This locomotive is impressive. Good job Lionel!
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Brian, thank you for posting the video. Looks pretty cool. I can't tell from the video, but are the head and tail lights the pyle style (2 smaller lights in the lens?
Thanks,
Man, they boogered the stripe color. Looks much too bright. I don't understand how Lionel does this when the previous Legacy J was dead on.
Surefire posted:Man, they boogered the stripe color. Looks much too bright. I don't understand how Lionel does this when the previous Legacy J was dead on.
Just looked at my premier model. My premier has more of a maroon color. Lionels looks to be a shade of orange. Could be the lighting. Who knows. Havent seen the real 611. how about some 611 fans chiming in. Either way, I will keep my premier model and may even order the newest one in the latest MTH book.
There appears to be too much orange and pink in that stripe....and not enough brown.
As mentioned above, I'm not sure how you previously nail a product....and then struggle with its reissue.
It's suppose to be easier, cheaper, and better the second time around....unless it's a divorce.
Berkshire President posted:It's suppose to be easier, cheaper, and better the second time around....unless it's a divorce.
Hilarious. You may own the internet for a day.
What about the stainless rims? Personally, I've aways liked them on my models from the 726 Berkshire (and other pre-magnetraction steamers) to the modern models of the NYC Hudson. My TMCC '611' doesn't have them and neither does the prototype does it?
Berkshire President posted:As mentioned above, I'm not sure how you previously nail a product....and then struggle with its reissue.
This seems to be the trend at Lionel since the legacy moguls.
Interestingly enough, Derek from Notch 6 did a Facebook live last evening featuring the Lionel TMCC J, and the new 611 J. The stripes between the 2 were obviously different. Then he brought in a 611 magnet that was sold by the Virginia Museum of Transportation gift shop, and painted in N&W 611 colors. Interestingly enough the magnet, which in theory should match the real engine, matched the newer Legacy engine better than the older one. Not saying it's scientific, just saying it's curious.
I'll let Derek post that screen shot if he wishes or you can view the video on FB. Approximately the 14 minute mark. I still personally think the darker stripe is more prototypical of the engine but that just going off previous product and photographs but it makes you wonder a little.
But on another note, the Railsounds are pretty spectacular. I always loved my TMCC Js whistle but Legacy takes it to a whole new level with the quilling whistle. Derek does a great job at going through the sounds.
**Edited to reflect the Virginia Museum of Transportation.
If you haven’t seen the N&W Video “The Modern coal Burning Steam Locomotive” I implore you to take a half hour and watch it.
Heres a screenshot from the video of #602 as she literally rolls out of the shop brand new. Now of course the film and age will distort the colors, but it as you watch the video pay attention to the passenger cars - notice the engine, RPOs, heavyweight coaches and streamlined cars are all different shades of N&W Tuscan?
My opinion is this stripe color is pretty close to the Lionel Postwar 746, which a scale version was one of the offerings. Of course for the 600-603-611 it’s not what is expected and Lionel has said at York they would correct it when I talked to them about it. Now we just need to see some pics of the freedom train version
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Hi Guys,
That red stripe thing: one has to take into account the effects of the weather and exposure to ultraviolet rays of the sun. The new Lionel J, to me, has a freshly shopped red stripe. More in appearance to the real J that is running at Strasburg. Other previous models have the stripe a much darker red. I'm not sure which is correct; I personally believe they are all correct. It just depends on how long the engines were exposed to the outdoor elements. Just my 2 cents
Steve
Steve: I totally get what you are saying. There's a lot of truth in it.
Problem is, most of us want our J's the same color....and matching our passenger cars, in the same color.
MartyE posted:...But on another note, the Railsounds are pretty spectacular. I always loved my TMCC Js whistle but Legacy takes it to a whole new level with the quilling whistle. Derek does a great job at going through the sounds.
