For people who have a lot of williams trains.Are you happy with the product.I talking about its speed pulling power?I have to admit I had never heard of williams trains.By the time I did I had pretty much had a bunch of mth trains.Then they where brought by bachmann.So let me hear your take on williams trains.
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If you want to run in conventional you can't go wrong with a Williams engine. Good pullers and run great and you can always upgrade them to DCS or ERR in the future if you wish. The newer Williams by Bachmann have prime mover sounds horn and bell. Waaay better than the original grade crossing horn and clanking bell .
I have several Williams engines, some quite old. They have always been a great value. I recently added ERR to two of my L&NE FAs. They are among my favorites. Years back I found that in conventional mode they outperformed Lionel and were closer to scale as well.
Mine are very well made. For the price i wouldn't hesitate to buy a williams that I liked; engine, pass cars, etc. (And then add err or a sound package if desired.)
I’ve got around 30 Williams engines ranging from their F3’s to GP9’s, 30’s and 38’s and, probably my favorites, the scale FA’s. I’ve changed the wiring in most of mine to series which gives them a lower slow speed and seems to make them run more smoothly.
I have found Williams to be extremely reliable engines that are capable of pulling long trains with no issues.
They are about as easy to maintain as some Lionel Postwar engines and the few times I’ve had an issue with one of them, Bachmann’s lifetime warranty has taken care of whatever the problem was including twice where they simply sent me new engines.
I have gravitated toward purchasing MTH engines in recent years but, still enjoy running my Williams engines in conventional mode from the transformer.
I’ll summarize by saying Williams is one model railroad product I have absolutely no problem endorsing.
Curt
Great products. Pretty much bulletproof remakes of classic Lionel...but with more modern drive train (can motor).
Easily upgraded...
One drawback...suethe smoke units...which in my experience seem to be random...some smoke really well...others not so well or not at all.
All in all, tho...excellent value compared to the more expensive brands...
I have two Williams locos and nine Williams by Bachman locos. All were purchased brand new form retailers ... some advertise here on OGR forum. Out of the nine WbB three were problematic, out of the box, and one of these three was dead on arrival. All three were made good on by the retailers from whom I purchased.... and never had another problem with them since.
They are all good pullers, reliable, and look good ... yes lite on detail but I do not expect fine detail at the WbB price point. Sound on my scale forty four tonner is decent, the model looks good, and is fun to run. For the money WbB are very good locomotives ... but I now test the locomotives at time of purchase before I bring them home. As others have said you can upgrade them to DCS or ERR too.... although I've not done this as of yet.
\got more Williams that the rest combined.....yes..I like...
You get the idea.......
I have the Pennsy B6sb steam switcher/shifter and have had no problems with it.
Tom
Baggage car from Jerry's first five car heavyweight set. This set led the way for factory sets. He saw the market for heavyweight, close to scale size passenger cars and put his money where is mouth was. Others soon followed. 17" over sills. REA square on points logos have been added as well as the chains. Very close to if not the same rivet pattern of the MTH 17" cars. John in Lansing, ILL
I've been happy with my Williams trains as they are reliable good runners. They aren't my most accurate trains, but when I need a locomotive that will run on and on and on, my Williams are always good go to trains. I usually pack a few Williams locomotives with my more "complex" ones if they go down when I run for the public.
Great product. I have several Williams GG-1 locomotives converted to PS2 and running off live catenary. Williams came on the scene with FM TM. They were the introduction for many of us to can motors. How great that was.
I first bought Williams back in the 80's as a much cheaper option than original Lionel. Their FMs, GG1s, Budd cars and Madisons still run on my layout. The only problems I ever had were the e-units that have failed (and were replaced by old mechanical e-units and a rectifier). Other than that, they're bullet proof.
You can't beat the value for the price. Go ahead and buy some.
I also think they are great locos. I own 5 Crown Edition brass steamers and they are all great runners / pullers. I plan to have most of them upgraded to DCS, which will make them run even better. The only negative I can think of is being brass, they're more delicate than diecast locos.
