for my Christmas layout. I would certainly hold out for wood on a permanent layout and using foam for scenic supports.

I could be wrong because I used 1” rigid foam for my holiday layouts, but I thought it was noisy. Most use it for landscaping on top of a plywood base. The 2” might be quieter and it let’s you carve out rivers, valleys, etc.

Yes noise is a concern of mine. Also how to secure track down and elevating the track. I was also pondering homosote base and rigid foam on top of the homosote.

Central and Western HomaRoad Supply is offering precut pieces to accommodate O gauge. I intend to use it.

www.cwhomaroad.com

Hi Jay,

This looks like a good place to start with road bed. The price seems reasonable.

Thanks

John

Why would you place a potential "noise maker" (rigid foam) on top of what is usually considered a "noise suppressor" (homasote)?  Most put homasote on top of plywood for its sound deadening qualities.

Chuck

I agree with Chuck, put the Homasote on top.  Also, I just learned about C&W Homaroad here on the Forum recently.  I would definitely look into Jay’s link if I still needed roadbed.

One of the owners, Russ Chilton is very responsive.

I do appreciate the expertise and experience everyone has and gives freely to newbie's like myself. My original plan had 1/2" plywood with 1/2" homosote on top for sound deadening. My heart skipped several beats as the big box stores are asking 50.00 for 1/2 ply and 35.00 for 1/2 homosote. needing at least 10 sheets each. Yes, I realize this is not an inexpensive hobby, however $1000.00 just for the top might put a halt to the project. If this is my only real option for stability and reasonable sound deadening then I will be forced to go this route. Could I "get away" with using 1/2 ply and then just use the C&W homaroad for deadening or is that fool hardy?

Thanks to all in advance

I used 1/2” ply, but my joists are on 16” centers.  How far apart are you putting your joists

Think of it this way. Other than the yard area, most of your layout is comprised of grades. That makes it ideal for cookie-cutter style construction. This style places plywood and homasote just under the tracks, not over the entire layout. If you cover your layout with sheets of plywood, you’re still going to need to support the tracks on the grades. This means risers and probably more plywood roadbed under the tracks. Cookie-cutter requires a lot of “cutting” and a lot of planning to minimize waste, but it’s something you should consider. It’s also partly the reason L-girder bench work was designed.

Always excellent insights Dave. In developing my design, which I changed again this week, I’ve considered this concept for a portion. I have to hash it out on my laptop instead of paper.

Thank you

Jay, some folks lay a sheet and then cut out the track design to raise the grades with risers. This method makes it easy to add straight walls or cliffs. Full cookie-cutter requires filling in the spaces between tracks with cloth, chicken wire, etc., to craft the landscaping.