Totally agree the Railsounds are spectacular, BUT it still bugs me and feel Lionel dropped the ball when they decided (except for Vision Line items) to no longer specifically call out/identify the locomotive by its roadname and/or cab number (i.e. "Norfolk & Western 611..." or just ""611" ...you've got the green"". This specific cab identification, IMHO gave Lionel locomotives a distinct advantage over everyone else especially when it came from their still superior quality sound system. The irony is that MTH is now offering some specific roadname/cab/route/geographic sound info to some of their newer offerings. The MTH sound quality or fidelity still does not meet or exceed Lionel, but MTH continues to reduce that gap. As to why or the reasons Lionel decided to move to the "generic" tower-com announcements is debatable especially since sound editing seems much easier and likely at a relatively lower cost than what was available 15+ years ago. My guess is that Lionel felt the generic route was the "K.I.S.S." method that had marginal cost savings and also reduced the chance of sound-file mix-up.
Nonetheless, that N&W J sounds great.
Failure to include loco specific crew talk is known as being CHEAP.
The sound files existed or are easily created. Their absence can only be attributed to cost cutting/short sighted decision making.
Ironically, I feel that putting that feature back into non VL engines would actually sell MORE of them. I'd have already purchased an NKP Legacy Mikado if it sounded different than my Legacy Great Northern Mikado. It would also be "different" from my other NKP steam engines.
Well, at least the stripe lines up on this one.
Hal
Brian Sheffield posted:This locomotive is impressive. Good job Lionel!
Nice video, but the bad track joint on the rearmost S gauge track always bugs me. It's been that way for some time. Time to fix it?
Weathering or fading or sunshine or whatever shouldn't enter in. It should match the Locomotive as built or as it was painted for Excursion service. Anything else is just giving Lionel a pass. This sort of stuff is ridiculous. There are so many Lionel items I would love to purchase but at this point I'm voting with my wallet. Until they get It together no way I'm preordering anything.
Scott Mann and 3rd rail for example consistently deliver trains that are EXACTLY as they said they would be. They are made in China as well. It can be done. For thousands of dollars it SHOULD be done.
I'm passionate about this as I love Lionel, but they are not returning the sentiment.
Surefire posted:Weathering or fading or sunshine or whatever shouldn't enter in. It should match the Locomotive as built or as it was painted for Excursion service. Anything else is just giving Lionel a pass. This sort of stuff is beyond maddening. There are so many Lionel items I would love to purchase but at this point I'm voting with my wallet. Until they get It together no way I'm preordering anything.
Scott Mann and 3rd rail for example consistently deliver trains that are EXACTLY as they said they would be. They are made in China as well. It can be done. For thousands of dollars it SHOULD be done.
I'm passionate about this as I love Lionel, but they are not returning the sentiment.
I would LOVE for Scott Mann to produce an ACCURATE model of the 611. I would pre order one in a heart beat. The models produced to date from both MTH and Lionel have had multiple inaccuracies. I can do without the whistle smoke and premium Lionel sounds. I just want a scale model that is correct from the running gear to the paint color. How about it, Scott? 
I got my J today but haven’t opened it yet. I’m going to talk to Brian next week and probably ship it back. I’ve got to many Js to have a lemon that might or might not get corrected. What a mess. I’ve got the Legacy J with passenger cars. I paid 1300 to get whistle steam and “Spirit of Roanoke” on the side, not a stripe that no way resembles the previous Js. I’m very disappointed. It’s really too bad.
N&W 1218 posted:I got my J today but haven’t opened it yet. I’m going to talk to Brian next week and probably ship it back. I’ve got to many Js to have a lemon that might or might not get corrected. What a mess. I’ve got the Legacy J with passenger cars. I paid 1300 to get whistle steam and “Spirit of Roanoke” on the side, not a stripe that no way resembles the previous Js. I’m very disappointed. It’s really too bad.
They'll make it right. I'm holding onto mine.
Surefire posted:Weathering or fading or sunshine or whatever shouldn't enter in. It should match the Locomotive as built or as it was painted for Excursion service. Anything else is just giving Lionel a pass. This sort of stuff is ridiculous. There are so many Lionel items I would love to purchase but at this point I'm voting with my wallet. Until they get It together no way I'm preordering anything.