John
Williams stuff is well-made. Or I guess I should say it was well made when I was buying it. But as I am building my layout, I couldn't afford to put in everything and conventional operation got the ax. I am committed to DCS and I run TMCC through DCS. Conventional operation just required enough extra complication in the wiring and planning for the various things that might happen or that I might want to do that it was easier juts to drop conventional operation. It sound odd to say this, but DCS simplified my layout construction and that meant a lot to me.
So I stopped buying conventional engines. Yes, I can upgrade anything to DCS or TMCC for $175 or so including the sound boards.....and that brings the total cost up to just about what I would have paid for a factory DCS or TMCC engine. So why? There's sure no economic sense in it.
Williams, like some other mfrs, needs to wake up and smell the electronics. It's 2018, not 1998. But that's just me. For a conventional operator I think Williams makes great stuff.
Don
I agree with the above. I now have 7 Williams F3s, 2 Williams F7s with Ott sound systems, and a GP7. All run quite well. The Willams F3s are the Lionel look alikes, but I think they actually look better because all of the units have front hand rails, portholes, and grills on the roofs. My GP7 has a problem with its horn, but it doesn't worry me at all. I also enjoy several Williams brass steam locomotives even though they have no sound.
Lew
Williams is great stuff, nice quality, great price and good pulling power. I was hesitant at first to buy Williams after they were bought by Bachman, but they have continued with the same tradition and done an excellent job.
I've upgraded a number Williams units with ERR and DCS kits. I've noticed the drive-train is very similar to that of MTH. And another nice benefit, the older Williams engines can interchange shells with many of the Lionel MPC engines. Let's you breath some new life into the favorites you had as a kid.
I have 2 and am very happy with them.
I have a WBB GP38, one of my favorite engines. I series-wired the motors to slow it down and it’s an excellent runner. Heavy and will pull more cars than I own.
I have several and I think they are great. They are well built, heavy and pull great. If accurate detailing and prototype fidelity are important to you, then most of the product line will not appeal to you. The MSRP is too high for them. Most retailers sell them at a more reasonable price. The dummy upgrade kits are a plus. The other manufacturers don't offer kits to power up dummies that I am aware of. Parts are readily available from Bachmann and from a few other places.
My first Williams was a PRR GG1 (along with a set of Williams passenger cars). The engine was on sale (a great price) as were the passenger cars. My next purchase was a Williams PRR steam loco and it is a great puller (I have it running now with 10 freight cars). I subsequently bought several A-A diesels including an ABA Santa Fe that looks great. It seems that Trainland in Lynbrook always has some Williams engines on sale and in geeral are more reasonable than MTH and Lionel.
I must mention that my last purchase was a Lionel Lion CHief plus rectifier and I find the accompanying remote a revelation.
John F
I have mixed feelings on Williams/WBB. First of the general feel and very deserved reputation is that they are rock solid. They are good for big hands and small hands alike to handle. On the downside if you are looking for scale realism you won't find it with stamped steel handrails. As to pulling power they are amazing. Plenty of weight and traction tires. Dc can motors that need no maintenance and are really hard to damage. The down side is that they take off at such low voltage that if you are pulling passenger cars you will likely not see the lights very well. Many hobbyists have rewired the motors in series to slow them down. The upside is if you are pulling trains up grades they have power to spare.
The thing I really have never liked about Williams engines is the sounds. Either you get no horn what so ever, like the Chuggington engines or the older Williams models, or you get Williams True Blast plus. This system has engine sounds, although I can't hear them well on the one example I run. The thing I really can't stand is the horn sound. Every time you hit the button you get the crossing signal of 2 long blasts, 1 short blast, and 1 long blast. You can't "play" the horn. I really don't like this feature.
The diesels ( I don't have any Williams steam to comment about) are great candidates for command upgrades. With twin vertical motors with flywheels they readily accept dcs packages. I have one I started a few years ago when I had more time on my hands. It was relatively easy to do for a first timer.
