Post War ALco Apron Repair

Hey G, Could help you better in straightening that frame than gluing it. If you want my advice on glue, use Gorrilla clear. If you buy another frame don't let anyone influence you in a non-powered unit frame as the front truck frame mount  is 1/4'' short of  the powered truck attachment and the front truck will look rediculous. You can however reattach your existing power truck mount. A shame, been there, ......148th

I assumed that GGG was writing about a later Alco, with the sheet metal frame and a plastic apron that is part of the cab.
Sorry, I don't have any tips on that.

As far as the diecast alco frames go: it's fairly simple to swap out the front truck mount on a dummy frame so the truck is properly placed.  The blank can be removed from the battery opening, and the various holes tapped to accept need screws.

Sorry C.W.B , but he stated postwar not PW, and is that repair not redundant to what I've already said.   Take care

quote:

Sorry C.W.B , but he stated postwar not PW, and is that repair not redundant to what I've already said.   Take care

Postwar Lionel Alcos were made as I described starting in the late 1950's.

The Postwar Lionel Alcos with diecast frames were last made in 1954.

C.W.B. you stated ( that GGG was was writing about a later alco ) , verbatim!  Only Postwar alcos built between 1950- 54 were built  in a cast frames. We"re not speaking of the PWC commissioning. The UP  2023 yellow and grey was made  in 1950 in two styles. The standard issue that is most seen was for the passenger units, and the grey nose for freight. Only a hundred or so of the grey nosed where made.There are no 1951 2023 as they are returned in 1950. 1950 2023's were  returned to Lionel for repaint due to lack of sales. They were repainted Aluminum and Grey.Next is the '52- '54 2031 Rock Islands. I also own the '52- '54 Erie 2032's . Next came the 2033 all Aluminum  colored '52 -54 Up's. All were cast frame. All used a 622 motor with the exception of the first original 1950 alcos that used a 622X motor. As our forum agreement states, you should not to reissue the same statement as previously stated by another individual..   Take care and have a great night,..............!48th

To repair a clean break of the apron on a postwar Alco, try Tenax7r or other solvent microweld product.  This also works with "PW" Alcos(which I always thought were "postwar"), MPC/Fundimensions Alcos, LTI & LLC Alcos(inc. PWC PostWar Celebration issues) with molded aprons.

The poster above has you confused.  You don't need a new frame to repair the apron.

The poster above is not confused, you ADCX are. All Alcos built after the 2033 UP are 200 series and stamped steel frames. They all have a plastic apron, and most do not have a horn or a front coupler, let alone a headlight. Some don't even have an apron ! There is also no magnetraction, just a weight. NO, you don't have to replace the frame if you care to run it ill repaired (LOL) . The MPC/ Modern/ LLC era alcos had a screwed in front apron. Have a great day! BTW GGG, if you own a 200 series  alco,...........go buy some Testors Glue . Do you really need any of us to tell you that? .....148th

1/48, you have some research to do.

All 200 series Alcos have aprons, some open some closed.  Many have 1 axle or 2 axle MagneTraction.

The OP wanted assistance with his apron issue, and you jumped in with a frame issue.  If there is some connection, we are missing it.

Oh, & welcome to the OGR forums!

quote:

All Alcos built after the 2033 UP are 200 series and stamped steel frames.

The Lionel Corp cataloged and made the 2024 C&O and 2041 Rock Island Alcos in 1969.  ADCX Rob already covered the magnetraction issue.

As far as my first offending post goes, did you write about tapping the holes, and removing the blank from the battery opening?

[quote] 1950 2023's were  returned to Lionel for repaint due to lack of sales. They were repainted Aluminum and Grey. {/quote]

Don't recall reading or  hearing  that unsold yellow UP's were returned to the factory and repainted. There sure are a lot of yellow UP's out there.

Where did you pick up this piece of information?

1/48th

Yes this is a Post War 1960 200 Series Alco.  No horn, but 2 axle magnitraction, open front apron and a front fixed coupler.

Since not all plastics are the same, and I have not done any repairs of this type, I choose not to just use testors and ask folks who have done this before.  :-)

Rob,  This is the Navy unit with a black molded plastic so I was considering some JB Weld.  The shell is pristine, in fact the whole set is, other than the cracked apron.  As I examined the shell, it really looks like the apron is under stress outward and just cracks.  Most of the Navy unit I have seen, seem to have this problem.

So the Tenerx7 is a quality permenant repair with this style of plastic?  Thank you, G

quote:

Since not all plastics are the same, and I have not done any repairs of this type, I choose not to just use testors and ask folks who have done this before.  :-)

IMHO, you were wise to ask. I tried using CA glue(thin type)  on the last cracked apron I had, with poor results. I think the shell was a 2024 C&O. Please let us know how you make out.

I can't imagine ANY Lionel Alcos from 1950 being sent back to NJ for repainting.

Never heard that one in all my years of collecting the 20XX series cast frame

Alcos!  And as someone pointed out, there's billions of yellow 2023s around

even today....most with warped shells and heaved frames, due to improper

attic storage.

CW,  Thanks I will.  This was an interesting read this morning!  G

Tenax 7R and similar welding "cements"  - ProWeld, Testors has one, etc., are worth the try.  They are non-residue, and if they don't work, they just evaporate.  They work nearly instantly.

For your cracked apron, do the best job you can of holding(clamp/fixture) the apron pieces in place, in alignment, and apply the Tenax with the included brush from the backside.  Capillary action will draw the fluid into the cracks and "melt" or microweld the plastic back together.  The longer you can keep the apron in place the better.

Parts dealers have the 204-78 reinforcement ledge which is a metal frame piece to supplement the fragile plastic aprons on these models.  Some dealers have complete plastic replacement pilot/apron assemblies for cutting in the entire piece for badly damaged locos.

+1 on Tenax. It will work on most rolling stock and diesel shells. It won't work with bakelite used on the scale boxcars and madison cars. If there are missing chips you can take a piece of styrene (I use sprues from kits) and melt them in some Tenax and use it as a filler. Then sand smooth.

Pete

Tenax7R has a different chemical make-up than the other plastic cements. This is the brand that works the best. I have repaired/replaced 200 series Alco couplers bars with great sucess with this cement.

Completed the repair and the Tenax worked great.  I used about 8 thin rubberbands to compress the apron.  Worked well with not alot of compression, but held the piece closed.  I applied the solvent with a fine micro tip brush from the back and then bottom.  I repeated a second coat about 20 secs later on the top, back, bottom.

Sealed well and gapped filled.

I did try mixing some black sprue scrapes with the Tenex, but it solidified too quickly.  When mixing plastic and glue I have used the gel and added liquid to get the right consistency and time.  The Tenex evaporates too quickly.

 I am very satisfied with the fix.

Now I need to see if I can match a paint and touch up the seem.  When it breaks the blue paint flakes off.   Thanks for the help.  G

Thank you for posting your results. The next time I run across an Alco with a cracked apron, I will try it.

 

G, when I make a styrene filler, I chuck the sprue up in a drill (press) and hold coarse sandpaper to it to make a powder. Then mix it with the Tenax to consistency of say chocolate syrup. It will remain like that for at least 5 minutes. It makes a stronger filler than something like Squadron putty.

Pete

Maybe I didn't make enough or use enough Tenex.  I scraped a round sprue with a razor blade getting a course granule.  Since I wasn't going to need much I didn't make much.  Not that I really needed it, it sealed well.

After I did the second coat, I decided leave well enough alone!  Didn't want to over do it.  G