Scott Mann and 3rd rail for example consistently deliver trains that are EXACTLY as they said they would be. They are made in China as well. It can be done. For thousands of dollars it SHOULD be done.
I'm passionate about this as I love Lionel, but they are not returning the sentiment.
An excellent, accurate, and fair assessment of today's State of the Union at Big Orange.
Surefire posted:Weathering or fading or sunshine or whatever shouldn't enter in. It should match the Locomotive as built or as it was painted for Excursion service.
Scott Mann and 3rd rail for example consistently deliver trains that are EXACTLY as they said they would be.
Not always. Their SP Daylight passenger cars were delivered in weathered/faded colors, for example.
I talked to Brian Sheffield yesterday and he’s going to check with Lionel and see what if anything can be done to correct the stripe color. He’s going to get back with me this week. I’m going to wait and see what if any fix will be made before I open the box. I’m optimistic that something will be done.
Lionel is well aware of the stripe color issue. We are all waiting to hear what will be done.
Anybody have the passenger cars and the new J in a well lit photo?
Here's a short video I shot this past Friday.
Just for a little perspective, here are the 606 TMCC J from around 2005 and the 611Legacy J from 2015.
The 2015 tender is on the right. The stripe is ever so slightly browner on the 2015 model and a bit higher.
And the 2015 Legacy J is on the left...
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And for a little perspective on "The Real Thing," I took these pictures in May 2015 at the Spencer, NC shops when the 611 was put back into action after her refurbishment. The stripe definitely isn't red, although the way the light hits it does make a difference. I ordered a Spirit of Roanoke version of the new Lionel 611 but it has not yet been delivered. Going back to Spencer on Sunday to see her again and might have the Lionel version to compare it to. Stay tuned. John
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Color and loco-specific radio chatter aside, the engine is beautiful and operates flawlessly. I'm color impaired, if not color blind, and dislike all cab/radio chatter, except on the real thing. My only "J", a Lionel product, was numbered as a "K", Old Number 746, and it was liquidated in the wake of my one and only divorce.
Much as I dislike O Gauge "cab/radio chatter", I was pleased to hear in the LS video that Lionel's Train Dispatcher is no longer describing the condition of the track but simply gives permission to move, in this case in accordance with signal indication. This is as it should be, per the operating rules, and there's a very good reason for it. Perhaps MTH will follow suit, then I might be able to endure the "chatter" portions of Eric's otherwise excellent reviews, rather than skip ahead.
I hope Lionel makes good on the color correction, etc. The devil is in the details.
Tonight, I had a couple of cars on the test track and thought I would take a picture because it illustrates the difference in N&W Tuscan red on the left and PRR Tuscan red on the right.
Left is a Lionel N&W 18” Powhatan Arrow 18” Stationsounds Diner, on the right MTH PRR premier Madison observation car:
The N&W Tuscan was more red.
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Craignor posted:Tonight, I had a couple of cars on the test track and thought I would take a picture because it illustrates the difference in N&W Tuscan red on the left and PRR Tuscan red on the right.
Left is a Lionel N&W 18” Powhatan Arrow 18” Stationsounds Diner, on the right MTH PRR premier Madison observation car:
The N&W Tuscan was more red.
I have always thought that Lionel nailed the N&W Tuscan color with their 18" passenger cars.
Craignor posted:Tonight, I had a couple of cars on the test track and thought I would take a picture because it illustrates the difference in N&W Tuscan red on the left and PRR Tuscan red on the right.
Left is a Lionel N&W 18” Powhatan Arrow 18” Stationsounds Diner, on the right MTH PRR premier Madison observation car:
The N&W Tuscan was more red.
100% correct. The Pennsy has more brown in it.
MartyE posted:Just for a little perspective, here are the 606 TMCC J from around 2005 and the 611Legacy J from 2015.
Beautiful pieces Marty!
Marty do you have some 18” passenger cars to put along side the new J to compare colors?