Overall great value for the money, should run without issue at low voltage unless it's been modified. I just really don't care for the sound package.
I think your opinion of Williams trains largely depend on what your expectations are. I have about a dozen Williams engines, all are pre Bachmann Williams and most all are from the Golden Memories Post War reproduction series. If your idea of 3 rail is Lionel Post War than these will more than fufill your expections for reasons stated above. Williams used the best of the Post War to emulate. The steamers and diesel have the best detail of the time and diesel frames are die cast vs the later Post War stamped steel with stamped handrails.
If your idea of 3 rail is command control with scale size and fine detail then look elsewhere.
Pete
have a couple, love them, great pullers...
bottom four shelves Williams...
except four the 4 Chessie's & 3 Arizona and California's
.
The only Williams locomotives I have are a AA pair of PRR Baldwin Sharks. As others have noted, I had to wire the motors in series to get good low-speed performance, but once I did that, they ran perfectly, and have for at least five years, now.
The drawbacks? Well, PRR Sharks had TrainPhone antennas along the roof, and Williams never even offered that feature as an option. Also (again, others have already pointed this out), the TruBlast II sound generator leaves a lot to be desired. One of these days, I'll get around to installing a better sound system in the dummy A unit.
Other than that, I have no complaints at all. They look good and they run well. Excellent value for the money.
The early Williams is not so good but once Jerry got the hang of it he offered some nice copies of post war Lionel's that ran very well. Sold to WBB they have lost Williams basic idea of offering nice trains at affordable prices. Yes the new engines are better but the Williams concept is gone.
I only have 10 but they are terrific, no frills, no fail pullers. If you are particular about sound and rivets, they may not be for you, but if you just want the fun of dependable locos pulling lots of cars, you can't go wrong.
Williams = bullet proof.
I tend to agree with JHZ's assessment. I just recently bought my second Williams (the first was over 8 years ago) loco. It is the new ?Golden Memories? blue Santa Fe diesel. It looks great and pulls like a champ but for True Blast Plus one can not hear the train sound or horn when the diesel is moving (even after turning the volume all the way up). I have returned it to Williams for 'repairs'. I have not heard back as yet whether what I have is normal or if there is something wrong.
Joe
I have several Williams Electric Trains on my layout. This is an A-A E7, I have had this loco for about twenty years. Being from Michigan, this Pere Marquette works out great, This photo is also my screen saver on my MacBook Pro.
I use MTH DCS Wi-Fi / The only thing I have to be careful of is that my layout has 18 volts to all the main lines and the power is always on. Have to park a Williams locos on a siding with a electrical power block and leave the power off, until ready to run layout in conventional mode.
I also have several pieces of their rolling stock. With the Detroit & Mackinac Railway, as the road name.
Hope this helps: Gary
I've got a WBB GP9 and I couldn't be any happier with it.
You can wire up the can motors in series by popping a few pins and switching them around in the connectors... Way slower with gobs more pulling power. AFAIK this can be done on any of their locos.
About 95% of the comments are positive. What do you think that percentage would be if someone asked about Lionel or MTH locomotives? That should tell you something.
Good solid models that are simple, durable, and work well. I have their O scale ABA Alco F series; their rendition of the old Lionel 4343, F3 in a Santa Fe ABA, the red color is too burgundy and flat compared to the Lionel originals I have but the locos are strong and solid; a 773 Hudson, the detail is not as good as my 1939 700E but it is rock solid in operation; a pair, both powered, of Canadian Pacific FM Train Masters, they come from different manufacturing runs and display a slightly different paint tone and small paint scheme variations, they have different road numbers actually nothing you wouldn't expect as they get road time on them both a powerful excellent renditions of the Lionel originals. I also have Jerry's version of the Lionel 682 Turbine in it's original Pennsy color scheme and road number, like the other Williams locos it is a solid performer and looks good in Brunswick green.