N&W 1218 posted:Marty do you have some 18” passenger cars to put along side the new J to compare colors?
Kevin
Still waiting for my new J but I do have MTH cars that I will definitely take a picture with. The engines above are from 2005 and the 2015 Legacy version.
Awesome photos!
Okay First let me say I am not a N&W expert. I have the 2005 version J with 18" Aluminum cars and now the latest version in 611 Spirit and 600. I have not taken the 600 out of the box but from the pictures here it seems the same as all the other new versions.
So Here is a quick study I did overnight and this morning.
Here id the 2005 TMCC version in the (back and left) and new Legacy version (front and right).
As Norm stated the Marker light housing on the 2005 version (Right) is much better and appears to be more scale based on pictures.
As Hot Water has stated the housing around the headlight was painted in the past and all the pictures that I have found and the pictures I have seen on the recently shopped 611 all show black housings. This could be fixed with a steady hand and some paint. Not sure I have that.
Overall they are the same engine, except Marker lights.
So here is the latest J with the N&W Inspection Car and you an see they do not match.
Here is the new Tool Car and again not sure they match but it is slightly better than the Inspection Car.
So here are my thoughts. Most of the photo's here that many of you have posted look more like the 2005 version. But After looking through many books like N&W in Color(Morning Sun) and N&W Passenger Service(TLC) I find about 80% of the photos of J's look more like the new version than the older version (2005). You guys will have to look at the books yourself for proof as somebody I know will knock this post down if i show those. I like the 2005 version and will not sell it and it will be the only version that will match the 18" aluminum cars. Sorry I could not photograph those as others wanted, but they are in storage. I am not completely opposed to the new paint but I am going off photo's and I think like others the paint is too Pink or red depending on how you look at it. As far as the new Passenger sets that I have on order to match the new engine, I am thinking about putting those on hold. I need proof that they will match any engines I have now. What will Lionel do about the stripe on these J's - Will they change them as others have stated? The biggest problem as I see it is that we may end up with engines in one shade and passenger cars in another and everybody trying to sell it all off. After several of these sort of issues in a row, one thing is for sure on my end - My Lionel preorders are going to be cut way back.
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Blue Streak,
Thanks for posting. I totally agree with you on preorders. Until I see and hear the product I’m not going to commit in the future. There will always be product out there somewhere, so I never worry about missing out.
I bought the “Spirit of Roanoke” to pull more of my 18” passenger cars. Since the engine and cars don’t match, I’m sending mine back. I really don’t want to do that but Lionel has left me no choice. If I were interested in the 746 version then the color of the stripe is spot on.
Does anyone have the 746 version? Does it have specific engine # crew talk or not? If so, I guess I could trade and get a 746.
When I see the photos that Blue Streak posted, two thoughts occur immediately:
1) The 2005 Version is "correct".
2) The 2019 Version and the 2019 cars look way too.....PINK.
I think technically its called fuschia...LOL!
Has Lionel said they will take care of this color issue? Or are they just looking into it?
sahan posted:Has Lionel said they will take care of this color issue? Or are they just looking into it?
Hopefully take care of it.
Where was it posted by Lionel personnel that the Color on the N&W J would be corrected?
How will Lionel correct the color? Stateside or back in China?
Sincerely, John Rowlen
I rode behind her out of spencer n.c.I could not get over how deep her whistle is.One heck of a locomotive!!
It will be corrected. I am 100% confident of that. Everyone just needs to have patience and keep this thread from being locked or deleted.
I’ve sent Lionel an email about this issue, that’s really all I can do. I’ve heard from some dealers that said it won’t be fixed, some others said it will, truthfully I don’t know what to believe. Lionel made a great model here and I love everything except the color. I think a lot will depend on the color of the cars. If they are that bright red then I don’t think they’ll change it. Hopefully we’ll get a resolution soon!
For us Strasburg fans on the plus side the new 611 goes will be the bright red ketchup and mustard cars lol!
The newly released N&W tool and inspection cars are a similar color, if not a bit brighter, as seen in previous post. I don't see how they would change colors at this point.
I’m waiting to see if the correct the color to be more like the old 18 inch aluminum passenger cars. This photo shows the new J with the aluminum cars.
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I called Lionel today, the official word is that they are trying to come up with a solution and expect a resolution (if they go that direction) within the next two weeks. I’ll keep you posted if I hear anything further.
Waiting for me at the LHS! Sauce for the goose, Mister Saavik.
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I sure hope they correct this.
Doug N posted:I sure hope they correct this.
I am going to run mine until they request them back to fix the stripe. I am 100% confident they will or I wouldn't be taking it home. Until then I'll just use that imagination that it is running in bright sunlight at that perfect angle.
Any word on Lionel's intention to correct the N&W J paint? I see a sudden increase in N&W J engines available at hobby shops that were previously sold out. Where did they come from?
Sincerely, John Rowlen
I sent my 611 back and canceled all the Excursion cars.
If they fix the engines there is no way the cars will match. If by chance they do I will buy them back.
I kept the 600 in case they fix it but my dealer knows I am not happy with it and it is next on the chopping block.
Joe
If I am going by Lionel’s time table they set for me when I last called I should hear something this week or next. But then again Lionel never follows an actual schedule...... I am hopeful that something will happen and the fact they are at least discussing it is a good thing. I do wonder what the response from hobby shops have been. They will make the most impact on this decision.
I got mine and opened up and tested it out. I have a slightly loose boiler front and the shell seems just a tad loose too. I'll check those screws later.
Other than the stripe color, I wouldn't have taken it from the LHS if I wasn't 100% confident Lionel will be taking care of and I won't comment further on, the engine is beautiful. If I had one complaint, is that as Derek pointed out in his Youtube video, they didn't have road number specific call outs when having the 611's engineer do the recordings. Seems like it would have been a logical choice to do so.
Here are a few pictures with the TMCC 606 and a quick video.
611 on the left. 606 on the right.
606 J from around 2005.
611 "Spirit of Roanoke" 2019
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Yeah I totally agree with that. I love the fact that the crew talk is different voices but they never mention 611. Actually the more I think of it I am not sure if any of my Legacy engines say the number. 2102 doesn't, my older Legacy 611 doesn't, I am not sure if my 765 does (even though I think they actually used the 765 crew to record it). Perhaps it's a cost saving situation where they can just use the same recording for all the same engines and call it a day. But I agree, they missed an opportunity to have 611 specific crew chatter. Meh, can't have everything I guess.
I wonder why Lionel started painting the headlight bezel wrong? The 606 had it right! Look at Marty's photos above.
One thing about that "Red", as soon as you lift the styrofoam lid, you can see the red through all of the wrappings! 
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The first Legacy 765 has the loco specific crew talk....and I really like it. I don't think the subsequent two did, though.
At some point, Big Orange changed this feature to mostly Vision Line only....which I think was a mistake. Why add Whistle Steam....and then go cheap on the sound? (Actually, the prices went up and the loco specific sound disappeared.)
Berkshire President posted:The first Legacy 765 has the loco specific crew talk....and I really like it. I don't think the subsequent two did, though.
At some point, Big Orange changed this feature to mostly Vision Line only....which I think was a mistake. Why add Whistle Steam....and then go cheap on the sound? (Actually, the prices went up and the loco specific sound disappeared.)
You can save money when a genetic dialog can be used across multiple models. Simple economics.
Engine specific crew talk and towercom started with Railsounds 5.0 in 2004 and carried over to Railsounds 5.5. When Lionel went to Railsounds Lite (6.0?) in 2010-11 cab-specific largely went away except for Vision Line and a few other exceptions as Berkshire notes above. Thing is with the new J's Lionel's catalog advertised "Crew talk recorded with the crew of 611," which is true. I spoke with Scott Lindsay, the 611's Chief Mechanical Engineer, a couple of weeks ago when the 611 was on display in Spencer, NC. He told me he recorded the crew talk earlier this year but nothing was cab-specific. I can definitely recognized his voice in my new Spirit of Roanoke engine. I agree Lionel missed an opportunity to really please it's customers but going generic once again, even after acquiring the services of the real 611 crew.