I have their copy of the Lionel 50th anniversary O27 passenger set, they are well make physical copies of the Lionel originals but they are hard pullers which stall locomotives with Magna Traction and spin the drivers of those that don't have that feature, I've made a couple passes over wheels and trucks but haven't yet solved this. The yellow color has too much red in it making it almost a hot orange tone with a hint of pink instead of golden yellow. Neither are anywhere close to UP's Armor Yellow but the Lionel is easy on the eyes and look clean which real UP yellow appears dirty in comparison.
Also, a set of their 60 foot Canadian Pacific streamliners, these are very nice solid models that don't pull hard like the O27's I mentioned above. Plus a set of 80 foot Superliners in Amtrak which I'm going to repaint for Canadian Pacific when, or if, I finally retire and some time to do them right. Not that CP ever used these but it is my world as I would have it that I'm modeling.
Williams was acquired by Bachman which is a company that is great on making things very well but is a complete flake when it comes to parts and support. Their life time warranty is only for the life of the production run and any spares that survive. Once a production run is done if your widget ever fails and no parts survive in storage there is no recourse with the warranty, its done with its lifetime.
Bogie
Western Pacific F units from the Williams 'Golden Memories' series. Fabulous trains.
I have quite a few Williams locos and have upgraded a number of them to battery powered bluetooth control. (See OGR Dec. 2016 issue for details). They run well and are easy to convert. Performance after the conversion is stellar.
I own five sets of F3s, four sets of GP9s, one older semi-scale steamer, one of the newer Pacifics with improved sound, a new GP30, and a four-car set of Madison passenger cars (NP), which run behind my Lionel NP steamer. The only trouble I've ever had is with the tether between the engine and tender on the new Pacific. Once attached, it's so tight and hard to undo that I'm afraid to mess with it for fear of tearing open the outer casing. I sold a few I wish I'd kept, including the C&EI BL2. I ordered one of the new 70-Ton diesels in Rutland livery. All of these locomotives are as solid and reliable as any MTH or Lionel I own. Definite thumbs up and I would love to see Bachmann increase the options and roadnames.
Even us guys who own very few Williams products like 'em. I'm particularly fond of my reproduction SG State Set and modified TCA 35th anniversary GG1 with 4 bakelite madisons.
Bruce
lewrail posted:I agree with the above. I now have 7 Williams F3s, 2 Williams F7s with Ott sound systems, and a GP7. All run quite well. The Willams F3s are the Lionel look alikes, but I think they actually look better because all of the units have front hand rails, portholes, and grills on the roofs. My GP7 has a problem with its horn, but it doesn't worry me at all. I also enjoy several Williams brass steam locomotives even though they have no sound.
Lew
You can plug and play the better Williams diesel sound boards. While not as fancy as MTH or Lionel they shouldn’t disappoint you.
I’ve done a few and I’m happy with them. They come in Alco and EMD. I’ve done it with older Williams and a Weaver RS3
William's & K Line great bang for the buck. "Fun 2 Run"
I usually buy by the model and roadname rather than brand, but Williams caught my attention when they started making scale GG1'S. I have the 4935, and it can pull 5 of the 20-inch aluminum cars at speed so high I have to be careful not to derail it on 054 curves.
I also bought the trainmaster because I wanted CNJ, and it cost about one fifth of an original Lionel. It pulls four scale Madison's as fast as the GG1.
I have th F7 AB set, and the Alco PA, both PRR, and the postwar K4. I am looking to convert the K4 to DCC, as I found a sound system recorded from the 1361.
I have a USRA Mikado, and it can handle 15 scale freight cars at 2/3 full throttle.
I have several Williams and WBB. Two have ERR.
Hey guys!Thanks for your replys.Its clear that williams trains has its own following.
@DennyM posted:I have several Williams and WBB. Two have ERR.