MartyE posted:Berkshire President posted:The first Legacy 765 has the loco specific crew talk....and I really like it. I don't think the subsequent two did, though.
At some point, Big Orange changed this feature to mostly Vision Line only....which I think was a mistake. Why add Whistle Steam....and then go cheap on the sound? (Actually, the prices went up and the loco specific sound disappeared.)
You can save money when a genetic dialog can be used across multiple models. Simple economics.
True it's cost saving. However, if you're going to bring the engineer from the prototype to do the crew talk (assuming they used it in one engine only) why not have them add the road number in. Like with the 765, my friend has the early (2010) run and my uncle has the new (2014) run. Why not just reuse the original (2010) run crew talk, assuming the files are still there, Makes no sense to me. Another question, so then why do the vision engines get road specific crew talk, because there made only every other year? To add a monkey wrench to this (and to continue my point with 765), the latest big boy (2019) will have road specific crew talk and there using the files from the VL big boy. Makes no sense.
MartyE posted:Berkshire President posted:The first Legacy 765 has the loco specific crew talk....and I really like it. I don't think the subsequent two did, though.
At some point, Big Orange changed this feature to mostly Vision Line only....which I think was a mistake. Why add Whistle Steam....and then go cheap on the sound? (Actually, the prices went up and the loco specific sound disappeared.)
You can save money when a genetic dialog can be used across multiple models. Simple economics.
I don't care how much money Lionel makes. I care about the quality of the product I receive and what I pay for said product.
Certain features, like Whiste Steam and excellent sound quality, can be intensive works of engineering.
Not using sound files that you already have is simply being cheap and inexcusable....and lazy.
Or, it may be another sign that the 15 year old girl putting the locomotive together in China really has no idea what she is doing.....and QC is not existent.....like on pink 611 Stripes, Neon Green Challengers and Mallets......and on and on.
Can we not post comments like that? I don’t want this post getting deleted based on racial issues, that’s uncalled for.
How is a comment, made tongue and check, about manufacturing in China.....remotely racial?
And when did everyone have to walk on eggshells around here?
Has Lionel decided if they are going to correct the paint on the Norfolk and Western 611 engines? How long will it be until they decide?
Only one we've heard from so far is Marty saying he is pretty sure Lionel is going to do something. You'd think Lionel would have said something by now.
Surefire posted:Only one we've heard from so far is Marty saying he is pretty sure Lionel is going to do something. You'd think Lionel would have said something by now.
You are correct. Lionel needs to say something. It's been long enough.
My thoughts and opinions after attending the Charles Ro open house:
I asked the Charles Ro family if the had any returns from dissatisfied customers. I was told they only had a few returns.
Ryan Kunkle and I had a very pleasant conversation about the J stripe issue. He said it is important for customers to contact Lionel if they are dissatisfied with their engine. If the shells were to be replaced, the replacement shells from the manufacture would be installed by Lionel stateside. At the time of our conversation, Lionel was in the process of gathering information on how many customers were going to request new shells.
My opinions from a business point of view:
If there is enough customers interest in replacements shells, then most likely they will be produced and then installed by Lionel
From a business cost stand point and customer satisfaction Do you replace the shells; offer a full refund; or some form of a rebate?
Chris
Chrico posted:
Ryan Kunkle and I had a very pleasant conversation about the J stripe issue. He said it is important for customers to contact Lionel if they are dissatisfied with their engine. If the shells were to be replaced, the replacement shells from the manufacture would be installed by Lionel stateside. At the time of our conversation, Lionel was in the process of gathering information on how many customers were going to request new shells.
Chris
This alone is why Lionel needs to say something. I have maintained that as long as Lionel was going to fix the stripe, I would keep mine. If they are not it will go back to the dealer. I have talked to Ryan at York and Dave at the warehouse sale and expressed my opinion. As of this writing based on what I had learned, I am keeping mine. I suppose that could change but I am confident they will fix it.