Bob Marley Fan me thinketh? Great song! Williams trains with Bob Marley is a good combo! Cheers
Hi, just letting you know there's a new FB page solely for Williams Electric Trains. 
https://www.facebook.com/groups/4392150397475477
I have a scale Penn Central GG1 and a scale LNE ABA ALCO FA. Both are bullet proof: great runners and pullers.
Peter
A while ago, I had Williams Santa Fe FAs (? Freight Length?) ABA, and all 3 engines were powered. 6 motored set. Could pull anything without a sweat.
Sold all my Williams diesels a while back as they did not, for various reasons, fit what I was looking for. No problems with how they ran.
I do have several Williams brass steamers that have been upgraded to command. They look great and run well. My two scale Williams GG1s, still conventional, have been run a lot at shows and they have been great, pulling a 11 car pax train at speed.
I am looking at getting their scale FA-1 set and upgrade it to command. However, I need to buy two AA sets to get two powered engines plus find a B unit.
Williams make a very good engine, Great pulling power, good looking engines. Have 8 diesels and 1 Berk., Would have been nice for those steamers with a good smoke unit. Did cone across a guy on you tube who put a MTH smoke unit in his Berk. Nice price also.
I Have 6 NW2s and an RS3. love them all. rewired them in series and they are great pullers!
One impediment to many for the Williams products is the fact they don't have any command models.
A few years back I upgraded a Williams scale GG-1 to TMCC.
A bit more recently, I upgraded the Williams 44-ton locomotive to TMCC.
I've done a number of the Williams brass steam upgrades for various folks, and even one or two for me. I have several waiting on the shelves for an upgrade now.
My Williams PRR steamers are the backbone of the fleet:
They were very smooth runners conventionally, and perform even more spectacularly under command control. And of course, they pull well.
George
Here my scale Williams PennCentral GG-1 is pulling my army train (which is quite heavy due to all the die-cast vehicles).......as an added bonus, this video is primarily about Gilly@N&W's Jawn Henry.....
Peter
Here's my Wms 'Blackjack' non-powered GG1 paired with a Lionel JLC model a few years ago. Beautiful solid black scale locomotive!
Still have an ABA of the scale PRR FA's and the Golden Classics No2356 Southern AA's as well as the handsome scale E7's in L&N with PS2. These are For Sale if anyone is interested. Just the AA's
@gunrunnerjohn posted:
John, where did you put the TMCC antenna?
@Putnam Division posted:Here my scale Williams PennCentral GG-1 is pulling my army train (which is quite heavy due to all the die-cast vehicles).......as an added bonus, this video is primarily about Gilly@N&W's Jawn Henry.....
Peter
Peter you have to get Gilly to replace those too "modern" hoppers with hamburger logo with hoppers appropriate for the era of the TE-1.
Ron
Williams engines brought me back to O-Gauge. Unfortunately have not taken any pics of my Williams engines. It was not long after Dad had passed in Oct. 1986 was back in my then local toy train shop in Charlotte. I had been eye-balling a Pennsy K4 on a shelf at least 10-feet off the floor but could read the price tag $390.00. I remember thinking $390.00 for a plastic engine. Dad (Santa) brought me my first Lionel train Christmas 1947 and he was from Conway .Pa. After remarking to the owner that was a lot of money for a plastic engine, he corrected my assumption that it was brass. So my thinking change to only $390 for a brass K4! He brought it down, I bought it. The beginning of the return to O-Gauge. Later bought a L1, then E6, then a B6. And then a GG1, Alco FA-1"s and RF-16 ABA Sharks all Williams.
One of these days must get them all out for a portrait!
Ron
@PRRronbh posted:Williams engines brought me back to O-Gauge. Unfortunately have not taken any pics of my Williams engines...
...One of these days must get them all out for a portrait!
Ron
Yes, please. 🙂
Mark in Oregon
@John Ochab posted:...a number of first generation Williams...They have a 6 Amp reversing board...
The first generation diesels had no reverse boards, just a rectifier for one direction operation.
@John Ochab posted:The DC can motors have axle mounted flywheels,
Armature mounted flywheels.
Some of the trains I have run using Williams diesels:
(the above ran with Williams units for its debut. I have since acquired MTH P40's to pull this train)
(Above: the Williams unit is in the trailing position. This and the Auto-Train are the only ones using two powered units.)
---PCJ
I have lots of Williams engines, rolling stock and passenger cars. They were quite affordable when I acquired them and they run great. My largest contingent is Pennsy Steam Turbines (I have 6) and Lionel knock off F-3s. The F-3 engines are double motored and were much less than Lionel originals at the time. I also have a moderate sized collection of Williams Brass locos including the magnificent Master Series NYC Hudsons. I keep my Dreyfuss Hudson in a display case next to my layout. It is truly moving art.
Rolland
I just purchased my first Williams by Bachmann engines. They are PRR sharks in Tuscan. I upgraded the headlights to LEDs and I'm quite satisfied with them. They pull great. I was so impressed that I bought a powered/ dummy set of PRR GP9's today!
Testing the club-owned Williams PA yesterday......
Peter
My William's B&O F3s. Really attractive and of course great runners.
I did the "wiring trick" on these so they run much better than without the jack rabbit starts.
I have my first Williams Santa Fe FM with magnatraction.. Been very good. I have 10 rubber tired engines. I have run those for hours at shows. I have never thrown a rubber tire pulling trains up to 20 cars with 2 engines. I ck grease in and renew.
@johnstrains posted:I did the "wiring trick" on these so they run much better than without the jack rabbit starts.
Bu "wiring trick" do you mean wiring the motors in series?
@RoyBoy posted:Bu "wiring trick" do you mean wiring the motors in series?
Yep, that's it. As I see it, it made a huge difference in performance, especially on my medium size PW style layout. And now that I think about it I've got some other Williams locos that I meant to re-wire.
Williams brass Camelback. ( Whistle is inside MTH work caboose. )
I do like the Williams offerings in Motive power and rolling stock!
@harleyhouse posted:I do like the Williams offerings in Motive power and rolling stock!
The real problem with collecting is the amount of shelving one has to purchase.
I have 2 Williams PA A-B-A sets, D&H and EL, a D&H A-B-B-A Shark set, Lackawanna FM pow/dum set, NH EP5 pow/dum set, NYC F-7 A-B-A set, D&H U-33 and SD-45 pow/dum sets, D&H Berkshire, and NYC, D&H, Lackawanna and PRR aluminum passenger sets, NYC Budd car set, one Amtrak Amfleet passenger set, an Amtrak Genesis an Amtrak FP-45 and one other Amtrak electric. Never had a problem with any of it. Flawless operation. Layout is 100% conventional. Recently sold an Amtrak Superliner passenger set.
I have several Williams and Williams by Bachman locomotives, steam, diesel, and electric. All are extremely reliable and run like a charm.
@trumptrain posted:Williams brass Camelback. ( Whistle is inside MTH work caboose. )
Dang that train sounds like the real thing once the engine passes--reminds me of being a kid with my head on the floor!
I have several Williams, from a N&W J11 with proto 3, to 2 conventional GP-38-2's, 1GP38-2 with TMCC, 3 F-3 Lionel NP upgraded with Williams can motors and traction tire trucks along with all 3 having ERR TMCC. My latest projects are Williams E-7's with ERR Cruise Commanders. One AB is custom painted for the Golden State, one AA is Burlington and one A unit is Milwaukee Road.
Once I tried the ERR upgrades I have been a Williams fan over Lionel and MTH.
My Williams locomotives are all "covered wagons." Many varieties of E-7's, F-3's, Alco PA's and FA's, and 7 Genesis locos. Some steam, and most color schemes made in the scale GG-1's. I run heavy 21" passenger trains mixed with GGD, Lionel, Atlas, K-line cars. The Williams locos fast starts are tamed by the heavy trains.
Ive never had a problem with any Williams products.
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