Folks need to know what Lionel's plan is so that they can decide what action they take. A lot of times people take a wait and see attitude rather than making the call.
Called Lionel 3 times today, twice I was told that their customer service was unavailable for an hour and the last time I was on hold for 10 mins before it went to a voicemail which was filled. So maybe they went on Thanksgiving break already, I don't know. All I know is what I posted previously. To piggy back on what the previous post was I strongly urge you, if you haven't done so already, to email Lionel and voice your disappointment that way. Hopefully they will based their decision on the number of emails they receive.
What will happen to all the Norfolk and Western 611 engines that are in dealer inventory? Are the dealers being informed that they should voice their objections to the color of the stripe? Satisfying just a few current owners who call Lionel, will leave all the other engines sitting in dealer inventory unchanged.
So to get a correctly painted engine, do you have to buy one, and them complain to Lionel to get a correctly painted new shell? Will the new shells be painted correctly?
Sincerely, John Rowlen
John Rowlen posted:What will happen to all the Norfolk and Western 611 engines that are in dealer inventory? Are the dealers being informed that they should voice their objections to the color of the stripe? Satisfying just a few current owners who call Lionel, will leave all the other engines sitting in dealer inventory unchanged.
So to get a correctly painted engine, do you have to buy one, and them complain to Lionel to get a correctly painted new shell? Will the new shells be painted correctly?
Sincerely, John Rowlen
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Did anyone buy the RPO tool car for the 611? That also is more reddish compared to the catalog picture and matches up more with the 611 stripe. Will lionel correct that as well? What about the passenger car 4 pack? I am assuming that also might be wrong. They have pushed the delivery date back to Feb 2020 now. I don't think it might be worth for Lionel to do a total recall. They are going to have problems either way
Sahan,
I did. Yes it all matched the very wrong color and i compared it in the now closed post on this subject. You may be able to still find it. I sent all of it back including the engine.
I see. I think they deleted that post. Can't find it.
Anyway I don't see a good solution to this problem. If they correct the engine they will have to correct the passenger cars as well. They might have to redo everything but that is a very big loss and I don't think they will do it.
Anyway I would like to email them, do you send it to "TalkToUS@LIONEL.COM" ?
Lionel should seriously start thinking of shifting their production out of China to Korea or some other place. These QC issues are now becoming pathetic. Something Similar happened with the Challengers (I know they corrected this) and now this.
Water tenders were perfect and they were made is Korea
Sahan,
Here are a few pis.
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My eyes hurt!!!
Not sure how you can keep up the notion of BTO when your QC is this bad.
The entire BTO idea is a giant issue. Especially if the photo doesn't match the finished product. I would love to get one of the brand new Hudson's coming out but now I am just of the mindset that I am going to have to see it first before I commit that large amount of money to it. Which stinks because I may miss out on it but I rather know what I am getting before I buy it. It's like buying a car without seeing it, none of us would do that. There is really no reason to keep rehashing the situation here, we all know it's painted wrong. I have kind of been on a mission ever since this engine came out to get at least an answer from Lionel. All the information I have officially from the company is that they are discussing it. I have heard a lot of hearsay, both positive and negative about this issue getting resolved. As soon as I hear some more information I will post it.
As I mentioned previously the best thing to do is to reach out to Lionel directly, call them and email them. Let them know you are dissatisfied with the product. But please be nice about it. I would never help anyone who was being mean to me personally. Be respectful. That's how we fix this. Hopefully we will get an answer soon.
Finally got a hold of Lionel! The lady on the phone didn't know much but what she did tell me is don't expect an answer until after the Christmas season is over. So it seems very likely that we won't have a decision until 2020.....
2020 ? Isn't that perfect vision? What will we see then? A decision should not take that long.
Lionel customers have seen the "red" cars ever since the N&W Theater Car. Was dissatisfaction in the "red" expressed then? If customers return the engines, somebody will have to do something with them … eventually.
The Hudson engines are great. My #5415 from Mr. Muffin's Trains is perfect. The #5416 from Pat's Trains is perfect. Consider another engine.
Sincerely, John Rowlen
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John Rowlen posted:Lionel customers have seen the "red" cars ever since the N&W Theater Car. Was dissatisfaction in the "red" expressed then?
Yes, and it was made clear to not expect anything to be done to correct the situation.
Gilly@N&W posted:John Rowlen posted:Lionel customers have seen the "red" cars ever since the N&W Theater Car. Was dissatisfaction in the "red" expressed then?
Yes, and it was made clear to not expect anything to be done to correct the situation.
I think Ryan said on the Trainworld video they are re running those in the correct colors which it make more sense to fix the J color stripe.
I was told by Lionel that they have not made a decision yet. When they do they will do an announcement on the forum and other social media sites.
Well I would have hope we have heard something by now which makes me think this will not end well. I have stated if Lionel doesn't fix the stripe I will ask for a refund. I still intend to do that. I guess not enough folks called and complained so they will let it go. The further we get away from the release just about 2 months now, without a word speaks volumes. I talked to several Lionel folks at various shows and events and always felt that it would be corrected but I can no longer see with the time that has past that this will be the case. I hope I'm wrong.
If you have a J and are unhappy with the stripe color please call them and politely tell them of your concern. Don't wait on others to do it. I would have hoped the dealers would have stepped up but I guess once they are out of their door it's not their problem.
I wish Lionel would just make a statement one way or another so those of us that want to put this to bed can. I am usually very optimistic but not so much right now.
Just a small update. I did call as most of my correspondence has been face to face with Lionel folks, I felt I should at least call so my concern was noted. I was told that they are still working on it but the busy season and getting next years catalog out is a priority. So we will wait. That being said a statement still wouldn't hurt.
Anyone else find it funny that the 2019 National Lionel Day boxcar has the correct stripe color for the J but yet the real one is messed up. Gotta love it...... As I mentioned previously I was told not to except anything till next year so yeah keep up the fight or else they'll just let it slide by...
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Lionel said they will post an announcement on the forum. Martye are you sure the dealer would allow you to return the train after 2 months?
HHmmm... better dead than red! 
What do you folks expect LIONEL to announce by way of a "fix"?
I kind of remember MTH took back some E units that were painted wrong, am I wrong?
Why aren't you unhappy guys returning them to get your money back? New catalog and busy season take priority? Glad I passed on that one.
Just a reminder if you are unhappy with the stripe color let Lionel know. Call them. Do not email them. Talk to a human. Without sufficient calls nothing will be done.
What I expect in way of a fix is the shells to be either re-painted or replaced. The stripe matches NOTHING that any manufacturer has done before and most likely will not match anything that will be done from here out.
As for why I haven't returned it, I will return it if the stripe will not be fixed. I'd like to give them a chance to make this right. Until I hear either way it will sit in the box. If Lionel is going to do nothing, I would hope they will say something sooner than later.
Even I, in my limited knowledge of the prototype, can see immediately that the color is way off. Not even close. Best of luck with a resolution to your satisfaction.
Marty,
I now have had both dealers I purchased my (2) J's from tell me Lionel has no plans to fix the paint issue. Both J's have been returned to the dealers and all passenger cars cancelled or returned. Have to wait till next run. My 2005 J is still the winner.
Time to punt if you still have one. I feel sorry for the dealers.
On the phone to Lionel today, I was told that there would be an announcement within the next week regarding J class.
Good luck - Hope it works out for you. If Lionel fixes them I might buy back one from a dealer (fixed) - Both dealers are forum sponsors here.
Wow I am sorry to hear this. I am just hoping Lionel will do an announcement soon.
I’ll wait the official word. At this point I’m less hopeful than I was after the Warehouse sale.
OK....I think the points have been made about this locomotive...enough to last in the minds of everyone! And...nearly the entire thread is off the topic that the OP originally intended... Topic closed!
